Struggling to decide ... slap me!

[Rachel Tilley]

Also thought I'd copy and paste an absolutely brilliant post (credited to @Burnett) that I have only just read today on another thread.

 

Maybe it's time people in Britain updated their impressions of Australia ? Many seem to come here from the UK because they want to believe the grass is greener in Oz. Some years ago, a woman still resident in the UK became close to feral in this forum at the mere suggestion life in Oz wasn't like the movie. She'd never been here and posted all the time with updates re: her family's progress as far as emigrating was concerned - ' only two more months', etc. And despite that she'd never stepped foot in Australia, she laid into anyone who as much as breathed they -- who were in Oz -- weren't as thrilled about the place as they'd expected to be. It was as if she thought that by controlling everyone else's opinion about Oz that she could keep her unrealistic dreams alive. And she had plenty of supporters here, almost as if there existed a gang whose very livelihood depended on being seen to be keeping the Oz myths alive

 

Sure, 50, 60 years ago, Poms made the big, exciting journey to Oz. Many were the talk of the village. Such a long journey - six weeks by ship. All those wonderful fresh foods, tropical fruits, everything so cheap compared with the old UK (which was still living on rations in the early 50s). Once here, they sent happy-snaps back home, showing themselves tanned, sitting on the beach. Of course, now we know a lot of it was sheer bravado. They knew those back home expected such photos and glowing accounts of Australia. Those UK pounds stretched a long way back then. And work was far easier to find then, compared to now. Sit, work and play in the sun long enough and sure, you'll develop a tan. Smiling for the camera takes a few seconds and what else would you do in a photo -- frown? So the myths about Australia grew out of proportion. And to cover the fact many early Poms in Oz had toilets consisting of stinking cans in an outside dunny and had cracked lino on the floors of their unheated weatherboard and fibro homes, those brave little Poms on Oz of decades ago made jokes, cracked hearty, kept a stiff upper lip and pretended they were loving it in Australia

 

The truth was a different story. As Pommy migrants, they copped a lot of stick just for being Pommies, and so did their kids. Work wasn't anywhere near as plentiful as the Aussie government was claiming to potential migrants who attended all those promotional film nights. The houses on offer in Oz were basic, infested with cockroaches, ants, spider and often - snakes. It was a huge country and travel expensive. Migrants had to really put effort into establishing friendships and were not swiftly accepted - and this is borne out not only in migrant tales recounted by Poms but by people from all over the world who'd taken a chance on Australia. Drink was the ice-breaker, the oil, so fine for drinkers and tough for those who expected a bit more from social encounters than Aussie men guzzling grog on one corner and the women in another, forced to chat about home and kids. Thousands of female migrants from the UK lived for years in a state of repressed depression, forcing themselves to be chirpy for the husband and kids. Most Poms in Oz back then for some reason told themselves they'd made their bed and must lie in it for life

 

Things are different now. It's no big deal to move to Oz - just a plane flight. Sure, a lengthy plane flight, but it's just a trip when all's said and done. It's not like Colombus sailing into the unknown, the way it used to be regarded. It's time other myths were put to bed too. Australia hasn't been 'cheap' for a long, long time. The Aussie mateship beliefs belong on tv, in fiction such as Neighbours. After all, do Poms expect to see real-life Donald Ducks or Mickey Mouses and movie stars all over the US? No. They're movies, entertainment. And so are the unrealistic expectations about Australia, although, granted, the Australian government capitalises on desperate Poms in the UK and their wish that Australia be some sort of cheap, tropical fruit and beach-filled Shangri-la

 

There's internet now. Every single aspect of Australia is accessible online, from the prices of houses, travel distances, schools, welfare-provisions, educational standards, the price of eggs and tea-bags, the weather generally and temperatures for every single part of this massive chunk of rock in the south-pacific. Migrating to Australia can no longer be likened to a voyage into the unknown. So why aren't Poms availing themselves of the million pieces of information at their fingertips while they're still right there in the UK?

 

Answer: because in the case of many -- they don't want to ! They don't want to know ! They don't want to face or accept reality !

 

The Big Adventure ! I'd be rich if I had a cent for every time I've read that term in his and similar forums

 

When the more appropriate term should be -- ' Our huge investment in time, money, effort and energy '

 

Poms in the UK need to toss old Uncle Fred's 1950s move to Australia in with all the other non-relevant bits and pieces lying around in the attic. It's 2015 now. Times change. Poms in the UK need to get up to date with Australia. They need to face facts - face the truth

 

There's not all that much difference these days between moving to Australia and moving to a new location in the UK or Europe. And putting all their eggs in one basket and flying to Oz on the seat of their pants is not intelligent, unless all the ground-work has been done first. And groundwork does not ONLY consist of applying to the Oz government and arranging transport for possessions and pets. There's a lot more to it than simply hopping on a plane and telling themselves that when they alight they'll be in paradise and all their troubles left behind them. No. Wherever we go, we take ourselves along with our bits and pieces. We aren't suddenly endowed with desirable personality traits and skills just because we step off a plane in Australia

 

Sure, the Australian government entices migrants. But the Australian pubic is not the Australian government, so Poms shouldn't expect Aussies to welcome even more competition for jobs, housing, road-space, etc., any more than Poms in the UK welcome the endless stream of migrants into the UK. So that's another bit of reality that Poms coming to Oz need to take into account

 

It's a real world and if Australia were even half as 'great' as some would have you believe, there would not -- to begin with -- be so many posts in this and other forums about wanting to, or thinking about, a return to the UK

 

This is the 2015 version of Australia here. Not the 1940s, or 1950s, or 1960s, or 1970s, 80s, 90s, etc. version

 

Things have changed in Australia. It's touted every second week by the mass media as THE most expensive place in the world as far as cost of living, housing, travel, etc, is concerned. That has to be faced, along with the very dismal truth about unemployment in Australia and the poor prospects for kids once they leave school

 

So Poms in the UK need to stop fantasising and start dealing with the truth about Australia. Yes, dreams and fantasies are nice, but Australia isn't going to provide them any more than anywhere else. Of course it rains and gets cold in Australia ! And be realistic, you Poms still in the UK --- you'll need to earn your living in Australia and you will not, most of you, spend endless hours on sunny beaches. You in the UK get the best of Aussie produce and you buy it cheaper than we here in Australia. Aldi is growing like a weed in Oz, just like in the UK. Why do you think that is? Right -- it's because Aldi is cheaper ! Why would Aussies be driving the growth of Aldi? Right again -- because Aussies want and need cheaper food. Why do they need and want cheaper food? Yes, right again -- because Aussies can't afford the more expensive foods. Then take a look at how many Aussies are forced to rent. Why are they forced to rent? Good, you're working it out now -- it's because houses are SO expensive that Aussies cannot afford to buy them. They WANT to own their own homes and something to leave to their children, but they can't AFFORD to buy. And those houses which Aussies CAN afford to buy are nowhere near the chance of employment

 

So there you are. Australia is VERY expensive and beyond the reach of most Aussies -- many of whom have been driven to move overseas in search of a better and more affordable existence

 

And back to where I began -- Poms still in the UK need to update their 'version' of Oz. They need to face the facts and reality. Hopping on a plane to Oz is not a magic carpet ride, nor is it the much touted 'Big Adventure'. It's costly. Once they move it may prove irreversible due to finances and other factors. So stop dreaming, you Poms in the UK. Australia is basically an isolated version of the UK. It costs a lot to get into Australia and a hell of a lot more to get out again, as many have learned to their pain

[JockinTas]

^^^^ I agree with most of that Rachel. I have to say though that Australia has been good to us as a family but we came 34 years ago when it was a lot easier to get ahead - buy a house and find a decent full time job with good pay.

[Chortlepuss]

Lots to think about and if you and your wife are equally excited about the move why not treat it as a working holiday? TBH I don't think you should consider 457 if PR is a possibility though. Sunshine Coast is beautiful. I do think you'll struggle to insure an empty house at any cost. I know my insurer allows a maximum of 3 months without anyone in there and that's with draining all water tanks etc. Good luck, not an easy decision to make. I turned my back on a decent pension to come to Oz and I'm sure I'll regret that when I'm back in the UK but glad I had a chance to experience Oz.

[drstu]

Thank you everyone for the wise words and balanced views. We recognise that no one can make the decision for us but it is helpful to get a range of opinions, particularly based on personal experience.

 

Rachel - to answer your questions my wife if anything is keener for us to give it a go, although she'd be also be content if we just stayed put, as she's someone who goes with the flow. We've been travellers all of our married life. She is also a doctor (hospital based) and will likely work a few days per week once we're settled to keep her skills current. She's my best mate so decisions are always made jointly, indeed if anything she's the boss! If one of us wasn't happy then we'd come back.

 

in many respects in our minds we're not emigrating, just going for a long holiday, which in many respects should make it easier. I guess that it is just the practical aspects eg giving up a great job, pension, what to do with the house etc which I worry about, my wife less so.

 

Thank you so much again. Watch this space ....

[drstu]

I forgot to add re 457. Since we are treating it as a long holiday initially rather than emigration, the 457 gives the option of bringing my superan contributions back which PR doesn't. PR is obviously more expensive too. My understanding is that schools in QLD are free to 457 holders although I accept that could change at any time.

[ramot]

Ok not quite the same circumstances, but when we went to Brunei for work age 50, we thought we either go for just the initial 3 year contract, or till retiring at age 60, ended up the latter.

 

Never regretted the move, some very difficult times, some amazing times, but what an adventure, but like the OP we were both in agreement about taking the chance.

 

Also we rented out our house, and have rented out property in UK now for 22 years. We luckily have never had problems, you should use good reputable agents, have always had 3 monthly inspections. You hear some horror stories, so only fair to say that as many of our expat friends have rented out their properties for years, the horror stories have been very much in the minority.

 

Every one has to make their own mind up about moving overseas, listen to advice, weigh it up,and either stay home safe or take a leap into the unknown.

 

ps You mention you will be working on the Sunshine Coast? have lived here for 12 years, love it, it's a great place to live, as far as I know good schools, great weather for most,of the year.

[starlight7]

Why on earth would a GP need to be on a 457? I would go for something better, they are short of GPs here and there seems to be absolutely no point in risking the 457 bit. You could always return to the uk, not as if you would be unable to find work!

[benj1980]

Also thought I'd copy and paste an absolutely brilliant post (credited to @Burnett) that I have only just read today on another thread.

 

Maybe it's time people in Britain updated their impressions of Australia ? Many seem to come here from the UK because they want to believe the grass is greener in Oz. Some years ago, a woman still resident in the UK became close to feral in this forum at the mere suggestion life in Oz wasn't like the movie. She'd never been here and posted all the time with updates re: her family's progress as far as emigrating was concerned - ' only two more months', etc. And despite that she'd never stepped foot in Australia, she laid into anyone who as much as breathed they -- who were in Oz -- weren't as thrilled about the place as they'd expected to be. It was as if she thought that by controlling everyone else's opinion about Oz that she could keep her unrealistic dreams alive. And she had plenty of supporters here, almost as if there existed a gang whose very livelihood depended on being seen to be keeping the Oz myths alive

 

Sure, 50, 60 years ago, Poms made the big, exciting journey to Oz. Many were the talk of the village. Such a long journey - six weeks by ship. All those wonderful fresh foods, tropical fruits, everything so cheap compared with the old UK (which was still living on rations in the early 50s). Once here, they sent happy-snaps back home, showing themselves tanned, sitting on the beach. Of course, now we know a lot of it was sheer bravado. They knew those back home expected such photos and glowing accounts of Australia. Those UK pounds stretched a long way back then. And work was far easier to find then, compared to now. Sit, work and play in the sun long enough and sure, you'll develop a tan. Smiling for the camera takes a few seconds and what else would you do in a photo -- frown? So the myths about Australia grew out of proportion. And to cover the fact many early Poms in Oz had toilets consisting of stinking cans in an outside dunny and had cracked lino on the floors of their unheated weatherboard and fibro homes, those brave little Poms on Oz of decades ago made jokes, cracked hearty, kept a stiff upper lip and pretended they were loving it in Australia

 

The truth was a different story. As Pommy migrants, they copped a lot of stick just for being Pommies, and so did their kids. Work wasn't anywhere near as plentiful as the Aussie government was claiming to potential migrants who attended all those promotional film nights. The houses on offer in Oz were basic, infested with cockroaches, ants, spider and often - snakes. It was a huge country and travel expensive. Migrants had to really put effort into establishing friendships and were not swiftly accepted - and this is borne out not only in migrant tales recounted by Poms but by people from all over the world who'd taken a chance on Australia. Drink was the ice-breaker, the oil, so fine for drinkers and tough for those who expected a bit more from social encounters than Aussie men guzzling grog on one corner and the women in another, forced to chat about home and kids. Thousands of female migrants from the UK lived for years in a state of repressed depression, forcing themselves to be chirpy for the husband and kids. Most Poms in Oz back then for some reason told themselves they'd made their bed and must lie in it for life

 

Things are different now. It's no big deal to move to Oz - just a plane flight. Sure, a lengthy plane flight, but it's just a trip when all's said and done. It's not like Colombus sailing into the unknown, the way it used to be regarded. It's time other myths were put to bed too. Australia hasn't been 'cheap' for a long, long time. The Aussie mateship beliefs belong on tv, in fiction such as Neighbours. After all, do Poms expect to see real-life Donald Ducks or Mickey Mouses and movie stars all over the US? No. They're movies, entertainment. And so are the unrealistic expectations about Australia, although, granted, the Australian government capitalises on desperate Poms in the UK and their wish that Australia be some sort of cheap, tropical fruit and beach-filled Shangri-la

 

There's internet now. Every single aspect of Australia is accessible online, from the prices of houses, travel distances, schools, welfare-provisions, educational standards, the price of eggs and tea-bags, the weather generally and temperatures for every single part of this massive chunk of rock in the south-pacific. Migrating to Australia can no longer be likened to a voyage into the unknown. So why aren't Poms availing themselves of the million pieces of information at their fingertips while they're still right there in the UK?

 

Answer: because in the case of many -- they don't want to ! They don't want to know ! They don't want to face or accept reality !

 

The Big Adventure ! I'd be rich if I had a cent for every time I've read that term in his and similar forums

 

When the more appropriate term should be -- ' Our huge investment in time, money, effort and energy '

 

Poms in the UK need to toss old Uncle Fred's 1950s move to Australia in with all the other non-relevant bits and pieces lying around in the attic. It's 2015 now. Times change. Poms in the UK need to get up to date with Australia. They need to face facts - face the truth

 

There's not all that much difference these days between moving to Australia and moving to a new location in the UK or Europe. And putting all their eggs in one basket and flying to Oz on the seat of their pants is not intelligent, unless all the ground-work has been done first. And groundwork does not ONLY consist of applying to the Oz government and arranging transport for possessions and pets. There's a lot more to it than simply hopping on a plane and telling themselves that when they alight they'll be in paradise and all their troubles left behind them. No. Wherever we go, we take ourselves along with our bits and pieces. We aren't suddenly endowed with desirable personality traits and skills just because we step off a plane in Australia

 

Sure, the Australian government entices migrants. But the Australian pubic is not the Australian government, so Poms shouldn't expect Aussies to welcome even more competition for jobs, housing, road-space, etc., any more than Poms in the UK welcome the endless stream of migrants into the UK. So that's another bit of reality that Poms coming to Oz need to take into account

 

It's a real world and if Australia were even half as 'great' as some would have you believe, there would not -- to begin with -- be so many posts in this and other forums about wanting to, or thinking about, a return to the UK

 

This is the 2015 version of Australia here. Not the 1940s, or 1950s, or 1960s, or 1970s, 80s, 90s, etc. version

 

Things have changed in Australia. It's touted every second week by the mass media as THE most expensive place in the world as far as cost of living, housing, travel, etc, is concerned. That has to be faced, along with the very dismal truth about unemployment in Australia and the poor prospects for kids once they leave school

 

So Poms in the UK need to stop fantasising and start dealing with the truth about Australia. Yes, dreams and fantasies are nice, but Australia isn't going to provide them any more than anywhere else. Of course it rains and gets cold in Australia ! And be realistic, you Poms still in the UK --- you'll need to earn your living in Australia and you will not, most of you, spend endless hours on sunny beaches. You in the UK get the best of Aussie produce and you buy it cheaper than we here in Australia. Aldi is growing like a weed in Oz, just like in the UK. Why do you think that is? Right -- it's because Aldi is cheaper ! Why would Aussies be driving the growth of Aldi? Right again -- because Aussies want and need cheaper food. Why do they need and want cheaper food? Yes, right again -- because Aussies can't afford the more expensive foods. Then take a look at how many Aussies are forced to rent. Why are they forced to rent? Good, you're working it out now -- it's because houses are SO expensive that Aussies cannot afford to buy them. They WANT to own their own homes and something to leave to their children, but they can't AFFORD to buy. And those houses which Aussies CAN afford to buy are nowhere near the chance of employment

 

So there you are. Australia is VERY expensive and beyond the reach of most Aussies -- many of whom have been driven to move overseas in search of a better and more affordable existence

 

And back to where I began -- Poms still in the UK need to update their 'version' of Oz. They need to face the facts and reality. Hopping on a plane to Oz is not a magic carpet ride, nor is it the much touted 'Big Adventure'. It's costly. Once they move it may prove irreversible due to finances and other factors. So stop dreaming, you Poms in the UK. Australia is basically an isolated version of the UK. It costs a lot to get into Australia and a hell of a lot more to get out again, as many have learned to their pain

 

 

I dont think half half of this is even relevant. I wouldn't even agree with the affordability element. It depends what job you have and the pay you can expect especially for a GP!

[LKC]

I'm sorry to disagree with you, but this is one of the most commonly misquoted comments that I see time and time again. It's only easy to move back if BOTH of the parents agree to move back. The reality is that if one of you are very happy there and the other one isn't then there is going to be a lot of torn opinions on where to live which will mean one person having to live unhappily in a country they don't want to be in.

 

If this job lives up to everything the OP hopes it to be then he is unlikely to want to return to the UK, so what the wife has to decide is whether she is prepared to live a life in a country she may be unhappy in for the sake of her husband and children? If the answer to that is yes and she is prepared to take a gamble then the family should go, but if she's not prepared to take that gamble then the family should maybe stay put in the UK where things seem pretty good for them all.

 

When a move is driven by one person because the positives are all about their career and what's best for them (whilst thinking it is also best for their family) then they are unlikely to want to move back to what they left that they weren't so happy with, especially as the OP states that he may not be able to return to the position he already holds.

 

We are all advising the OP about what he wants without consideration for knowing what his wife really wants, or what she intends to do with her own life when she is there.

 

I pretty much 100% agree with this. We moved over here for OH's career, and my own career (optometrist) was sacrificed as we decided that I would need to stay home with the kids who were only 1 and 2 when we moved. Whilst I love Australia and am happy to live either here or in the UK, now we have been here for seven years OH and both of the kids have become so deeply entwined with Australia that it would be very difficult for us to move back the UK, even if I was desperately miserable (which fortunately I am not). It is very easy to think that the best time to move is when children are young, but in actual fact once they start to grow up in a place they know nothing of where they actually came from. My girls don't remember the UK other than what we see on holiday. Their lives are in Australia, and now they are 8 and 9 it would be very difficult to uproot them from everything they know to move back 'home'. It isn't home to them, Australia is.

 

To be truthful, I think that if someone had told me what Rachel Tilley has written above before we moved, I would have had serious second thoughts about coming at all. It isn't that I am unhappy here at all and have no thoughts of moving, it just feels like the choice of where I would like to live has been taken away from me. For someone whose relationship wasn't as strong or who grew to resent their partner or children that could be quite a sticky situation to be in.

 

Having said all that, if both you and your wife are absolutely in agreement and are able to talk about and plan for that eventuality, it is a great experience, it is a wonderful country and we have been really happy here.

[Parley]

Your last sentence is the important one LKC.

It would have been so sad for your family if your 2nd thoughts meant them missing out on their new home which they love so much.

 

Knowing where they came from doesn't mean much in the end.

What is most important is where you want your future to be. The past is the past. Let it stay there.

[flag of convenience]

I dont think half half of this is even relevant. I wouldn't even agree with the affordability element. It depends what job you have and the pay you can expect especially for a GP!

 

I'd say affordability is very much an issue. While perhaps not immediately apparent on a GP's salary, costs do impact on living standards of many. Not without reason Australia has one of the highest personal debts in the world together with over priced housing.

[JockinTas]

I still find it hard to believe that migrants aren't informed before they arrive how hard it can be to find a job. I've read on this forum how depressing it has been for some new arrivals to find there isn't any work for them. Immigration has a lot to answer for, handing out visas at great cost to the migrant only for them to find when they get here that work for a lot of them is pretty thin on the ground.

[LKC]

Your last sentence is the important one LKC.

It would have been so sad for your family if your 2nd thoughts meant them missing out on their new home which they love so much.

 

Knowing where they came from doesn't mean much in the end.

What is most important is where you want your future to be. The past is the past. Let it stay there.

 

I totally understand what you are saying. I know that many migrants move because they are almost pushed from a life that they don't like in the UK (if that makes sense), but in our case we had a great life there and we have a great life here too. If we hadn't come they would have known a different but equally blessed life.

 

Having said that, we know that we are very lucky. We were pulled to Australia by a great opportunity for OH and it has been a very good move for us, despite the blood, sweat, tears and sacrifices. I'm almost positive that even if I'd have had second thoughts we would have still come. We talked about what we would do if things didn't work out (go back to the UK), but we didn't really think about the consequences of things going well if that makes sense. Somehow feeling like you belong in two places, but also feeling like you don't belong in either. Luckily I tend to just 'go with the flow' and I am at home where my OH and kids are, but I still think that it is important for potential migrants to talk about these things so that every member of the family knows that there are considerations that might not have been thought of.

[caramac]

I pretty much 100% agree with this. We moved over here for OH's career, and my own career (optometrist) was sacrificed as we decided that I would need to stay home with the kids who were only 1 and 2 when we moved. Whilst I love Australia and am happy to live either here or in the UK, now we have been here for seven years OH and both of the kids have become so deeply entwined with Australia that it would be very difficult for us to move back the UK, even if I was desperately miserable (which fortunately I am not). It is very easy to think that the best time to move is when children are young, but in actual fact once they start to grow up in a place they know nothing of where they actually came from. My girls don't remember the UK other than what we see on holiday. Their lives are in Australia, and now they are 8 and 9 it would be very difficult to uproot them from everything they know to move back 'home'. It isn't home to them, Australia is.

 

To be truthful, I think that if someone had told me what Rachel Tilley has written above before we moved, I would have had serious second thoughts about coming at all. It isn't that I am unhappy here at all and have no thoughts of moving, it just feels like the choice of where I would like to live has been taken away from me. For someone whose relationship wasn't as strong or who grew to resent their partner or children that could be quite a sticky situation to be in.

 

Having said all that, if both you and your wife are absolutely in agreement and are able to talk about and plan for that eventuality, it is a great experience, it is a wonderful country and we have been really happy here.

 

 

We moved back to the UK when our eldest was almost 9. She was absolutely against the idea ('the UK is ok for holidays, but I don't want to live there, I don't want to go to school there, I don't want to leave my friends..'). We organised a trial day at her new school, she came out beaming and saying how much she loved it!

I felt so guilty about taking her away from her life and friends, but she, and both her sisters, settled from day 1 and loved their 'new' life. Much depends on the child and how you handle the move, in either direction. I struggled much more than they did!

Our girls are all adults (or almost) and they're all adaptable, adventure seeking and pretty stable given the number of moves they've had and they all say they can't imagine spending all their childhoods in one place.

[Birch4]

Hi drstu,

We have just lodged our 189 visas. I did procrastinate quite a bit with the final payment and lodging the visa. I guess it's like anything in life if you think too much then you would never do anything as you can always find reasons not to go. We have applied for the skilled migrant visas but have no job offers yet... Hoping that one of us can secure an offer. We are planning to rent out our UK house. I think when you have children as well it is easy to worry if it's the best thing for them. But then I think of the travel, outdoor lifestyle and experience we will be giving to our son. We are planning to head to Brisbane/Sunshine Coast areas depending on work. When are you planning to go? Someone recently said to me 'it's better to look back and say I can't believe we did that! Than to look back and wish you had' Good Luck!

[Marisawright]

Someone recently said to me 'it's better to look back and say I can't believe we did that! Than to look back and wish you had'

 

That's fine, provided that statement isn't used to downplay or dismiss someone's legitimate worries about the move (as it often is!). Migration can be a great experience but it can also be difficult, expensive and stressful. There are some who regret not doing it, but equally there are many who look back and say, "if only I'd been more sensible, and not uprooted my family just because I wanted an adventure"!

[LKC]

We moved back to the UK when our eldest was almost 9. She was absolutely against the idea ('the UK is ok for holidays, but I don't want to live there, I don't want to go to school there, I don't want to leave my friends..'). We organised a trial day at her new school, she came out beaming and saying how much she loved it!

I felt so guilty about taking her away from her life and friends, but she, and both her sisters, settled from day 1 and loved their 'new' life. Much depends on the child and how you handle the move, in either direction. I struggled much more than they did!

Our girls are all adults (or almost) and they're all adaptable, adventure seeking and pretty stable given the number of moves they've had and they all say they can't imagine spending all their childhoods in one place.

 

Things are more complicated perhaps in that our eldest has Asperger's, so our view is coloured with that. It can be a struggle to transition from a school routine to a holiday one!

 

Truth be told, when all's said and done, we won't move back. OH and the kids are happy here and I am pretty content too, but I definitely think that it is a conversation worth having.

[drstu]

Hi drstu,

We have just lodged our 189 visas. I did procrastinate quite a bit with the final payment and lodging the visa. I guess it's like anything in life if you think too much then you would never do anything as you can always find reasons not to go. We have applied for the skilled migrant visas but have no job offers yet... Hoping that one of us can secure an offer. We are planning to rent out our UK house. I think when you have children as well it is easy to worry if it's the best thing for them. But then I think of the travel, outdoor lifestyle and experience we will be giving to our son. We are planning to head to Brisbane/Sunshine Coast areas depending on work. When are you planning to go? Someone recently said to me 'it's better to look back and say I can't believe we did that! Than to look back and wish you had' Good Luck!

 

Procrastination is my middle name currently! I have a job offer to start as soon as we can get the paperwork sorted - medical registration takes 6 months or so. All being well it will be June/July. Part of that will be 457 processing time but we are thinking, after everyone else's thoughts here, about just getting PR.

[Marisawright]

Procrastination is my middle name currently! I have a job offer to start as soon as we can get the paperwork sorted - medical registration takes 6 months or so. All being well it will be June/July. Part of that will be 457 processing time but we are thinking, after everyone else's thoughts here, about just getting PR.

 

If you are able to go straight for PR now, then it would be much, much, much better for you and your family. And if you can get it happening in time, I'm sure that job offer would still be there for you whichever visa you're on.

[benj1980]

Perhaps a chat with a reputable MARA agent would help?

[ItchyFeet76]

I forgot to add re 457. Since we are treating it as a long holiday initially rather than emigration, the 457 gives the option of bringing my superan contributions back which PR doesn't. PR is obviously more expensive too. My understanding is that schools in QLD are free to 457 holders although I accept that could change at any time.

 

PR also takes longer (457s can be granted in a matter of weeks, sometimes) and yes, your Super would be tied up as a PR. 457s can be risky but if you're aware of the risks and accept (or even prepare for) them, then I don't see the problem. Not everyone is eligible for PR and the 457 has helped many people achieve their dream of a life in Australia.

 

we are looking for 457 sponsorship too, but in a different industry (IT Security). We tried to emigrate a couple years back and failed, mainly due to the economy / job market (a big IT sec company got bought out and all their pen-testers were let go, flooding the market so my husband wasn't needed), but we're giving it one last go. Our aim is ultimately PR but, failing that, we will consider it a temporary move, a change of a scenery, and then return to our old life in the UK. Life is bloody short (as your profession surely reminds you every day), and you don't get a second chance. Grab any opportunity you can but just make sure you're aware of what could go wrong, and be prepared for the worst. That's our plan, anyway. We have 3 young children (5, 6, 9) and wanted to do it before my eldest was in double digits... At least the rules have changed now and you get 90 days to find a new job, not 30. And come 1 July there may well be some more changes to the system....so we're hoping to get our 457 granted before then, just in case the new rules thwart our plans!

 

Best of luck anyway ?

 

Ps you're right, there are no school fees on a 457 in Qld

[Guest Guest226914]

I'd say affordability is very much an issue. While perhaps not immediately apparent on a GP's salary, costs do impact on living standards of many. Not without reason Australia has one of the highest personal debts in the world together with over priced housing.

 

Probably true on paper...

 

I just feel that everyone experiences Australia differently. Every situation is different due to variations in lifestyle, location and employment. Before I moved to Sydney people would say woah you are crazy....Sydney is the most expensive place in Australia. If I had listened to them I probably would have been scared off. As a generalisation, yes, Sydney probably is on paper the most expensive place to live but we made it work and I love it here and financially we are better off than we were in UK and Sydney has given us a better quality of life. I think the bottom line is people can give advice and look at statistics etc but until you really sit down and work it all out for yourself you don't know what it will all be like. Eg. just because people say Sydney is expensive doesn't mean you will find it expensive. Just because people say you shouldn't come on a 457, doesn't mean you shouldn't. I know lots of people who came on 457s and eventually got PR. Ok it is more risky but it is still do able and if that works for you and you are aware of all the conditions then why not. I am a teacher and before I came out people told me it was virtually unheard of to gain permanent employment and I was very nervous but I happened to find a job relatively easily. I am not saying that people should not be aware of potential problems and difficulties but whilst it may be hard for one person it can be easy for another.

 

As long as you are aware of every possible scenario and the pros and cons (going into things with eyes wide open) and you do lots of research then go for it. It may turn out better than everyone said it would/you thought it would or it might not. Just because people/statistics say one thing does not mean you will necessarily experience it that way.

[northshorepom]

There's nothing wrong with 457s if your aim is to come over and have a go. That's exactly what it's for (and what any work permit, which is all it is, is for in any country)

 

This forum has always been anti-457. I don't know why, perhaps it has lots of people whose aim is to Migrate with a capital M, perhaps because they've bought into the Aussie media received wisdom that 457s are for shipping in cheap labour, not sure

 

Most international companies who hire from overseas will bring those people in on 457s, because (like any work permit), it can be processed pretty quickly. My employer does it same as all the others. They will not generally be interested in either paying the much higher visa costs, nor waiting the months it takes, to process a PR visa, and why would they for an unknown quantity?

 

You just need to have your eyes open as to the differences in tax/benefit treatment (both positive and negative) that it entails. The fact that you're tied to one employer shouldn't be a big deal or surprising to you, as that's obviously what sponsorship/work permits always mean

[flag of convenience]

Probably true on paper...

 

I just feel that everyone experiences Australia differently. Every situation is different due to variations in lifestyle, location and employment. Before I moved to Sydney people would say woah you are crazy....Sydney is the most expensive place in Australia. If I had listened to them I probably would have been scared off. As a generalisation, yes, Sydney probably is on paper the most expensive place to live but we made it work and I love it here and financially we are better off than we were in UK and Sydney has given us a better quality of life. I think the bottom line is people can give advice and look at statistics etc but until you really sit down and work it all out for yourself you don't know what it will all be like. Eg. just because people say Sydney is expensive doesn't mean you will find it expensive. Just because people say you shouldn't come on a 457, doesn't mean you shouldn't. I know lots of people who came on 457s and eventually got PR. Ok it is more risky but it is still do able and if that works for you and you are aware of all the conditions then why not. I am a teacher and before I came out people told me it was virtually unheard of to gain permanent employment and I was very nervous but I happened to find a job relatively easily. I am not saying that people should not be aware of potential problems and difficulties but whilst it may be hard for one person it can be easy for another.

 

As long as you are aware of every possible scenario and the pros and cons (going into things with eyes wide open) and you do lots of research then go for it. It may turn out better than everyone said it would/you thought it would or it might not. Just because people/statistics say one thing does not mean you will necessarily experience it that way.

 

Of course all are different hence the reason I noted a GP may well prosper in Sydney's bloated, insane housing bubble. Other aspects of Sydney life tend to be cheaper than Perth's. Still a roof over the head tends to be a minimal human requirement.

 

Those that interred the fray in recent years may well react with glee to the unearned profits made around housing. In fact to the point of almost why bother to work?

 

I know Aussies whom have never been quite able or held off expecting a price correction, now unable to put down roots in their home city. All have decent jobs if not top of the pay scales required for such cities to prosper.

 

There are all sorts of possibilities but Sydney increasingly is not a city where ordinary working people can expect to live their lives as in the traditional Australian sense but then is hardly alone in that just more clearly defined.

[flag of convenience]

There's nothing wrong with 457s if your aim is to come over and have a go. That's exactly what it's for (and what any work permit, which is all it is, is for in any country)

 

This forum has always been anti-457. I don't know why, perhaps it has lots of people whose aim is to Migrate with a capital M, perhaps because they've bought into the Aussie media received wisdom that 457s are for shipping in cheap labour, not sure

 

Most international companies who hire from overseas will bring those people in on 457s, because (like any work permit), it can be processed pretty quickly. My employer does it same as all the others. They will not generally be interested in either paying the much higher visa costs, nor waiting the months it takes, to process a PR visa, and why would they for an unknown quantity?

 

You just need to have your eyes open as to the differences in tax/benefit treatment (both positive and negative) that it entails. The fact that you're tied to one employer shouldn't be a big deal or surprising to you, as that's obviously what sponsorship/work permits always mean

 

Hardly anti 457 as well you know. So many on here came on 457's to make such a claim total fallacy. In fact I may well be the only one against the rorting of the system and the back door entry to a PR on this forum.

Of course it may/may not benefit the individual claimant. Especially those that would fail to qualify through normal channels, as well as to be cost effective, but has far over reached its original intent and while good news for business both small and large is not of benefit to Australians wanting training or seeking a job.