Fisher1 Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 On 31/07/2018 at 20:44, newjez said: Well for us, it's been a year since visiting the gp about my son's kidney problems to getting a date for surgery. It's just a game we are learning to play. It's seems half the battle is getting a referral for a diagnosis. If we had been more pushy from the start we probably would have got an early result. It will have been four months since seeing the surgeon that he has his surgery, and that is for an urgent case. I do not remember it being anything like this ten years ago. Weve been saying for ages that its about getting that first referral ...once you're in the care is great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjez Posted August 3, 2018 Share Posted August 3, 2018 3 hours ago, Fisher1 said: Weve been saying for ages that its about getting that first referral ...once you're in the care is great. State of the art MRI, but don't seem capable of sending an email. His first operation ten years ago was the subject of a paper as it was the first of it's kind in the UK. Brilliant surgeon, (name was Mr Mohamed, but we won't go there), performed a magical operation, but the dvd camera broke down so they couldn't film it. Typical. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BacktoDemocracy Posted August 6, 2018 Share Posted August 6, 2018 On 3/8/2018 at 04:10, Rallyman said: Wishing your son a speedy recovery why do you think we are waiting longer to see doctors today compared to 10 years ago ? Possibly an increasing population ? Do you ever give up, why do you tell us all how politically ambivalent when obviously you are not. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rallyman Posted August 6, 2018 Share Posted August 6, 2018 2 hours ago, BacktoDemocracy said: Do you ever give up, why do you tell us all how politically ambivalent when obviously you are not. What’s your problem ? I wished NJ son a speedy recovery and simply asked him why he thought it was taking longer to see a doctor now than 10 years ago. You need to go for a lie down old chap it’s all getting too much for you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisher1 Posted August 6, 2018 Share Posted August 6, 2018 On 03/08/2018 at 23:45, newjez said: State of the art MRI, but don't seem capable of sending an email. His first operation ten years ago was the subject of a paper as it was the first of it's kind in the UK. Brilliant surgeon, (name was Mr Mohamed, but we won't go there), performed a magical operation, but the dvd camera broke down so they couldn't film it. Typical. 41 minutes ago, Rallyman said: What’s your problem ? I wished NJ son a speedy recovery and simply asked him why he thought it was taking longer to see a doctor now than 10 years ago. You need to go for a lie down old chap it’s all getting too much for you No you didnt, actually. You added the suggestion that the wait was possibly the result of a growing population. If you check all the stats you'll find that the NHS is underfunded a d has been for years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simmo Posted August 7, 2018 Share Posted August 7, 2018 20 hours ago, Fisher1 said: No you didnt, actually. You added the suggestion that the wait was possibly the result of a growing population. If you check all the stats you'll find that the NHS is underfunded a d has been for years. the growing population probably does have a bearing on it TBH 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisher1 Posted August 8, 2018 Share Posted August 8, 2018 18 hours ago, simmo said: the growing population probably does have a bearing on it TBH But the main problem is underfunding. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BacktoDemocracy Posted August 8, 2018 Share Posted August 8, 2018 18 hours ago, simmo said: the growing population probably does have a bearing on it TBH Nope, the biggest problem is the explosion in the population of over 65's living with multiple conditions and the collapse of aged care provision marooning the elderly in hospitals, all easily foreseeable but the govt are ideologically committed to cutting public expenditure, they are not bothered cutting the deficit, they simply do not believe the State should be involved in society, no difference there then from the 1700's. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tea4too Posted August 8, 2018 Share Posted August 8, 2018 37 minutes ago, BacktoDemocracy said: Nope, the biggest problem is the explosion in the population of over 65's living with multiple conditions and the collapse of aged care provision marooning the elderly in hospitals, all easily foreseeable but the govt are ideologically committed to cutting public expenditure, they are not bothered cutting the deficit, they simply do not believe the State should be involved in society, no difference there then from the 1700's. I agree. An ageing population with people living longer but not necessarily healthier is a bigger strain on the NHS than immigration. The majority of migrants to the UK are of working age, and the 2015 Report for the UK office of Budget Responsibility found that migration is actually beneficial to the sustainability of public debt. The real issue is government’s sustained underfunding while pressures on Health and Social Care budgets continue to increase. T x 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simmo Posted August 8, 2018 Share Posted August 8, 2018 1 hour ago, BacktoDemocracy said: Nope, the biggest problem is the explosion in the population of over 65's living with multiple conditions and the collapse of aged care provision marooning the elderly in hospitals, all easily foreseeable but the govt are ideologically committed to cutting public expenditure, they are not bothered cutting the deficit, they simply do not believe the State should be involved in society, no difference there then from the 1700's. So nothing to do with the population increasing by 2.4 m over the last 5 years with 85% from immigration, or the fact that 1/3 of all births are by foreign born mothers. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simmo Posted August 8, 2018 Share Posted August 8, 2018 46 minutes ago, tea4too said: I agree. An ageing population with people living longer but not necessarily healthier is a bigger strain on the NHS than immigration. The majority of migrants to the UK are of working age, and the 2015 Report for the UK office of Budget Responsibility found that migration is actually beneficial to the sustainability of public debt. The real issue is government’s sustained underfunding while pressures on Health and Social Care budgets continue to increase. T x Shame those working age immigrants get old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tea4too Posted August 8, 2018 Share Posted August 8, 2018 5 hours ago, simmo said: Shame those working age immigrants get old. The NHS is under specific pressure from a change in the age profile of citizens– it is top heavy with an increasingly aged population due to people living longer, while the working age population is reducing due to a decrease in the birth rate. Migrant workers help to bridge the gap and, as their average age is 39 years, it will be several decades before they themselves require help and support in their final years. Immigration is a red herring and not the key factor in the problems being faced by the NHS. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BacktoDemocracy Posted August 8, 2018 Share Posted August 8, 2018 5 hours ago, simmo said: So nothing to do with the population increasing by 2.4 m over the last 5 years with 85% from immigration, or the fact that 1/3 of all births are by foreign born mothers. Nope.! 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjez Posted August 8, 2018 Share Posted August 8, 2018 5 hours ago, simmo said: Shame those working age immigrants get old. I think they are hoping they will retire back in their country of origin in the sun. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjez Posted August 8, 2018 Share Posted August 8, 2018 19 minutes ago, tea4too said: The NHS is under specific pressure from a change in the age profile of citizens– it is top heavy with an increasingly aged population due to people living longer, while the working age population is reducing due to a decrease in the birth rate. Migrant workers help to bridge the gap and, as their average age is 39 years, it will be several decades before they themselves require help and support in their final years. Immigration is a red herring and not the key factor in the problems being faced by the NHS. Also, by a pharmaceutical industry which isn't interested in curing illness when they can medicate it long term. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjez Posted August 8, 2018 Share Posted August 8, 2018 (edited) 29 minutes ago, newjez said: I think they are hoping they will retire back in their country of origin in the sun. Would you really retire in the UK what with the weather and dreadful health services simmo if you had a choice not to? Edited August 8, 2018 by newjez 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simmo Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 9 hours ago, newjez said: Would you really retire in the UK what with the weather and dreadful health services simmo if you had a choice not to? You are getting yourself all mixed up with your quotes now.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisher1 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 18 hours ago, BacktoDemocracy said: Nope, the biggest problem is the explosion in the population of over 65's living with multiple conditions and the collapse of aged care provision marooning the elderly in hospitals, all easily foreseeable but the govt are ideologically committed to cutting public expenditure, they are not bothered cutting the deficit, they simply do not believe the State should be involved in society, no difference there then from the 1700's. Which, in essence, brings us back to underfunding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BacktoDemocracy Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 48 minutes ago, Fisher1 said: Which, in essence, brings us back to underfunding. Exactly, but my concern is how the attitudes of centuries ago are dressed up as some kind of academic theory to give them respectability when all it is is a continuation of prejudice based on class and instinctively those being discriminated against have discerned it and have upended the apple cart( brexit) in the believe that it will change things for the better and change their world for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisher1 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 5 hours ago, BacktoDemocracy said: Exactly, but my concern is how the attitudes of centuries ago are dressed up as some kind of academic theory to give them respectability when all it is is a continuation of prejudice based on class and instinctively those being discriminated against have discerned it and have upended the apple cart( brexit) in the believe that it will change things for the better and change their world for them. I think you're right. Ignore whole sections of society at your peril. What a mess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjez Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 14 hours ago, simmo said: You are getting yourself all mixed up with your quotes now.. Well, it's hard what with you being splayed or hobbled or whatever they call it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simmo Posted August 10, 2018 Share Posted August 10, 2018 On 08/08/2018 at 20:38, newjez said: Would you really retire in the UK what with the weather and dreadful health services simmo if you had a choice not to? millions do/have Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjez Posted August 10, 2018 Share Posted August 10, 2018 10 hours ago, simmo said: millions do/have Rubbish. Most don't have a choice. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VERYSTORMY Posted August 11, 2018 Share Posted August 11, 2018 A friendly reminder. Keep it civil. We do have a big red button available that isn't just time off or a warning. Personal insults will not be tolerated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rallyman Posted August 11, 2018 Share Posted August 11, 2018 On 07/08/2018 at 07:02, Fisher1 said: No you didnt, actually. You added the suggestion that the wait was possibly the result of a growing population. If you check all the stats you'll find that the NHS is underfunded a d has been for years. So you honestly think a growing population has no bearing on the NHS waiting lists it’s all down to funding ? While it might not be totally the cause it will have some bearing on it maybe they need to start getting monies back for treatment of overseas patients and this will help under funding https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/nhs-failing-recover-unpaid-bills-overseas-patients-mps-report-a7556156.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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