bristolman Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 You really must stop letting facts get in the way, eventually the remoners will get to grips with the fact the Europe hasn't been plunged into war, economic depression hasn't engulfed the UK and all the other "project fear" scare stories haven't come true, no doubt they'll say, ah but we are still in the EU, that is true, but so far none of the predictions have been realised, so I can't see why anyone would take notice of their doom and gloom predictions post EU membership, by the way I think the cold spell later this week is because of Brexit. I still have remoaners telling me that the economy is on the verge of collapse even though every indicator says the opposite. I would hate to go through life being so negative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amibovered Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 I still have remoaners telling me that the economy is on the verge of collapse even though every indicator says the opposite. I would hate to go through life being so negative. In truth it's just a left wing ideology that nation states are to blame for everything, the EU was meant to bring the end of nation states in Europe, all the economic scare stories are really just wishful thinking, in the hope that we'll be punished for betrayal of the dream. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolman Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 In truth it's just a left wing ideology that nation states are to blame for everything, the EU was meant to bring the end of nation states in Europe, all the economic scare stories are really just wishful thinking, in the hope that we'll be punished for betrayal of the dream. I'm amazed by those that clearly want it to go pear shaped so they feel vindicated, they don't care what the cost as long as they can say I told you so. Fortunately there is absolutely nothing to indicate they will get their wish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amibovered Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 I'm amazed by those that clearly want it to go pear shaped so they feel vindicated, they don't care what the cost as long as they can say I told you so. Fortunately there is absolutely nothing to indicate they will get their wish. I wish we still had the LIKE button :notworthy: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BacktoDemocracy Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 (edited) The far right have learned how to use social media to spread phoney new stories. It was especially evident in the US Presidential campaign. The truth is becoming harder and harder to find. A worrying trend, the far right in the Tories seem to continue to control the actions of the party, having got rid of Cameron it seems like they are holding May to ransom now, if that is the case, and it seems increasingly likely, then we are facing a true return to the 1920's/30's, it is all starting to look a little scary. I am very willing to hear voices of optimism and would love to hear facts that counter my view but after her announcement yesterday about immigration being the major issue and saying the UK is leaving the EU I am left with a lot of fears like what if we are facing a right wing 'putsch' where taking back control is the only thing that concerns them, do we have more Machivellian Moseley ' s hiding in the Tory party than we have ever imagined, are there enough white supremacists hiding in there to just disregard the future of the country so long as they stop johnny foreigner. The far right have for years seemed like pantomime baddies, there to be booed, what if they aren't, is it too late, why is May being so secretive and why the delay and why the fight against giving parliament a say. It may be my predilection for doom and gloom but I am now starting to feel uneasy that the extreme right is making a real come back, I hope not but May increasingly does not strike me as someone with a liberal bone in her body and the opposition has been traduced by idiots who completely ignored the extreme right in their assessment of the political landscape. A thought that has struck me is that since John Major there has not been anyone who has made an effort to confront the right. Can someone out there make a case for a different analysis. Edited January 9, 2017 by BacktoDemocracy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjez Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 A worrying trend, the far right in the Tories seem to continue to control the actions of the party, having got rid of Cameron it seems like they are holding May to ransom now, if that is the case, and it seems increasingly likely, then we are facing a true return to the 1920's/30's, it is all starting to look a little scary.I am very willing to hear voices of optimism and would love to hear facts that counter my view but after her announcement yesterday about immigration being the major issue and saying the UK is leaving the EU I am left with a lot of fears like what if we are facing a right wing 'putsch' where taking back control is the only thing that concerns them, do we have more Machivellian Moseley ' s hiding in the Tory party than we have ever imagined, are there enough white supremacists hiding in there to just disregard the future of the country so long as they stop johnny foreigner. The far right have for years seemed like pantomime baddies, there to be booed, what if they aren't, is it too late, why is May being so secretive and why the delay and why the fight against giving parliament a say. It may be my predilection for doom and gloom but I am now starting to feel uneasy that the extreme right is making a real come back, I hope not but May increasingly does not strike me as someone with a liberal bone in her body and the opposition has been traduced by idiots who completely ignored the extreme right in their assessment of the political landscape. A thought that has struck me is that since John Major there has not been anyone who has made an effort to confront the right. Can someone out there make a case for a different analysis. A very British Coup. Pound hammered today. Nearly at a yearly low. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gbye grey sky Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 I found this interesting. Has may been paralyzed by the complexity, her need to control, and her lack of faith in her underlings? http://www.economist.com/news/leaders/21713837-after-six-months-what-new-prime-minister-stands-still-unclearperhaps-even?&intent=&gclid=CNqCs4egtNECFawV0wodg0cBOg If so, it doesn't bode well. Train crash brexit caused by dithering driver. Implementing a successful outcome following the vote to leave the EU was always an impossible task. Cameron rightly jumped quickly and his old Etonian pal, Boris, was smart enough to see the train crash coming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjez Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 I'm amazed by those that clearly want it to go pear shaped so they feel vindicated, they don't care what the cost as long as they can say I told you so. Fortunately there is absolutely nothing to indicate they will get their wish. maybe when the pound reaches parity with the USD you might finally start to realise there are real dangers here if the government don't get their act into gear and come up with some sort of feasible plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjez Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 Your glass isn't even half full lol did you not understand my reply? You're response made no sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjez Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 (edited) If may doesn't want people to missinterpret her, then maybe she shouldn't talk in riddles, and answer direct questions. She's more criptic than Bristolman, and that takes some doing. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jan/09/theresa-may-media-is-misrepresenting-my-brexit-views Edited January 9, 2017 by newjez Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjez Posted January 9, 2017 Share Posted January 9, 2017 I'm amazed by those that clearly want it to go pear shaped so they feel vindicated, they don't care what the cost as long as they can say I told you so. Fortunately there is absolutely nothing to indicate they will get their wish. what a moronic comment. We're all terrified it will go pear shaped. I feel so sorry for those trying to take money over to Australia. Where as you seem to have no compassion for what suffering you have caused these people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gbye grey sky Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 (edited) I'm amazed by those that clearly want it to go pear shaped so they feel vindicated, they don't care what the cost as long as they can say I told you so. Fortunately there is absolutely nothing to indicate they will get their wish. You are so blinkered that you clearly cannot read the signs. I would love it, love it, love it, if my pessimistic outlook on this debacle was proven completely wrong and the UK prospered post-Brexit. Not only do I have pensions in the UK which I could not move but also friends and family and I am concerned for them. It must be a lot easier to be blindly optimistic. What I have struggled to comprehend is people advocating change (leaving the EU) who thought everything was rosy as it was. Like having your perfect home but deciding to move out to one around the corner which the surveyor has said is likely to fall down. Edited January 10, 2017 by Gbye grey sky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parley Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 Most countries, including Australia, manage to prosper without being part of some gigantic club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith and Linda Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 maybe when the pound reaches parity with the USD you might finally start to realise there are real dangers here if the government don't get their act into gear and come up with some sort of feasible plan. I remember some years ago now that the sky was going to fall on our heads if the pound dropped below $2 US, but then it could be $1.99 or $1.72 or $1.5325 just pick a figure hey! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith and Linda Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 You are so blinkered that you clearly cannot read the signs. I would love it, love it, love it, if my pessimistic outlook on this debacle was proven completely wrong and the UK prospered post-Brexit. Not only do I have pensions in the UK which I could not move but also friends and family and I am concerned for them. It must be a lot easier to be blindly optimistic. What I have struggled to comprehend is people advocating change (leaving the EU) who thought everything was rosy as it was. Like having your perfect home but deciding to move out to one around the corner which the surveyor has said is likely to fall down. I would get another surveyor! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith and Linda Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 what a moronic comment. We're all terrified it will go pear shaped. I feel so sorry for those trying to take money over to Australia. Where as you seem to have no compassion for what suffering you have caused these people. here we go again using the word ALL, just so not true but it does help bolster your own view. maybe some compassion for ones going to the UK though, again just your one way view of things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gbye grey sky Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 I would get another surveyor! But you would still move out of your perfect home to one which according to most surveyors was in poor shape. High risk for no discernible gain. Betting on an outsider for the chance of getting your stake back to use an alternative metaphor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith and Linda Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 But you would still move out of your perfect home to one which according to most surveyors was in poor shape. High risk for no discernible gain. Betting on an outsider for the chance of getting your stake back to use an alternative metaphor. So was it your surveyor that also said it was a perfect home you already had? however if your perfect home was full with a queue outside waiting to get in then not everybody would want to remain in there and would be willing to renovate and underpin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gbye grey sky Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 So was it your surveyor that also said it was a perfect home you already had? however if your perfect home was full with a queue outside waiting to get in then not everybody would want to remain in there and would be willing to renovate and underpin. No, it is the posters themselves who, ad nauseum, have beaten the drum for years for the place that they live. For them it is utopia and they have also made clear that immigration was not the issue that led to them advocating change either. It is a mystery why people with a seemingly perfect existence are so keen to change it for an uncertain future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith and Linda Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 No, it is the posters themselves who, ad nauseum, have beaten the drum for years for the place that they live. For them it is utopia and they have also made clear that immigration was not the issue that led to them advocating change either. It is a mystery why people with a seemingly perfect existence are so keen to change it for an uncertain future. Well it was you that said it was a perfect home, and it is you that is assuming a seemingly others belief of perfect existence. Also is not the future always uncertain anyhow? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjez Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 I remember some years ago now that the sky was going to fall on our heads if the pound dropped below $2 US, but then it could be $1.99 or $1.72 or $1.5325 just pick a figure hey! your currency is effectively your reverse blood pressure. Just because it's low(high) doesn't mean you are going to die, but it's a good sign that not all is well, and you may want to look at your lifestyle, or else you may start to develop problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjez Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 Most countries, including Australia, manage to prosper without being part of some gigantic club.yep, why would Australia want that? http://dfat.gov.au/trade/agreements/tpp/pages/trans-pacific-partnership-agreement-tpp.aspx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parley Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 Trade agreements are a bit different to the EU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjez Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 In truth it's just a left wing ideology that nation states are to blame for everything, the EU was meant to bring the end of nation states in Europe, all the economic scare stories are really just wishful thinking, in the hope that we'll be punished for betrayal of the dream.left of Corbyn? https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jan/09/jeremy-corbyn-uk-is-better-off-out-of-eu-with-managed-migration Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjez Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 (edited) Trade agreements are a bit different to the EU.it started as a kiss... But I agree, UK should leave the EU and be a part of the EEA/EFTA - either as a transition or permanent state Edited January 10, 2017 by newjez Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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