Australian Citizenship - who's got it / going to get it, and why?

[Guest]

An Irish colleague of mine was surprised when I shared with her that despite having been in Australia for over seven years I hadn't applied for citizenship. She applied immediately upon living here for the mandatory period of time to be eligible (four years I think?) and is awaiting a date for the ceremony. When i asked her why she'd applied, she described it as an "insurance policy" against any future changes to immigration legislation, so that even if she went home to Ireland for a period of time she'd always have the opportunity to return here if she wished. Personally, I did briefly toy with the idea of applying for citizenship in 2014 when I was stung for the cost of a Resident Return Visa during a trip back home, but instead elected not to. When it came down to it, it just didn't feel like a very honest thing for me to do. I currently live in Australia but only because my (Australian) partner wanted to spend some time back here. I've never felt at home here and feel no affinity with this country and so that in all honesty making a pledge to the place seemed well, dishonest, in truth.

 

I just wondered though how many P.I.O. members have either got citizenship or are planning to apply for it and what prompted it? Was it because you feel Australian now (perhaps more than you feel British), or because you want to display your commitment to your adopted country or because you want the ability to come and go with the ease that comes with holding an Australian passport? Or, is there another reason that I haven't touched upon?

[northshorepom]

I'm eligible but haven't bothered yet. I probably will do though, this year

 

It's more for convenience and the kids than anything else. I like living here but don't consider myself Australian, which is I think what holds me back. I'm not sure it sits right with me to take it out feeling that way.....but then I see all the people who do it and immediately leave the country and think I shouldn't be so precious (I'm not slagging you if you did this by the way, the rules are there and as far as I'm concerned people are just operating them)

 

I have a mate who has been based in Oz since the early 90s (Aus wife, now ex-, and 3 Aus children, all born and raised here) who never bothered because he didn't feel Australian. He doesn't think twice about it, but then I guess as his kids were born here to a local mum that issue never arose; different for those of us who came here as a family.

[northernbird]

I spent 4 years living in Canada, a place that still holds a piece of my heart. We didn't pursue PR, which we could have done and ex-husband lost his job and we had to return to the UK. I was destroyed by that move and swore that I would never be in that position again. When we could go for PR here we did and citizenship was the next logical step. I'm a proud citizen of this country. I can't recall if you have children but if you do I think if that child is an Australian citizen then you would be daft not to have it. Just my two penneth.

[Guest]

I'm about to apply.

 

1. I would like to vote.

2. Convenient in and out of country

3. I plan to live here long term

4. I don't get why you wouldn't get it if available. The Queen isn't going to feel cheated.

[Gbye grey sky]

I undoubtedly will when I can.

 

1. My wife and children are joint citizens so it makes sense to be on the same footing.

2. I fully intend to stay for life barring something unforseeable.

3. I care about the country and would like to be able to vote.

[northshorepom]

There you go. I just printed off the ID forms so I can apply

 

I'm never supporting Australia v Britain in any sporting event though

 

I suppose the voting argument is a good one, although I think compulsory voting is crap (purely on the basis of it obviously doesn't work)

:-)

[dmjg]

As both your wife and daughter are citizens, EW,

 

what happens if you go back

 

and in fifteen years the little one comes back for a holiday,

 

meets some surfer dude,

 

pro-creates,

 

buys a house,

 

and gramps cant come and stay for long because he didnt take the opportunity of unfetted access when it arose???

[amibovered]

When I did it about 25 years ago the Government of the time were mad keen on people becoming citizens, so much so that they made it hard not to do it, but very easy to take citizenship, I would have done it anyway, funnily enough I've sworn an oath to the Queen of Australia, but never to the Queen of England.

[dmjg]

As both your wife and daughter are citizens, EW,

 

what happens if you go back

 

and in fifteen years the little one comes back for a holiday,

 

meets some surfer dude,

 

pro-creates,

 

buys a house,

 

and gramps cant come and stay for long because he didnt take the opportunity of unfetted access when it arose???

 

 

Actually,

 

as a son in law with kids here and english only grandparents on the in law side,

 

thats not always a bad thing..........

[Patphillips47]

We for a long time said we would never come back to the UK permanently ,one should never say never !

we took citizenship out because of our grandchildren really and felt it was the right thing to do

Came back in 2001 it had taken 2 years to decide to come back but it was because of my ailing Mum in the UK

Back to Oz 2006 then retired back to UK 2013 now going back to Oz in 2016

So having dual nationality has been a bonus for us ,we love both countries really acknowledge both have faults and problems

i call myself a Pozzie !

[bunbury61]

An Irish colleague of mine was surprised when I shared with her that despite having been in Australia for over seven years I hadn't applied for citizenship. She applied immediately upon living here for the mandatory period of time to be eligible (four years I think?) and is awaiting a date for the ceremony. When i asked her why she'd applied, she described it as an "insurance policy" against any future changes to immigration legislation, so that even if she went home to Ireland for a period of time she'd always have the opportunity to return here if she wished. Personally, I did briefly toy with the idea of applying for citizenship in 2014 when I was stung for the cost of a Resident Return Visa during a trip back home, but instead elected not to. When it came down to it, it just didn't feel like a very honest thing for me to do. I currently live in Australia but only because my (Australian) partner wanted to spend some time back here. I've never felt at home here and feel no affinity with this country and so that in all honesty making a pledge to the place seemed well, dishonest, in truth.

 

I just wondered though how many P.I.O. members have either got citizenship or are planning to apply for it and what prompted it? Was it because you feel Australian now (perhaps more than you feel British), or because you want to display your commitment to your adopted country or because you want the ability to come and go with the ease that comes with holding an Australian passport? Or, is there another reason that I haven't touched upon?

 

I did it to give my children CHOICE .

In a world where that is becoming less so .

My eldest daughter is an Aussie ,but the youngest was born in the u.k .

Sort if thinking ahead ,as soon as the youngest was born ,I got her an Aussie passport .

At the moment ,does she care ,appreciate or understand NO ....but one day she might

[ali]

We arrived prior to the rule change and were eligible after 2 years. It was always our plan to apply for citizenship, we didn't/don't intend returning to the UK and as such wanted to be able to vote in elections. Had we not been determined to settle here, I'm not sure that I would have taken out citizenship, whilst I can't knock people for having an insurance policy, it wouldn't be something that would have sat comfortably with me if I wasn't prepared to invest in living here.

Edited March 21, 2016 by ali

[Parley]

I did it to give my children CHOICE .

In a world where that is becoming less so .

My eldest daughter is an Aussie ,but the youngest was born in the u.k .

Sort if thinking ahead ,as soon as the youngest was born ,I got her an Aussie passport .

At the moment ,does she care ,appreciate or understand NO ....but one day she might

 

Why do you have to do it as soon as she is born.

Couldn't she get hers herself whenever she wants later ?

[DT55]

We're eligible to apply on 9th April and I will put in my application on that day. Reasons?

-long term commitment to Oz

-not having to bother with RRV visas

-peace of mind in case government decides to make any stupid rules that may be to the detriment of non citizens

- access to HECS funds for kids

[dmjg]

Why do you have to do it as soon as she is born.

Couldn't she get hers herself whenever she wants later ?

 

Because you never know when they (governments) are going to move the goal posts.

 

When i was born, my parents could have gotten me a uk passport as my grandfather was (is) a pom.

 

But that rule changed in 1982,

 

So i had to get an ancestry visa,

 

Followed by unlimited leave to remain,

 

Followed by citizenship,

 

Followed by the passport.

 

Harder, more expensive, more stressful.

 

 

 

If i hadnt have done this before we left in 2009,

 

we would now have alot of trouble getting me back if we needed to,

 

as the other three are all uk citizens by birth or descent.

[amibovered]

My wife took British citizenship 11 years ago, just as well, it would have made returning to the U.K last year a pain without it.

[Guest]

As both your wife and daughter are citizens, EW,

 

what happens if you go back

 

and in fifteen years the little one comes back for a holiday,

 

meets some surfer dude,

 

pro-creates,

 

buys a house,

 

and gramps cant come and stay for long because he didnt take the opportunity of unfetted access when it arose???

 

 

Oh god, if she hooked up with someone like that then I'd disown her!

 

I'm joking of course.

 

Seriously though, as parents we expect our daughter to have inherited her mother's adventurous spirit when it comes to travel, and so if we're living in England we'd fully expect her to assert her independence from us by living in Australia. It's exactly what my OH did to her own parents! Projecting into the future (always a risk I know), I'd imagine that if our daughter ever made me a grandparent that I'd still be able to visit her for a holiday, say 2-3 weeks, on a regular holiday visa?

[Marisawright]

An Irish colleague of mine was surprised when I shared with her that despite having been in Australia for over seven years I hadn't applied for citizenship. She applied immediately upon living here for the mandatory period of time to be eligible (four years I think?) and is awaiting a date for the ceremony. When i asked her why she'd applied, she described it as an "insurance policy" against any future changes to immigration legislation, so that even if she went home to Ireland for a period of time she'd always have the opportunity to return here if she wished.

 

The "insurance policy" is the reason I got citizenship, too. Having said that, I liked Australia and fully intended to stay long-term so I didn't feel at all dishonest in doing so.

 

I do think people with Australian children are mad not to get citizenship even if they have scruples. You can never say never: I know you hate it here, but what if all your kids end up returning to Australia when they're older, and you can't afford the money to apply for a Parent's Visa (assuming they're even available by then)? Would you be happier living all alone in the UK or would you wish you could be in Oz with your kids? Of course you could still visit on a holiday visa, while you were fit enough - but what happens when the long trip gets too much?

Edited March 21, 2016 by Marisawright

[Quoll]

Pragmatics really. The scuttlebut at the time was that I wouldn't be able to be employed in my role unless I was a citizen (turned out to be untrue in the end but it was a distinct possibility at the time). Add to that the dual citizenship of both my kids so never quite sure where they might end up and ease of access to grandkids. And having an Australian DH made it easier all round. We were amazingly fortunate however that DH became eligible for UK citizenship because his mum was UK born - albeit in 1919! That was a whole lot easier than a spouse visa would have been when we needed to be here for my parents

[Guest]

The "insurance policy" is the reason I got citizenship, too. Having said that, I liked Australia and fully intended to stay long-term so I didn't feel at all dishonest in doing so.

 

I do think people with Australian children are mad not to get citizenship even if they have scruples. You can never say never: I know you hate it here, but what if all your kids end up returning to Australia when they're older, and you can't afford the money to apply for a Parent's Visa (assuming they're even available by then)? Would you be happier living all alone in the UK or would you wish you could be in Oz with your kids? Of course you could still visit on a holiday visa, while you were fit enough - but what happens when the long trip gets too much?

 

There'd be nothing to stop her visiting her aged parents in the UK! :smile:

 

Seriously though, our kids are only on loan to us. Part of watching them grow up is preparing yourself for the time when they leave the nest and strike out on their own. It's easier to say than do I'm sure, but it's part of life no? I certainly don't envisage returning to live in Australia after we leave, but I can see myself visiting if necessary.

[Marisawright]

There'd be nothing to stop her visiting her aged parents in the UK! :smile:

 

.....except cost and time. When my parents were alive, I visited for 6 to 8 weeks every two years. It meant I didn't have any other holidays for about fifteen years, as I had to save up all my money and annual leave for the "big trip" - and it was always a struggle to get a big block of leave approved. And that was just me and my oh, we didn't have the extra expense of kids (which would've meant flying in school holidays i.e. peak season, as well as the extra fares). You're assuming your kids will be well off and able to pop home whenever they want, and that may not be the case.

 

Also, what if one of your children or grandchildren is taken seriously ill? Your wife will be able to fly over to Oz to help care for him/her, but you'll have to be content with a visit, then go back to the UK and watch helplessly from the sidelines.

 

These are all "what if" scenarios which will probably never happen - but they COULD happen, and that's precisely why we take out insurance.

 

Actually if you look at the words of the pledge, it's not that onerous and in fact, you could probably say 90% of it with perfect truth.

 

"From this time forward, I pledge my loyalty toAustralia and its people, whose democratic beliefs I share, whose rights and liberties I respect, and whose laws I will uphold and obey."

[Harpodom]

I did it for various reasons. Firstly, I was the odd one out in the family, second I was eligible, and after nearly 8 years here I now feel part Aussie, part Brit

 

But what ACTUALLY spurred me to do it (last year-3 years later than I could have done) was Tony Abbott and parleycross: being able to vote is THE big issue for me.

[Patphillips47]

.....except cost and time. When my parents were alive, I visited for 6 to 8 weeks every two years. It meant I didn't have any other holidays for about fifteen years, as I had to save up all my money and annual leave for the "big trip" - and it was always a struggle to get a big block of leave approved. And that was just me and my oh, we didn't have the extra expense of kids (which would've meant flying in school holidays i.e. peak season, as well as the extra fares). You're assuming your kids will be well off and able to pop home whenever they want, and that may not be the case.

 

Also, what if one of your children or grandchildren is taken seriously ill? Your wife will be able to fly over to Oz to help care for him/her, but you'll have to be content with a visit, then go back to the UK and watch helplessly from the sidelines.

 

These are all "what if" scenarios which will probably never happen - but they COULD happen, and that's precisely why we take out insurance.

 

Actually if you look at the words of the pledge, it's not that onerous and in fact, you could probably say 90% of it with perfect truth.

 

"From this time forward, I pledge my loyalty toAustralia and its people, whose democratic beliefs I share, whose rights and liberties I respect, and whose laws I will uphold and obey."

Your story is more or less my story holidays from Oz were always to the UK to see my Mam and Dad then when Dad passed away trips became even more frequent and eventually we moved back to the UK to look after Mam

Now its the other way round -in the UK but family pulling us back

I think if your entitled to citizenship its worth while having it regardless if you stay or go

[Diane]

I did it for various reasons. Firstly, I was the odd one out in the family, second I was eligible, and after nearly 8 years here I now feel part Aussie, part Brit

 

But what ACTUALLY spurred me to do it (last year-3 years later than I could have done) was Tony Abbott and parleycross: being able to vote is THE big issue for me.

 

This ^^

 

For goodness sake, EW, do it and do it quick (like before 2nd July!)

 

Actually I activated my citizenship by birth when I was about 21 - if I'd needed visa to come out here in 2004 I would have never have passed the medical to get one. The kids' citizenship by descent I activated on the weekend of the 2003 Rugby World Cup final....

[Guest]

.....except cost and time. When my parents were alive, I visited for 6 to 8 weeks every two years. It meant I didn't have any other holidays for about fifteen years, as I had to save up all my money and annual leave for the "big trip" - and it was always a struggle to get a big block of leave approved. And that was just me and my oh, we didn't have the extra expense of kids (which would've meant flying in school holidays i.e. peak season, as well as the extra fares). You're assuming your kids will be well off and able to pop home whenever they want, and that may not be the case.

 

Also, what if one of your children or grandchildren is taken seriously ill? Your wife will be able to fly over to Oz to help care for him/her, but you'll have to be content with a visit, then go back to the UK and watch helplessly from the sidelines.

 

These are all "what if" scenarios which will probably never happen - but they COULD happen, and that's precisely why we take out insurance.

 

Actually if you look at the words of the pledge, it's not that onerous and in fact, you could probably say 90% of it with perfect truth.

 

"From this time forward, I pledge my loyalty toAustralia and its people, whose democratic beliefs I share, whose rights and liberties I respect, and whose laws I will uphold and obey."

 

I completely understand the notion of the 'insurance policy' to enable someone to return to Australia if required, I just wonder whether applying for citizenship is the only way to ensure this in the long-term? Particularly as I already have a Spouse Visa?

 

I should point out that I completely understand why people might choose to be pragmatic in securing citizenship just in case they need it. It's just that for me it would feel wrong as I don't identify with Australia and so applying for citizenship would feel like hypocrisy in my case.