Having kids

[Keith and Linda]

Your a legend Kev, well done mate.

I have said it before and will say it again, surely we have children out of love, I cannot understand people that say we can't afford children, If having children is based on affordability, then, I ask how has the human race survived so far?

when planning/dreaming of our life's together Linda & I wanted children, and we decided to have them whilst we were young, that way we would ourselves be able to enjoy them whilst we would generally be more energetic, fit and healthy. Also that Linda would stay at home and have quality time with them until they started going to school, we talked about how we would decorate their rooms. None of our dreams of having family was based on affordability, purely love!

[Que Sera Sera]

Your a legend Kev, well done mate.

I have said it before and will say it again, surely we have children out of love, I cannot understand people that say we can't afford children, If having children is based on affordability, then, I ask how has the human race survived so far?

when planning/dreaming of our life's together Linda & I wanted children, and we decided to have them whilst we were young, that way we would ourselves be able to enjoy them whilst we would generally be more energetic, fit and healthy. Also that Linda would stay at home and have quality time with them until they started going to school, we talked about how we would decorate their rooms. None of our dreams of having family was based on affordability, purely love!

Unfortunately people do have to plan nowadays as there aren't many couples who can afford a mortgage on one wage.

[Paul1Perth]

We don't have kids yet, but would definitely want two kids in the future. We don't want to be full time working parents as we want to be there for our kids.

We both had an income of 65k gross annually. And managed to save around 2k net a month when we had a $420 a week rental house.

 

If we have kids, my wife wants to work 2 or 3 days a week. So her income is likely to drop to somewhere around 25k annually. We were wondering if we would manage having kids.

What kind of benefits/rebates/etc would you have? I know there is child care rebate that covers up to 50% of the cost of child care (up to $7500 a year per child). Then there is child care benefit and family support allowance.

 

So I made a calculation on centrelink and we could get around 3k family assistance entitlement a year. Child care at $80 a day for 2 kids, 2 days a week = $16640 a year. 7.5k is covered by the government, so you have to pay 9k yourself.

 

So to sum it up; We would earn $40 grant less a year, due to having less salary, we pay $9000 grant for child care, but get 3k family allowance. So we have to pay $6000 compared to our current situation. And then I didn't even talk about all the extra costs (food, clothes, etc etc). Seems like an impossible or am I overlooking something here?

 

No you aren't overlooking anything. Don't know why you've bothered working it out, it's too scary isn't it. I was never bothered about having kids but my wife got broody and really wanted one. For a quite life I though I would go along with it and really expected months of fun before she got pregnant.:wink: Didn't work out that way and she was pregnant the first month she came off the pill. Never trust a nurse.:wink:

 

That was one of the things that led us to emigrate as it happened. We had always been used to going on a couple of holidays abroad in the summer. We had a timeshare in Portugal and used to go to Greece or somewhere for another couple of weeks. When we had the youngster and we had got a mortgage for the first time too it was the first time we couldn't afford a holiday abroad and the summer was crap. It really got us down. We were both working full time too. Eventually thought we may as well bite the bullet and emigrate to somewhere with a nice climate.

 

Women don't listen when they want kids, reasoning goes out the window, it's no good pointing out the costs, the answer you will probably get is "everyone else manages". That's about the sum of it too, you struggle through somehow.

 

We have two boys now, couldn't afford either of them.:wink:

[Paul1Perth]

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Definitely. Overthinking it. No-one could ever afford to have kids. If you really want them, have them..the rest will sort itself out.

 

See, typical womans answer.:wink:

[Paul1Perth]

When they come along, you'll wonder why you went so long without having them in the first place such is the joy they bring you. They totally consume you in every way, the last thing you'll think about is how on earth to 'budget' for them or how much money you've got left...

 

I like your thoughtfullness though, and planning ahead - so many people have them and cant 'afford' them which can sometimes result in not the best start in life. However, the want for kids should out way the affordability.

 

Most guys will never get this. The want and need thing is totally foreign to most guys.

[Paul1Perth]

Unfortunately people do have to plan nowadays as there aren't many couples who can afford a mortgage on one wage.

 

Never been any different has it QSS?

[ciaranmacgiolla]

if u want kids, just do it.. one will always adapt, yes gone are your white walls, nice romantic holidays(for about 16 years), nice sofa,kitchen table, etc etc but trust me, when u r having a bad day in work and come home to a big hug from your kids and u sit down with them for 10 minutes hearing about their day in school/kindy... nothing beats that EVER..

[Paul1Perth]

I don't know whether our lives have been better for having kids. It's one of those things you are never going to know. We've had good times and not so good times. We would certainly have been a lot better off and been able to do some tremendous things that you don't even contemplate once you have kids. I think I would have had just as happy a life without them and maybe more happy, who's to know.

 

A friend of mines son has a drug problem and is in a home at the moment being treated. He's been taking drugs since he was 14, always been in trouble, caused a lot of grief to the family. The parents are no longer married, he's a young man of 30 now, doesn't have a job, still has a problem. neither parent know what to do with him, he absconded for a couple of days when no-one knew where he'd gone.

 

It's not all sunshine and roses.

[Marisawright]

We don't have kids yet, but would definitely want two kids in the future.... Seems like an impossible or am I overlooking something here?

 

Definitely over-thinking it. No one can really afford to have kids, you just manage somehow when they arrive. I don't have kids myself but what happens when my friends have kids is that they change their lifestyle. Right now you're probably buying more clothes, going on more holidays, eating out/drinking more often etc. Your priorities (and your opportunities for all that) will change once you have children and that will free up money to help pay for them.

[Naomi from Manchester]

Seems like an impossible or am I overlooking something here?

 

Not sure where you live, but we pay $120 per day for daycare in Sydney.

 

It's easier not to pay for 2 in daycare at the same time, if you leave enough time between them one can be starting free state school whilst the other starts day care. Most people seem to plan it so there's only about 2.5yrs between them, however.

 

You just stop spending money on yourself, you don't really have time for this anyway (no longer time for weekend hobbies, evening classes, mini breaks, shopping sprees etc).

 

'If you can't feed 'em, don't breed 'em!' (Said someone).

[Naomi from Manchester]

An honest response from Paul1Perth! (#33)

Edited February 6, 2015 by Naomi from Manchester

[Keith and Linda]

Unfortunately people do have to plan nowadays as there aren't many couples who can afford a mortgage on one wage.

 

Well QSS I did say planning in my post, but can we assume you mean some sort of financial planning? if so I still have trouble accepting that if one is wanting to be a loving family with children, is subject to being able to afford one!!! :wacko:, surely one can afford a child whatever your income/financial situation and the child will not be loved any differently, will it?

There would be a good chance that neither you or I, and a good many others would be here today if our parents had decided they could not have afforded to have us, so we can count ourselves lucky in that they chose, as a loving couple to want us.

[Que Sera Sera]

I know we didn't get a chance to plan anything with our first but I'm kind of glad it happened that way I suppose because on paper we certainly could not afford to have her and we certainly couldn't afford for me to not go back to work, and we couldn't afford childcare it was a catch 22 situation and it took us a good while of penny pinching and robbing Peter to pay Paul. I do think that had we waited until we were in our thirties we would have enjoyed the process more. We wouldn't have loved her any differently but I could have afforded to be a stay at home Mum for awhile, which would have been great. So what Im trying to say badly is yes financial planning for the right time.

Edited February 6, 2015 by Que Sera, Sera

[blossom]

Well I left it until 35 to have my first baby. When I got ready we decided to move to Oz, so waited. Then my marriage went south. I certainly couldn't afford to have my baby and a mortgage. So renting for the foreseeable future for me. On a possitive, the government helps with my rent, which they wouldn't if it was a mortgage (quite unfair really).

[flag of convenience]

Never was for me and cost was but a consideration of the entire package. Good some people do consider all options and not blindly follow but at bone time does appear to be the herd. Don't solely go on economic considerations though. Go on what is right for you after weighing up the pro and cons.

[Paul1Perth]

An honest response from Paul1Perth! (#33)

 

I think there are more blokes that think like that than would admit it Naomi, especially to their wives.:wink:

 

I also know a few who (in private) say "being married is good, but it's not as good as being single".:laugh: Once married everything is a compromise.

[Paul1Perth]

Well QSS I did say planning in my post, but can we assume you mean some sort of financial planning? if so I still have trouble accepting that if one is wanting to be a loving family with children, is subject to being able to afford one!!! :wacko:, surely one can afford a child whatever your income/financial situation and the child will not be loved any differently, will it?

There would be a good chance that neither you or I, and a good many others would be here today if our parents had decided they could not have afforded to have us, so we can count ourselves lucky in that they chose, as a loving couple to want us.

 

There's a limit though K&L. I've seen a few marriages implode because of financial pressures and the stresses that brings, from thinking they could afford to have kids. A break up doesn't help anyone, least of all the kids.

[Que Sera Sera]

I think there are more blokes that think like that than would admit it Naomi, especially to their wives.:wink:

 

I also know a few who (in private) say "being married is good, but it's not as good as being single".:laugh: Once married everything is a compromise.

TBF I know a fair few women like it too.

[HappyHeart]

I think there are more blokes that think like that than would admit it Naomi, especially to their wives.:wink:

 

I also know a few who (in private) say "being married is good, but it's not as good as being single".:laugh: Once married everything is a compromise.

 

the way I see it children are the ultimate source of emotional stress (parental guilt/worrying about their future/hurting on their behalf/parental instinct to protect) and the ultimate source of pleasure (parental pride/joy/love)

 

Take the critters out of the equation and the net result would be a more stable emotional state. But the highs make up for the lows...

 

I wouldn't question or feel sorry for childless couples, I think they have much to be thankful for and the lifestyle must be very different...

 

Having children doesn't equal fulfillment...I think a lot of people think it does..it somehow completes a woman and for many people that's the case but not the be all and end all..

 

Easy to say as a mother of 2 though I guess....I know my childless SIL doesn't think her lifestyle is 'all that', longs for children but unlikely to happen now...

[Johndoe]

^^^^It does raise questions Fi. Although I have said that I don't regret a minute of it, if I were to put the highs to one side and think about where I am now, then I'm loaded with regret. There's no getting away from the fact that having a kid with a disabilty and many foster kids, all of whom had behavioural problems, contributed to the ex and I losing sight of each others' needs. We simply didn't have time for one another and tbh, the only time we seemed to talk to each other, was in placement meetings when we were discussing the kids. The ex has said that she couldn't wait to get to work and dreaded coming home sometimes although why she never voiced that at the time is beyond me.............she doesn't even know herself, although I'm guessing, knowing how she rises to a challlenge (or did once), that she thought that to pack in fostering was like admitting defeat.

 

Would I do it again? have my own kids yes...............someone elses, never......................and I would never recommend fostering to anyone. I never thought I would ever think that way but I've had plenty of time (alone) to think more clearly lately.

[Naomi from Manchester]

This is really interesting reading!

[Keith and Linda]

There's a limit though K&L. I've seen a few marriages implode because of financial pressures and the stresses that brings, from thinking they could afford to have kids. A break up doesn't help anyone, least of all the kids.

 

People with plenty of money break up too. but both scenarios says more about the adults than the money or children.

 

Linda and I have had plenty of fallouts over money, and not because I wanted to have a beer or she wanted some make-up, more on why did she/I spend an extra 10 pence at the greengrocers this week.

Love produces children not cash, what is the saying? yes LOVE CONQUERS ALL.

 

 

just to show I do have some experience on this subject. I come from a broken home, my wife of over 37 years, was married previously with one child to boot, my elder brother is married to a divorcee and she herself comes from a broken home, my other two brothers have divorces and failed relationships both with children involved, my sister is twice divorced but no children, the no children is a sadness in her life now. Of the above some (like myself) were never financially comfortable, and some were, not rich just comfortable but still need to earn by working. None of the above failures were directly due to financial burdens, and all children were born from and into what was and thought to be forever loving relationships.

[Paul1Perth]

People with plenty of money break up too. but both scenarios says more about the adults than the money or children.

 

Linda and I have had plenty of fallouts over money, and not because I wanted to have a beer or she wanted some make-up, more on why did she/I spend an extra 10 pence at the greengrocers this week.

Love produces children not cash, what is the saying? yes LOVE CONQUERS ALL.

 

 

just to show I do have some experience on this subject. I come from a broken home, my wife of over 37 years, was married previously with one child to boot, my elder brother is married to a divorcee and she herself comes from a broken home, my other two brothers have divorces and failed relationships both with children involved, my sister is twice divorced but no children, the no children is a sadness in her life now. Of the above some (like myself) were never financially comfortable, and some were, not rich just comfortable but still need to earn by working. None of the above failures were directly due to financial burdens, and all children were born from and into what was and thought to be forever loving relationships.

 

Great saying but pure BS.

[Que Sera Sera]

I actually think you have to have an exeptionally strong marriage to survive children and an even stronger marriage to survive Step Children. They do have a uncanny knack at finding cracks and turning them into craters. Lovely as they are :wink:

[Keith and Linda]

Great saying but pure BS.

 

only for those that want it to be such, again says more about the person/s.