Still here and still feel the pull

[Antipodista]

What on earth is going on with this thread? People being rude and using “dearie” and “diddle dums” and this nonsense? Accusing others of being argumentative…whilst simultaneously being passive aggressive and argumentative?!

This seems to - yet again - come back to the usual inability to respect and understand that one person may prefer one country/area/state/thing to another. To be unable to offer an opinion without dragging another person’s.

It mirrors social media - and media in general - these days, and it’s bonkers.

To the OP - I hope the thread gets back on track soon as this all probably hasn’t helped how you are feeling  Sending you best wishes xxx

[perthpom1]

Hi Lucia, keen to see how it is going for you. Have you progressed or made any further decisions? I feel  ( and was dreading) I was heading in the same direction, and would be stuck here,  but luckily my partner is keen to return home also. 

[calNgary]

Over a page of posts removed due to breaching forum rules . Stay on topic, avoid personal comments about other members or don't post.

  

         Cal x

[Barnyrubble]

I am just reading these blogs and am so concerned.  Our children and grandchildren live in Australia very happily but want us there.  I am so scared.  I love the UK, being near Europe, feeling financially comfortable but the thought of being there aged 70 with financial insecurity and lonely and 'stuck' is making me feel sick.  My spouse wants to try it though but friends downunder are telling us we need at least $100k to live there comfortably and we haven't got that.  But I have many worries.  Here everything is so close  free bus travel  free medical and medicine.  I feel all I will have there is the same every day of my life from the day I arrive.  HELP?

[Quoll]

3 hours ago, Barnyrubble said:

I am just reading these blogs and am so concerned.  Our children and grandchildren live in Australia very happily but want us there.  I am so scared.  I love the UK, being near Europe, feeling financially comfortable but the thought of being there aged 70 with financial insecurity and lonely and 'stuck' is making me feel sick.  My spouse wants to try it though but friends downunder are telling us we need at least $100k to live there comfortably and we haven't got that.  But I have many worries.  Here everything is so close  free bus travel  free medical and medicine.  I feel all I will have there is the same every day of my life from the day I arrive.  HELP?

So, essentially, your children want you there but you don't really want to go? 

People on here will certainly disagree but I pay everything on my credit card and pay it off every month and that averages around the $7k per month (that's bottom line $84k without rent!). That doesn't include rent because we own our own home. We pay little in power because we have solar hot water and my husband scavenges wood. We are running a very elderly car that belongs to our son but we haven't been going anywhere anyway. I do get free bus travel. We pay health insurance and have certainly had some $$$ medical outgoings. We don't stint, that's for sure and I go out (locally) quite a bit and spend money on coffees and meals if I fancy it. We both have hobbies so I will spend money on yarn if I want. I choose the premium cinema on the rare occasion I go to the movies. We are slowly renovating our house but only the little things get put on the credit card. Our son hunts so we spend less on meat than we might otherwise do.  Can you spend less than us? of course you can but, fortunately we don't need to scrimp and save, life would certainly be much more miserable and I see some of my friends who are in that situation and who hesitate before buying a coffee at a social gathering - some of them are really struggling.   One of our sons lives on the smell of an oily rag in the bush - hunts or grows his food, owns his own place but still needs a few thousand a month for rates, power, broadband, petrol, insurances, rego, maintenance items and the food things he doesn't grow (he loves cheese but doesn't have and doesn't want the tie of a cow). It's not a cheap place to live and the safety networks would be non existent if you were on a bridging visa (they're not great if you're a permanent resident either)

You'd probably find it cheaper to come over for a couple of months every year - my parents came for 6 months a year (summer!!!) for 16 years before they decided that although they absolutely loved Australia they were more comfortable in their own home with their own friends and the NHS. At the point you stop visiting, you could help your kids with fares  to visit you if they can't afford the trip - and it would all cost less than the £100k+ than your visa to live here. 

Your kids have made the decision about what to do with their lives, and, in the same way, that we always say parents shouldn't stop their kids from choosing their own adventure in life, so your kids should not be telling you that you have to have an adventure you dont particularly want.  If you're not 100% on doing it and the thought of doing it is making you feel sick then don't do it. 

Good luck with your decision. 

Edited May 16, 2022 by Quoll

[Parley]

Quoll must live like the Queen. Honestly who spends $7K a month on themselves. No one else i expect. Especially if no rent or mortgage involved.

The ASFA retirement standard for a comfortable lifestyle for a couple is only just over $64K a year.

I probably spend $2000 to $2500 a month and don't feel like i am depriving myself.

[NicF]

1 hour ago, Parley said:

Quoll must live like the Queen. Honestly who spends $7K a month on themselves. No one else i expect. Especially if no rent or mortgage involved.

The ASFA retirement standard for a comfortable lifestyle for a couple is only just over $64K a year.

I probably spend $2000 to $2500 a month and don't feel like i am depriving myself.

Have to agree.  I don't have a mortgage but support myself, husband, two kids at Uni and a dog on about $4k a month.  And we have only just put solar on, don't get free bus travel and don't have anyone giving us meat occasionally to reduce our costs either.

 

I do however agree with Quoll that parents should not move over just because the kids want them to.

[Parley]

9 minutes ago, NicF said:

Have to agree.  I don't have a mortgage but support myself, husband, two kids at Uni and a dog on about $4k a month.  And we have only just put solar on, don't get free bus travel and don't have anyone giving us meat occasionally to reduce our costs either.

 

I do however agree with Quoll that parents should not move over just because the kids want them to.

Yes I am probably about $4K a month too taking into account the large annual bills like Council Rates and Home and Car Insurances. 

Having some regular income certainly helps, even part time in retirement would make things more comfortable. Either from Superannuation or some part time work.

 

[Toots]

6 hours ago, Barnyrubble said:

I am just reading these blogs and am so concerned.  Our children and grandchildren live in Australia very happily but want us there.  I am so scared.  I love the UK, being near Europe, feeling financially comfortable but the thought of being there aged 70 with financial insecurity and lonely and 'stuck' is making me feel sick.  My spouse wants to try it though but friends downunder are telling us we need at least $100k to live there comfortably and we haven't got that.  But I have many worries.  Here everything is so close  free bus travel  free medical and medicine.  I feel all I will have there is the same every day of my life from the day I arrive.  HELP?

Your children want you to live in Australia but what do YOU really want to do?  Feeling concerned and scared about the whole thing is not good for your health.  It would be a lot cheaper as Quoll suggests, to come for a long holiday each year.  My Mum did that every second year.  She did love her long holidays here during the UK winter but she was also perfectly happy to return to her life in Scotland with her long time friends and she had a great social life there too.  Of course if would have been lovely to have had her here all the time but realistically we both worked full time and the kids were at school so she would have been on her own a lot.  It's not an easy decision for you to make as you seem to be perfectly happy with your current lifestyle which would be hard to give up to move to the other side of the world  ......................  even if you would be closer to your children and grandchildren.

[Quoll]

4 hours ago, Parley said:

Quoll must live like the Queen. Honestly who spends $7K a month on themselves. No one else i expect. Especially if no rent or mortgage involved.

The ASFA retirement standard for a comfortable lifestyle for a couple is only just over $64K a year.

I probably spend $2000 to $2500 a month and don't feel like i am depriving myself.

I dunno where it goes either but 360 health insurance, 1000 groceries, 80 broadband, 150 petrol, 60 medications, 75 power, 50 water, 100 coffee/lunches, 40 phones, rates 500 pm plus the other odd 2000 for a one off dental (that’s this month), 400 annual sub for a hobby (have two of them), 1500 for a one off car fix, 1000 car rego, 1000 buildings insurance 800 contents insurance - the “one offs” come with horrible regularity and, as I said, minor house Reno stuff so Bunnings gets 300 a month.  Sure we could economise - I didn’t need 2 coffees this morning, nor did I need 10 skeins of yarn at the local wool show but it all mounts up! We don’t drink, go out for expensive meals every week (once a month maybe and that’s 200), smoke, go away or gamble. It’s getting more expensive by the month.

So for someone who doesn’t have that sort of access to cash and who knows they would be on a fixed income I’d say they have every right to be concerned. 

[Loopylu]

33 minutes ago, Quoll said:

I dunno where it goes either but 360 health insurance, 1000 groceries, 80 broadband, 150 petrol, 60 medications, 75 power, 50 water, 100 coffee/lunches, 40 phones, rates 500 pm plus the other odd 2000 for a one off dental (that’s this month), 400 annual sub for a hobby (have two of them), 1500 for a one off car fix, 1000 car rego, 1000 buildings insurance 800 contents insurance - the “one offs” come with horrible regularity and, as I said, minor house Reno stuff so Bunnings gets 300 a month.  Sure we could economise - I didn’t need 2 coffees this morning, nor did I need 10 skeins of yarn at the local wool show but it all mounts up! We don’t drink, go out for expensive meals every week (once a month maybe and that’s 200), smoke, go away or gamble. It’s getting more expensive by the month.

So for someone who doesn’t have that sort of access to cash and who knows they would be on a fixed income I’d say they have every right to be concerned. 

Australia is not a cheap place to live. At least in the UK all medications are free to those on an aged pension… no need if you are on a low income to choose between your health and food/rent.

[Barnyrubble]

Ouch.  So what's that annually?

[beketamun]

3 hours ago, Loopylu said:

Australia is not a cheap place to live. At least in the UK all medications are free to those on an aged pension… no need if you are on a low income to choose between your health and food/rent.

with the health insurance over here you get straight in for treatments, leaving the ones with no health insurance in the public queue, which should theoretically be reduced making the waiting time shorter for those without insurance.  That's important in these covid days with lengthening public queues due to delays, there is a huge backlog in the public system and so many serious illnesses undiagnosed or untreated.

It's a sort of self-imposed means test leaving the choice to those who can afford to pay, the theory being that if you have the money, you won't put yourself at the mercy of the public system.  They never had full NHS here so no sense of grandfathered entitlement to totally free care at the point of delivery.  The issue is of course, healthcare costs are rising faster than wages so if you want the same treatment, people have to pay more.

 

8 hours ago, Parley said:

Quoll must live like the Queen. Honestly who spends $7K a month on themselves. No one else i expect. Especially if no rent or mortgage involved.

The ASFA retirement standard for a comfortable lifestyle for a couple is only just over $64K a year.

I probably spend $2000 to $2500 a month and don't feel like i am depriving myself.

To be honest, that's not a bad figure to work on.  If you're retired for 30 years you're still going to need a couple of new cars, some renovations, probably extra healthcare costs as you get older.  $4k is good for a maintenance budget.  We live off $4k a month now and we're both working, but we save a lot more.  We will be able to easily maintain ourselves on $4k post retirement but are budgeting for more than double that because we won't be able to just take a work contract to make up a shortfall.

[ramot]

4 hours ago, Loopylu said:

Australia is not a cheap place to live. At least in the UK all medications are free to those on an aged pension… no need if you are on a low income to choose between your health and food/rent.

A brief synopsis

The PBS Safety Net Threshold 1st January 2022,                                                           $326,40 for concession card holders.    $1542,10 for general patients

Cost of scripts before the threshold met           $6,80 for concession card holders                     $42,50 for general patients  

Once you reach the Threshold.                          

medicine free for concession card holders            Cost up to $6,80 for general patients                   If you combine all your family scripts as my husband and I do you should reach the threshold sooner. 

There are several different concession cards for Australian pensioners

We usually reach our threshold by July. we don't have a concession card as we aren’t eligible for an Australian pension, so pay $6,80 for our scripts till the end of December.                                                          
Almost all of our retired friends have  concession cards and meet the threshold quite early in the year for free scripts.  

Edited May 17, 2022 by ramot

[Parley]

31 minutes ago, beketamun said:

To be honest, that's not a bad figure to work on.  If you're retired for 30 years you're still going to need a couple of new cars, some renovations, probably extra healthcare costs as you get older.  $4k is good for a maintenance budget.  We live off $4k a month now and we're both working, but we save a lot more.  We will be able to easily maintain ourselves on $4k post retirement but are budgeting for more than double that because we won't be able to just take a work contract to make up a shortfall.

The reality is most people would have nowhere near the resources in retirement to support a lifestyle of $84K per year.

You would need a minimum of $2M in investments on top of your home to fund that. Probably more. Maybe top 15% of Australians would have that. Most would not.

I'm happy for Quoll that she can afford that lifestyle, but to portray it as typical is simply wrong.

 

[Barnyrubble]

Thank you for that.  We would not qualify for a concession i dont think as we cant access an Australian pension.  

 

[Barnyrubble]

Wow. To be in a position you couldnt afford a coffee must be a hard life.  And $7k a month without rent is unbelievable.

We love Australia and we love rhe UK.  Hard choice and we have about a week to make it. Our house sale is priceeding, so do we buy a deautiful downsize and be free to do whatever, whenever and suffer any consequences when we are old??  Who knows whats going to happen but i will let you know.

 

[Marisawright]

15 minutes ago, Barnyrubble said:

Thank you for that.  We would not qualify for a concession i dont think as we cant access an Australian pension.  

 

If you have a permanent visa (i.e. your RRV) then you get some concessions, it has nothing to do with the pension.  We don't get the pension yet but we get the concession, which means each item costs $6.80.  You also don't need the pension to get concessions on public transport. 

Edited May 17, 2022 by Marisawright

[Barnyrubble]

I thought we qualified for a semior card but mot a concession card for PBS.  Different info from Different people.  Confusing or what!

[Barnyrubble]

And your food bills are up to 40% higher than here plus the cost of living there is 30% higher.   How do you all afford it!?

[Marisawright]

6 minutes ago, Barnyrubble said:

I thought we qualified for a semior card but mot a concession card for PBS.  Different info from Different people.  Confusing or what!

It's not different info, it's just how people refer to the cards.  They all give you a concessionary price but the name of the card is different. The proper name for the card we have is the Commonwealth Senior Health Card.  That qualifies us for the $6.80 price. 

[ramot]

21 minutes ago, Marisawright said:

It's not different info, it's just how people refer to the cards.  They all give you a concessionary price but the name of the card is different. The proper name for the card we have is the Commonwealth Senior Health Card.  That qualifies us for the $6.80 price. 

I am genuinely interested in your post, as all retired Australian friends have the Seniors Health card, I must ask others in the same position as us.                                                                                                                                                                                                                       We are citizens, moved here when  retired but only have the regular Medicare card, and a seniors card. Is the Senior Health card income related? For instance we don’t have superannuation, I don’t know if that makes a difference as all our income comes from UK and is fully taxed. No dispensation for the house and our assets? Is that the same for an Australian with retirement money in their superannuation?

So are you saying a seniors card is the same as a Senior Health card? I’m confused.

If this doesn’t really fit the thread we can ask for it to be moved, it might be of interest to many posters 

Edited May 17, 2022 by ramot

[Parley]

18 minutes ago, ramot said:

I am genuinely interested in your post, as all retired Australian friends have the Seniors Health card, I must ask others in the same position as us.                                                                                                                                                                                                                       We are citizens, moved here when  retired but only have the regular Medicare card, and a seniors card. Is the Senior Health card income related? For instance we don’t have superannuation, I don’t know if that makes a difference as all our income comes from UK and is fully taxed. No dispensation for the house and our assets? Is that the same for an Australian with retirement money in their superannuation?

So are you saying a seniors card is the same as a Senior Health card? I’m confused.

If this doesn’t really fit the thread we can ask for it to be moved, it might be of interest to many posters 

https://www.servicesaustralia.gov.au/who-can-get-commonwealth-seniors-health-card?context=21966

 

[Marisawright]

1 hour ago, ramot said:

I am genuinely interested in your post, as all retired Australian friends have the Seniors Health card, I must ask others in the same position as us.                                                                                                                                                                                                                    

It's just terminology.  The difference between concession with a small 'c' and a Concession Card with capital letters.   We also have the Seniors Health Card and it gives us access to concessionary pricing.  However as you (correctly) said in your post, there are other concession cards including a Pensioners Concession Card.

[Skani]

1 hour ago, Barnyrubble said:

And your food bills are up to 40% higher than here plus the cost of living there is 30% higher.   How do you all afford it!?

I have to admit that your friends'  "$100,000 to live comfortably" made my eyes pop.  As mentioned by Parley earlier,  the Association of Superannuation Funds of Australia costed a comfortable retirement standard (for a home owning couple) at $64,771 ( December 2021).   Their inclusions are here:  https://www.superannuation.asn.au/resources/retirement-standard

As a widowed retiree my income is a bit less than their figure for a "comfortable" lifestyle for singles but I have a perfectly comfortable life.  (Actually, my greatest annual expense after groceries in the last few years  has been veterinarian bills:  without those I would be even more comfortable.  ). 

But the main issue is whether you wish to move, not whether your children wish it for you.  Migrating is very stressful, even when all participants are fully committed:  if one of you is unsure it will add even greater stress.