JJJB Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 There is some confusion about debt. Government Debt was pretty stable until 2008 when it suddenly from under $100bn to $430bn in 2013 (now stands at $21,000 per head of population). The link below is a good guide to what is roughly happening. http://www.australiandebtclock.com.au The real news is that Total Australian Debt is close to $4.8 trillion at present, up from about $1.5 trillion in the early noughties, that equates to $212,0000 per head of population. Politics aside, all debt needs to be reigned in, we deal with it now in a sensible manner or just weight until the bubble bursts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul1Perth Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 Mining has added huge amounts of cash to Australia. The cash freebies di nothing. The average bogan went and bought a new flat screen made in Japan and the rest pumped into shares / super. There is no evidence it added anything. If it had, then economies all over the world would copy. The mining tax in its origina form would have killed dozens of otherwise profitable mines. The average public has no concept of the economics of mining. Very few mining companies ever make much money. When they do, the NPV calculations are much worse than almost any other industry - the avergae mine starts at a 10 year mine life. It will though have taken an average of 10 years to find the deposit at a spend of millions per year - my current exploration budget for my very small project in Africa (a lot cheaper to explore than Australia) is $10 mill per year. The project started in 2006. If we are lucky, we might be in a position to cnstruct in 3 years. Then, it is one of only a couple of industies that has very little say in how much it sells its goods for. The vast majority of metals are sold by traders on the LME. As a result, we could open a mine and the spot price the next day be below the cost of production and we go belly up. No shortage of that happens. The tax would not though have just killed mining. It would have made a huge number of other industries very nervous about investing in Australia. There was still a huge amount of damage done. During the period prior to introduction i worked for one of the largest miners and our external consultants would advise regularly on every country we operated in. During that period Australia was ranked 2nd lowest in the world - even the DRC was higher. That did a huge amount of damage to Australia nobody even realises Maybe they didn't have the guts? Wouldn't have been any good them sitting on their hands for a few months and saying we'll wait and see what it does for Aus, they would have missed the opportunity, which they did. If you just take the outcome, which was no recession, how can you say the stimulus didn't work? btw you just put me in the average bogan bracket as that is exactly where our handout went, flat screen TV. Heard on the news this morning a bit more about the plans for the budget. Jeff Kennett on his high horse too. It's OK for him he's had his day and has nothing to lose. Surprised to hear an economist say that the money that was made was put back in in 8 consecutive personal tax cuts. He said first time it's happened and it will never happen again. Maybe people just have short memories and forget the good times and what happened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flag of convenience Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 There is some confusion about debt. Government Debt was pretty stable until 2008 when it suddenly from under $100bn to $430bn in 2013 (now stands at $21,000 per head of population). The link below is a good guide to what is roughly happening. http://www.australiandebtclock.com.au The real news is that Total Australian Debt is close to $4.8 trillion at present, up from about $1.5 trillion in the early noughties, that equates to $212,0000 per head of population. Politics aside, all debt needs to be reigned in, we deal with it now in a sensible manner or just weight until the bubble bursts. IMF expects Australia's gross debt to peak at 32% of GDP in 2015. That is among the lowest in any advanced country. While the debt certainly did grow under ALP due to the world financial crisis as well as some wastage definitely, you will be pleased to note Australia's all important net debt is the second lowest of the advanced world. Put out net debt beside Portugal, Eire, UK, USA for example to see how much better shape we are in. The growth of spending needs to be curtailed though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 IMF expects Australia's gross debt to peak at 32% of GDP in 2015. That is among the lowest in any advanced country. While the debt certainly did grow under ALP due to the world financial crisis as well as some wastage definitely, you will be pleased to note Australia's all important net debt is the second lowest of the advanced world. Put out net debt beside Portugal, Eire, UK, USA for example to see how much better shape we are in. The growth of spending needs to be curtailed though. That's weird, I have been lead to believe we are in a "debt crisis". Surely i should be able to believe all i'm told/read? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobj Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 Seems like a very simplistic thought process, everything is black and white to you lot isn't it. And why not? Cheers, Bobj. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petals Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 That's weird, I have been lead to believe we are in a "debt crisis". Surely i should be able to believe all i'm told/read? It must be true if its in the Murdoch press surely! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasepom Posted May 1, 2014 Author Share Posted May 1, 2014 The govt should look on how other countries are managing their debt. If they put us in a confidence crisis then we will be in trouble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul1Perth Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 The govt should look on how other countries are managing their debt. If they put us in a confidence crisis then we will be in trouble. They aren't they are just ignoring it hoping it will go away. Or, as the Americans say, kicking the can down the road. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flag of convenience Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 It must be true if its in the Murdoch press surely! Surely without doubt. That nice Mr Hockey confirmed it to be so. To any with lingering doubts dispel them. Don't worry though your government is here to help. We'll somehow weather this together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flag of convenience Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 They aren't they are just ignoring it hoping it will go away. Or, as the Americans say, kicking the can down the road. Tread water as much as possible then mow down the rest still standing after the next election. Keep the powder dry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flag of convenience Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 And why not? Cheers, Bobj. I guess adding a little colour to life Bob can be all that more illuminating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Echidna66 Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 I guess adding a little colour to life Bob can be all that more illuminating. Tony abbot is a slimy piece of **** alright and will destroy Australia and its people as planned.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dave53 Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 At least the migrants amongst us here have the options of jumping on a plane and returning to wherever we came from if all goes belly up .. Dave C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parley Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 Yes its true. Australia is doomed. Hurry, get out while you still can! Hurry get back to England. Australia is going to explode. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starlight7 Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 Tony Abbott, bad though he may be, is better than the alternative who couldn't manage their way out of a paper bag. That twit Bill they have got as a leader is pathetic. The once proud Labour party has had a succession of dire and incompetent leaders -very sad because they used to be a fantastic party. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobj Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 I guess adding a little colour to life Bob can be all that more illuminating. That's nice.:yes: Cheers, Bobj. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flybyknight Posted May 2, 2014 Share Posted May 2, 2014 the scariest thing I've noticed about this government is the integration and control of the mainstream media. a couple of hundred people protested the last government and it made the press. In march 2014 around 50,000 people marched through Melbourne, with numerous other peaceful protests around Australia. however they were not covered in the mainstream press. coincidence? how can there be true democratic process when the public have no unifying voice? nipped in the bud! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Echidna66 Posted May 2, 2014 Share Posted May 2, 2014 There is some confusion about debt. Government Debt was pretty stable until 2008 when it suddenly from under $100bn to $430bn in 2013 (now stands at $21,000 per head of population). The link below is a good guide to what is roughly happening. http://www.australiandebtclock.com.au The real news is that Total Australian Debt is close to $4.8 trillion at present, up from about $1.5 trillion in the early noughties, that equates to $212,0000 per head of population. Politics aside, all debt needs to be reigned in, we deal with it now in a sensible manner or just weight until the bubble bursts. Another one for a blue rinse..Bahaa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Echidna66 Posted May 2, 2014 Share Posted May 2, 2014 Maybe I got that wrong..Is blue rinse used as a sheep dip? Bahaa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flag of convenience Posted May 2, 2014 Share Posted May 2, 2014 Tony Abbott, bad though he may be, is better than the alternative who couldn't manage their way out of a paper bag. That twit Bill they have got as a leader is pathetic. The once proud Labour party has had a succession of dire and incompetent leaders -very sad because they used to be a fantastic party. There is no excuse for where Abbott and his crony corporates have install for this country if allowed the chance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambethlad Posted May 5, 2014 Share Posted May 5, 2014 Abbott is a pathetic fear monger nutter. He wants us to believe Oz is an economic basket case. Truth is our net government debt as a percentage of GDP is 11%. The UK is 87% and the USA is 82%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marisawright Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 I heard Tony Abbots comments on the radio that the previous Labor govt has left the begind a financialmess. What ?? Hangon a minute. Hang on a minute, indeed. The new regulations mean that full details of the government budget was available to the Coalition before election day. So if it's in a mess now, it was in a mess then - why didn't they tell us all this at the time? That means they knew they couldn't keep any of the promises they were making. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasepom Posted May 6, 2014 Author Share Posted May 6, 2014 Abbott is a pathetic fear monger nutter. He wants us to believe Oz is an economic basket case. Truth is our net government debt as a percentage of GDP is 11%. The UK is 87% and the USA is 82%. That was exactly my point the govt is employing scare tactics so they can introduce new taxes. Even the soft Aussie media are picking up on this. Fact is Australia is still a comparatively low debt nation. Theres nothing to fear except the govt. if they carry on we will be scarred into spending and they will put Australia into recession. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bibbs Posted May 6, 2014 Share Posted May 6, 2014 (edited) Abbott is a pathetic fear monger nutter. He wants us to believe Oz is an economic basket case. Truth is our net government debt as a percentage of GDP is 11%. The UK is 87% and the USA is 82%. The problem is our main money earner industry is being over taxed, and can (and is) moving to cheaper locations. Our GDP can very easily drop. The UK with population ~70million, and the US at ~300million, have better scope for making money than us. We are a tiny country, we should trying to be as debt free as possible. Where the large populations can have a wide spread of industries, we don't. We are killing off the golden egg laying goose. Borrowing to invest is fine, borrowing to just give it away isn't. And with all this belt tightening I've seen no reduction in services. So I'd suggest they were not actually needed in the first place. The only issue I've personally got, is they are not cutting enough. I believe government should be for the basic infrastructure, that's it. Edited May 6, 2014 by Bibbs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasepom Posted May 6, 2014 Author Share Posted May 6, 2014 We've borrowed in the past when we've needed it. Doesn't mean we have to pay it off ASAP. Need to balance the needs of the tax payer against the needs of the budget. Because we are a small nation we have to preserve consumer confidence. The Australlan people HAVE to feel they have money to spend otherwise the economy will shrink putting jobs at risk. It's a balancing act but the govt is starting to make waves which could cause families to make cut backs fearing future problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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