Changes to pathway to Citizenship

[Ali369829]

Any news?

[bwatt99]

13 minutes ago, Elliotkan said:

Looks like the ridiculous four years residential requirement will still get passed...

 

 

Even though you was weeks away from applying before changes was made or announced? Regardless wife still submitted her application several weeks back.

She was 4 weeks away from applying under old rules or was wait until july 2018 under new rules where she will have gained the 4 yrs pr. Even though her same visa was temp as was partner visa which was 2 yrs temp at first,this should be added to the pr status or at least when first arrived which under both she be eligible.

But if new rules pass its july 2018 when it was 1 june 2017 before that.

[welljock]

4 hours ago, Elliotkan said:

Looks like the ridiculous four years residential requirement will still get passed...

 

 

It was 4 years before.

[AJ]

Just now, welljock said:

It was 4 years before.

If you came over PR to start with you had to have 4 years residency before citizenship.  If you came on a temp visa like a 457 you still had to do 4 years but only the last one had to be PR.  Now everyone has to have 4 years PR regarless of what visa.  I dont see anything wrong with that. 

[welljock]

2 minutes ago, AJ said:

If you came over PR to start with you had to have 4 years residency before citizenship.  If you came on a temp visa like a 457 you still had to do 4 years but only the last one had to be PR.  Now everyone has to have 4 years PR regarless of what visa.  I dont see anything wrong with that. 

I don't see much wrong with it either and most of my work mates, even the ones who came over on a 457 or equivalent, think one year on PR is ridiculously low. 

[Elliotkan]

1 minute ago, AJ said:

If you came over PR to start with you had to have 4 years residency before citizenship.  If you came on a temp visa like a 457 you still had to do 4 years but only the last one had to be PR.  Now everyone has to have 4 years PR regarless of what visa.  I dont see anything wrong with that. 

it means time spent on TR doesn't count though.

I would only have to wait for another few months to be eligible to apply for the citizenship now may have to wait for another few months + three years

That is the difference.

 

[AJ]

14 minutes ago, Elliotkan said:

it means time spent on TR doesn't count though.

I would only have to wait for another few months to be eligible to apply for the citizenship now may have to wait for another few months + three years

That is the difference.

 

Yes I know what the difference is.  Still nothing wrong with everyone being the same.  If a person goes through the PR route from the start, has to have their skills assessed and do 4 years as a Permanent Resident why should someone not have to who has been sponsored without.

Edited September 20, 2017 by AJ

[Elliotkan]

20 minutes ago, welljock said:

I don't see much wrong with it either and most of my work mates, even the ones who came over on a 457 or equivalent, think one year on PR is ridiculously low. 

Just to clarify -

It was 3 years on TR + last year as PR = 4 years

Now Four years on PR (if someone had been in this country on student visa for 10 years and finally got their PR this year, they still have to wait for another 4 years.)

 

Different people find different inconvenience the new law brings to them. Could be subjective when it comes to say which one makes more sense than the others.

For instance, I personally think it's fair to ask people to have good English (if they have decided to stay in this country for good) regardless of their original cultural background while some might find it too harsh.

However, I personally think four years PR residential requirement ridiculous as it somehow makes me feel efforts spent on integrating with this society in the past few years not being recognised.

 

Overall, if all elements of this citizenship overhaul make sense it wouldn't have been derailed...

But we can't do much as it's to be decided by the upper house.

Let's wait and see.

Edited September 20, 2017 by Elliotkan

[TyronG]

Tyron, 

We’ve just had one of the first signs the Government is backing down on the citizenship Bill and I wanted to let you know straight away. 

 

It’s only a small step forward but Peter Dutton has now started talking about compromise options on his Citizenship Bill. That means the Government can recognise that even the first draft of this Citizenship Bill can’t make it through in it’s current form. 

 

Labor has committed to rejecting the Bill entirelyrather than trying to amend it in some compromised form. So right now when the Government has started taking backwards steps is the perfect time to be demanding that the Bill be withdrawn completely.Click here to read one of the online articles so you can see where the Government is at right now.

 

It is the perfect time to be building support in the community, whatever community news, radio and personal conversations you are able to have, please have them now. Let people know that where legislation is as unfair as what the Government is introducing right now should be rejected completely. 

 

If there are any small matters that the Government can claim are reasonable, they should be brought back in separate legislation. 

 

Thanks for everything you are doing. If we can win the argument in the community then I am confident we can win it in the Parliament.

Tony

 

 

 

PS. We haven't won yet, but we are on our way. Please share our petition on Facebook, Twitter, in Facebook Groups or just with your friends and family. This ensures their voices are also heard in this debate. 

Link to the petition: www.tonyburke.com.au/get-active/citizenshippetition

Click here to share the petition on your Facebook. 
Click here to share the petition on your Twitter.

 

Tony Burke

 

Member for Watson

Shadow Minister for Environment and Water

Shadow Minister for Citizenship and Multicultural Australia

Shadow Minister for the Arts

Manager of Opposition Business

[bwatt99]

1 hour ago, welljock said:

I don't see much wrong with it either and most of my work mates, even the ones who came over on a 457 or equivalent, think one year on PR is ridiculously low. 

And what about my now wife who i met after i had my pr,where i got her a partner visa with is 2 yrs temp and 2 years pr.

She got granted her temp visa while still overseas but had to validate, it which she did when we moved in june 2013. So not only had she done over 4 yrs now in australia her partner visa as temp should count towards pr as its under same visa. So before they decided to change rules could have have applied 1st june,i if they want her to have 4 yrs pr they has to wait till july 2018.

Me personally i think its bull,my son is born here who is citizen,im aready citizen due to having pr from day one and added our daughter to it.

Wife is only one in family who is still to get we decided to apply just a few weeks ago as was mentioned here and a few other places it be a good move.

Now im not so sure, being currently out of work i would hate to loose such fee paid.

But what about people who are pr before they wanted to make changes this should play a big factor.

Maybe anyone who gains pr after 20th april should yes do 4 yrs.

[Spinny_Drift]

9 hours ago, Roberta2 said:

When did Dutton say that?

 

Google is your friend....

 

"Mr Dutton said he would not water down the proposed laws.

"We're not going to compromise to the left of the Labor party. The left of the Labor party is out of step with the broader Australian public. The public wants to see an increase in the English language requirement, they want to see people meet Australian laws and values."

 

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06-20/labor-resolves-to-block-governments-citizenship-changes/8634140

[Spinny_Drift]

3 hours ago, AJ said:

If you came over PR to start with you had to have 4 years residency before citizenship.  If you came on a temp visa like a 457 you still had to do 4 years but only the last one had to be PR.  Now everyone has to have 4 years PR regarless of what visa.  I dont see anything wrong with that. 

It may be a factor for someone that has to pay all the taxes without any of the benefits/say typically available to PR's/citizens!

Just saying........

 

[CaptainR]

So presumably on the 18th of October a decision should be made about the bill and we should know what the actual changes to citizenship should be? My wife and kids are due to apply in December but I imagine there will also be a backlog. It would be an absolute pain having my wife resit the IELTS after having done it already for the PR a few years ago (she is non native English speaker). 

[AJ]

17 minutes ago, Spinny_Drift said:

It may be a factor for someone that has to pay all the taxes without any of the benefits/say typically available to PR's/citizens!

Just saying........

 

Can do a skills assessment and go for PR anytime - just saying!

[Ali369829]

47 minutes ago, Spinny_Drift said:

Google is your friend....

 

"Mr Dutton said he would not water down the proposed laws.

"We're not going to compromise to the left of the Labor party. The left of the Labor party is out of step with the broader Australian public. The public wants to see an increase in the English language requirement, they want to see people meet Australian laws and values."

 

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06-20/labor-resolves-to-block-governments-citizenship-changes/8634140

Very old news... need to update guys

[Spinny_Drift]

1 hour ago, Ali369829 said:

Very old news... need to update guys

lol - no kidding!

 

That was a post in reply to an earlier question but thanks for observing the obvious!

[Spinny_Drift]

1 hour ago, AJ said:

Can do a skills assessment and go for PR anytime - just saying!

Really? Last I heard you couldn't apply anytime (could be wrong).......just saying!!! Are you basing your opinion on the assumption that you could (at least in theory) qualify for PR from the get-go?

Edited September 20, 2017 by Spinny_Drift

[AJ]

12 minutes ago, Spinny_Drift said:

Really? Last I heard you couldn't apply anytime (could be wrong).......just saying!!! Are you basing your opinion on the assumption that you could (at least in theory) qualify for PR from the get-go?

Of course you can, if your job is on the list, (was the SOL), you within age and you can pass a skills assessment, thousands of people do it

[Spinny_Drift]

So the answer is yes - you are basing your opinion on the assumption that you possibly qualify for PR from the get-go! What about those that don't ie 457s, students, partners etc where PR is not an option off the bat? They're the ones complaining about 4 years over an above time they've already put in! No - just in case another assumption is made I'm not in either of those boats!

They potentially have a valid argument if Govt's sole motivation re. the 4 yr argument is to allow for more touchy-feely, let's get to know each other better time. Their argument is what happened in the years prior to the PR grant and why are they simply discounted!

I wonder though if there's is currently potential to migrate from TR-PR-Citizenship in less than 4 yrs? If so, surely that is something the proposed amendments should address!

 

 

 

[ramot]

We will have been here 15 years if we get our PR through next year. We are here legally on a Retirement visa and lodged for PR when finally eligible for  a parent visa.  Then an extra 4 years for citizenship instead of 1, just pointing out that there are many examples of people who don't fit the 4 years on PR, then straight to citizenship, so that's why the 3 extra years on PR seems a bit rough.

[seeker]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1JYRvi6XH4LKUvdCW5vmCG44U7VG469oZNQeKgceVDO4/edit?ts=589cfc5c#gid=0

some active members who lodged citizenship applications are updating status in the above sheet. looks like all the people who lodged before April 20th got the dates for exam, most of them got approvals , though approvals delayed than usual time. Number of people attended citizenship ceremonies this month is reduced by 2/3 in some councils, this clearly tells that DIBP people are doesn't have any work to do by end of this month.this may also put the pressure on government to take decision quickly. if the bill doesn't pass and DIBP has to process the applications for old rules and more than 65000 people lodged the applications from April 20th( figures told by DIBP), so expect massive delays in processing...

[Ali369829]

34 minutes ago, seeker said:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1JYRvi6XH4LKUvdCW5vmCG44U7VG469oZNQeKgceVDO4/edit?ts=589cfc5c#gid=0

some active members who lodged citizenship applications are updating status in the above sheet. looks like all the people who lodged before April 20th got the dates for exam, most of them got approvals , though approvals delayed than usual time. Number of people attended citizenship ceremonies this month is reduced by 2/3 in some councils, this clearly tells that DIBP people are doesn't have any work to do by end of this month.this may also put the pressure on government to take decision quickly. if the bill doesn't pass and DIBP has to process the applications for old rules and more than 65000 people lodged the applications from April 20th( figures told by DIBP), so expect massive delays in processing...

From 20th April to 30th July around 26000 application.

rest all before 20 th April (under process)

news said 60,70 or 80,000 application total but around 26,000 on hold by Potato dutton on or after 20th April.

u can check scrutiny or recent senate report.

 

[Sheila]

47 minutes ago, seeker said:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1JYRvi6XH4LKUvdCW5vmCG44U7VG469oZNQeKgceVDO4/edit?ts=589cfc5c#gid=0

some active members who lodged citizenship applications are updating status in the above sheet. looks like all the people who lodged before April 20th got the dates for exam, most of them got approvals , though approvals delayed than usual time. Number of people attended citizenship ceremonies this month is reduced by 2/3 in some councils, this clearly tells that DIBP people are doesn't have any work to do by end of this month.this may also put the pressure on government to take decision quickly. if the bill doesn't pass and DIBP has to process the applications for old rules and more than 65000 people lodged the applications from April 20th( figures told by DIBP), so expect massive delays in processing...

Great analysis. ... !!! Hope for the best

[seeker]

30 minutes ago, Ali369829 said:

From 20th April to 30th July around 26000 application.

rest all before 20 th April (under process)

news said 60,70 or 80,000 application total but around 26,000 on hold by Potato dutton on or after 20th April.

u can check scrutiny or recent senate report.

 

i am just checking the report, below is the snippet.. by 31st July 59940, and till  65000 till last week( I red somwhere)..  people who are yet to lodge.. better you lodge the applications.. government is in soup now, impacted migrants and their families should not vote for liberals anymore because of the dodgy  approach taken by liberals..

3.10 The Department of Immigration and Border Protection (the Department) confirmed that since 20 April 2017 to 31 July 2017, it had received 50,940 applications. These applications are currently not being processed but applications received before 20 April 2017 are continuing to be processed

 

[Vic154]

I agree that the whole 4 yr PR rule is harsh. I've been here 5 years on a 457, I should have PR by next year which will mean 10yrs before citizenship.

Now someone who arrives today straight on a PR visa will end up getting their citizenship before me! Despite me living and working here for 5 more years!

What is the difference between how I have lived my life during the last 5 yrs vs how I would have lived had I been on a PR visa? None! I would still have done the same job, paid the same taxes, joined the same clubs, lived the same Australian values, etc etc

That is why that rule is unfair in my opinion. I live my life the same way and contribute just as much as someone on PR.


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