Gbye grey sky Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 I'd put money on DC lasting under a year. This wasn't a vote for DC. This was a vote for gove... The Tories will lurch to the right to counter ukip. Careful what you wish for... UKIP are essentially a one-issue party so as long as the EU referendum is held in 2017 they will become less relevant. DC has said that he will not stand as leader for a 3rd election (though this could have as much credence as Farage's resignation speech) so if that is the case he will need to stand aside sooner rather than later. Under a year might be a tough call but sometime in 2016 perhaps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul1Perth Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 I doubt if it will be any different from any other democracy. How well do you know the Scots? I don't think there is distraction from the real issues which independence would bring.. At the minute there is a focus on autonomy for the government and ultimate independence, but that doesn't mean that the Scots think it will be paradise when it happens.They are used to hard work. The prize is deciding their own future not having it decided by people miles away who don't know them and are not interested in getting to know them. You could say that about most people North of Watford. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parley Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 I'll give 2 to 1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akiralx Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 (edited) I read somewhere that the vote for the SNP was for more power at Westminster, not independence? Yes, that's undoubtedly correct. As for David Cameron leaving as PM within a year, that is fanciful - his position is rock solid after being the first Conservative leader to increase his majority in decades. He has previously stated that he will not stand for a third term, so one would imagine his standing down in 2019 to give a new leader a run-in to the next election. I'm mystified as to why Boris Johnson is a favoured successor, apart from his amiable persona - which is at least partly an act. Edited May 12, 2015 by akiralx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjez Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Okay. I'll take the bet.how much ? 500 quid ? Try William hill if you're that interested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newjez Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Who have they got better to replace him though? No-one that I've seen and if someone is not better then they would be stupid to get rid of him. Boris Johnson is a nutcase liability to the whole country. Anyone who thinks he's just a bit of a quirky character should have a look into his past. Any number of people could replace him. They have a depth of talent. A drovers dog could do it. This is no longer about the electorate. They have control, it will be hard to lose control. I would expect a hard shift to the right and away from Europe. I really do expect the Thatcher years again. Whilst many would cheer that, for a long time Thatcher's theories didn't work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parley Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Try William hill if you're that interested. I must have misread your post. I thought you said you would put money on it. Obviously not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest51810 Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 I would seriously consider it Stacey. Come on up! The media seem to want to stir up hate and you have to wonder why Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest51810 Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 I read somewhere that the vote for the SNP was for more power at Westminster, not independence? Yep. People who voted no voted for SNP this year, my friend did. They want to make sure we have a stronger voice and a few different reasons but doesn't necessarily mean they want independence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest51810 Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 I think there were a lot voted no to independence because they thought it wasn't going to get up. Since then the SNP haven't really stopped campaigning for it and the people who were sitting on the fence have got a bit more nationalistic and think there's a chance of another referendum. I guess a lot of the people that are opposed to trident and all the other work that the industry is generating will get a bit of a backlash from the employees. Should it come to getting rid or not. I don't think there will be that much backlash about trident. Did you read my article that I put up? A lot of faslane employees voted SNP. I was surprised. There's not as many jobs directly related to trident as some people seek to think. The number was exaggerated last year and now it's went down. Even that ex defence conservative guy thinks it's a total waste of money. What does that say! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul1Perth Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Any number of people could replace him. They have a depth of talent. A drovers dog could do it. This is no longer about the electorate. They have control, it will be hard to lose control. I would expect a hard shift to the right and away from Europe. I really do expect the Thatcher years again. Whilst many would cheer that, for a long time Thatcher's theories didn't work. They could probably put a drovers dog in at the moment but don't expect to win the next election. Maybe he's not that bothered though? Who would want the PM job?:no: After he's done his stint he'll be able to go and buy a small Island and retire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul1Perth Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Come on up! The media seem to want to stir up hate and you have to wonder why I don't think it's anything sinister Stacey, I just think the press will run with any story that will sell papers and generate a discussion. There are people in Nepal by the thousand and one of the reasons is they can't get enough planes in and out of the airport with relief, due to the number of press that are trying to get in and out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul1Perth Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 I don't think there will be that much backlash about trident. Did you read my article that I put up? A lot of faslane employees voted SNP. I was surprised. There's not as many jobs directly related to trident as some people seek to think. The number was exaggerated last year and now it's went down. Even that ex defence conservative guy thinks it's a total waste of money. What does that say! Sure they voted SNP because they're Scottish or just live there. If someone told them their job was on the line they would have voted differently. Might be a total waste of money, a lot of things in defence work are, should see the money that gets wasted, it's enough to make you cry. However it keeps people in a job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest51810 Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Sure they voted SNP because they're Scottish or just live there. If someone told them their job was on the line they would have voted differently. Might be a total waste of money, a lot of things in defence work are, should see the money that gets wasted, it's enough to make you cry. However it keeps people in a job. http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/trident-town-joining-snp-surge-5673036 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Pretty easy being an SNP MP. Offer No Austerity whilst offering better services whilst not demanding any raises in tax. Then blame the Tories when you deliver none of this, where can I sign up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest51810 Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Do you really think the politicians in Scotland are/will be any different? I'm not stupid enough to think any politician is perfect.. Definitely but who's more likely to actually care about Scotland - someone in Westminster who maybe goes to Scotland once a year if he's lucky or someone or someone who grew up here. Wasn't that the argument against labour working with SNP.. The why would SNP care about middle england. Well I'm sure our one tory mp in the borders really cares about the working class areas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul1Perth Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/trident-town-joining-snp-surge-5673036 I think the lady towards the end of the article summed it up Stacey “I think a majority of people who work at Faslane did vote SNP in the end, even if that meant their jobs might be at risk, because a lot of them are proud Scots and feel the SNP can give them a voice.” They aren't really thinking their jobs could disappear and if they do because they voted SNP then don't come crying later. You would be surprised how many jobs trident is supporting. Just about everyone mentioned on this page would struggle without the project. Money has to come from somewhere to spend in the shop and the pub. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest51810 Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 I think the lady towards the end of the article summed it up Stacey “I think a majority of people who work at Faslane did vote SNP in the end, even if that meant their jobs might be at risk, because a lot of them are proud Scots and feel the SNP can give them a voice.” They aren't really thinking their jobs could disappear and if they do because they voted SNP then don't come crying later. You would be surprised how many jobs trident is supporting. Just about everyone mentioned on this page would struggle without the project. Money has to come from somewhere to spend in the shop and the pub. Well it seems to be a risk they want to take, that's to do with them.. Rather than me or you. I'm not the one who has to live there so that's why while I hate trident Id understand if they wanted to keep it. However that area was one of the yes voting areas last year. They are obviously clued up about the risks but still most want it gone. She was right about one thing though - some of the other little towns who don't have trident still manage fine and I think they are trying to revamp the area a bit. I don't think we will ever get rid of it as a UK anyway. I'm just glad there's another poster on here who disagrees with having it, I was starting to think I was a hippy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellie 2 Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Gbye Grey Sky, I should have mentioned in my last post that the SNP, before the referendum, published the "Wee Blue Book" which explained what they would do, in all areas of government, immediately after a YES vote. I have a copy but don't know if it is still available on their website. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellie 2 Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Sure they voted SNP because they're Scottish or just live there. If someone told them their job was on the line they would have voted differently. Might be a total waste of money, a lot of things in defence work are, should see the money that gets wasted, it's enough to make you cry. However it keeps people in a job. I did read that the SNP had plans to utilise that facility so that there would be minimum loss of jobs. I can't remember what the plan was. That's old age galloping on! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gbye grey sky Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Pretty easy being an SNP MP. Offer No Austerity whilst offering better services whilst not demanding any raises in tax. Then blame the Tories when you deliver none of this, where can I sign up? Applies to all SNP supporters in a way. Freedom to snipe at everything as they never had to have their policies scrutinised fully as they were never going to be the party of government at Westminster. To be fair though they have been doing a creditable job in Scotland. There are major limitations on them there which is not their fault. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest51810 Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 I did read that the SNP had plans to utilise that facility so that there would be minimum loss of jobs. I can't remember what the plan was. That's old age galloping on! It was to become a conventional base. Isn't it mad to think only 2 of our MP's now support trident. There's that conservative guy that's against it too but I've forgot his name Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest51810 Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Applies to all SNP supporters in a way. Freedom to snipe at everything as they never had to have their policies scrutinised fully as they were never going to be the party of government at Westminster. To be fair though they have been doing a creditable job in Scotland. There are major limitations on them there which is not their fault. You're quite a fair guy aren't you? Yep that was the whole point.. If we messed up then we would only have ourself to blame which can only be good for everyone surely? You don't have to listen to us moaning about DC, we could moan at Nicola sturgeon :tongue: Seriously though, we need more powers like more welfare ones so that they can try and change things as much as possible. Otherwise like you say - there are big limitations Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gbye grey sky Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 It was to become a conventional base. Isn't it mad to think only 2 of our MP's now support trident. There's that conservative guy that's against it too but I've forgot his name I am grateful to the SNP for at least putting Trident on the agenda. It seems all the other parties (Greens excepted) just regard retention and renewal as a complete given and not even up for discussion. Mention scrapping nuclear submarines here and you are considered an imbecile. I suppose once something has existed for generations it just becomes embedded in the national psyche. I cannot believe people really think that the UKs nuclear missiles make any difference at all - after all we are never going to fire them surely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gbye grey sky Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 You're quite a fair guy aren't you? Yep that was the whole point.. If we messed up then we would only have ourself to blame which can only be good for everyone surely? You don't have to listen to us moaning about DC, we could moan at Nicola sturgeon :tongue: Seriously though, we need more powers like more welfare ones so that they can try and change things as much as possible. Otherwise like you say - there are big limitations Yes, but anything short of full independence leaves the SNP with plenty of wiggle room to take credit for what is popular and blame Westminster for what is not. In fact even full Independence could carry the blame game on quite a bit. Think how any Government blames the last one for the mess they inherited. A split would be so tricky to get right the SNP could carry on blaming Westminster for at least a generation after gaining Independence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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