Is Dan Andrews doing the right thing?

[Alan Collett]

8 minutes ago, Paul1Perth said:

Well they had to make a decision on the distance and 5k means you can go out for a run, get to shops, bike ride maybe. 1k or 100m wouldn't allow much at all, would have been stupid. 

Seems pretty common sense that 5k seems about right.

The Covid app is still around but needs everyone to have it and use it properly for it to work. A lot of the people spreading the virus don't even believe it's a problem, they want to do their own thing, so they are hardly likely to use the covid app properly.

Living in Perth everyone here knows how lucky we are. You wouldn't know the virus had ever existed, apart from not being able to travel outside WA, but there's plenty to do here. No masks, places packed, no social distancing, no cases for ages.

You can see by the decrease in numbers of cases in Victoria you are on the right track. Unless you aim for zero cases and no transmission you are not going to get back to "normal", you would be on your guard all the time. 

The pain will be worth it in the end.

 

Thanks for the insight Paul - appreciated.

However ... what happens in the absence of a vaccine?  

Are we (Australia generally) going to be isolated from the rest of the world - apart from maybe NZ - for ever and a day?

Are we never going to be able to go to Europe again?    Have we signed up to that as an outcome?

Best regards.

[Alan Collett]

1 minute ago, HappyHeart said:

Firstly, COVID-19 is not influenza. We know relatively little about it but we do know that's it's MUCH MORE CONTAGIOUS AND DEADLY than flu. 

We know we have a flu vaccine and that by far the vast majority of over 65s and at risk groups get vaccinated. Yet still people die. 

People tend to die 'with' disease not 'of' disease. People with cancer, with chronic health conditions, the young, the elderly all live with varying degrees of immunosuppression. 

I reject this claim that some of us should be allowed to take our chances and vulnerable people should take precautions. That strategy condemns large numbers to a long life of isolation and misery due to the selfishness of others. 

The strategy should be elimination till a vaccine is found. We dont allow kids into schools and dsycare without up to date vaccinations. Why people are getting their knickers in a knot about this particular vaccine baffles me. I for one am prepared to live in this bubble till a vaccine is found...that may be a few years..Who knows. If local cases spike I accept lockdown as the quickest way to get back to NORMAL. 

I don't accept any number of deaths as collateral damage. Every one is someone's beloved person. I think the entire world needs a rethink society and what we value most. Capitalism requires sacrificial lambs to keep the world turning.  We can't serve 2 masters. 

I hear what you say, but respectfully disagree with most of it.

I suspect that in time not too far distant financial necessities and consequences in terms of unemployment and resulting misery will cause the Vic Government to see things more in line with my perspective than yours.

Best regards.

[Marisawright]

1 hour ago, Alan Collett said:

 

Thanks for the insight Paul - appreciated.

However ... what happens in the absence of a vaccine?  

Are we (Australia generally) going to be isolated from the rest of the world - apart from maybe NZ - for ever and a day?

Are we never going to be able to go to Europe again?    Have we signed up to that as an outcome?

That's a decision people are going to have to face up to at some point next year.  But the reality is that right now I don't see the WA, NT, QLD or TAS premiers or the New Zealand PM opening the borders - i haven't met an unhappy denizen of any of those states yet, except in the immediate border areas. Even the tourism industry seems to be coping pretty well with local trade.   And the premiers know that  if they did open the borders, as soon as Covid cases started to rise, (which they would), they'd get the blame and it wouild be political suicide. 

 I think that if Victoria decided to open up and just manage the numbers, they'd find themselves in a bubble of one, because all the other states would just keep their borders with Victoria closed.  So it wouldn't help much.   Sure, there will come a point where everyone will have to face the music if a vaccine isn't found, but after all, politicians are not famous for looking far into the future.

Edited September 11, 2020 by Marisawright

[Mike@Bonbeach]

Just going to put my 2 bob's worth into this discussion.

My situation is I am 80 years old living on my own since my dear wife died just over 2 years ago. My son and his family live more than 12 kms away so we can't even legally meet halfway for a catchup. I haven't seen my grandchildren since early July (except on Facetime), and they were the major reason for us emigrating to Australia in the first place. I live on an estate next to a golf club where the vast majority of us are members and well into our 60's, 70's and 80's. We all love our golf yet we cannot go and play, but it's OK to go off to the supermarket or Dan Murphys and mingle with loads of other people at quite close distances, try walking around a supermarket and keeping your 1.5 metres distance, yet looking out my window I can see a completely deserted golf club, who, incidentally we are still paying our annual subs to. Under stage 3 we were allowed to play in 2's and wear masks which we all did conscientiously, the club house was closed and your times on the course were recorded for tracing purposes. You arrived, played your round, no hand shakes and immediately left the course to go home. What was/is wrong with keeping to those restrictions?, at least we were out and about getting exercise and sunshine. Dan Andrews has blamed just about anybody for the current situation in Victoria yet the vast majority of the cases stemmed from his poor administration of the quarantine hotels. He says he doesn't know who authorised the curfew at night, the police say they never asked for it and the CHO didn't ask for it either. He didn't know who was responsible for the quarantine arrangements. Contact tracing was apparently being done on paper, and he has now sent a team of his so called heath administrators to Sydney so they can see how it is done there. It's been one big cock up after another.

We are being told to get out and exercise for an hour a day and we have a lovely walking track next to the river but again trying to keep your 1.5 meters distance is quite impossible with people jogging by breathing the exhaust fumes all over everyone they pass. What could be more healthier for a bunch of older folks than getting 4-5 hours fresh air and sunshine than walking around a huge open space like a golf course.

The so called "singles bubble" which comes into effect on the 14th September. Well, I can have one person visit me yet if I want to go and see my son he has to make sure there is nobody else in the house, what's his wife and kids supposed to do if I do go visiting, and we have to wear masks, yet if I was one of an intimate couple living apart from each other, I could visit and not be limited to the 5kms or have to wear a mask. It seems that so many of these restrictions have been thought up on the go, probably written down on the back of a fag packet, with no thought to the consequences of peoples general health and mental wellbeing.

You may feel that my take over this Covid-19 fiasco in Victoria is just a lot of sour grapes, it may well be, but I have never felt so lonely or angry in my 80 years, and I am sorry but apart from the initial out break back in the first couple of months of 2020  the rest of the responsibility lies fairly and squarely on the shoulders of Daniel Andrews and his administration.

Keep safe everyone.

Mike 

[newjez]

1 hour ago, Mike@Bonbeach said:

Just going to put my 2 bob's worth into this discussion.

My situation is I am 80 years old living on my own since my dear wife died just over 2 years ago. My son and his family live more than 12 kms away so we can't even legally meet halfway for a catchup. I haven't seen my grandchildren since early July (except on Facetime), and they were the major reason for us emigrating to Australia in the first place. I live on an estate next to a golf club where the vast majority of us are members and well into our 60's, 70's and 80's. We all love our golf yet we cannot go and play, but it's OK to go off to the supermarket or Dan Murphys and mingle with loads of other people at quite close distances, try walking around a supermarket and keeping your 1.5 metres distance, yet looking out my window I can see a completely deserted golf club, who, incidentally we are still paying our annual subs to. Under stage 3 we were allowed to play in 2's and wear masks which we all did conscientiously, the club house was closed and your times on the course were recorded for tracing purposes. You arrived, played your round, no hand shakes and immediately left the course to go home. What was/is wrong with keeping to those restrictions?, at least we were out and about getting exercise and sunshine. Dan Andrews has blamed just about anybody for the current situation in Victoria yet the vast majority of the cases stemmed from his poor administration of the quarantine hotels. He says he doesn't know who authorised the curfew at night, the police say they never asked for it and the CHO didn't ask for it either. He didn't know who was responsible for the quarantine arrangements. Contact tracing was apparently being done on paper, and he has now sent a team of his so called heath administrators to Sydney so they can see how it is done there. It's been one big cock up after another.

We are being told to get out and exercise for an hour a day and we have a lovely walking track next to the river but again trying to keep your 1.5 meters distance is quite impossible with people jogging by breathing the exhaust fumes all over everyone they pass. What could be more healthier for a bunch of older folks than getting 4-5 hours fresh air and sunshine than walking around a huge open space like a golf course.

The so called "singles bubble" which comes into effect on the 14th September. Well, I can have one person visit me yet if I want to go and see my son he has to make sure there is nobody else in the house, what's his wife and kids supposed to do if I do go visiting, and we have to wear masks, yet if I was one of an intimate couple living apart from each other, I could visit and not be limited to the 5kms or have to wear a mask. It seems that so many of these restrictions have been thought up on the go, probably written down on the back of a fag packet, with no thought to the consequences of peoples general health and mental wellbeing.

You may feel that my take over this Covid-19 fiasco in Victoria is just a lot of sour grapes, it may well be, but I have never felt so lonely or angry in my 80 years, and I am sorry but apart from the initial out break back in the first couple of months of 2020  the rest of the responsibility lies fairly and squarely on the shoulders of Daniel Andrews and his administration.

Keep safe everyone.

Mike 

I do admit that mental health is important, and the government should be doing everything they can to improve mental health.

That's why my son is back at school in the UK against my better judgement. He needs it, and the risk where I live is low.

Alot of the rules our government impose on us don't make sense. Golf is a classic example. 

There has to be a balance.

But I can't see us not getting a vaccine due to the sheer number of vaccines in development.

Edited September 11, 2020 by newjez

[starlight7]

I have always been a hugger and a kisser and so have 90% of my friends, male and female, so our social lives have been downgraded probably even when we can meet again. Elbow touching just doesn't cut it I'm afraid. Just heard the UK has had 3,000 new cases today.  Well we would just about drop our bundles if that happened here- we really worry about a few dozen. One of my little grandchildren is very, very sad she cannot attend school because she is in Grade 6- a big year, last of her primary school and nothing to show for it- no proposed celebrations, no graduation day, no parties.   Very distressing. I am not keen on Dan but then I think he does try his best and the alternative would quite possibly be a lot worse. Hard to know what should be done and hard now because many have lost trust in the state government.

[SWMOY04]

On 10/09/2020 at 21:01, Alan Collett said:

IMHO the 5k radius is arbitrary - why not 1k, or 100 metres? 

Indeed, what happened to the much touted COVID app?

Best regards.

Because the average person walks at just over 5km/hr

Therefore if you are allowing people an hour of excercise (walking jogging etc) it makes sense to have a radius around that distance. 

Try doing laps of 100m for an hour... on your street and you'll see why your "arbitrary" method makes less sense than the more sensible 5km radius.

One of the main things necessary to fight this condition if/when you do get it is relative cardiovascular and pulmonary fitness... So walking and excercise is good in preparation for your body, in case you ever get it. Therefore...they can't promote excercise and then not facilitate it. Amongst other things.

NO ONE HAS GOT ANYTHING RIGHT in terms of all the lockdown methods... Everyone is trying what may or may not work... I don't know Dan Andrews.. I didnt vote for the man .. but I doubt he would sit there with his pinky in his teeth scheming how to take advantage of this pandemic

 

[\begin rant]

Economy can stuff it, no monetary value can be placed on human lives. 

All you cooing about dictatorships should try living under a TRUE dictatorship, without the backing of a western citizenship and consulate.... Then you'll know why there's so many refugees in Oz

Think Dan Andrews is a dictator? Jump on a boat and go to New Zealand, they are mandated by international law to accept refugees, let's see if they take you seriously with your claims of "dictator Dan". Otherwise, shut up...(about dictatorship)

 

[/Rant over]

Edited September 12, 2020 by SWMOY04

[Dusty Plains]

23 hours ago, Alan Collett said:

 

Thanks for the insight Paul - appreciated.

However ... what happens in the absence of a vaccine?  

Are we (Australia generally) going to be isolated from the rest of the world - apart from maybe NZ - for ever and a day?

Are we never going to be able to go to Europe again?    Have we signed up to that as an outcome?

Best regards.

There may never be a cure, and there may never be an effective vaccine for all humanity. If Australia becomes isolated it will be  because of the need for heightened degree of national security.  If Australia has a vaccine for its entire population, and our neighbours to the north do not have access to the vaccine. then we will undoubtedly have a dire problem at our borders.  

[Alan Collett]

59 minutes ago, SWMOY04 said:

Because the average person walks at just over 5km/hr

Therefore if you are allowing people an hour of excercise (walking jogging etc) it makes sense to have a radius around that distance. 

Try doing laps of 100m for an hour... on your street and you'll see why your "arbitrary" method makes less sense than the more sensible 5km radius.

One of the main things necessary to fight this condition if/when you do get it is relative cardiovascular and pulmonary fitness... So walking and excercise is good in preparation for your body, in case you ever get it. Therefore...they can't promote excercise and then not facilitate it. Amongst other things.

NO ONE HAS GOT ANYTHING RIGHT in terms of all the lockdown methods... Everyone is trying what may or may not work... I don't know Dan Andrews.. I didnt vote for the man .. but I doubt he would sit there with his pinky in his teeth scheming how to take advantage of this pandemic

 

[\begin rant]

Economy can stuff it, no monetary value can be placed on human lives. 

All you cooing about dictatorships should try living under a TRUE dictatorship, without the backing of a western citizenship and consulate.... Then you'll know why there's so many refugees in Oz

Think Dan Andrews is a dictator? Jump on a boat and go to New Zealand, they are mandated by international law to accept refugees, let's see if they take you seriously with your claims of "dictator Dan". Otherwise, shut up...(about dictatorship)

 

[/Rant over]

*   At the risk of being pedantic, a 5km radius and walking at 5km/hour means it would take 2 hours to walk the permitted maximum distance and back.    It was only last week the number of hours increased from 1 hour a day.

*   No economy means no money to pay health professionals, as exhibited by many socialist run basket cases around the world.   As someone who (originally) claimed to be a health professional I invite you to consider how you would be paid if the economy couldn't afford to pay you or your colleagues.   Like it or not Governments need a properly working economy to raise revenue to pay for various aspects of social care and service delivery.

*   No value should be placed on human lives?    Are you saying keep everyone alive irrespective of cost?   That's an idealistic perspective, and clearly not one that is realistic, or one that is taken on board by Governments generally which usually operate with a measure of pragmatism when considering the cost of otherwise avoidable deaths. 

Best regards.

[Paul1Perth]

On 11/09/2020 at 11:12, Alan Collett said:

 

Thanks for the insight Paul - appreciated.

However ... what happens in the absence of a vaccine?  

Are we (Australia generally) going to be isolated from the rest of the world - apart from maybe NZ - for ever and a day?

Are we never going to be able to go to Europe again?    Have we signed up to that as an outcome?

Best regards.

I think Europe are only just realising how serious it is to try and ride it out, have herd immunity or whatever their reasons are.

Spain, France, Portugal, Greece were so desperate to get holiday makers there and their economy moving their numbers of cases have skyrocketed. It was common sense that this would happen and now they are all thinking about second and sometimes third lockdowns.

Greece and Portugal didn't have that many cases, now they have loads. The UK have lots of places "locked down" but it's so much harder to do there with so many roads and towns running in to each other. Our relations are all in the UK and have had restrictions of some kind since March. They all admit to being sick of it but they haven't a clue when it's going to end. 

The government there never hit it hard enough at the very start. They've got months of restrictions to come yet and I've a feeling that a lot of people are just going to ignore the rules now.

We should have been going back for a holiday and a wedding in July. Obviously postponed till next year. As things stand I can't see me and the wife going next year. Won't be worth the risk. Have to hope Greece or somewhere, maybe one of the Islands gets on top of it and we'll risk a holiday there maybe.

Summers on the way, we'll just have to make do with WA for a while yet. Plenty to do.

[Paul1Perth]

On 11/09/2020 at 12:44, Mike@Bonbeach said:

Just going to put my 2 bob's worth into this discussion.

My situation is I am 80 years old living on my own since my dear wife died just over 2 years ago. My son and his family live more than 12 kms away so we can't even legally meet halfway for a catchup. I haven't seen my grandchildren since early July (except on Facetime), and they were the major reason for us emigrating to Australia in the first place. I live on an estate next to a golf club where the vast majority of us are members and well into our 60's, 70's and 80's. We all love our golf yet we cannot go and play, but it's OK to go off to the supermarket or Dan Murphys and mingle with loads of other people at quite close distances, try walking around a supermarket and keeping your 1.5 metres distance, yet looking out my window I can see a completely deserted golf club, who, incidentally we are still paying our annual subs to. Under stage 3 we were allowed to play in 2's and wear masks which we all did conscientiously, the club house was closed and your times on the course were recorded for tracing purposes. You arrived, played your round, no hand shakes and immediately left the course to go home. What was/is wrong with keeping to those restrictions?, at least we were out and about getting exercise and sunshine. Dan Andrews has blamed just about anybody for the current situation in Victoria yet the vast majority of the cases stemmed from his poor administration of the quarantine hotels. He says he doesn't know who authorised the curfew at night, the police say they never asked for it and the CHO didn't ask for it either. He didn't know who was responsible for the quarantine arrangements. Contact tracing was apparently being done on paper, and he has now sent a team of his so called heath administrators to Sydney so they can see how it is done there. It's been one big cock up after another.

We are being told to get out and exercise for an hour a day and we have a lovely walking track next to the river but again trying to keep your 1.5 meters distance is quite impossible with people jogging by breathing the exhaust fumes all over everyone they pass. What could be more healthier for a bunch of older folks than getting 4-5 hours fresh air and sunshine than walking around a huge open space like a golf course.

The so called "singles bubble" which comes into effect on the 14th September. Well, I can have one person visit me yet if I want to go and see my son he has to make sure there is nobody else in the house, what's his wife and kids supposed to do if I do go visiting, and we have to wear masks, yet if I was one of an intimate couple living apart from each other, I could visit and not be limited to the 5kms or have to wear a mask. It seems that so many of these restrictions have been thought up on the go, probably written down on the back of a fag packet, with no thought to the consequences of peoples general health and mental wellbeing.

You may feel that my take over this Covid-19 fiasco in Victoria is just a lot of sour grapes, it may well be, but I have never felt so lonely or angry in my 80 years, and I am sorry but apart from the initial out break back in the first couple of months of 2020  the rest of the responsibility lies fairly and squarely on the shoulders of Daniel Andrews and his administration.

Keep safe everyone.

Mike 

See your point about the golf mate. They closed courses here for a while and if there's a sport, apart from funning or bikevriding on your own, where you'd feel safe and still be able to mingle with mates and have a laugh golf is it.

They messed up royally there with the quarantine and I heard they'd traced a lot of cases to the BLM demos. All hushed up now I reckon.

Your numbers are coming down fast though and hopefully it's only a matter of weeks before you maybe get to see your rellies. Either that or the golf course open up again.

All the best, have a bit more patience and you should come through it OK. Certainly a lot better than the UK at the moment.

[Nemesis]

On 11/09/2020 at 14:13, Marisawright said:

That's a decision people are going to have to face up to at some point next year.  But the reality is that right now I don't see the WA, NT, QLD or TAS premiers or the New Zealand PM opening the borders - i haven't met an unhappy denizen of any of those states yet, except in the immediate border areas. .

Just because you haven't met us all doesn't mean we do not exist.. 

[starlight7]

I am glad they are being tough on those having lockdown protests.  They are selfish people and they are trying to undo all the pain of the rest of us who do isolate and are staying away from friends and family. They should throw the book at them.Pity they can't force them to work in a Covid ward.

[SWMOY04]

 

9 hours ago, Alan Collett said:

*   At the risk of being pedantic, a 5km radius and walking at 5km/hour means it would take 2 hours to walk the permitted maximum distance and back.    It was only last week the number of hours increased from 1 hour a day.

*   No economy means no money to pay health professionals, as exhibited by many socialist run basket cases around the world.   As someone who (originally) claimed to be a health professional I invite you to consider how you would be paid if the economy couldn't afford to pay you or your colleagues.   Like it or not Governments need a properly working economy to raise revenue to pay for various aspects of social care and service delivery.

*   No value should be placed on human lives?    Are you saying keep everyone alive irrespective of cost?   That's an idealistic perspective, and clearly not one that is realistic, or one that is taken on board by Governments generally which usually operate with a measure of pragmatism when considering the cost of otherwise avoidable deaths. 

Best regards.

Face-meet-palm

-average...AVERAGE... that means, some people need that much space to walk, whilst others would jog it, and others would take it a s a"walk in the park" if you excuse the pun (if they are into running)... so they have to AVERAGE it out for everything from the couch potato to the fastest Victorian runner. no way would they MANDATE that everyone HAS TO WALK 5km (radius)...c'mon now... lol

-if you think I am bothered/motivated by pay when I am watching patients and colleagues dying, you clearly have no clue about the majority of healthcare professionals, yes, I am one of them, for whatever reason that line got lost in the edit

-its impossible to keep everyone alive, I am obviously not that stupid. But I wouldn't risk unnecessary deaths all in the name of "economy"

like i said, no one has gotten ANYTHING right, but we are definitely NOT doing anything wrong by being cautious

 

[Tulip1]

5 hours ago, SWMOY04 said:

 

Face-meet-palm

-average...AVERAGE... that means, some people need that much space to walk, whilst others would jog it, and others would take it a s a"walk in the park" if you excuse the pun (if they are into running)... so they have to AVERAGE it out for everything from the couch potato to the fastest Victorian runner. no way would they MANDATE that everyone HAS TO WALK 5km (radius)...c'mon now... lol

-if you think I am bothered/motivated by pay when I am watching patients and colleagues dying, you clearly have no clue about the majority of healthcare professionals, yes, I am one of them, for whatever reason that line got lost in the edit

-its impossible to keep everyone alive, I am obviously not that stupid. But I wouldn't risk unnecessary deaths all in the name of "economy"

like i said, no one has gotten ANYTHING right, but we are definitely NOT doing anything wrong by being cautious

 

You seem to be quite a fan of capital letters.  

Edited September 12, 2020 by Tulip1

[SWMOY04]

9 hours ago, Tulip1 said:

You seem to be quite a fan of capital letters.  

I AM!!! 

[Dusty Plains]

On 11/09/2020 at 13:12, Alan Collett said:

Are we (Australia generally) going to be isolated from the rest of the world - apart from maybe NZ - for ever and a day?

Are we never going to be able to go to Europe again?    Have we signed up to that as an outcome?

1.Possibly, if there is no vaccine;

2. Let's hope not. If there is no vaccine then anyone leaving Australia will be almost guaranteed that they cannot return.  I'd be happy with that.

[Marisawright]

On 12/09/2020 at 20:37, Nemesis said:

Just because you haven't met us all doesn't mean we do not exist.. 

I didn’t say otherwise, I am aware some Victorians are anti but not anyone of my acquaintance

[Jon the Hat]

3 hours ago, Marisawright said:

I didn’t say otherwise, I am aware some Victorians are anti but not anyone of my acquaintance

If being anti gets you a visit from the police then I can see why!

[Marisawright]

7 hours ago, Jon the Hat said:

If being anti gets you a visit from the police then I can see why!

Haha, we don't have the thought police yet.  Expressing opinions on Facebook and other social media is not a crime, nor is having conversations with friends. I'm a member of some large Facebook groups.

[starlight7]

There was an anti person on one of my facebook accounts and facebook actually removed his posts which I found interesting.  He is a pretty immature individual and ranted on in quite an extreme way about conspiracies and he thought the virus didn't exist at all.

[Rossmoyne]

I don't live in Victoria so I possibly shouldn't comment about Dan the man.   But I do have many friends who do live there, and whilst they are doing all that they are required to do, they are beginning to wonder if Dan is the full quid.... so to speak.   It would seem to me from what they tell me and from what I read in the media, that the whole second wave there was down to a BLM riot, a lack of professional hotel quarantine rules and supervision, a lack of efficient contact tracing, and a curfew that no-one will put their hands up to agreeing to.  Not to mention the way the Victorian Police are acting recently.   Surely he should take responsibility for all of those failures as he is after all, the Premier?!   I personally think he is doomed now whatever he does.   He shrugs off questions from the media with a "I will get back to you" and never does... surely if he wants a political life after this, he would be as up front and transparent as possible....  As I say, just my view, but thankfully I live in WA and maybe my view is slanted because we are in a much better situation than Victoria.    My heart bleeds for my Victorian friends and everyone else there.

[Alan Collett]

20 minutes ago, Rossmoyne said:

I don't live in Victoria so I possibly shouldn't comment about Dan the man.   But I do have many friends who do live there, and whilst they are doing all that they are required to do, they are beginning to wonder if Dan is the full quid.... so to speak.   It would seem to me from what they tell me and from what I read in the media, that the whole second wave there was down to a BLM riot, a lack of professional hotel quarantine rules and supervision, a lack of efficient contact tracing, and a curfew that no-one will put their hands up to agreeing to.  Not to mention the way the Victorian Police are acting recently.   Surely he should take responsibility for all of those failures as he is after all, the Premier?!   I personally think he is doomed now whatever he does.   He shrugs off questions from the media with a "I will get back to you" and never does... surely if he wants a political life after this, he would be as up front and transparent as possible....  As I say, just my view, but thankfully I live in WA and maybe my view is slanted because we are in a much better situation than Victoria.    My heart bleeds for my Victorian friends and everyone else there.

There are many who think that Dan can do no wrong - but the polls appear to be moving against him.

If the past is any guide to the future his colleagues in the State ALP will let Dan take the flak, and then move against him in time for the 2022 State election.

"Daniel Andrews’ government has suffered a significant swing against it in five key marginal seats polled this week.

The shock poll suggests ­angry voters are punishing the Labor Party for its failures in the second coronavirus wave — triggered by the botched hotel quarantine program and fuelled by contact tracing bungling.

The MediaReach poll of more than 3000 voters in the marginal Labor seats of Bayswater, Hawthorn, Mount Waverley, South Barwon and Monbulk — held by Deputy Premier James Merlino — ­revealed all would be lost if an election was held this week.

The polling, secretly done for the state Liberal Party leadership and obtained by the Herald Sun, shows an average swing away from Labor of a staggering 14.35 per cent across the five seats on a two party-preferred basis."

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/victoria/new-poll-reveals-victorians-frustrations-with-andrews-government/news-story/b82feaae60f856e1cec4ee7ef091cf0c

Best regards.

[rtritudr]

21 hours ago, Alan Collett said:

The MediaReach poll of more than 3000 voters in the marginal Labor seats of Bayswater, Hawthorn, Mount Waverley, South Barwon and Monbulk — held by Deputy Premier James Merlino — ­revealed all would be lost if an election was held this week.

The polling, secretly done for the state Liberal Party leadership and obtained by the Herald Sun, shows an average swing away from Labor of a staggering 14.35 per cent across the five seats on a two party-preferred basis."

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/victoria/new-poll-reveals-victorians-frustrations-with-andrews-government/news-story/b82feaae60f856e1cec4ee7ef091cf0c

Hmm, a poll commissioned by the Liberal Party reported by the Murdoch Herald Sun.

[Alan Collett]

3 minutes ago, rtritudr said:

Hmm, a poll commissioned by the Liberal Party reported by the Murdoch Herald Sun.

Well the State ALP seemed to take it seriously enough to consider a leadership spill ...

Best regards.