Northampton PGCE Top Up Course

[LFrance]

Has anyone ever been successful with an AITSL skills assessment having completed the Northampton PGCE top up course? TRBWA have recommended the course and said they recognise it but AITSL have information on their website that they often do not accept Top Up courses for PGCE as the initial teacher training completed is not a recognised programme. 
I have QTS gained via school direct. I have academic transcript of the course as well as a letter from the university stating that I did 120 days placement of supervised teaching practice. Any help is appreciated as I need to know whether to go ahead with this course. 

[VERYSTORMY]

I would run it past a registered migration agent. 

[Marisawright]

15 hours ago, LFrance said:

 TRBWA have recommended the course and said they recognise it 

Have they given you that in writing?

[LFrance]

a senior registration officer recommended the course via email 

[LFrance]

2 hours ago, VERYSTORMY said:

I would run it past a registered migration agent. 

Thanks for advice

[Marisawright]

1 hour ago, LFrance said:

a senior registration officer recommended the course via email 

That's encouraging. That means that IF you can get a visa to migrate to WA, you should be able to get registered.  The difficulty might lie in getting the visa.  

Just to clarify, the skills assessment is for the visa application.  It's just for the visa, nothing more.  It has nothing to do with whether you're allowed to teach in WA.  For that, you need teacher registration, and that's done by the TRBWA.  The TRBWA doesn't get involved at all, until after you've got the visa. So them saying it's recognised, doesn't mean AITSL will take the same attitude.

@benj1980 is a teacher in WA who's been actively involved in the whole issue of recognising PGCE qualifications.  I've tagged him so hopefully he'll drop in with some info.

Edited July 21, 2023 by Marisawright

[LFrance]

2 minutes ago, Marisawright said:

That's encouraging. That means that IF you can get a visa to migrate to WA, you should be able to get registered.  The difficulty might lie in getting the visa.  

Just to clarify, the skills assessment is for the visa application.  It's just for the visa, nothing more.  It has nothing to do with whether you're allowed to teach in WA.  For that, you need teacher registration, and that's done by the TRBWA.  The TRBWA doesn't get involved at all, until after you've got the visa. So them saying it's recognised, doesn't mean AITSL will take the same attitude.

@benj1980 is a teacher in WA who's been actively involved in the whole issue of recognising PGCE qualifications.  I've tagged him so hopefully he'll drop in with some info.

Thanks - it is the visa that is the barrier. I have been told by TRBWA that they recognise this course and am 99% sure I’d be registered to teach no problem… it’s getting the positive skills assessment that I feel will be the issue, unless someone comes forward that has used this course before & succeeded. 

[Tulip1]

3 minutes ago, LFrance said:

Thanks - it is the visa that is the barrier. I have been told by TRBWA that they recognise this course and am 99% sure I’d be registered to teach no problem… it’s getting the positive skills assessment that I feel will be the issue, unless someone comes forward that has used this course before & succeeded. 

You need to speak to a migrant agent.  That is your best chance and if you don’t have a chance they will know and tell you.  The sooner you know either way the better for you.  

[Marisawright]

25 minutes ago, LFrance said:

Thanks - it is the visa that is the barrier. I have been told by TRBWA that they recognise this course and am 99% sure I’d be registered to teach no problem… it’s getting the positive skills assessment that I feel will be the issue, unless someone comes forward that has used this course before & succeeded. 

I think you're right.  Let's hope @benj1980 has some insights.

[benj1980]

Hi @LFrance normally the recommendation would be to simply speak to a registered agent, however I haven't found one that knew much about the routes into teaching and AITSL's requirements. That said I have stopped looking for them as well, so they may well be up to date with the challenges that you have.

School Direct is another version of the SCITT that I completed, the fee paying version. The salaried version is actually like Teach Australia. AITSL does not like these type of programs despite having Teach Australia. Go figure. SCITTs now cover 55% of new entrants into teaching, so I have raised this with my local Federal MP who was surprised that so many potential teachers seem to be ineligible. Anyway I am waiting to hear back, this case has been escalated I believe to AITSL and various ministers. Watch this space...

What can you do? Well, I came to Australia via a SCITT and I am not the only one, however we seem to be in the minority. AITSL had no interest in transcripts from my training provider, but were keen for information from the University that moderated and validated my PGCE. I was able to provide an academic transcript from the university confirming the modules I completed with credits and the amount of prac experience in terms of days through a letter. This was deemed appropriate. I had an academic transcript from my SCITT and was rejected initially by AITSL. You say you have an academic transcript, make sure it is from the University!

[LFrance]

7 hours ago, benj1980 said:

Hi @LFrance normally the recommendation would be to simply speak to a registered agent, however I haven't found one that knew much about the routes into teaching and AITSL's requirements. That said I have stopped looking for them as well, so they may well be up to date with the challenges that you have.

School Direct is another version of the SCITT that I completed, the fee paying version. The salaried version is actually like Teach Australia. AITSL does not like these type of programs despite having Teach Australia. Go figure. SCITTs now cover 55% of new entrants into teaching, so I have raised this with my local Federal MP who was surprised that so many potential teachers seem to be ineligible. Anyway I am waiting to hear back, this case has been escalated I believe to AITSL and various ministers. Watch this space...

What can you do? Well, I came to Australia via a SCITT and I am not the only one, however we seem to be in the minority. AITSL had no interest in transcripts from my training provider, but were keen for information from the University that moderated and validated my PGCE. I was able to provide an academic transcript from the university confirming the modules I completed with credits and the amount of prac experience in terms of days through a letter. This was deemed appropriate. I had an academic transcript from my SCITT and was rejected initially by AITSL. You say you have an academic transcript, make sure it is from the University!

Thanks for this Ben. Let’s hope something can be done because it’s just outrageous that these courses are not recognised. It should be about the individual themselves and not what a piece of paper says. 
 

if I complete the PGCE top up course I will have a PGCE Cert and transcript from a University and my supervised practice letter is from a University also but is based on my practice observed on my SCITT. The PGCE top up does not include the supervised practice. Do you think AITSL will reject this as it’s from the SCITT part of my quals?

[rammygirl]

Beware top up qualifications as any experience will only be counted after qualification. If you need experience for points or visa this could be an issue.

Interestingly Australian teacher training is being reviewed as it isn’t adequately preparing teachers for the classroom…..

[Marisawright]

18 hours ago, LFrance said:

if I complete the PGCE top up course I will have a PGCE Cert and transcript from a University and my supervised practice letter is from a University also but is based on my practice observed on my SCITT. The PGCE top up does not include the supervised practice. Do you think AITSL will reject this as it’s from the SCITT part of my quals?

If you had already done the course, then I'd say all you can do is try.  However there is no way I'd be embarking on the course when it's clear that right now, it's unlikely to get you a visa.  

Rammygirl also makes a good point. For most occupations, you can't count any experience gained before you get the required qualifications.  If that's also the case for teaching,  none of your current teaching experience would count.  

[LFrance]

3 hours ago, rammygirl said:

Beware top up qualifications as any experience will only be counted after qualification. If you need experience for points or visa this could be an issue.

Interestingly Australian teacher training is being reviewed as it isn’t adequately preparing teachers for the classroom…..

Thanks. 
 

and that doesn’t surprise me… I think a school centred route is the ideal training 

[benj1980]

It's now the preferred training route in the UK! Due to the additional invaluable classroom experience, instead of having the afternoon off from lectures you are still in a school environment.

@rammygirl is right, a review has been completed and there's many changes due to happen at university level, we were getting graduates with little knowledge of differentiation, explicit instruction etc. However, they could all tell you their learning style through VARK... 

In terms of an application to AITSL it is hard to say whether it would be accepted, it sounds promising but absolutely no guarantees.

[LFrance]

3 minutes ago, benj1980 said:

It's now the preferred training route in the UK! Due to the additional invaluable classroom experience, instead of having the afternoon off from lectures you are still in a school environment.

@rammygirl is right, a review has been completed and there's many changes due to happen at university level, we were getting graduates with little knowledge of differentiation, explicit instruction etc. However, they could all tell you their learning style through VARK... 

In terms of an application to AITSL it is hard to say whether it would be accepted, it sounds promising but absolutely no guarantees.

Thanks Ben. I will be keeping an eye out for any updates. Given I can still teach temporarily on a working-holiday visa, I think I will go ahead with the course and review my visa options at a later date. 

[KieronH]

Just jumping in on this to see if there are any updates or how anyone has been successful with a top up course?