Quoll Posted December 19, 2010 Share Posted December 19, 2010 I guess I am a bit jaded as well because one of the problems is the assumption that each parent has the child's welfare as a high priority and that is not always the case unfortunately. I do my utmost to make things as easy as I can on little one, do not criticise LO's father to her (the opposite in fact, probably overcompensate) only to have a confused little one coming home saying "Daddy says you're bad and mean and this isn't my home any more." Hate to say it but that sounds pretty much standard. I admire you for being the bigger person in all this. I have a friend who is being similarly skewered by a particularly vindictive ex and she is positively angelic - I would be out with the sharp carving knife for a touch of Bobbiting I am afraid. I did find a neat little voodoo doll complete with pins and spells in Dymocks, just designed to release your inner demon with respect to the ex and I gave her that for Christmas. How she manages to be so "good" is utterly beyond me but she had a really good laugh at the voodoo doll! Maybe you could ask Santa for one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whopperdaisy Posted December 19, 2010 Share Posted December 19, 2010 I guess it is a matter of knowing that it will ultimately hurt little one if I add to the whole mess by retaliating, that thought is a heck of an incentive to behave... I can't control what my ex does, only how I behave and the example I set. It is frustrating as hell but not much choice other than get on with it. You gave me a laugh with the Christmas present though :laugh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest22466 Posted December 19, 2010 Share Posted December 19, 2010 I guess I am a bit jaded as well because one of the problems is the assumption that each parent has the child's welfare as a high priority and that is not always the case unfortunately. I do my utmost to make things as easy as I can on little one, do not criticise LO's father to her (the opposite in fact, probably overcompensate) only to have a confused little one coming home saying "Daddy says you're bad and mean and this isn't my home any more." Gees the above seems to mirror my situation and I dont bad mouth about his father (only behind his back ) however I do draw the line if my child is thinking its ok to be disrespectful to me as his father is. So the rules are well while your in this home the rules are...blah blah Also the trick is if you dont bad mouth the ex ...its always nice to say to your child well thats not a very nice thing for daddy to say about mummy is it ...as mummy does not say bad things about daddy to you and you see the cogs ticking away......In time the child sees the situation for what it is and for what it was when they are older. Id have my son say to me "daddy says we should chop mummys head off" and he would start crying saying is daddy going to do that to you mummy ....honest it takes so much restaint at times...but i try to make my sons life as happy as possible while he is with me, as you say when they are with the other party you have no control on what is said or done to the child and no one belives you anyway. So its a case of do what you feel is right for your child as karma is present.....My son would wet the bed on the nights he was back from his fathers and it just breaks your heart..but doing it all in another country on your own is even harder ...so watch out cos the Hague Convention Law is about ............. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest essee Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 I guess I am a bit jaded as well because one of the problems is the assumption that each parent has the child's welfare as a high priority and that is not always the case unfortunately. I do my utmost to make things as easy as I can on little one, do not criticise LO's father to her (the opposite in fact, probably overcompensate) only to have a confused little one coming home saying "Daddy says you're bad and mean and this isn't my home any more." I'm so very sorry for everyone thats going through this, its heartbreaking. If its any help at all, Keep on doing what you're doing, when the children are older they'll remember. I was determined that no matter what happened I was never go to say bad things about dad. I always used to say "I'm sorry dad said something like that. Lets forget about it now and go and do........" Now my kids are grown up, with kids of their own, my relationship with them is still very solid, because they feel as though they can trust me, and know that when they needed it I put them first. Whereas dad made all the classic mistakes, his relationship with them is veeerry tenuous. He desparately tries to keep them in his life, but they remember, and without any help from me. :hug: to all of you going through this. Its a long haul but will be worth it for you and the kids in the end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whopperdaisy Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 I'm so very sorry for everyone thats going through this, its heartbreaking. If its any help at all, Keep on doing what you're doing, when the children are older they'll remember. I was determined that no matter what happened I was never go to say bad things about dad. I always used to say "I'm sorry dad said something like that. Lets forget about it now and go and do........" Now my kids are grown up, with kids of their own, my relationship with them is still very solid, because they feel as though they can trust me, and know that when they needed it I put them first. Whereas dad made all the classic mistakes, his relationship with them is veeerry tenuous. He desparately tries to keep them in his life, but they remember, and without any help from me. :hug: to all of you going through this. Its a long haul but will be worth it for you and the kids in the end. I think that is a great way to handle it with grace and without badmouthing, I will try to use that method myself, thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2tigers Posted January 13, 2011 Author Share Posted January 13, 2011 I think that is a great way to handle it with grace and without badmouthing, I will try to use that method myself, thank you. So right, its a long journey but worth it! My ex is terrible with this, he see's it as I 'Stole his children' but the facts are in writing with court. So he calls me at any opportunity and really messes with the children's minds. If He was a good father and husband I would still be there, the Judge saw that too. That little bit of evidence is enough to know It was right for the children and they will also see this when they get older. Some people act out of bitterness, unfortunately that reaction has long term affects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeM Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Haha well... as there's nothing for an 18 year old undergraduate lad who wants a career in IT/teaching maybe lecturing/tutoring/training in IT then there is no prospects for me in the UK really with fees about to rise to £9000+ per annum. Saying that, my job may be in danger here as I'm a contractor and my office is currently off limits due to the flooding and we have a mass conference call in the morning so we shall see what happens but after the email I got this morning it's not looking good... I already have my place at Queensland University of Technology and all being well with flood cleanup operations, I should start on 28th February. Aside from that I'm currently assuredly loved up with a fellow pommy girl on the sunshine coast. Meanwhile my mum wants to go home because of the flooding. I'm not sure why. But I wish she would stop talking about it because I have everything here, where I had nothing in England and now it's doing my head in. :arghh: Cheers LukeM :goofy: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whopperdaisy Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Hope that job works out for you OK, Luke. At 18 I figure you're old enough to choose for yourself (only natural your mum will worry and miss you though, its what we do :rolleyes:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WIO Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 What happens if the female partner decides to move back to the UK during pregnancy? Leaving the male partner in Australia? Is this covered under the Hague convention? Or is this tough cookies? I worry as my partner threatens it all the time, saying she needs her mum around when she has kids - I have no intention of returning as I am an Aussie citizen, and as such all my family are over here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2tigers Posted January 23, 2011 Author Share Posted January 23, 2011 What happens if the female partner decides to move back to the UK during pregnancy? Leaving the male partner in Australia? Is this covered under the Hague convention? Or is this tough cookies? I worry as my partner threatens it all the time, saying she needs her mum around when she has kids - I have no intention of returning as I am an Aussie citizen, and as such all my family are over here. The Hague convention does not come into force on an unborn child. If she gives birth in the UK and stays there, as far as I am aware, there isn't much you can do. She is within her rights and wouldn't be breaking any law. It is when the child is born that it complicates matters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quoll Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 What happens if the female partner decides to move back to the UK during pregnancy? Leaving the male partner in Australia? Is this covered under the Hague convention? Or is this tough cookies? I worry as my partner threatens it all the time, saying she needs her mum around when she has kids - I have no intention of returning as I am an Aussie citizen, and as such all my family are over here. Yup, tough cookies. Looks like there might need to be some compromise here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whopperdaisy Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 I guess it depends on whose needs become most important when you have children. It is not an easy situation for anyone. It may be that you do have to compromise or find a solution that brings her folks here for a while? Especially first time, while it is exciting to be pregnant, it is also very intense and can be quite scary. It is pretty natural to want familiar comforts around. It is a huge adjustment in itself and added to being away from family, quite daunting (I had mine over here and honestly wish I had move back to the UK but that is for other reasons). It is also the time that you realise that you are no longer free to come and go between countries, that someone else can stop you. That can bring up a lot of fear and what-ifs. Here's the thing. Having a child with someone away from home means that if things don't work out, you are effectively still prevented from going, well, pretty much anywhere by that person unless they choose to allow it. Even for holidays. In my case, as my parents become more elderly, that could mean I don't get to see them again. For those of my family unable for whatever reason to travel, I will get to see them in 15 years or so. While I am not saying you would put your partner in that situation (I would hope not, I can assure you it is not good for kids for their mum to be unhappy) it is scary still to hand someone that power. When you think of it like that, I expect you can see while your partner may feel panicked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest confusedd Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 A long thread and a very contributed one. I can see that almost all cases are due to the male partner arguing that they need to see their child but turns out that they just want both child and ex to be stuck. Mine situation is the opposite and I hope someone can shed some lights. I recently sponsored my partner and our daughter over on spousal visa. The visa just got granted and she wants to split with me (they have not arrive yet). Now they got the visa but she's cutting off contact with me so I do not know if she will be coming over and even if she does I wouldn't know when. I didn't know she would act like this and if she wants to split then fine, but I would like to be able to see our daughter. I don't know what to do. I guess I cannot invoke the law since they have not entered Australia yet. She is so immature and wants to own our daughter... Please help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellie 2 Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 Yup, tough cookies. Looks like there might need to be some compromise here. Unfortunately some do not want to compromise. I know this from bitter experience! Not going overseas but interstate. Divorce granted but no mention of going interstate to be with another man! Would not allow children to visit father despite the fact he was willing to pay fares. She is now in 4th relationship and children, now in teens, don't really know their father. Yes, I'm biased, but I think an awful lot of men get the rough end of the stick where children are concerned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quoll Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 Unfortunately some do not want to compromise. I know this from bitter experience! Not going overseas but interstate. Divorce granted but no mention of going interstate to be with another man! Would not allow children to visit father despite the fact he was willing to pay fares. She is now in 4th relationship and children, now in teens, don't really know their father. Yes, I'm biased, but I think an awful lot of men get the rough end of the stick where children are concerned. Yup, some of them do, there is no doubt about that but I would think there are more women trapped by this than men. I am surprised that a woman would be allowed out of the jurisdiction if the father objected - I know of a woman who cant even move out of a particular suburb! (That's probably a very unusual situation but hard fought on both sides!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2tigers Posted March 9, 2011 Author Share Posted March 9, 2011 A long thread and a very contributed one. I can see that almost all cases are due to the male partner arguing that they need to see their child but turns out that they just want both child and ex to be stuck. Mine situation is the opposite and I hope someone can shed some lights. I recently sponsored my partner and our daughter over on spousal visa. The visa just got granted and she wants to split with me (they have not arrive yet). Now they got the visa but she's cutting off contact with me so I do not know if she will be coming over and even if she does I wouldn't know when. I didn't know she would act like this and if she wants to split then fine, but I would like to be able to see our daughter. I don't know what to do. I guess I cannot invoke the law since they have not entered Australia yet. She is so immature and wants to own our daughter... Please help. I am sorry to read your situation, your right in saying you cannot invoke this law, this law is for a very different reason. I am sat here thinking that It may be easier if you looked at it from her situation (Putting aside the thoughts she is trying to keep your daughter away from you), if she has had second thoughts (which it sounds like she obviously has) then she may not want to move to the other side of the world, not many people would in that situation. She more than likely has her support network where she is, and has made the decision that for her to be happy and healthy that is where she needs to be. If she moved to the other side of the world for a man she does not want to be with, what quality of life would that be for her. This would reflect on your child too. Is it not possible that you could move over to the UK to be closer to your child? I am assuming at some stage you may have lived there before? Sorry if this is not what you wanted to read, but international relationships can at times be heartbreaking when it comes to situations like this. The decision may well come down to you, where do you want to live? In AU without your child or UK with her. My ex is an Aussie and he wishes to stay there, he is easily able to financially live and work in the UK if he wished to be a bigger part of his childs life, but his priority is in AU with his family and his support network (goes both ways hey). We work around this with visits, webcams and telephone. Its not the perfect situation but its the best we can do as neither of us wants to live in each others countries. All is not lost, if you wished to stay in AU there are ways for you to still be part of your childs life. If you are not getting any joy you could seek legal help and I am sure a judge would secure your involvement if needed. Best of luck to you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest confusedd Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 I am sorry to read your situation, your right in saying you cannot invoke this law, this law is for a very different reason. I am sat here thinking that It may be easier if you looked at it from her situation (Putting aside the thoughts she is trying to keep your daughter away from you), if she has had second thoughts (which it sounds like she obviously has) then she may not want to move to the other side of the world, not many people would in that situation. She more than likely has her support network where she is, and has made the decision that for her to be happy and healthy that is where she needs to be. If she moved to the other side of the world for a man she does not want to be with, what quality of life would that be for her. This would reflect on your child too. Is it not possible that you could move over to the UK to be closer to your child? I am assuming at some stage you may have lived there before? Sorry if this is not what you wanted to read, but international relationships can at times be heartbreaking when it comes to situations like this. The decision may well come down to you, where do you want to live? In AU without your child or UK with her. My ex is an Aussie and he wishes to stay there, he is easily able to financially live and work in the UK if he wished to be a bigger part of his childs life, but his priority is in AU with his family and his support network (goes both ways hey). We work around this with visits, webcams and telephone. Its not the perfect situation but its the best we can do as neither of us wants to live in each others countries. All is not lost, if you wished to stay in AU there are ways for you to still be part of your childs life. If you are not getting any joy you could seek legal help and I am sure a judge would secure your involvement if needed. Best of luck to you 2tigers, thank you for your detailed reply. Well I wish she is just as civil as you when it comes to separation involving a child. The problem with her is that not only she wants to separate from me, she wants to block my access to our daughter. I have no problem if she is having second thoughts about moving over here but she should not lose contact with me where I no longer get to make contact with our daughter. I am guessing that she would eventually try to enter AU but not letting me know. So my question is, is there anyway I could find out when she enters AU and try to get in contact with her again? This way I could invoke the law and at least get access to our daughter. She just recently want to break up with me so we are still in contact, but she did indicate to me that she will go unreachable and does not want our daughter to be able to see me again. Also, if I manage to invoke the law I will try to be reasonable. If she wants to take our daughter back home I would give permission provided she does not block access when I am visiting (or simply just lose contact again). Is there a law to govern that if I permit her to bring our daughter back home? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest kaylee25 Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 Hi very interesting post. Was just wondering if this applies if you go on a temporay 457 visa?? Or is it just for PR's? Thanks kaylee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peach Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 Hi very interesting post. Was just wondering if this applies if you go on a temporay 457 visa?? Or is it just for PR's? Thanks kaylee Which post does your question apply to? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest kaylee25 Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 Sorry all very interesting but was mainly referring to the first post about the Hague convention. Thanks x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peach Posted March 9, 2011 Share Posted March 9, 2011 The Hague convention doesn't consider visa status as far as I'm aware - so regardless of how you got to Australia one parent can't remove a child without the other's permission. Here is a typical (horror) story : Child must return to Australia under Hague Convention, says 1st Circuit | North America > United States from AllBusiness.com and another :http://forum.gumtreeblog.com.au/discussion/archive/index.php/t-1028.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2tigers Posted March 9, 2011 Author Share Posted March 9, 2011 If the parent and child are on a tourist visa then they are able to come and go as they please. It is when BOTH parents make a conscious decision to relocate this is when the HC comes into play. Even if both parents and child were born and have lived most of their lives in the UK, once they as a family relocate, even on temporary visa's, you cannot just jump on a plane with your child, you need the other parents permission. Regardless. If you do-not get permission the HC can come into place and the child would be sent back. Confusedd - I very much doubt your ex would be eligible to come into AU on a partner visa as you are no longer a couple. One of you should inform immigration of your change in circumstances. She would need to apply under a different visa category if she was to move to AU now. I am very sorry for your circumstances, if I was you I would seek legal advice to see if you can get regular contact organised. Sooner you do this the better as days move into months into years so easily. I wish you luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest confusedd Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 Confusedd - I very much doubt your ex would be eligible to come into AU on a partner visa as you are no longer a couple. One of you should inform immigration of your change in circumstances. She would need to apply under a different visa category if she was to move to AU now. I am very sorry for your circumstances, if I was you I would seek legal advice to see if you can get regular contact organised. Sooner you do this the better as days move into months into years so easily. I wish you luck. I have not inform immigration about this and I am very reluctant to do so because that will mean it will be even harder for me to stay in contact with our daughter. I really wish she could move here even she decides not to be with me. Thanks I will seek legal advise but I don't think it will help a lot given that they are not in AU... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest confusedd Posted March 15, 2011 Share Posted March 15, 2011 Hi all, I have some questions regarding the visa type. My partner now has a partner visa and our daughter's visa was together with her application thus was also granted a temporary visa. Now my partner is blaming me that I should have applied a permanent visa for our daughter since she is eligible (subclass 101). She wants me to make another visa application for our daughter. I don't get it, won't this temporary visa become a permanent visa after they live here for two years? What's the purpose of getting a subclass 101 for our daughter? More importantly can our daughter apply the 101 visa now given that she has been granted a temporary visa? Cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whopperdaisy Posted March 15, 2011 Share Posted March 15, 2011 Confusedd, has your ex given any reason why she wants to separate? It may not be first choice but, unless there is a very significant reason otherwise, if you were in the UK she would have a very weakened case if she has said she will prevent contact altogether. The UK may put a little more weight than here in Aus on proven domestic violence or abuse towards the child (not suggesting that is the case with you, it is with me) but otherwise the court will likely take a very dim view - she does have the right to change her mind about moving and honestly I think it very hard to win a relocation if she is the primary caregiver but if you choose to be in the UK you may get a big chunk of custody perhaps and certainly should get contact rights even if you stay in Aus unless the reasons are very compelling indeed. No idea on the visas unless it is because she won't get to keep her spouse visa based on changed circumstances but would get right to abode under another family visa based on your daughter's permanent residency? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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