So Brexit now needs parliamentary approval?

Eh, most Tories want to remain?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-35616946

Eh, most Tories want to remain?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-35616946

one day you may understand. It's not a left wing thing. It's a little bit more complicated than that.

 

 

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-35616946

Hahaha, that's a laugh, you really don't have a clue do you, you've posted a link from before the referendum showing how they intended to vote, utterly useless now as most have said they will respect the result of the referendum.

I'll help you out a bit, with some up to date info http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-news-all-mps-trigger-article-50-indicate-vote-against-ken-clarke-nick-clegg-leave-eu-a7543131.html

Oh look 1 Conservative, Ken Clarke, surprise,surprise.

Comedy gold mate.

Hahaha, that's a laugh, you really don't have a clue do you, you've posted a link from before the referendum showing how they intended to vote, utterly useless now as most have said they will respect the result of the referendum.

I'll help you out a bit, with some up to date info http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-news-all-mps-trigger-article-50-indicate-vote-against-ken-clarke-nick-clegg-leave-eu-a7543131.html

Oh look 1 Conservative, Ken Clarke, surprise,surprise.

Comedy gold mate.

It's especially worrying when you read things like this.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/01/24/jeremy-corbyn-nicola-sturgeon-plot-undermine-theresa-mays-plans/

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jan/24/supreme-court-forces-theresa-may-give-mps-brexit-vote-article-50

Provide a small enough gap and the Tory europhiles may jump it.

one day you may understand. It's not a left wing thing. It's a little bit more complicated than that.

 

 

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-35616946

only complicated in your mind mate, to most people its very clear, you do realise that the tories whips were out in force and many MPs voted for cameron's view when in truth they wanted out.

Would they dare to vote not to leave ?

Total waste of tax payers money , the people voted to leave no need to go to the high court.

Many Tories occupy seats in the south east of England where the vote was solidly Remain. Those voters will not punish their Tory MP for conceding a hard Brexit provided that it does not affect them adversely. You only have to look at what happened in the Richmond by-election where the Tory Independent was ousted by the Lib Dem solely because he supported Leave. Many Tory MPs down there still want a job post 2020 so that should motivate them to scrutinise the Goverment's proposals carefully.

There are a lot of Tories highly sceptical about the benefits of leaving the single market as are many businesses. When business leaders speak out Tories listen for sure as Nissan will attest.

Would they dare to vote not to leave ?

Total waste of tax payers money , the people voted to leave no need to go to the high court.

Would they dare to vote not to leave ?

Total waste of tax payers money , the people voted to leave no need to go to the high court.

The main point at issue is not about Leave or Remain. It is about Parliament having the opportunity to scrutinise and debate the terms of Brexit. The Government having to justify those terms and ultimately be held to account by somebody. It is what Parliament exists for really and anyone who thinks that Parliament should be excluded have to think very carefully about what sort of democracy they want.

Referendums are a blunt sword and are completely useless as a tool for framing complex and detailed legislation.

of course they will follow the party line, for article 50. Even labour won't oppose article 50 in strength. But it's clear that given a choice they would favour remain. It's going to be a dirty two years. Anything could happen. The majority of MPs are not in favour of the course of action. If the process gets stuck, which way will they lean?

 

It's especially worrying when you read things like this.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/01/24/jeremy-corbyn-nicola-sturgeon-plot-undermine-theresa-mays-plans/

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jan/24/supreme-court-forces-theresa-may-give-mps-brexit-vote-article-50

 

Provide a small enough gap and the Tory europhiles may jump it.

not that it matters one way or the other, the vote will pass, but it's not about following the party line, the Government voted to have a referendum, you would expect them to respect the result of that wouldn't you?

not that it matters one way or the other, the vote will pass, but it's not about following the party line, the Government voted to have a referendum, you would expect them to respect the result of that wouldn't you?

they do. We are leaving the EU. But parliament will determine how we leave. They will also sort out the problems if we get stuck in any way. But if it comes down to it, and the government puts us on a destructive path, you would hope that parliament would protect us from that. We don't want to become Russia do we?

The main point at issue is not about Leave or Remain. It is about Parliament having the opportunity to scrutinise and debate the terms of Brexit. The Government having to justify those terms and ultimately be held to account by somebody. It is what Parliament exists for really and anyone who thinks that Parliament should be excluded have to think very carefully about what sort of democracy they want.

 

Referendums are a blunt sword and are completely useless as a tool for framing complex and detailed legislation.

"think very carefully about what sort of democracy they want."

Try explaining that to all the people who have thrown their toys out of the pram who were demanding a 2nd vote, like wise everyone who is demanding Trump resign , people voted we don't need the high court to tell us if we can leve or not .

Set up a full cross party committee to negotiate our terms headed by the PM , did the government of the day have to report back and ask if previous negotiations were ok when they tried to get deals before ? , in short no it was left to the PM to get the best deal he or she could , and when done reported to the House of Commons

"think very carefully about what sort of democracy they want."

 

Try explaining that to all the people who have thrown their toys out of the pram who were demanding a 2nd vote, like wise everyone who is demanding Trump resign , people voted we don't need the high court to tell us if we can leve or not .

 

Set up a full cross party committee to negotiate our terms headed by the PM , did the government of the day have to report back and ask if previous negotiations were ok when they tried to get deals before ? , in short no it was left to the PM to get the best deal he or she could , and when done reported to the House of Commons

I have always said that the 2nd referendum calls were a nonsense. But at the end of the day that was only a referendum, not to be conflated with the future of Parliamentary democracy. Referendum as a basis for formulating policy are rubbish because they are so narrowly defined and this particular one hardly produced an overwhelming mandate as a basis for major policy change either but it is what it is and the nation's lawmakers must now implement exit without ruining the livelihoods of millions of people. This will be a major undertaking and if Parliament are not to be involved in something this important then it is open to debate whether Parliament should simply be abolished and an autocracy established backed up by periodic referendums.

Not heard anyone suggesting Trump resign either. Is that relevant?

I have always said that the 2nd referendum calls were a nonsense. But at the end of the day that was only a referendum, not to be conflated with the future of Parliamentary democracy. Referendum as a basis for formulating policy are rubbish because they are so narrowly defined and this particular one hardly produced an overwhelming mandate as a basis for major policy change either but it is what it is and the nation's lawmakers must now implement exit without ruining the livelihoods of millions of people. This will be a major undertaking and if Parliament are not to be involved in something this important then it is open to debate whether Parliament should simply be abolished and an autocracy established backed up by periodic referendums.

 

Not heard anyone suggesting Trump resign either. Is that relevant?

Why am I left with this strong feeling that many who have voted leave are either in favour of an autocracy, so long of course it implements policies favourable to their views, usually anti immigrant, anti foreigner, or simply seem to genuinely not understand democracy and what it does for us.

It seems like because we do not have a written constitution that creates citizens then understanding the importance of Parliament and the courts to hold the executive to account seems not to impinge on people, because we have no written constitution we are particularly vulnerable to a coup especially with a weak opposition, or even a opposition leader who might think that a coup would give his political ideology a rallying point and a relevance in the ensuing economic and social carnage.

There is too much certainty and lack of doubt around the parliamentary brexiteers, it is bravado for some but one is left feeling like some simply do not care what happens, it's like heads I win tails you lose, and Corbyn seems like he is disinterested and is waiting for the car crash so he can pick it over for the scrap value and maybe weld 2 bits together to make a car for himself.

I can no longer make sense of the motives, but I'm not sure that a vicars daughter with a penchant for designer clothes in her 60's has got sufficient of a stranglehold on the party nor sufficient commitment to democracy to be looking out for the future of the country

Interesting to note that while loads of people are saying Brexit will be bad for the economy and the pound, the announcement that Brexit might be delayed (by the courts deciding to uphold the constitution - how crazy is that?) weakened the pound.

they do. We are leaving the EU. But parliament will determine how we leave. They will also sort out the problems if we get stuck in any way. But if it comes down to it, and the government puts us on a destructive path, you would hope that parliament would protect us from that. We don't want to become Russia do we?

Interesting to note that while loads of people are saying Brexit will be bad for the economy and the pound, the announcement that Brexit might be delayed (by the courts deciding to uphold the constitution - how crazy is that?) weakened the pound.

Gbp to the Ozzie dollar has seen a steady rise since last week from 1.61 up to 1.67 currently

Interesting to note that while loads of people are saying Brexit will be bad for the economy and the pound, the announcement that Brexit might be delayed (by the courts deciding to uphold the constitution - how crazy is that?) weakened the pound.

I do love a democracy where two percent of the people control the country.

Interesting to note that while loads of people are saying Brexit will be bad for the economy and the pound, the announcement that Brexit might be delayed (by the courts deciding to uphold the constitution - how crazy is that?) weakened the pound.

Are you viewing the graphs upside down because the GBP has rallied a little.

I do love a democracy where two percent of the people control the country.

Or to put it another way, you hate democracy when a minority does not control the country.

Or to put it another way, you hate democracy when a minority does not control the country.

no, I was being sarcastic.

Okay.

Tasty

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2014-08-08/why-chlorine-chicken-from-america-inspires-dread-in-europe