Guest Andy Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Well I really think it is the other way around. That unless someone is seriously ill, they will never get out of the UK system what they have put in. Majority of people have no more than a few doctor appointments a year if that. I agree completely, the nhs is funded by the tax payer do is in no way free to those that contribute, it is only free if you don't contribute throughout your life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caramac Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Well I really think it is the other way around. That unless someone is seriously ill, they will never get out of the UK system what they have put in. Majority of people have no more than a few doctor appointments a year if that. That be may be true until they're old, although it doesn't take a serious illness for the cost to mount up, just something long term can do that. My parents rarely went to the drs until they were well into their late 60s. My mum still goes very rarely, but my dad has hypertension, diabetes, high cholesterol and has had two knee replacements. Plenty of older people have strokes, cancer, falls, joint replacements, arthritis, heart disease, dementia.... These things are all very expensive to treat. During my 40s people I know have developed brain tumours, breast cancer, MS, Parkinson's, ovarian cancer, joint problems needing intensive physio and two have had heart attacks. My niece has renal failure and will need dialysis and eventually a kidney transplant in the future. My daughter had a month in ITU when she was a baby. We were told that the cost of that was in excess of £1,000 a day and that was 20 years ago. I have only had three admissions for births and two for minor procedures, so I guess I've not had my 'fair share' compared to the amount of tax me and my family has paid, but I guess I see any tax I pay is an insurance policy for what may happen today, tomorrow, next week...., but also if I could no longer pay into the system at least I would be looked after I'm also happy that, if I'm lucky enough not to need it, to think that my money is spent treating those who do, like my niece who doesn't earn nearly enough to pay for dialysis or a kidney transplant. I believe that a healthy society is worth paying for - keeping people in work benefits us all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Pommie1 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Hope over to Thailand for dental work..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johndoe Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Hope over to Thailand for dental work..... What!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And lose a kidney whilst under anaesthetic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calNgary Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 What!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And lose a kidney whilst under anaesthetic? But you will have a nice smile when you get over the shock,lol Cal x Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Que Sera Sera Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Hi all let me see if i get this right: in britain, we have the NHS. free healtcare, or very low costs for most things (e.g. dental). in Australia, we pay for most of the medical costs (those refunds wont go far). AND we have been told some doctors bulk bill and some dont? and this entirely depends on them but most dont bulk bill? whats the deal with that? so if your kid needs braces, will this cost like thousands of dollars? also, if you want to have a wisdom tooth removed, this also costs a thousand dollars? i know dental care is also paid in the UK but when im told teeth cleaning costs 200 dollars in Oz, i cant help but cringe. what are your experiences? we are a young couple so never had any medical issues and have lived in britain, but im thinking of the future, kids etc... i find myself missing NHS...:arghh: But you knew all this before you came out didn't you? You did your research? So what's caused the sudden screaming head? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catlover1 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 HI there, we live in the Highlands and are both in our mid 40s with no kids but there are a few medical centres here that bulk bill so we've not found that a problem. However, the dentist is another story! $80 for a check up and $165 for a clean! And I used to pay about 25 quid for a clean! The NHS is really one of it's kind and again something you don't appreciate until you have to start paying for services. I dread to think though if you have a lot of health problems how you would afford it here! I hope to go back to the UK when I am older though as I would be worried unless I had private health insurance in Oz! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasepom Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 If you have basic hospital cover you're fine. There are plenty of old people in Australia who manage just fine. Plus if you live to be a ripe old age then you'll lose all your teeth anyway so problem solved :biggrin: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayrshire2oz Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 having read some of the costs other members are experiencing I would feel more at ease knowing we had cover for most eventualities including dental, optical and medicines. does anyone know if such cover can be got and how expensive it would likely be for two adults and two kids. cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayrshire2oz Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 does the Australian state only provide emergency treatment? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beach pig Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Ok guys I think we all know the Nhs is not free and we pay taxes for it.for what I have and my family have been through here in oz I would rather pay a few quid a week to the nhs system rather than going to the docs then being referred to a specialist which then you need deep pockets and longer arms.put it this way and this is my experience I had to have a bone graft in my arm and it was either wait 8 months or pay $5.000 with a specialist I opted for the $5.000 because I could get back to work sooner.Now it's these astronomical upfront costs which are hard to take.i would rather pay a few quid taxes a week rather than a bill out of the blue. Also ambulance insurance,before you do anything get it,i was driving country sa and swerved to avoid a roo in the road ,hit a tree then flipped the car on its roof ,pretty much came out without any serious damage except the damage to my wallet for the bill I got for the ambulance.but they where professional and so was the volunteer CFs which I have a high regard for (god bless you guys). put it like this if you had a big sinkhole at the end of your drive and you could not get your car out would you rather pay a contractor to fix it.(Out of the blue costs)or ring the council and have it fixed.rest my case Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keefo Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Not taking sides here but when people say you pay for the NHS with taxes which is true then what do the taxes in oz contribute to. If they contribute to health care then are you not paying a double wammy by then taking out private as well? Just a question so don't shoot me down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Not taking sides here but when people say you pay for the NHS with taxes which is true then what do the taxes in oz contribute to. If they contribute to health care then are you not paying a double wammy by then taking out private as well? Just a question so don't shoot me down.when people say taxes they probably mean national insurance, which you do not pay in Australia. You dont always have to pay private so there is a lot of free medical treatment here as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ali Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Prior to our move our daughter was referred for a brace - we were told that she wouldn't necessarily be able to have it on the NHS - 12 months later, she still hadn't been seen and I cancelled the appointment as we were migrating. She saw the school dentist here and within 3 weeks had 2 teeth removed and braces fitted. The cost of the braces did cost us $4,000 - she was seen every month (braces changed) and once they were removed for good (after 12 months) had a retainer - she's now 19 and still see's the orthodontist every 6 months (she had the braces at 11) and we haven't paid anything else. I'm one of those people too who doesn't believe that the NHS is free - having paid NI contributions for over 20 years and hardly every using the health service - I can't say that I got out of it what I paid into it. Eye tests here are bulk billed and I also have to have a special test every 2 years which is free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andy Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Prior to our move our daughter was referred for a brace - we were told that she wouldn't necessarily be able to have it on the NHS - 12 months later, she still hadn't been seen and I cancelled the appointment as we were migrating. She saw the school dentist here and within 3 weeks had 2 teeth removed and braces fitted. The cost of the braces did cost us $4,000 - she was seen every month (braces changed) and once they were removed for good (after 12 months) had a retainer - she's now 19 and still see's the orthodontist every 6 months (she had the braces at 11) and we haven't paid anything else.I'm one of those people too who doesn't believe that the NHS is free - having paid NI contributions for over 20 years and hardly every using the health service - I can't say that I got out of it what I paid into it.Eye tests here are bulk billed and I also have to have a special test every 2 years which is free.Hi Ali, Just to say that it is not just national insurance contributions that pay for the nhs, that just pays for a small part. The NHS is funded by general taxation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gbye grey sky Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 ok. Free at the point of delivery. I think many people don't understand that it's unlikely that the tax they pay will ever cover the full cost of what they get out unless they're lucky and never ill. I understand the point you are making but that does not actually make sense as some will get far more than any tax and some may never pay any tax for a variety of reasons. It follows that most will be net contributors. Not that that is an argument against as that also applies to private health insurance. Personally I am delighted to be a net contributor and hope that continues because it means I am fortunate to be healthy. Private would never pick up the tab for long term chronic conditions either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kungfustu Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 The NHS has to be funded from somewhere, that is just common sense....I dont begrudge paying my share at all, its a service that is there if you need it, If you have an emergency you get treated. If you want braces to straighten straight teeth then you will have to pay.....if you have a problem with your teeth its there for you and rightly so is free....We all pay national insurance but that also gives us a pension on retirement, taxation also funds the NHS but I dont see us paying anymore taxes than the next westernised country so we aren't doing that bad.....being hammered in the carparks is a bit of a pish take but most of those are privately run carparks. You cannot do anything about the service you receive apart from complain afterwards.....in most instances my family have received first class treatment and a quality service from staff that care....I dislocated my finger a cpl weeks ago playing football......went to a walk-in-center and was seen within 30 mins, xray, put back in, another xray, strapped up and on my way all with-in 1 1/2hrs.....I got a follow up appointment within 3 weeks, no queuing....in and out in 20 minutes....I have a further follow up appointment in another 4 weeks.....gratis!.....you cant argue with that! The NHS is a great british institution that provides a first class service (most of the time) to every person in this country and lets not forget there is a lot of us to look after.....I think its the envy of the rest of the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andy Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 The NHS has to be funded from somewhere, that is just common sense....I dont begrudge paying my share at all, its a service that is there if you need it, If you have an emergency you get treated. If you want braces to straighten straight teeth then you will have to pay.....if you have a problem with your teeth its there for you and rightly so is free....We all pay national insurance but that also gives us a pension on retirement, taxation also funds the NHS but I dont see us paying anymore taxes than the next westernised country so we aren't doing that bad.....being hammered in the carparks is a bit of a pish take but most of those are privately run carparks. You cannot do anything about the service you receive apart from complain afterwards.....in most instances my family have received first class treatment and a quality service from staff that care....I dislocated my finger a cpl weeks ago playing football......went to a walk-in-center and was seen within 30 mins, xray, put back in, another xray, strapped up and on my way all with-in 1 1/2hrs.....I got a follow up appointment within 3 weeks, no queuing....in and out in 20 minutes....I have a further follow up appointment in another 4 weeks.....gratis!.....you cant argue with that! The NHS is a great british institution that provides a first class service (most of the time) to every person in this country and lets not forget there is a lot of us to look after.....I think its the envy of the rest of the world. I hear you and agree with a lot of what you say however as I said before my family has had awful treatment. In short as you know my mother died 5 weeks ago from what we assumed was ovarian cancer. We were in and out of Stoke Mandeville for the weeks running up to her death of which as I said before the service and care she received was appalling. To cut a long story short she was on a chest drain in a ward 10 days before she died, after the procedure they sent her home when she was clearly unwell and a week later I myself took her in with my dad as we were so worried, she died 36 hours later and we were all amazed that the cancer could have killed her so quickly as she was due to start het chemo 3 days later. It was only last week after a meeting at the hospital that we discovered that during the drain procedure she caught an infection which was MRSA, this attacked my mothers body in the week she was at home and was near death when I took her in. We had her GP visit her at home 3 hours before I took her in, he did not check her blood pressure or temp even though the glands in her neck were up and she was unaware of where she was, he put her glands down to her saliva ducts and gave her a prescription for a throat spray for a dry mouth and her disorientation down to the drugs she was on and said she should be fine for the chemo? I then 3 hours later took her to hospital as I was so worried where the doctor checked he blood pressure which was 60 over something and she had a huge temp as well as her kidneys had packed up. As I said she died 36 hours later. I could write a book on the atrocious treatment we received however that will not change anything and as you rightly say all we can do is complain which we are in the process of doing as I could not bear the thought of anyone else going through this. I am also well aware that others will have had a great service but I can only give my thoughts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caramac Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I understand the point you are making but that does not actually make sense as some will get far more than any tax and some may never pay any tax for a variety of reasons. It follows that most will be net contributors. Not that that is an argument against as that also applies to private health insurance. Personally I am delighted to be a net contributor and hope that continues because it means I am fortunate to be healthy. Private would never pick up the tab for long term chronic conditions either. Of course, I feel the same. I really meant on a per capita basis rather than individuals. Obviously some people contribute more and some take more according to income and need. It seems pretty fair to me. You're right about the private companies too - they put in clauses and exclusions which a public health service doesn't do. When you need it and for as long as you need it, it's there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petals Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Answering the OP no do not miss the NHS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosiew Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Ok guys I think we all know the Nhs is not free and we pay taxes for it.for what I have and my family have been through here in oz I would rather pay a few quid a week to the nhs system rather than going to the docs then being referred to a specialist which then you need deep pockets and longer arms.put it this way and this is my experience I had to have a bone graft in my arm and it was either wait 8 months or pay $5.000 with a specialist I opted for the $5.000 because I could get back to work sooner.Now it's these astronomical upfront costs which are hard to take.i would rather pay a few quid taxes a week rather than a bill out of the blue. Also ambulance insurance,before you do anything get it,i was driving country sa and swerved to avoid a roo in the road ,hit a tree then flipped the car on its roof ,pretty much came out without any serious damage except the damage to my wallet for the bill I got for the ambulance.but they where professional and so was the volunteer CFs which I have a high regard for (god bless you guys). put it like this if you had a big sinkhole at the end of your drive and you could not get your car out would you rather pay a contractor to fix it.(Out of the blue costs)or ring the council and have it fixed.rest my case To be fair, do you think you would have got a bone graft any quicker than 8 months on the NHS? We are always hearing about people waiting ages for specialist appointments, xrays and test results from hospitals so it may have been much the same. In the UK the private option would have been there for you, just like here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosiew Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 does the Australian state only provide emergency treatment? No. Australia has a comprehensive national health service like the NHS (excluding dental for most people). But it is a hybrid system and it is easier for people to access private treatment. So a lot people do not wait out the time to receive all of their specialist treatment through a public hospital. Many people have private health insurance to cover part of these costs. There are a lot of private pathology and xray services (the state refunds part or all of the cost) and so people tend not to be waiting for hospital appointments for tests, which speeds things up a bit. For historical reasons in most states the ambulance is not free - but it only costs a small annual subscription. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ali Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Hi Ali, Just to say that it is not just national insurance contributions that pay for the nhs, that just pays for a small part. The NHS is funded by general taxation. I know, but it's still a contribution and I'd paid a lot into it - thanks for the correction though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katie22 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 having read some of the costs other members are experiencing I would feel more at ease knowing we had cover for most eventualities including dental, optical and medicines. does anyone know if such cover can be got and how expensive it would likely be for two adults and two kids. cheers Yes, you can get hospital cover and / or extras cover. The extras covers you for dental, optical, physio etc. Obviously there's also different types of cover, the lower the premium the higher gap you'll have to pay. Go on to the websites of the health funds - BUPA, Medibank, Health Partners & google more then they can often give you instant quotes, at least that gives you an idea. Ambulance cover is a definite, if you don't and you end up having to call one - accidents happen - you'll end up with a $900 + bill. Hospital cover is up to you, it does give you more choice of specialists and if you need elective surgery it can usually be done as soon as it can be arranged. I've looked after a few patients who've had their joint replacement the following day after their initial consultation. Compare that to people I've heard who've been on a waiting list for over a year in the public system. However, despite having hospital cover as a previous person wrote you can still be left with very large out of pocket expenses. Doctors can charge massive gaps and take it from someone who works with them, the larger gap does not necessarily mean the better doctor. At the end of the day private health care is a business and to survive businesses need profits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dave53 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 This NHS v Medicare debate has been going on and will continue to go on for years . I have worked in the NSW health service for years , and in that time I've been both a patient and an employee . I've also been hospitalized in the UK in the last few years . Believe me when I say , " there is very little difference in the two " . Both have their pluses and minus's. I received brilliant service in the UK in a public hospital , one that could not have been bettered in Australia I must add . After next weeks budget in Australia , we may all have a change of heart .. Dave C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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