Having kids

[Guest littlesarah]

The Royal College of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists has also warned that those over the age of 40 are up to three times more likely to lose their baby than younger mothers.

Their babies also face a greater risk of ill-health or abnormalities such as Down’s Syndrome.

It is dangerous to promote the thinking that women can safely wait until their 40's to have a baby.

It is very risky.

 

The truth is that pregnancy is risky at any age - 25% of confirmed pregnancies are lost before birth (with estimates of up to 50% if we include positive pregnancy tests lost before medical confirmation), and 17 babies per day die before or shortly after birth in the UK. The risk of chromosomal abnormality is indeed higher with age, but as soon as one decides to try to get pregnant, the risk of emotional and physical trauma is set in chain. Even in someone in their 40s, the risk of chromosomal abnormality and miscarriage is still lower than the likelihood of a successful outcome, so I think that to describe pregnancy in that age group as 'very risky' isn't necessarily accurate. I think that any woman having a baby over 35 considers the risks and all possible outcomes, and to suggest that women should be scared to do so is somewhat patronising. The baby I lost most likely had a chromosomal abnormality, but when I was pregnant with Baby Little I refused the recommended screening tests because I knew that I would carry that little life for as long as I could, regardless of the eventual outcome. I would love to eventually have another, but I really need to finish my PhD first, so I'll be at least 41 if/when I get pregnant again; and again I'll probably develop diabetes (which also places the pregnancy at risk) - but I am intelligent and educated enough to make my own decisions. Maybe you wouldn't make the same choices at me, but as you haven't lived my life, you can't really say either way.

 

For the purposes of accuracy, the estimates are something like 1 in 66 chance of chromosomal abnormality at age 40, vs 1 in 384 at age 30. But compared to the overall chance of pregnancy loss (1 in 4)

 

In addition, the condition of the sperm can also influence chromosomes, and there is evidence that folic acid supplements in men may improve outcomes too. So I think we can conclude that many factors contribute to pregnancy loss, some of which cannot be changed (like maternal and paternal age), but some of which can (diet, lifestyle, medical intervention) - and the importance of these other factors isn't fully understood.

[Parley]

Stacey, what do you mean by old fashioned people ?

Every generation of young people assume they are wiser than their parents. It has always been so but probably isn't true.

 

Risk is relative of course as I have been trying to say.

A woman's reproductive system is at its peak in her early 20's. The risk increases as she ages.

By mid 30's the risk is significantly greater than early 20's and as she hits her 40's it is significant;y worse again.

 

This is simple physiology.

Calling it old fashioned won't change much.

 

But find the right man is probably the first step anyway.

[Guest51810]

Stacey, what do you mean by old fashioned people ?

Every generation of young people assume they are wiser than their parents. It has always been so but probably isn't true.

 

Risk is relative of course as I have trying to say.

A woman's reproductive system is at its peak in her early 20's. The risk increases as she ages.

By mid 30's the risk is significantly greater than early 20's and as she hits her 40's it is significant;y worse again.

 

This is simple physiology.

Calling it old fashioned won't change much.

 

But find the right man is probably the first step anyway.

 

I've had someone tell me I need to choose between travel/a good job and having a child. That I can't have all those things. I find that a tad old fashioned. They didn't mention it from the physical point of view, it was more like women should stay home with their children instead of working full time.

 

There was no way I would have wanted to have kids at 22 but some friends have. Definitely not for me. I can't even imagine having one in the next few years to be honest but I don't like people telling me that I might be too old in my early 30's. It makes me feel rushed. Although your right - I need to find a guy first!

[Guest51810]

We all just assume that we can have children at this age anyway. I have a friend who is trying and she's finding it harder. I think she had a ovary removed or something like that

[Marisawright]

Who is promoting that on this thread?

 

My argument would be that women need to be aware of their ongoing fertility to avoid accidental pregnancy at a later age and with the added risks of increased disability. No-one would argue that it's a great idea to have your babies at 40 plus ...

 

To be fair, the general tone of the preceding discussion was that there's no harm in delaying motherhood if you want.

[Marisawright]

I've had someone tell me I need to choose between travel/a good job and having a child. That I can't have all those things. I find that a tad old fashioned. They didn't mention it from the physical point of view, it was more like women should stay home with their children instead of working full time.

 

There was no way I would have wanted to have kids at 22 but some friends have. Definitely not for me. I can't even imagine having one in the next few years to be honest but I don't like people telling me that I might be too old in my early 30's. It makes me feel rushed. Although your right - I need to find a guy first!

 

I think there are several factors to consider. You haven't found the right guy yet, so of course it makes sense for you to be wait. What worries me is when I see a young couple in their twenties who say they're delaying, even though they definitely want kids.

 

Let's face it, there are so many things that can happen. What if they wait till she's 35, then nothing happens? By the time they've tried for a while, realised there may be a problem, started investigations, tried treatments, failed, tried IVF, failed multiple times -suddenly they're too old for adoption and have missed the boat. Whereas if they'd tried for a baby in their 20's they would've had ample time to explore all options.

 

Or take another example - married at 19, decided to wait till 30 to have a child. Marriage broke up at 29. Didn't find another partner until she was 40 and discovered she was already going through early menopause.

 

There are two ways to look at having children young. True, you miss out on having that freedom in your twenties or thirties - but on the flip side, your kids are going to be grown up and independent when you're still in your forties, which you may think is old but is actually the best years of a woman's life - you're still looking good, but you've got all that life experience behind you.

[Parley]

Exactly Marisa, very well put.

We are in total agreement.

[Guest51810]

Yep sometimes I wish I was ready to have them at this age since it's easier when they are growing up. Don't have a partner so there's no point me worrying. Can't help it sometimes though! I'm at a iffy age where I'm still young but on the side of 20's that it's expected of us to settle down soon, have kids, have a job sorted, marriage etc.

[Guest51810]

I agree though - If people are in a relationship and want kids then there's probably no point putting it off a long time

[Guest littlesarah]

To be fair, the general tone of the preceding discussion was that there's no harm in delaying motherhood if you want.

 

I wouldn't say there's 'harm' in delaying motherhood because it just means that some of the risks are increased. But babies of mothers of all ages die before or at the time of birth - it's just that no one talks about it. Yes, some of the risks are higher over 35, but that doesn't mean that having a baby later is the wrong thing to do. In life, we have to make risk assessments all the time, and the information around conception and birth is freely available so we should all consider it before we launch into getting pregnant. There are many factors to consider, and age is only one of them. I would suggest that each couple needs to figure out when they want to try to start to a family, and do what feels right to them. I agree with your points about having less time to address infertility, but again it's just one of many things to think about.

[Guest51810]

I wish I hadn't read this thread now.. It seems to have got my biological clock ticking :laugh: I'll be cooing over baby clothes even more now when I go into Next clothing shop

[Guest littlesarah]

I wish I hadn't read this thread now.. It seems to have got my biological clock ticking :laugh: I'll be cooing over baby clothes even more now when I go into Next clothing shop

 

When/if the time is right, you'll know. And then you have to try to accept whatever had you get dealt. As with seemingly everything to do with children, everyone has their own experience, and many believe that theirs is the right and only way to proceed. As you know, I'm ancient to have just started a family, but I am certain that I am better for it (but then I'm also certain that working as much as I do is also right for my family, as is bottle feeding, cloth nappying, part time daycare and a bunch of other things that may or may not be right for everyone!) :wink:

[flag of convenience]

Yep sometimes I wish I was ready to have them at this age since it's easier when they are growing up. Don't have a partner so there's no point me worrying. Can't help it sometimes though! I'm at a iffy age where I'm still young but on the side of 20's that it's expected of us to settle down soon, have kids, have a job sorted, marriage etc.

 

I thought this was the globalised generation not getting committed to ties and experiencing what life had to offer.

[flag of convenience]

The old fashioned people got to me and I started thinking that maybe leaving it till my 30's isn't right but I've just thought of 5 women who have had kids in their mid 30's and they don't seem too old at all. They already had kids before though

 

When and if the time is right you'll likely know. Plenty of time in your case though. Don't let others influence your decision.

[Paul1Perth]

I've had someone tell me I need to choose between travel/a good job and having a child. That I can't have all those things. I find that a tad old fashioned. They didn't mention it from the physical point of view, it was more like women should stay home with their children instead of working full time.

 

There was no way I would have wanted to have kids at 22 but some friends have. Definitely not for me. I can't even imagine having one in the next few years to be honest but I don't like people telling me that I might be too old in my early 30's. It makes me feel rushed. Although your right - I need to find a guy first!

 

You can get your travel in while you're young Stacey and a good job might come by, it might not. Having a job you might enjoy is more important IMO.

 

Things have to change when you have kids Stacey, whether it seems old fashioned or not you can't carry on the same. You have to make choices about work, holidays, travel, friends, social outings. You feel constantly tired and it's easy to start having arguments with your partner as one of you thinks the other one is not putting in as much effort.

 

You don't realise how hard it is till they role up.

[HappyHeart]

I think there are several factors to consider. You haven't found the right guy yet, so of course it makes sense for you to be wait. What worries me is when I see a young couple in their twenties who say they're delaying, even though they definitely want kids.

 

Let's face it, there are so many things that can happen. What if they wait till she's 35, then nothing happens? By the time they've tried for a while, realised there may be a problem, started investigations, tried treatments, failed, tried IVF, failed multiple times -suddenly they're too old for adoption and have missed the boat. Whereas if they'd tried for a baby in their 20's they would've had ample time to explore all options.

 

Or take another example - married at 19, decided to wait till 30 to have a child. Marriage broke up at 29. Didn't find another partner until she was 40 and discovered she was already going through early menopause.

 

There are two ways to look at having children young. True, you miss out on having that freedom in your twenties or thirties - but on the flip side, your kids are going to be grown up and independent when you're still in your forties, which you may think is old but is actually the best years of a woman's life - you're still looking good, but you've got all that life experience behind you.

 

 

But people make these decisions at the time..for all the right reasons. You have to be ready. These things happen for a reason...if you're meant to be childless then so be it...acceptance of the hand you're dealt rather than trying to design your future. I think if you've made a decision that you later regret you shouldn't beat yourself up about it. We wouldn't do anything if we had hindsight...just let things pan out how they're meant to....

[JockinTas]

^^^ I always smile to myself when I hear young folk saying "Having a baby won't change our lives so much" ..... little do they know :wink:

[Parley]

@HappyHeart, that is the whole problem and what we have been discussing.

People are NOT meant to be childless. But sadly it can happen because they leave things too late by focussing on hedonistic pursuits and career ambitions, thinking the family can wait.

Then, as Marisa points out, the marriage breaks down or fertility problems arise too late. But it didn't have to be that way.

[Marisawright]

Yep sometimes I wish I was ready to have them at this age since it's easier when they are growing up. Don't have a partner so there's no point me worrying. Can't help it sometimes though! I'm at a iffy age where I'm still young but on the side of 20's that it's expected of us to settle down soon, have kids, have a job sorted, marriage etc.

 

Your time will come. Maybe you're just being more sensible, and bypassing the mistakes and failed relationships/marriages some of us have along the way! I was in two long relationships (one a marriage) before I finally found my current oh, and by that time I was fifty. So you've got a long way to go yet before you have to worry!

[Marisawright]

But people make these decisions at the time..for all the right reasons. You have to be ready. These things happen for a reason...if you're meant to be childless then so be it...acceptance of the hand you're dealt rather than trying to design your future. I think if you've made a decision that you later regret you shouldn't beat yourself up about it. We wouldn't do anything if we had hindsight...just let things pan out how they're meant to....

 

I don't disagree. No one should be having kids because they "should" (which was the attitude often pushed on to my generation) - it's up to each individual. But what I see now is the opposite: young women who really want a baby, being pressured into not fulfilling that desire because today's society demands you have to 'achieve' first. That would be fine if getting pregnant in her thirties was guaranteed, but it isn't -- these days most of us have trouble predicting what we'll be doing in 5 years let alone 10 or 15.

[HappyHeart]

@HappyHeart, that is the whole problem and what we have been discussing.

People are NOT meant to be childless. But sadly it can happen because they leave things too late by focussing on hedonistic pursuits and career ambitions, thinking the family can wait.

Then, as Marisa points out, the marriage breaks down or fertility problems arise too late. But it didn't have to be that way.

 

 

I disagree Parley and see it in a different way but that's fine, we can't all have the same viewpoint. I don't think we are all meant to have children, nor do I think some people with children 'should' have them....I just think you can only decision make with the information available to you in the current moment and if that leads to regrets down the track..so be it.

[Marisawright]

People are NOT meant to be childless.

 

Again, I don't think nature bears that out. In nature, many animals never get to mate let alone have offspring. That can be due to opportunity, or it could be the pecking order in a herd or pack (only the dominant animals are allowed to reproduce). Humans are unique in being able (sometimes) to make a choice about it, rather than being dictated by circumstances. In fact if every single animal (or every single human) in the world did reproduce, we'd be in even more trouble than we are now!

[HappyHeart]

I don't disagree. No one should be having kids because they "should" (which was the attitude often pushed on to my generation) - it's up to each individual. But what I see now is the opposite: young women who really want a baby, being pressured into not fulfilling that desire because today's society demands you have to 'achieve' first. That would be fine if getting pregnant in her thirties was guaranteed, but it isn't -- these days most of us have trouble predicting what we'll be doing in 5 years let alone 10 or 15.

 

 

I know what you mean..the demands on women nowadays are multiple..but we are at least lucky to have 'choices'....women make decisions based on what they want and what they feel is their priority. No doubt that can lead to regrets in the future but....we are all blessed with a brain and individual decision making is just that.

 

If my career had been my priority at 22 who knows where I would be now in terms of family....I did it the other way round but that's not to say one way is better..or worse..it can be for the best...

[Parley]

What I meant was people do a whole lot of other things in there 20's and 30's and when they hit late 30's try for a baby and fail.

The excuse that they weren't meant to have a baby is probably wrong. They just left it too late.

[Paul1Perth]

@HappyHeart, that is the whole problem and what we have been discussing.

People are NOT meant to be childless. But sadly it can happen because they leave things too late by focussing on hedonistic pursuits and career ambitions, thinking the family can wait.

Then, as Marisa points out, the marriage breaks down or fertility problems arise too late. But it didn't have to be that way.

 

Some people and couples choose to be childless and there's nothing wrong with that. Plenty of people with kids end up divorced too. Sometimes because of the extra pressures that come along with kids. Sometimes one partner has just gone along with the idea of having kids, because of the grief they are getting, thinking things will carry on the same when kids come along. When they do come along they want to carry on the same as they did and it breeds resentment and an unhappy end to the marriage.