Are you 'comfortable' with Australia's handling of Tamil asylum seekers at sea?

[Rallyman]

Reports in the media this morning that some Tamil asylum seekers given visas to stay to Australia have gone back to visit family for holidays , hardly the action of someone who flees a country for fear of their life and living under persecution , how true this report is not sure

[Parley]

Reports in the media this morning that some Tamil asylum seekers given visas to stay to Australia have gone back to visit family for holidays , hardly the action of someone who flees a country for fear of their life and living under persecution , how true this report is not sure

 

Doesn't surprise Rallyman. Most of the Sri Lankans have been assessed in the past as economic migrants.

 

Do you have a link ?

[Harpodom]

Making traumatised people undergo a 4 question video interview whilst still at sea doesn't strike me as a comprehensive or fair assessment of their circumstances Paul. Surely there's a humane way of properly assessing the validity of an applicant's claim without resorting to measures like this, or leaving them to rot in off-shore camps?. Reading the transcript of Scott Morrison's press conference on the subject, what came across was his obstinate resentment towards arrivals by boat. A kind of petty vindictiveness which stems from a position that Australia should not have to deal with such people, coupled with a determination to ensure that they are treated so harshly by Australia that they'll immediately regret ever troubling the Australian Government. If that's the case then why remain signatories to international agreements on taking refugee quotas at all? Why not be brutally honest and just say "We don't want these people, we're not interested in their plight, they need to sort out their own problems or go somewhere else?" Instead of this grudging, mean-spirited, punitive approach that they're currently adopting? Australia clearly doesn't care what the international community thinks of it anyway, so why not be brutally honest? Australian public opinion clearly backs the government on this issue, so it'd probably be a massive vote winner in 2016.

Agreed mate.

 

Why bother with the convention when the major political parties and the nation as a whole aren't remotely inclined to behave in the spirit of the thing.

 

I think I know why the pollies won't withdraw though: they know how much of a pariah state Australia would become

[Paul1Perth]

Leaked Paul. Leaked..

 

So how do we know what's true and what's made up?

[Paul1Perth]

Reports in the media this morning that some Tamil asylum seekers given visas to stay to Australia have gone back to visit family for holidays , hardly the action of someone who flees a country for fear of their life and living under persecution , how true this report is not sure

 

Like I replied to Harpo, who knows what's true and what's not?

[Harpodom]

Like I replied to Harpo, who knows what's true and what's not?

The Guardian has a pretty good track record for unearthing big stories Paul.

[Paul1Perth]

The Guardian has a pretty good track record for unearthing big stories Paul.

 

They are like all the other papers Harpo, so desperate for an "exclusive" they will print anything without corroborating. It's tough selling papers at the moment mate, everything is free, on-line. Who cares whether it's true or not?:no:

[Harpodom]

They are like all the other papers Harpo, so desperate for an "exclusive" they will print anything without corroborating. It's tough selling papers at the moment mate, everything is free, on-line. Who cares whether it's true or not?:no:

I give up!

[Paul1Perth]

I give up!

 

No you don't Harpo, I know you, you are only having a rest mate.:wink:

[Rallyman]

Greens leader Christine Milne is shocked that the Abbott Government is sending back boat people to Sri Lanka, a country she portrays as a hell-hole:

 

 

“They have a shocking reputation for human rights,” she told a press conference this morning.

 

 

“It is now up to Prime Minister Abbott. Prime Minister tell Australians - are you going to send 153 people back to the people who have persecuted them?

 

 

“Is that what this nation has become under your leadership? Because I think the overwhelming majority of Australians will be horrified by this.

 

 

“Not only is it shocking and cruel for the people who have been persecuted and are being treated like this, but it is absolutely in breach of our obligations under the refugee convention.”

 

 

Christine Milne plans a holiday in December 2011:

 

 

For now, there is a holiday in Sri Lanka and a rare chance to relax, possibly with her head in a history book, for the few short months that school is out.

 

 

Canada, 2010 - data shows many Tamil “refugees” actually think Sri Lanka is safe to visit:

 

 

 

 

A secret government survey reveals the majority of successful Tamil refugees travel back to Sri Lanka, raising questions about the legitimacy of their refugee status…

 

 

“I think it’s been fairly common knowledge, that after asylum seekers get status they go back,” said James Bissett a former head of Immigration Canada… A total of 50 people were surveyed, 31 of them had successfully obtained refugee status and 22 had returned to Sri Lanka. The CBSA refuses to release further information and will not say if an expanded study will be conducted to examine the full nature of the problem.

 

 

The most famous Tamil last year said conditions for Tamils in Sri Lanka were vastly better:

 

 

U.K. Prime Minister David Cameron has been misled about conditions for Tamils in the north of the country, cricketer Muttiah Muralitharan, a Tamil and national hero, said today.

 

 

The lives of people are improving, Muralitharan, who took 800 test wickets, told reporters at an event in Colombo with Cameron to promote reconciliation on the island. Cameron, who traveled to the north yesterday, confronted President Mahinda Rajapaksa last night about refugees…

 

 

“In wartime I went with the UN, I saw the place, how it was,” Muralitharan said. “Now I regularly go and I see the place and it is about a 1,000 percent improvement in facilities,” he said.

 

 

United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees says it’s helping refugees return to Sri Lanka:

 

 

Five years after the end of the conflict in Sri Lanka, the majority of those who were IDPs [internally displaced persons] in the country have returned to their place of origin. However, an undetermined number of individuals remain in protracted displacement, unable to return home owing to housing, land and property issues…

 

 

In Sri Lanka, IDP and refugee returnees have difficulty in meeting their basic needs. The lack of a comprehensive national policy on land rights has had an adverse impact on sustainable return… The return of Sri Lankan refugees will continue, albeit at a slower pace…

 

 

UNHCR will also facilitate the voluntary repatriation of Sri Lankan refugees in cooperation with the Governments of India and Sri Lanka.

 

 

UNHCR now praises Sri Lanka for how it is resettling returning refugees and the displaced. In fact, refugees from other countries are fleeing to Sri Lanka:

 

 

In this global and regional context, Sri Lanka has made progress in reintegrating the returning Sri Lankan refugees and by being a host country to many of those that flee violence in the region. Since the conflict in Sri Lanka ended in May 2009, UNHCR has helped over 11,400 Sri Lankan refugees who have returned voluntarily to restart their lives. Similarly, though numbers remain low in comparison to other host countries in the region, Sri Lanka currently hosts 291 refugees and 1547 asylum seekers, all of whom are registered with UNHCR.

 

 

Sri Lankan government has made great strides in reintegrating 573,651 returning internally displaced persons since the end of civil conflict in 2009. UNHCR continues to assist the government in finding durable solutions for the remaining IDPs. Likewise, Sri Lanka has very effectively dealt with the issue of statelessness on its territory by passing legislation enabling Tamils of Indian Origin, who had been previously disenfranchised, and a population of ethnic Chinese, who had been in the country since the 1940s, to access citizenship. Sri Lanka is often cited as the best practice in the region in resolving issues of statelessness.

 

 

UPDATE

 

 

 

 

 

 

An insane anology, grossly offensive both to Sri Lanka and to the Jews and gypsies particularly who were the victims of Nazi genocide:

Former Liberal prime minister Malcolm Fraser, an opponent of Operation Sovereign Borders, went further still yesterday, tweeting that handing asylum-seekers over to Sri Lanka at sea was redolent of handing Jews to Nazis in the 1930s.

 

 

(Thanks to readers brett t r, pitman and others.)

[Paul1Perth]

Christine Milne is shocked at everything.

[Harpodom]

Sorry, but what is the source of this incoherent polemic?

 

Greens leader Christine Milne is shocked that the Abbott Government is sending back boat people to Sri Lanka, a country she portrays as a hell-hole:

 

 

“They have a shocking reputation for human rights,” she told a press conference this morning.

 

 

“It is now up to Prime Minister Abbott. Prime Minister tell Australians - are you going to send 153 people back to the people who have persecuted them?

 

 

“Is that what this nation has become under your leadership? Because I think the overwhelming majority of Australians will be horrified by this.

 

 

“Not only is it shocking and cruel for the people who have been persecuted and are being treated like this, but it is absolutely in breach of our obligations under the refugee convention.”

 

 

Christine Milne plans a holiday in December 2011:

 

 

For now, there is a holiday in Sri Lanka and a rare chance to relax, possibly with her head in a history book, for the few short months that school is out.

 

 

Canada, 2010 - data shows many Tamil “refugees” actually think Sri Lanka is safe to visit:

 

 

 

 

A secret government survey reveals the majority of successful Tamil refugees travel back to Sri Lanka, raising questions about the legitimacy of their refugee status…

 

 

“I think it’s been fairly common knowledge, that after asylum seekers get status they go back,” said James Bissett a former head of Immigration Canada… A total of 50 people were surveyed, 31 of them had successfully obtained refugee status and 22 had returned to Sri Lanka. The CBSA refuses to release further information and will not say if an expanded study will be conducted to examine the full nature of the problem.

 

 

The most famous Tamil last year said conditions for Tamils in Sri Lanka were vastly better:

 

 

U.K. Prime Minister David Cameron has been misled about conditions for Tamils in the north of the country, cricketer Muttiah Muralitharan, a Tamil and national hero, said today.

 

 

The lives of people are improving, Muralitharan, who took 800 test wickets, told reporters at an event in Colombo with Cameron to promote reconciliation on the island. Cameron, who traveled to the north yesterday, confronted President Mahinda Rajapaksa last night about refugees…

 

 

“In wartime I went with the UN, I saw the place, how it was,” Muralitharan said. “Now I regularly go and I see the place and it is about a 1,000 percent improvement in facilities,” he said.

 

 

United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees says it’s helping refugees return to Sri Lanka:

 

 

Five years after the end of the conflict in Sri Lanka, the majority of those who were IDPs [internally displaced persons] in the country have returned to their place of origin. However, an undetermined number of individuals remain in protracted displacement, unable to return home owing to housing, land and property issues…

 

 

In Sri Lanka, IDP and refugee returnees have difficulty in meeting their basic needs. The lack of a comprehensive national policy on land rights has had an adverse impact on sustainable return… The return of Sri Lankan refugees will continue, albeit at a slower pace…

 

 

UNHCR will also facilitate the voluntary repatriation of Sri Lankan refugees in cooperation with the Governments of India and Sri Lanka.

 

 

UNHCR now praises Sri Lanka for how it is resettling returning refugees and the displaced. In fact, refugees from other countries are fleeing to Sri Lanka:

 

 

In this global and regional context, Sri Lanka has made progress in reintegrating the returning Sri Lankan refugees and by being a host country to many of those that flee violence in the region. Since the conflict in Sri Lanka ended in May 2009, UNHCR has helped over 11,400 Sri Lankan refugees who have returned voluntarily to restart their lives. Similarly, though numbers remain low in comparison to other host countries in the region, Sri Lanka currently hosts 291 refugees and 1547 asylum seekers, all of whom are registered with UNHCR.

 

 

Sri Lankan government has made great strides in reintegrating 573,651 returning internally displaced persons since the end of civil conflict in 2009. UNHCR continues to assist the government in finding durable solutions for the remaining IDPs. Likewise, Sri Lanka has very effectively dealt with the issue of statelessness on its territory by passing legislation enabling Tamils of Indian Origin, who had been previously disenfranchised, and a population of ethnic Chinese, who had been in the country since the 1940s, to access citizenship. Sri Lanka is often cited as the best practice in the region in resolving issues of statelessness.

 

 

UPDATE

 

 

 

 

 

 

An insane anology, grossly offensive both to Sri Lanka and to the Jews and gypsies particularly who were the victims of Nazi genocide:

Former Liberal prime minister Malcolm Fraser, an opponent of Operation Sovereign Borders, went further still yesterday, tweeting that handing asylum-seekers over to Sri Lanka at sea was redolent of handing Jews to Nazis in the 1930s.

 

 

(Thanks to readers brett t r, pitman and others.)

[Sammy1]

Sorry, but what is the source of this incoherent polemic?

 

Well at least we know he can google, copy and paste. Sure it makes no sense, but then a lot of the comments on here don't.

[Rallyman]

It's what was being said on the radio this morning so yep I looked it up and posted it, paints a clearer picture if true that these people are in fact economic asylum seekers

[Rallyman]

Link : blogs.news.com.au/.../exposing_christine_milnes_trashing_of_sri_lanka/

[Harpodom]

It's what was being said on the radio this morning so yep I looked it up and posted it, paints a clearer picture if true that these people are in fact economic asylum seekers

In your eyes maybe, and presumably in the eyes of quite a few others.

 

I suppose we see/hear/believe what we want to see/hear/believe. The same applies on both sides of this divide.

 

I accept that if people are without doubt found to be 'economic asylum seekers', that they should be deported.

 

I don't accept that the process of determining this should take the form of a 4 question interview via video-link at sea, or indeed indefinite incarceration in an offshore prison.

 

The *only* fair solution lies in treating people with dignity and respect, respecting their right to claim asylum, hearing their asylum claim in a timely manner and with proper representation and right of appeal. And in forging constructive relationships with regional neighbours. Not bribes, not gifting warships, not blocking UN war crimes investigations, but co-operation.

 

I know what this govt (and the previous govt) are up to: they want to treat these people so appallingly that it:

 

1. 'sends a message'

 

and

 

2. appeases the haters

 

But there is a better, fairer, more humane way of doing this. This isn't rocket science.

[Danny842003]

In your eyes maybe, and presumably in the eyes of quite a few others.

 

I suppose we see/hear/believe what we want to see/hear/believe. The same applies on both sides of this divide.

 

I accept that if people are without doubt found to be 'economic asylum seekers', that they should be deported.

 

I don't accept that the process of determining this should take the form of a 4 question interview via video-link at sea, or indeed indefinite incarceration in an offshore prison.

 

The *only* fair solution lies in treating people with dignity and respect, respecting their right to claim asylum, hearing their asylum claim in a timely manner and with proper representation and right of appeal. And in forging constructive relationships with regional neighbours. Not bribes, not gifting warships, not blocking UN war crimes investigations, but co-operation.

 

I know what this govt (and the previous govt) are up to: they want to treat these people so appallingly that it:

 

1. 'sends a message'

 

and

 

2. appeases the haters

 

But there is a better, fairer, more humane way of doing this. This isn't rocket science.

 

what is the fairer way of doing things? Processing the people onshore where they promptly abscond and are lost to the system for years at a time? As happens in the UK

Im not saying I like either way but it's a harder problem than you seem to be making it out to be.

[Harpodom]

what is the fairer way of doing things? Processing the people onshore where they promptly abscond and are lost to the system for years at a time? As happens in the UK

Im not saying I like either way but it's a harder problem than you seem to be making it out to be.

I don't accept that.

 

I think it's a lot simpler than you seem to make it out to be.

[Xenon4017]

I don't accept that.

 

I think it's a lot simpler than you seem to make it out to be.

 

It isn't. Want to give it a go? I'll be the recent arrival and you can be the Australain Govt that you'd like to see.

 

I'll write my replies as the asylum seeker in square brackets, and my other comments in parenthesis.

 

So, fire away. We're sat opposite each other, and by the way, thanks for the cup of tea.

[Harpodom]

Clever, I'm literally $hitting myself.

 

Nah. If you can't perform good governance without dehumanising a group of vulnerable traumatised *voiceless* people, then you're not fit to govern in my book.

 

 

 

It isn't. Want to give it a go? I'll be the recent arrival and you can be the Australain Govt that you'd like to see.

 

I'll write my replies as the asylum seeker in square brackets, and my other comments in parenthesis.

 

So, fire away. We're sat opposite each other, and by the way, thanks for the cup of tea.

[Danny842003]

I don't accept that.

 

I think it's a lot simpler than you seem to make it out to be.

 

So it's that easy neither succsessive UK and Aus governments can't achieve it.

 

You say it simple but give no clue as to how you would achieve it.

[Xenon4017]

Clever, I'm literally $hitting myself.

 

Nah. If you can't perform good governance without dehumanising a group of vulnerable traumatised *voiceless* people, then you're not fit to govern in my book.

 

Well, you seem incapable of doing the job either. Then again, no one voted for you.

 

You criticize without offering any credible alternative. I would have really played fair, but you don't even want to go one step down the road. I bet Paul1Perth would find the courage.....

[Harpodom]

Well, you seem incapable of doing the job either. Then again, no one voted for you.

 

You criticize without offering any credible alternative. I would have really played fair, but you don't even want to go one step down the road. I bet Paul1Perth would find the courage.....

So your 'credible' alternative is to treat people like $hit is it? Off you go then, lets see you do in real life what you expect the politicians do in your name

[Xenon4017]

So your 'credible' alternative is to treat people like $hit is it? Off you go then, lets see you do in real life what you expect the politicians do in your name

 

Calm down, you've missed the point.

 

You stated that it should be easy to assess asylum claims. My own experience is that it isn't. I was prepared to go into a role play with you to demonstrate this. But you shied away, despite having all the answers, it would seem.

 

It's not credible to say you have the answers then refuse to disclose them.

[flag of convenience]

Reports in the media this morning that some Tamil asylum seekers given visas to stay to Australia have gone back to visit family for holidays , hardly the action of someone who flees a country for fear of their life and living under persecution , how true this report is not sure

 

Further attempts to cloud the waters. And if try it would be I'd strongly suspect after becoming an Australian citizen. I know Iraq's that have returned to Iraq after getting a passport. Your issue being?