Advice needed on wanting to move back to Aus again.

[fjm]

On 04/01/2019 at 21:33, Marisawright said:

Be aware that Sydney house prices have increased massively since you left.  If you left for financial reasons last time, I'd be concerned about surviving this time.

We sold up around the same time as you, did some travelling and then spent some time in the UK.   When we decided to return to Australia, we discovered that it was simply impossible to go back to Sydney.   The little townhouse we'd sold for $600,000 in 2012 would now cost over a million. To rent a nice flat in our old area would cost around $750 a week.  

We are now in Melbourne, where I'd say house prices are about the same as 2012 Sydney prices. 

Depending what jobs you do, if you want to be close to your family in Sydney, then I'd suggest looking at Newcastle - still close enough for a day trip to Sydney on the weekend, housing is much more affordable, great beaches and it's nothing like the old working-class town it used to be.

Sorry to jump on another thread, but we are potentially moving back to Australia later this year - husband has a job offer in Sydney (we lived in Melbourne previously) and I was wondering how commutable it would be from the Gosford/Brisbane Water area...??  We’d rather do a longer commute and get more for our money house wise (renting initially).  Is that an unrealistic commute...?

[Entity]

10 hours ago, fjm said:

Sorry to jump on another thread, but we are potentially moving back to Australia later this year - husband has a job offer in Sydney (we lived in Melbourne previously) and I was wondering how commutable it would be from the Gosford/Brisbane Water area...??  We’d rather do a longer commute and get more for our money house wise (renting initially).  Is that an unrealistic commute...?

Hi there, my husband used to commute from Gosford station to Sydney. From memory it was about 1.5-2hr journey door to door. It’s very doable but obviously makes quite a long day. Plenty of tradies used to commute down from Newcastle to Sydney but that’s quite a journey. You obviously get much more for your money and space in the Central Coast.

[Entity]

On 15/01/2019 at 00:22, Melbpom said:

Entity, I am in the process of moving back to Australia and leaving behind my parents who are in their late 70's. Will they miss me and will I miss them, yes of course but they are fit and healthy and have travelled widely themselves. If they were ill then maybe it would be harder but thankfully they're not. There has never been an expectation that I would care for them (in a hands on way) in their old age. They in their turn were living overseas when their parents eventually went into care homes.

I am returning to Australia because I think I have a better quality of life there and have been miserable here. The other really important reason is that I miss my youngest son who stayed behind to go to uni. He is not quite on his feet yet and is pleased that I and my oldest son are returning.

What I'm trying to say is that all family situations are different and only you can go with your gut and do whatever feels right.

Thank you, good to hear your story. We are currently investigating possibilities. It’s a lot to think about, it’s not as easy for various reasons as it used to be for us to make a decision.

[Entity]

On 14/01/2019 at 22:15, Marisawright said:

It's a very tough road and it's only going to get worse, so I wouldn't bank on being able to get a Parent visa.  The processing time for the Non-Contributory Visa is 30 years (in other words, never!).  The processing time for the Contributory Visa is 5-6 years and I think the fees are around $100,000.  

I'm sure there are parents who make the move and love it, but I've also met a few in real life and none of them were entirely happy.  Because they'd had to stump up such a high fee, they couldn't afford such a nice home in Australia as they had in the UK, and they had to be very conscious of their budget because of their frozen pension.  They had to throw out a lot of their treasured possessions.   They were glad to be in Australia to see their grandkids - but that was only once a week, and the rest of the week they had to live in their cramped flat, watching their pennies and missing their friends.   

For that reason, I'd say please don't push them to get the parent visa, or assume they will want to go.  It's a big step to throw away a lifetime of memories and friendship and move to a foreign country in your old age.  

Thank you, my parents have looked into this before although we would obviously seek advice. I would never force them and my gut feel is that they won’t move anyway, I was just wanting to investigate options for them as that will be something they consider although ultimately I think they will stay. They would not travel to Australia anymore although they used to and I wouldn’t expect them to. Thank you for your thoughts.

[fjm]

9 hours ago, Entity said:

Hi there, my husband used to commute from Gosford station to Sydney. From memory it was about 1.5-2hr journey door to door. It’s very doable but obviously makes quite a long day. Plenty of tradies used to commute down from Newcastle to Sydney but that’s quite a journey. You obviously get much more for your money and space in the Central Coast.

Thank you! Nice to know we are not being completely unrealistic

[Marisawright]

2 hours ago, fjm said:

Thank you! Nice to know we are not being completely unrealistic

I’m not sure I’d call 4 hours commuting time every day realistic?

The point with tradies who do it is that they don’t do it every day, just when they get a job in Sydney. I know people who do that commute long term, but not 5 days a week. They work from home or work locally some of the week

Edited January 17, 2019 by Marisawright

[fjm]

12 minutes ago, Marisawright said:

I’m not sure I’d call 4 hours commuting time every day realistic?

The point with tradies who do it is that they don’t do it every day, just when they get a job in Sydney. I know people who do that commute long term, but not 5 days a week. They work from home or work locally some of the week

No, you’re right, 4hrs is unrealistic.  However, I’m sure if we managed to find somewhere between Gosford and Sydney, it wouldn’t be out of the question - he already has a 1hr commute at each end of the day here in UK. 

[Marisawright]

37 minutes ago, fjm said:

No, you’re right, 4hrs is unrealistic.  However, I’m sure if we managed to find somewhere between Gosford and Sydney, it wouldn’t be out of the question - he already has a 1hr commute at each end of the day here in UK. 

Google Maps is your friend. Use the “directions” feature and set the time for rush hour and you’ll get a realistic idea of commute times

[wattsy1982]

On 04/01/2019 at 17:08, Entity said:

My husband and I are English, we lived in Wellington, NZ for about 7 years (we have NZ passports) before moving to Sydney in 2007 where we had two children. I have a sibling and nieces in Sydney. We moved back to the UK in 2012, our reasons at the time were financial and for our children to be near grandparents in the UK. After a short time back, we both regretted our decision, however our parents are here and obviously getting older. I am desperate to move back to Australia as is my husband. Our children are 10 and 8, they both love sport and also want to move although we don’t discuss it with them. They are obviously both in school, my husband has his own business here. Are we mad to move back or do I wait it out and hope my feelings change? I feel desperate that we have only one life and we are getting older as are our children. Do I stay here for our parents or do we greatly upset them by moving back again. I am at the stage of wishing I could be brain-washed to forget about Australia but it just won’t leave me  Has anyone been in a similar position and what advice could you give?

Hi @Entity just came across your post and can kind of relate.

We moved back to the UK last year after 5 years in Australia. I can now see that my main reason for moving back was for my parents and the guilt of them not seeing my kids grow up and the kids not being round them either....i wasn't thinking what was best for then or us as a family of 5. I can now see that aus is probably the 'best' option for us but that will come at the cost of grandparents...its a tough choice for sure.

 

[Jon the Hat]

It is really challenging isn't it?  I don't think I would be considering it if we weren't half Australian.  I am fortunate that in addition to my wife's family I have an Aunt & Uncle and cousins who I know well in Perth, and this overall provides a family network which we can rely on.  Really tough to do without that I think.

[Quoll]

6 hours ago, wattsy1982 said:

Hi @Entity just came across your post and can kind of relate.

We moved back to the UK last year after 5 years in Australia. I can now see that my main reason for moving back was for my parents and the guilt of them not seeing my kids grow up and the kids not being round them either....i wasn't thinking what was best for then or us as a family of 5. I can now see that aus is probably the 'best' option for us but that will come at the cost of grandparents...its a tough choice for sure.

 

The one regret that both my, now adult, sons have independently mentioned is that their childhood was isolated from extended family. Both partnered with girls from very close extended family groups and both found that odd yet sometimes comforting in a way. They're both very  independent and have a good relationship with our extended family but not "in your pocket" close. I think both would prefer something between their partners mob which can occasionally be stifling and our mob which are more distant but there when they need us.   

As a grandparent you have to have a different view of grandparenting when your grandkids are on the other side of the world - personally I survive with the out of sight out of mind approach. I talk to them regularly on Skype but that's not very satisfying for any of us, we  do it though and we quite like the long visits but I'm very envious of my peers who have their grandkids over all the time, do the odd baby sitting, go on trips, do grandparents day at school etc. Some of us cope ok and I suppose given my independent steak I was always going to cope better than others who are desperate for enmeshment so I guess it will depend on how well your folks cope. If there are other grandkids it's easier to be out of sight /mind.

[ramot]

10 hours ago, wattsy1982 said:

Hi @Entity just came across your post and can kind of relate.

We moved back to the UK last year after 5 years in Australia. I can now see that my main reason for moving back was for my parents and the guilt of them not seeing my kids grow up and the kids not being round them either....i wasn't thinking what was best for then or us as a family of 5. I can now see that aus is probably the 'best' option for us but that will come at the cost of grandparents...its a tough choice for sure.

 

Speaking as a grandmother to two grandsons age 9 & 11 who I have never lived near to as they are in UK while we live in Australia,    Like another poster we accept and cope with the situation. We are the ones who unusually chose not to live in UK near our children when my husband retired, we hadn’t lived in UK for 10 years as expats and weren’t ready to move back, came here to experience another country for a few years, 15 years ago and no intention of leaving. Two of our grown up children followed us here, leaving son and grandchildren in UK. So many of our friends are like us with family scattered that it’s really the norm for us.

We do go to UK most years for about 3 months so spend plenty of time with our grandchildren even if a bit condensed, and all go away together for a week while there, but to be honest our children never saw their grandparents much as we never lived close, so probably about 3/4 times a year for the odd weekend. We face time fairly often, luckily our two chat away non stop, just as if we are in the room with them, we have a laugh, love hearing all their news, and we keep the odd silly joke to tell them to make them cringe! We alsoarrange our son to give them a treat every now and then specially from us. Of course it’s not the same as living with them, but it sure beats the ‘old days’ when a letter or tel call was the choice. We make the best of living apart but feeling as close as possible.

[Toots]

4 hours ago, Quoll said:

The one regret that both my, now adult, sons have independently mentioned is that their childhood was isolated from extended family. Both partnered with girls from very close extended family groups and both found that odd yet sometimes comforting in a way. They're both very  independent and have a good relationship with our extended family but not "in your pocket" close. I think both would prefer something between their partners mob which can occasionally be stifling and our mob which are more distant but there when they need us.   

As a grandparent you have to have a different view of grandparenting when your grandkids are on the other side of the world - personally I survive with the out of sight out of mind approach. I talk to them regularly on Skype but that's not very satisfying for any of us, we  do it though and we quite like the long visits but I'm very envious of my peers who have their grandkids over all the time, do the odd baby sitting, go on trips, do grandparents day at school etc. Some of us cope ok and I suppose given my independent steak I was always going to cope better than others who are desperate for enmeshment so I guess it will depend on how well your folks cope. If there are other grandkids it's easier to be out of sight /mind.

I have to say my two sons never mention not having extended family around when they were growing up.  It could be that they did see their only grandparent (in Scotland) for quite extended periods every year.  I think also could be because our good friends were called 'auntie' and 'uncle' so they had a sort of pretend extended family around and they were very good friends (still are) with the children of said aunties and uncles.  We don't have grandchildren yet and I have no idea where our two lads will end up living.  Could be here or it could be overseas.  I guess we will cope fine if they do settle overseas just like my Mum had to.

[ali]

2 hours ago, Toots said:

I have to say my two sons never mention not having extended family around when they were growing up.  It could be that they did see their only grandparent (in Scotland) for quite extended periods every year.  I think also could be because our good friends were called 'auntie' and 'uncle' so they had a sort of pretend extended family around and they were very good friends (still are) with the children of said aunties and uncles.  We don't have grandchildren yet and I have no idea where our two lads will end up living.  Could be here or it could be overseas.  I guess we will cope fine if they do settle overseas just like my Mum had to.

We spent very little time with extended family other than seeing my dad regularly.  We lived in the same town as my husbands family.  We've had nieces and nephews stay when they've started their WHV's but for my two they've said it's like having friends children visiting rather than family.  They've never mentioned wishing they were closer to their cousins.

[Toots]

24 minutes ago, ali said:

We spent very little time with extended family other than seeing my dad regularly.  We lived in the same town as my husbands family.  We've had nieces and nephews stay when they've started their WHV's but for my two they've said it's like having friends children visiting rather than family.  They've never mentioned wishing they were closer to their cousins.

We are a very small family so my two sons only had 2 cousins anyway.  My sister never wanted to have children and neither did my OH's sister.  My brother's son and daughter were born and brought up in Thailand and are a bit younger than my sons but as they grew older they became closer and they visited each other often over the years.  Since my brother died his son is now in Queenstown NZ and his daughter is in Edinburgh.   My sons are in Ireland and the US so all distant from each other.  I can understand some families are very close - living practically in the same town and even in the same street.  My family has never been like that.  What you don't have you don't miss.

[Quoll]

40 minutes ago, Toots said:

We are a very small family so my two sons only had 2 cousins anyway.  My sister never wanted to have children and neither did my OH's sister.  My brother's son and daughter were born and brought up in Thailand and are a bit younger than my sons but as they grew older they became closer and they visited each other often over the years.  Since my brother died his son is now in Queenstown NZ and his daughter is in Edinburgh.   My sons are in Ireland and the US so all distant from each other.  I can understand some families are very close - living practically in the same town and even in the same street.  My family has never been like that.  What you don't have you don't miss.

I think that's the point - my lads didn't miss it until they saw that others have different family experiences and now that they see how different it is when you do have that closer extended family they're rather envious. It didn't occur to me that they might have wanted more connection when they were younger - it wasn't as if they never had a connection at all, we worked hard to foster that with visits etc but it was something that obviously resonated with them once they saw how "close" some families are. Mind you, it's made them both very independent which is probably no bad thing.

[starlight7]

I guess a lot depends on your family- sometimes far is better than near!  We found we had a better and happier relationship long distance than we ever had when we lived in the UK.  Much better. Then we created our own extended family with children, children's children etc, too many to count now and it all worked out well for us. As with all good things, it takes time.