Changes to pathway to Citizenship

[PierreC]

What I would like to know is if you are currently eligible for Citizenship now under the current law, what happens to your application if the changes are approved? Do we get our money back?

It looks like people who applied before today are still fine.


Sent using Poms in Oz mobile app

[briman]

Yea I am talking about between now and 1st of June... I have literally been waiting to get paid this month and apply I have my application all filled out ready to hit submit.

[Keep me in oz]

Thanks for the posts confirming where it is outlined! Any guesses on what will happen to people who apply after 20th April and before legislation is passed? 

[elderberry]

This may be a little controversial, but as one of many PRs who had to go through the rigours, tests, and high cost of obtaining PR, I think the changes are long overdue. 

Unfortunately the 457 became abused, and it does seem unfair that someone say, arriving on a Working Holiday Visa can land up with Citizenship without needing to speak English or having any particularly specialised skill.

I do feel for all of you affected directly by this though and can appreciate your disappointment. PRs were also suddenly changed when I was applying 5 years ago and there was no warning then either.

[PierreC]

Thanks for the posts confirming where it is outlined! Any guesses on what will happen to people who apply after 20th April and before legislation is passed? 

This is the official answer:

The Government will introduce new citizenship related legislation into the Parliament, informed by responses to this paper, by the end of 2017. The package of reforms will apply to applications received on or after the Government’s announcement on 20 April 2017.


Sent using Poms in Oz mobile app

[briman]

1 minute ago, Keep me in oz said:

Thanks for the posts confirming where it is outlined! Any guesses on what will happen to people who apply after 20th April and before legislation is passed? 

Read further up, new rules apply.

[Keep me in oz]

1 minute ago, briman said:

Read further up, new rules apply.

so you think they will sit on the application and then when legislation is passed annul the application or something? or maybe freeze new applications (which they haven't done yet)

[briman]

Yea it's the same question I am asking, because I guess so many people are in the same boat as me whereby they qualify now but under the new process they wont for a few years.

[Keep me in oz]

2 minutes ago, briman said:

Yea it's the same question I am asking, because I guess so many people are in the same boat as me whereby they qualify now but under the new process they wont for a few years.

When are you eligible? Mine is three weeks today! If the system allows me to apply in three weeks time i will be putting my app in i think!

[briman]

I have been eligible for the last few months and have been filling out my form online and getting a few documents like movement records and things. Just hadn't clicked the submit button...

[briman]

Other thing I want to know is who is exempt from the English test, its not clear?

[Keep me in oz]

4 minutes ago, briman said:

I have been eligible for the last few months and have been filling out my form online and getting a few documents like movement records and things. Just hadn't clicked the submit button...

I have a friend in the same boat, she is submitting hers today though just in hope she will get in with the old system. she isnt eligible under the rule of the new system at present. 

One would hope English people are exempt but i doubt it, the test has to be taken for other visas even if you are English so i cant see why this would be different!

[dunc]

The way the document is worded it sounds like this is going through not being put forward for approval! Maybe that's the norm though. 

[Stevwtosh]

47 minutes ago, PierreC said:

 

Because Stevwtosh arrived on a PR directly, It won't change much for him indeed. 

 

Nope am sailing in the boat as everyone does. What am saying is that it should be the old system for current PR holder's i.e legally lived in Australia for 4 years and with 1 year on PR. So what am saying is that it would be unfair for someone who have lived here for 3 years legally and maybe just 3 weeks away to be on PR for a year to qualify for Citizenship that have to now wait 3 more years to be eligible. This is why I said Immigration don't normally operate like this. It's should be for new granted PR holder's. Just my thought

[politedave82]

8 minutes ago, Stevwtosh said:

Nope am sailing in the boat as everyone does. What am saying is that it should be the old system for current PR holder's i.e legally lived in Australia for 4 years and with 1 year on PR. So what am saying is that it would be unfair for someone who have lived here for 3 years legally and maybe just 3 weeks away to be on PR for a year to qualify for Citizenship that have to now wait 3 more years to be eligible. This is why I said Immigration don't normally operate like this. It's should be for new granted PR holder's. Just my thought

My situation.

 

Arrived Feb 2014 - PR granted Jan 2016.

Would have been eligible Feb 2018 - now Jan 2018. 

10 months is now 33 months.

And there'll be some with way less than 10 months affected.

Edited April 20, 2017 by politedave82

[briman]

Yea it looks like it just tough luck

7 minutes ago, Stevwtosh said:

Nope am sailing in the boat as everyone does. What am saying is that it should be the old system for current PR holder's i.e legally lived in Australia for 4 years and with 1 year on PR. So what am saying is that it would be unfair for someone who have lived here for 3 years legally and maybe just 3 weeks away to be on PR for a year to qualify for Citizenship that have to now wait 3 more years to be eligible. This is why I said Immigration don't normally operate like this. It's should be for new granted PR holder's. Just my thought

Yea I think its just going to be tough luck... I am not sure we are going to get all these answers anytime soon.

[n1ck]

1 minute ago, politedave82 said:

My situation.

 

Arrived Feb 2014 - PR granted Jan 2016.

Would have been eligible Feb 2018 - now Jan 2018. 

10 months is now 33 months.

And there'll be some with way less than 10 months affected.

5 months for me. This is BS. Hopefully they make it that it's only for new PR applicants.

[VERYSTORMY]

From my experience over a fair few years, this is how it will occur. 

It will apply from today. The Minister has very broad powers to change immigration and citizenship regulations without the need for immediate legislation. 

Hopefully a proffessional will come along and give some clarification 

[javadxster]

Correct me if I am wrong but it says those with permanent are exempt from English test.

 

* Must demonstrate competent English language skills through a tougher reading, writing and listening test (people with permanent or enduring incapacity, or aged under 16, exempted).
Read more at http://www.9news.com.au/national/2017/04/20/02/18/federal-government-cracks-down-on-australian-citizenship-requirements#A7sggdK60hcPjyia.99

[PierreC]

Correct me if I am wrong but it says those with permanent are exempt from English test.
 
* Must demonstrate competent English language skills through a tougher reading, writing and listening test (people with permanent or enduring incapacity, or aged under 16, exempted).
Read more at http://www.9news.com.au/national/2017/04/20/02/18/federal-government-cracks-down-on-australian-citizenship-requirements#A7sggdK60hcPjyia.99

Permanent incapacity mate


Sent using Poms in Oz mobile app

[Stevwtosh]

6 minutes ago, javadxster said:

Correct me if I am wrong but it says those with permanent are exempt from English test.

 

* Must demonstrate competent English language skills through a tougher reading, writing and listening test (people with permanent or enduring incapacity, or aged under 16, exempted).
Read more at http://www.9news.com.au/national/2017/04/20/02/18/federal-government-cracks-down-on-australian-citizenship-requirements#A7sggdK60hcPjyia.99

It means who are not capable to do so. E.g disability

[Beffers]

4 hours ago, MaggieMay24 said:

Only the primary applicant on a skilled visa needs to demonstrate English.  The partners and children don't need to have any level of English.  If they are over 18 they would need to pay a secondary fee without English ability.  As well, people migrating on other visas such as partner, child, parent, etc. don't need any level of English.  So this may be quite difficult for many people applying for citizenship.

Think you've hit the nail on the head. There's a plethora of families migrating with only one English speaker. The new citizenship test means that ALL family members need to have competent English. I don't see this as a bad thing. Language is a key barrier to integration. And how can people confirm they support Australian values when they don't even speak the country's main language? It'll shake up a few people I would imagine. 

[Irish83]

As someone who has recently received their PR I'm still in the little honeymoon period of the relief that it has brought. Had always planned to apply for citizenship when the 12 months was up, but would have been relaxed about it being granted, unlike the PR, my life was a constant stress.

The news of having to wait 4 years doesn't really bother me. I have an aussie partner, I plan on being here anyway so I don't see the big deal. However, am I missing something obvious which will effect me by remaining a PR holder rather than a citizen?

Thanks


Sent from my iPhone using PomsinOz

[path2aus]

I have one question though "people who can work are working, or are actively looking for work or seeking to educate themselves". Does that mean that everyone above 18 at home need to work? Like if my wife stays home taking care of our new born, she cannot apply for citizenship? Since she is young and can work? That does not make sense to me. All countries have single person earning families. Do all Australians work? There are no stay at home mom's in Australia?

[robfromdublin]

16 minutes ago, Irish83 said:

As someone who has recently received their PR I'm still in the little honeymoon period of the relief that it has brought. Had always planned to apply for citizenship when the 12 months was up, but would have been relaxed about it being granted, unlike the PR, my life was a constant stress.

The news of having to wait 4 years doesn't really bother me. I have an aussie partner, I plan on being here anyway so I don't see the big deal. However, am I missing something obvious which will effect me by remaining a PR holder rather than a citizen?

Thanks


Sent from my iPhone using PomsinOz

The key issues are the ability to vote and the ability to rely on Australian consular assistance when travelling abroad on an Aussie passport.  Separately, my driver to getting citizenship was to avoid the possibility of being summarily deported from the country away from my wife and kids.  This could only happen if convicted of an offence carrying a sentence greater than 12 months.  Obviously, I have no intention of breaking the law, but you never know what life thrusts at you.  A recent case involved a Kiwi being subject to a road rage incident from a man with a history of such incidents.  He hit the guy, who fell into the path of a truck and died.  The Kiwi is now being charged with manslaughter and will be deported if convicted. That could genuinely happen to anyone, and I'd rather have the protection of being a citizen so that I would not be deported. I know this seems crazy, but it was worth a few hundred dollars and filling out a few forms for me. 

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-11-21/gateway-motorway-murder-charged-downgraded-manslaughter/8042268

Another point is it saves hassle when travelling.  Emirates screwed up when checking me and the family in last year.  They demanded an ETA or visa label and refused to issue a boarding pass until I got one.  As PR with an electronic visa I didn't need what they were asking for and I kept making the point.  A few frantic phone calls later and eventually they admitted their error but we could really have done without the stress. It turns out for some visas the information is on a different part of the Emirates screen and they hadn't scrolled down to check.  I've spoken to 3 people who've had that happen to them.  Again, for me it was worth getting the passport just to avoid that rubbish.