How Long before you realised that Australia was or was not the place that you wanted to spend the rest of your days ?

[Marisawright]

@InnerVoice, you and I sound a bit the same, in that the pull is more about European holidays than about the UK itself.  That's why we tried retiring to the UK in 2015.  We soon realised that our dreams of gallivanting endlessly around Europe weren't practical or affordable, and we were appalled at how elderly our friends and acquaintances had become.  I felt that if we stayed, I'd be old before my time.  I felt glad to be here during the pandemic too, especially when I lost friends overseas. 

[InnerVoice]

@Marisawright yes, we're on the same page there. That's why we're looking at the possibility of spending some of our retirement years in Europe, although not looking at is a permanent move. Whilst a spell in Portugal, Spain or the south of France sounds idyllic, the reality would present some challenges - the main one being the language barrier. I'm confident I could learn enough lingo to get by one a day-to-day basis, but I think I would find it hard to become sufficiently fluent to enjoy those social interactions that you can in one's native language - a bit of banter, if you like. Long-term that could be quite limiting socially, which I guess is why expat enclaves come about.

Strangely, I'd have thought that people would age more quickly here given the strength of the sun, and those who've lived here all their lives seem to have pretty awful skin - at least here in Queensland. However, I think the older generation here tend to be more active than their UK counterparts, which is probably why they appear more spritely.

[Marisawright]

22 minutes ago, InnerVoice said:

Strangely, I'd have thought that people would age more quickly here given the strength of the sun, and those who've lived here all their lives seem to have pretty awful skin - at least here in Queensland. However, I think the older generation here tend to be more active than their UK counterparts, which is probably why they appear more spritely.

Yes, I'm talking about attitudes not appearances. 

[Toots]

15 minutes ago, InnerVoice said:

@Marisawright yes, we're on the same page there. That's why we're looking at the possibility of spending some of our retirement years in Europe, although not looking at is a permanent move. Whilst a spell in Portugal, Spain or the south of France sounds idyllic, the reality would present some challenges - the main one being the language barrier. I'm confident I could learn enough lingo to get by one a day-to-day basis, but I think I would find it hard to become sufficiently fluent to enjoy those social interactions that you can in one's native language - a bit of banter, if you like. Long-term that could be quite limiting socially, which I guess is why expat enclaves come about.

Strangely, I'd have thought that people would age more quickly here given the strength of the sun, and those who've lived here all their lives seem to have pretty awful skin - at least here in Queensland. However, I think the older generation here tend to be more active than their UK counterparts, which is probably why they appear more spritely.

Aging is funny thing.  I know a fair few active oldies, still living independently into their late 80s and 90s.  My lovely old neighbour Edna (when we lived in Sydney) was active and independent until she was 102.  She died when she was 103.  I suppose it's luck really.  My paternal grandfather died when he was 72 but his twin sister was 102 when she died.  As long as you keep your marbles and decent health it's OK to live to a great age but otherwise, I'd rather cark it then live in pain and misery.

[Rocky2288]

I came to Australia from the North of England on a WHV in 2015, met my partner here, ended up staying. 
 

I’ve been back four times since and the last trip back, which was recently, was when I truly decided I can’t spend the rest of my life here. 
 

We live in Sydney and while Sydney is great if you are high earners, if you’re not, it just isn’t affordable compared to where I’m from. Slightly regret not bringing my partner back in 2017 instead of applying for the partner visa. It cost us 6k, which was a lot of money to us. I know by now we’d have a mortgage on a house there. Buying a house in Sydney is just out of the question for us. 
 

My dad died last year. We went over for a few weeks to support my mum who has very poor health herself and it was heartbreaking having to leave. I have a younger sister and I would like to be able to see her more. The flights are getting more and more expensive, too. Probably too expensive for us to afford but I can’t not visit my mum. 
 

I have never really found ever type of friends here who I had in the UK who share a similar ethos on life. The friends I have I don’t see that often and after this visit and being able to see friends properly for the first time in a few years I realised how lonely I am here. The sad thing is I have kind of gotten used to it. 

I miss the countryside deeply and I’m not a beach/hot weather person. I do appreciate I am living in a country that is a dream to be in for so many, it was just never really my plan to move overseas. 

So I suppose I have a multitude of reasons really but I know this last trip home I felt a sense of inner peace/contentment I haven’t in a long while and I know I have to get back some day. 

I am unsure when it will be. We have pets, a toddler and plan on trying for another soon. But I hope before it’s too late. 

 

 

 

 

 

[Marisawright]

13 hours ago, Rocky2288 said:

So I suppose I have a multitude of reasons really but I know this last trip home I felt a sense of inner peace/contentment I haven’t in a long while and I know I have to get back some day. 

I am unsure when it will be. We have pets, a toddler and plan on trying for another soon. But I hope before it’s too late. 

Some people never, ever settle overseas.  They could be living in a paradise and they won't feel at peace, because they're too deeply connected to their homeland.  It's not logical but it's just one of those things.

How does your partner feel about moving back?  If she's willing to give it a try, then don't put it off one minute longer. The more entrenched you get in your Australian life, the harder it will be to make the move, until one day you realise you're stuck forever.  Start looking into the feasibility of a spouse visa for the UK -- there are financial requirements which you might find it hard to meet.  

[Nemesis]

8 hours ago, Marisawright said:

Some people never, ever settle overseas.  They could be living in a paradise and they won't feel at peace, because they're too deeply connected to their homeland.  It's not logical but it's just one of those things.

Thats just it though, isn't it. One person's paradise can be the next person's prison.

[Quoll]

23 hours ago, Rocky2288 said:

I came to Australia from the North of England on a WHV in 2015, met my partner here, ended up staying. 
 

I’ve been back four times since and the last trip back, which was recently, was when I truly decided I can’t spend the rest of my life here. 
 

We live in Sydney and while Sydney is great if you are high earners, if you’re not, it just isn’t affordable compared to where I’m from. Slightly regret not bringing my partner back in 2017 instead of applying for the partner visa. It cost us 6k, which was a lot of money to us. I know by now we’d have a mortgage on a house there. Buying a house in Sydney is just out of the question for us. 
 

My dad died last year. We went over for a few weeks to support my mum who has very poor health herself and it was heartbreaking having to leave. I have a younger sister and I would like to be able to see her more. The flights are getting more and more expensive, too. Probably too expensive for us to afford but I can’t not visit my mum. 
 

I have never really found ever type of friends here who I had in the UK who share a similar ethos on life. The friends I have I don’t see that often and after this visit and being able to see friends properly for the first time in a few years I realised how lonely I am here. The sad thing is I have kind of gotten used to it. 

I miss the countryside deeply and I’m not a beach/hot weather person. I do appreciate I am living in a country that is a dream to be in for so many, it was just never really my plan to move overseas. 

So I suppose I have a multitude of reasons really but I know this last trip home I felt a sense of inner peace/contentment I haven’t in a long while and I know I have to get back some day. 

I am unsure when it will be. We have pets, a toddler and plan on trying for another soon. But I hope before it’s too late. 

 

 

 

 

 

I agree with Marisa, if your OH is good to move, do it now because if you don't, it will never be the right time - guaranteed! The kids will be settled in school, the job will be going well, you just get a promotion, your in laws are floundering a bit, your pension is accruing nicely, the kids have got good friends  and before you know it the kids are going to Uni, they have romantic  attachments etc etc. It is very easy to pass the point of no return just through apathy and "things are going well".   Your problem may well be that either your partner doesn't want to move or they aren't able to get a visa easily and you're there for the rest of your days in which case you have to decide which is your least worst option and get on with it.  I suggest that you need to be talking about this right now, don't leave it any longer so you know what you're working with.  Life is what happens when you are busy making other plans you know!!!

[Quoll]

1 hour ago, Nemesis said:

Thats just it though, isn't it. One person's paradise can be the next person's prison.

Yup, there's only one heartbeat between a dream and a nightmare! 

[Blue Flu]

On 20/04/2023 at 09:13, InnerVoice said:

@Marisawright yes, we're on the same page there. That's why we're looking at the possibility of spending some of our retirement years in Europe, although not looking at is a permanent move. Whilst a spell in Portugal, Spain or the south of France sounds idyllic, the reality would present some challenges - the main one being the language barrier. I'm confident I could learn enough lingo to get by one a day-to-day basis, but I think I would find it hard to become sufficiently fluent to enjoy those social interactions that you can in one's native language - a bit of banter, if you like. Long-term that could be quite limiting socially, which I guess is why expat enclaves come about.

Strangely, I'd have thought that people would age more quickly here given the strength of the sun, and those who've lived here all their lives seem to have pretty awful skin - at least here in Queensland. However, I think the older generation here tend to be more active than their UK counterparts, which is probably why they appear more spritely.

Depends largely. English Relatives of mine , when alive certainly appeared 'old' before their time, or more to the point set in their ways. But others , had a very wide range of social interests and very active and great communicators. It is certainly easy to travel to EU. You mention Portugal.  One of my favourites. English is very widely spoken there. More than in Spain. All children learn it from a young age. They won't get the English 'banter' perhaps, but that will be found in the ex pat enclaves. They are more tolerant as least I found than in Spain , but there will always be give and take living elsewhere . I can't say I found  Australians anymore friendly, having the same language. In fact in many ways more reserved, or less overt in that odd way here (and Portuguese are somewhat reserved for Southerners) 

 

[Rocky2288]

Thanks for the replies. Yes, I did feel a sense of panic about becoming stuck. 
 

We are lucky in a sense that my wife’s dad was originally from the UK, so she has a British passport too. 
 

So it’s more the logistics of it and the means to actually do it. It might be that one of us would have to go there first (probably be) and then the rest of the family follow. 

Anyway, that’s where we are at. 

[Marisawright]

6 minutes ago, Rocky2288 said:

Thanks for the replies. Yes, I did feel a sense of panic about becoming stuck. 

We are lucky in a sense that my wife’s dad was originally from the UK, so she has a British passport too. 

That's good to know, but it can also be dangerous because it can give you a false sense of security.  It's easy to think, "We can do it any time, so let's wait until xx".   And then by the time xx happens, there's some other reason why it seems like a good idea to put it off.  And then by the time....and so on.

You have a window until your oldest child is about 13.  After that, you'll start worrying about disrupting their education, and then it's a slippery slope because you've raised an Australian child who won't want to leave all their friends to move to the UK permanently, and then your wife won't want to move without her child.  I know that seems like a long way in the future but don't forget it's a trajectory that starts at 13 and we've seen many a Pom get stuck in it.

[Rocky2288]

9 hours ago, Marisawright said:

That's good to know, but it can also be dangerous because it can give you a false sense of security.  It's easy to think, "We can do it any time, so let's wait until xx".   And then by the time xx happens, there's some other reason why it seems like a good idea to put it off.  And then by the time....and so on.

You have a window until your oldest child is about 13.  After that, you'll start worrying about disrupting their education, and then it's a slippery slope because you've raised an Australian child who won't want to leave all their friends to move to the UK permanently, and then your wife won't want to move without her child.  I know that seems like a long way in the future but don't forget it's a trajectory that starts at 13 and we've seen many a Pom get stuck in it.

I can see how it can happen, someone getting stuck I mean. 
We do have time but I think with my dad dying at 68 and my mum having the health she does, I don’t have the expectation that I will live to be very old so it brings with it a bit more sense of urgency. 
We have talked about leaving Sydney first, since it will be dramatically cheaper to do so.  

[SophW]

On 24/10/2020 at 13:28, tea4too said:

We visited my brother and his family soon after their immigration to Aus, excited to see first hand everything they loved about their new life. It was a happy trip and we have been back several times, but even on that first visit we struggled a little to see the world through their eyes.

To some extent their friends were even more challenging as a fair few assumed we were on a recce and looking to emigrate ourselves. Trying to explain that Aus was great but home was in beautiful Wales and no, the weather wasn't a deal breaker, no we didn't hibernate for six months of the year, yes we do have a nice home in a nice area and enjoy our lifestyle... all seemed to fall on stoney ground. It made for some awkward moments and I'm sure at least one woman thought I was criticising her new life by seemingly rejecting it for my own family. The tumbleweed was huge and fast moving.

But in answer to your question bug family, I knew from the get-go that I don't need to move to Aus to find what we already have, but it took a few years more and reading lots of PIO threads to realise there is no simple answer to what people need in order to feel that they belong. Most of us only know when we have lost or found whatever 'it' is. T x

I absolutely love the last paragraph of your post, T. Since coming back from Australia for my honeymoon in June, it's all I've thought about. Without getting too deep, I'm 34 and never really travelled while at uni (like many do). My theory is that I've seen an amazing part of the world and want to see more, but realistically I can't take a year off work and bugger off I also need to think about my biological clock which is currently battling with my desire to go see the world. Similar to you, I am really happy and settled here, although grateful 2 weeks in Oz opened my eyes to the world out there and how short life can really be. Your post has helped me in ways you probably don't realise, so thank you. X

[BritChickx]

I've known since the first week I've been here that I will eventually move back to the UK. My partner feels the same way.

It's a funny thing really - I've spent almost a decade aiming to return to Aus after travelling here years ago and wanting give it a go at living here.

But it took me being on the other side of the world to truly realise that I couldn't imagine spending the rest of my life in another country to my family. 

I think now that I'm in my 30s I've become more family orientated and maybe more family dependent. I used to see family at least fortnightly. And I never disliked where I lived in the UK either. 

My partner and I have been here for 3 months now, and obviously that isn't long enough to give it time to settle. I'm enjoying where I am and getting settled in with work and we make the most of our days off exploring but I think at some point the pull of family will make is return. In the mean time will make the most of being in Oz.

[Quoll]

32 minutes ago, BritChickx said:

I've known since the first week I've been here that I will eventually move back to the UK. My partner feels the same way.

It's a funny thing really - I've spent almost a decade aiming to return to Aus after travelling here years ago and wanting give it a go at living here.

But it took me being on the other side of the world to truly realise that I couldn't imagine spending the rest of my life in another country to my family. 

I think now that I'm in my 30s I've become more family orientated and maybe more family dependent. I used to see family at least fortnightly. And I never disliked where I lived in the UK either. 

My partner and I have been here for 3 months now, and obviously that isn't long enough to give it time to settle. I'm enjoying where I am and getting settled in with work and we make the most of our days off exploring but I think at some point the pull of family will make is return. In the mean time will make the most of being in Oz.

I've followed your journey since the beginning - I'm glad you've had the opportunity to return and make considered decisions even if you do now see that the grass wasnt perhaps as green as you remembered it. Enjoy it while you can! 

[ramot]

2 hours ago, BritChickx said:

I've known since the first week I've been here that I will eventually move back to the UK. My partner feels the same way.

It's a funny thing really - I've spent almost a decade aiming to return to Aus after travelling here years ago and wanting give it a go at living here.

But it took me being on the other side of the world to truly realise that I couldn't imagine spending the rest of my life in another country to my family. 

I think now that I'm in my 30s I've become more family orientated and maybe more family dependent. I used to see family at least fortnightly. And I never disliked where I lived in the UK either. 

My partner and I have been here for 3 months now, and obviously that isn't long enough to give it time to settle. I'm enjoying where I am and getting settled in with work and we make the most of our days off exploring but I think at some point the pull of family will make is return. In the mean time will make the most of being in Oz.

The reality of emigrating is different to the dream. You worked incredibly hard to get here, so my advice having lived in several countries, unless you are really unhappy, give yourself time to settle, enjoy the experience of living in another country, and if or when the time is right,      make the decision that is right for you. 

Wish you both the very best, and hope you enjoy your time here, however long it is. x M

[Marisawright]

3 hours ago, BritChickx said:

I've known since the first week I've been here that I will eventually move back to the UK. My partner feels the same way.

It's a funny thing really - I've spent almost a decade aiming to return to Aus after travelling here years ago and wanting give it a go at living here.

 

You're discovering that there's a big difference between travelling in Australia as a young person and actually living here as an adult.  It's not just that Australia has changed, it's that you've changed. 

I agree with Ramot -- see it as an extended holiday for a year, or two, or three.  However, if your goal is to settle back in the UK eventually, don't leave it much longer than that.  It's surprisingly easy to get stuck in Australia, especially once you start a family.

[BritChickx]

22 hours ago, Quoll said:

I've followed your journey since the beginning - I'm glad you've had the opportunity to return and make considered decisions even if you do now see that the grass wasnt perhaps as green as you remembered it. Enjoy it while you can! 

 

20 hours ago, ramot said:

The reality of emigrating is different to the dream. You worked incredibly hard to get here, so my advice having lived in several countries, unless you are really unhappy, give yourself time to settle, enjoy the experience of living in another country, and if or when the time is right,      make the decision that is right for you. 

Wish you both the very best, and hope you enjoy your time here, however long it is. x M

 

19 hours ago, Marisawright said:

You're discovering that there's a big difference between travelling in Australia as a young person and actually living here as an adult.  It's not just that Australia has changed, it's that you've changed. 

I agree with Ramot -- see it as an extended holiday for a year, or two, or three.  However, if your goal is to settle back in the UK eventually, don't leave it much longer than that.  It's surprisingly easy to get stuck in Australia, especially once you start a family.

Thank you all for your replies and well wishes

I'm sure it has me that's changed but also I never really lived in Aus before, I only ever travelled. Obviously the usual daily grind exists and that's fine, but it's definitely made me think about what I want long term and it will eventually be to live close to family and keep to short term travel/holidays throughout the world. I have no regrets about coming and I won't be too hasty in returning.

There's a lot of things I like about Aus, and we are both on better wages so that helps too and will make the most of earning and saving more  .

We aren't sure on the area we are in either, it's gorgeous but we are after a bit more hustle and bustle so thinking about travelling for 2-3 months and then re-settling elsewhere if we decide to stick it out longer than 18 months.

At the moment we're just gonna see how things go. Now I've been working a couple of months I'm gonna make more of a conscious effort to meet people - going to meet up thing this weekend. We fully intend on making the most of being here though, have already booked an Aus holiday for next month  . 

PS not intending on starting a family, we don't want kids, so its just us which makes deciding what to do a bit easier as well. 

Edited September 8, 2023 by BritChickx

[simmo]

On 07/09/2023 at 05:42, BritChickx said:

I've known since the first week I've been here that I will eventually move back to the UK. My partner feels the same way.

It's a funny thing really - I've spent almost a decade aiming to return to Aus after travelling here years ago and wanting give it a go at living here.

But it took me being on the other side of the world to truly realise that I couldn't imagine spending the rest of my life in another country to my family. 

I think now that I'm in my 30s I've become more family orientated and maybe more family dependent. I used to see family at least fortnightly. And I never disliked where I lived in the UK either. 

My partner and I have been here for 3 months now, and obviously that isn't long enough to give it time to settle. I'm enjoying where I am and getting settled in with work and we make the most of our days off exploring but I think at some point the pull of family will make is return. In the mean time will make the most of being in Oz.

Sounds exactly like my experiance.  I had the time of my life backpacking in Australia but soon realised that living and working full time is a completly different kettle of fish.  Its an itch that needs to be scratched and if you never did it you will always be wondering "what if".  When you return, you will look at the UK and Europe with new eyes.

[22B]

On 08/09/2023 at 11:42, BritChickx said:

How lucky.

I have 3 children, a wife starting a new career path and I despise being here. I know that I will eventually leave them all, probably once the last child has formed their own life plan in around 10 years.

 

Quote

 

Thank you all for your replies and well wishes

I'm sure it has me that's changed but also I never really lived in Aus before, I only ever travelled. Obviously the usual daily grind exists and that's fine, but it's definitely made me think about what I want long term and it will eventually be to live close to family and keep to short term travel/holidays throughout the world. I have no regrets about coming and I won't be too hasty in returning.

There's a lot of things I like about Aus, and we are both on better wages so that helps too and will make the most of earning and saving more  .

We aren't sure on the area we are in either, it's gorgeous but we are after a bit more hustle and bustle so thinking about travelling for 2-3 months and then re-settling elsewhere if we decide to stick it out longer than 18 months.

At the moment we're just gonna see how things go. Now I've been working a couple of months I'm gonna make more of a conscious effort to meet people - going to meet up thing this weekend. We fully intend on making the most of being here though, have already booked an Aus holiday for next month  . 

PS not intending on starting a family, we don't want kids, so its just us which makes deciding what to do a bit easier as well. 

 

Edited October 12, 2023 by 22B

[Bristolgirl]

I agree with how most of you are feeling and send love and understanding. I find Australia to be quite soul-less to be honest, a fairly boring place to live, extremely expensive and Sydney born people less than welcoming. Caveat -maybe that is just living in a wealthy suburb where who you know, where you/your children went/go to private school and what you own are the main topics. Do not get me wrong if you are an extrovert, wealthy, love surfing, drinking and hot weather then Australia is paradise. If this doesn't apply you and you require a bit more subtlety and depth then you may struggle. It is very hot, impossible to find a rental that is not $$$$, Sydney people do not listen, speak over the top of you, are very rude - mean, gossipy, entitled and do not reply to messages. There is next to no culture, traffic is horrendous and there is very little to do apart from the beach/RSL. To sum up - Sydney is fun when you are young/travelling/holidaying but not for those who want real, deep and meaningful connections.

[jimmyay1]

i feel you .  its also a "living in Sydney" issue as much as anything.

No doubt about , it quality of life has decreased for many except the already pretty asset rich, over the last few years,  it is  a worldwide phenomenon but particularly pronounced in places like Sydney.

I love visiting Sydney, and go there a few times a year.... but would i want to live there and have the daily grind to contend with as well?  Probably not, unless it was for a year of "living in Sydney" just for the experience.  

With the big increase in the demand for  / cost of rental, or house prices, and other factors, it has become a bit of a rat race like London, albeit with an amazing lifestyle IF you have several million $.  

The only people i know are happy in Sydney, but they have no mortgage and live in the eastern suburbs. 

The pressure is then somewhat off, access to the parts worth living near is easy,  and they don't need to climb the greasy pole or work all hours - which kind of defeats the point for many of living there if all you do is work, particularly if you are a "lifestyle migrant" like many Brits are. Why make life more difficult for yourself? 

Other cities are easier. 

Its a bit of a myth that Sydney's the only place where you can have a good life. 

In terms of whether you find somewhere "boring" or not i think this depends to an extent on your outlook on life, and what you can find pleasure in, and how you can relate to people.   

Culturally, compared to say European cities or the UK, i have always found  Sydney to be relatively conformist / immature in terms of it's youth subcultures / outlook on life.  So many people look like clones of each other, dress the same, same haircut / talk about same schools, money, way past the age where people do that in say the UK.  

This isn't AS prevalent in other cities in Aus, which have more alternative scenes, and are genuinely more relaxed, but it is a little bit of an Australian city thing. 

Because many people don't leave home until their late 20s/30s and stay living with parents, go to local Unis. continue to hang out with school friends, it lends itself to a tendency towards a more inward looking, and "conformist" culture (with exceptions of course).

When i first started working in Melbourne, i found all the talk of "what school did you go to" quite baffling (after 15 years working in professional office jobs in London where i don't think i'd heard anyone's schooling been mentioned once) ....... until i realised the men in my Melbourne office and, many of the ones in senior position  had been to the same couple of private schools, lived in pretty much the  same suburb as they'd gone to school in,  had been to the same Unis, in Melbourne and had lived at home whilst they had studied, were mostly all friends, all followed the same football team etc, and helped recruit others with the same background etc.  

It was pretty much a closed clique, and felt like i'd walked into a time warp. This in the Melbourne office of big international company too - not some small suburban office. 

I had to just laugh it all off and ignore, move on and find my own space . You're never going to win or really join in fully in a situation like that, you just have to find your own groove and not give a **** about the other rubbish. It means as a migrant, to an extent you might always be viewed as a bit of an outsider,  and have the few struggles which come with that.  How you adapt to that is key to making a go of it.   

 As for climate.......as a resident of Melbourne it's certainly not hot all the time and we get very little of the east coast humidity. In fact the biggest beef by many  about Melb in terms of weather is that it is pretty changeable and cool to mild for a good chunk of the year.  

 

 

[InnerVoice]

23 hours ago, Bristolgirl said:

I agree with how most of you are feeling and send love and understanding. I find Australia to be quite soul-less to be honest, a fairly boring place to live, extremely expensive and Sydney born people less than welcoming. Caveat -maybe that is just living in a wealthy suburb where who you know, where you/your children went/go to private school and what you own are the main topics. Do not get me wrong if you are an extrovert, wealthy, love surfing, drinking and hot weather then Australia is paradise. If this doesn't apply you and you require a bit more subtlety and depth then you may struggle. It is very hot, impossible to find a rental that is not $$$$, Sydney people do not listen, speak over the top of you, are very rude - mean, gossipy, entitled and do not reply to messages. There is next to no culture, traffic is horrendous and there is very little to do apart from the beach/RSL. To sum up - Sydney is fun when you are young/travelling/holidaying but not for those who want real, deep and meaningful connections.

I loved surfing, drinking, and the hot weather (and still do, to a lesser extent), but after spending a year in Sydney when I first moved to Australia, I came to the same conclusion about Sydneysiders. I found them incredibly self-centred, superficial, and obsessed with material wealth. I left because I didn't like the people and had no desire to be part of their rat race, but I still think it's a beautiful city and a great place to visit for a few days. I'm sure Sydney's in no way unique in that respect, and you'll find the same mentality in any of the world's major commercial centres where people's main objective is to get rich and flaunt it.

[Bobj]

In other words, a rat race.as most big cities are.

Cheers, Bobj.