Poor poor Tories you couldn't make it up!!

[Perthbum]

What does that post have to do with how long you have worked on building sites for? What does it matter to you if I have a life outside off PIO? Sorry my life isn't as exciting and adventurous as yours. I have often dreamed of living in a world like yours, then I wake up and realise its just a dream.

 

so how long have you worked on building sites for?

Do you get out? Go camping fishing cycling fell walking canoeing with your kids? try it....you might justlive the dream one day in this country than keep moaning about the weather and the country in general.

[wakeboard1980]

I've only been on this site for 5 weeks and I've had at least 4-5 people come to me at the gates asking If there's work and I go to the gate twice a day to go to lunch. I guess they're all talking crap and are all in 50k plus jobs

 

I wish I was in a 50k job, the missus would love that. Did you look at those people's cvs? We're they all sparkys? Just because people come knocking on the site gate lest mean they can do or are qualified for the job. I know tat because the guys that re send by agency's are a gamble until you put them to work and see hat they can do compared to hat they c,aim they can do.

[wakeboard1980]

Do you get out? Go camping fishing cycling fell walking canoeing with your kids? try it....you might justlive the dream one day in this country than keep moaning about the weather and the country in general.

 

I don't have kids, I have 1 child. She is a bit young to do most things you have written there, but yes when she gets older i will get out and about with her. I don't moan about he weather and country in general. Yes the rather is shite at the moment, I'm not the Bly one saying tat, and what do I moan about when it comes to the 'country in general'? My glass is half full remember?

 

you forgot to answer the question in the post, how long have you worked on construction sites for?

[Skyba]

Is it that bad?

 

And I do read what you say, you just need to remember what you say. I'd be talking to your boss once you are fully qualified and be asking for a pay rise. You can't expect one at he moment because you aren't qualified, I don't think anyone would pay you sparky rates.

 

 

Hes not my boss as such as I'm a subby and I will get a pay rise when my NVQ comes that's already been discussed but I'm still on around £1.50-£2 less an hour than I should be.

 

And it is that bad, capitalism is driven by having an army of unemployed to feed the companies with low paid labour, this is exactly what is happening. Sparks I'm working with have seen their pay drop in the last 3 years from an average of Round £17-20 p/hr down to £13 p/hr, that's a huge drop caused by the job market being flooded and companies taking advantage of it.

 

Capitalism thrives when people are desperate

[wakeboard1980]

Hes not my boss as such as I'm a subby and I will get a pay rise when my NVQ comes that's already been discussed but I'm still on around £1.50-£2 less an hour than I should be.

 

And it is that bad, capitalism is driven by having an army of unemployed to feed the companies with low paid labour, this is exactly what is happening. Sparks I'm working with have seen their pay drop in the last 3 years from an average of Round £17-20 p/hr down to £13 p/hr, that's a huge drop caused by the job market being flooded and companies taking advantage of it.

 

Capitalism thrives when people are desperate

 

its more than just the company's you work for taking advantage if it. It's company's 'buying' jobs. But you know what? That's what happens hen there is a recession, happens everywhere.

[Skyba]

Oh I know exactly who it is behind the prices going down, the big wigs such as Carrillion Who buy the jobs and use the companies against each other, thing is its always the working man who pays for it in the end, the big wigs still pocket bigger and bigger pay cheques each year while our wages go down

[MARYROSE02]

Who exactly is 'the working man" and how can I recognize him? Does he wear a cloth cap, donkey jacket with pvc patch on the shoulder and 'Brims' or 'Macalpine' on the back, smoke rollups, or at best 'Woodbines,', keeps whippets and pigeons, and reads The Daily Mirror?

[wakeboard1980]

Oh I know exactly who it is behind the prices going down, the big wigs such as Carrillion Who buy the jobs and use the companies against each other, thing is its always the working man who pays for it in the end, the big wigs still pocket bigger and bigger pay cheques each year while our wages go down

 

The margins aren't what the used to be either. The developers that have the cash know they ill get jobs done for a great price because of the recession. You are right, wages have gone own, but its people like you who are doing jobs that they aren't qualified that don't help the situation either. And yes there will be people to fill your shoes if you weren't there but to have guys not qualified doing he job you are doing is not right either.

Edited March 29, 2013 by wakeboard1980

[Skyba]

The margins aren't what the used to be either. The developers that have the cash know they ill get jobs done for a great price because of the recession. You are right, wages have gone own, but its people like you who are doing jobs that they aren't qualified that don't help the intubation either. And yes there will be people to fill your shoes if you weren't there but to have guys not qualified doing he job you are doing is not right either.

 

I am qualified, they weren't looking for electricians they wanted mates/improvers because its only at set out stage, also they knew that I would be qualified in a number of weeks, usually I would turn down a job paying this poorly as it only adds to the problem. Thing is I have bills to pay like anyone else, as I said before, capitalism strives on desperation, I had a choice, take the poorly paid job and live or don't and see my benefits cut anyway because they are dismantling the welfare system!! Right wing supporters just don't know what they want, call anyone who isn't in work a scrounger then begrudge the ones who take whatever they can get lol.

 

i am a qualified electrician, I have a letter explaining the cock up from the college and that my folder has been passed its jus waiting for the Certs to be ordered and technical discussion completed, I am more clued up than some sparks who I have met who have had their ticket for a while also.

[Skyba]

Who exactly is 'the working man" and how can I recognize him? Does he wear a cloth cap, donkey jacket with pvc patch on the shoulder and 'Brims' or 'Macalpine' on the back, smoke rollups, or at best 'Woodbines,', keeps whippets and pigeons, and reads The Daily Mirror?

 

Why do you pop up with your ridiculous and pointless comments, you've added nothing to this discussion other than an extremist view with no real points made

[StevieF8]

A report doesn't constitute as proof you know!! Just be wise someone writes a long story about it it doesn't make it true, what is proof is the results of two elections which I have pointed out to you.

 

i stated that migration wouldn't have a notable effect on voting, meaning that it wouldn't decide a GENERAL election one way or another. In this country migrant tend to live in certain areas, this will cluster their vote meaning they will effect a certain constituency, I don't know if you know this butnelections are won by seats not individual votes. Bradford bielection proves that a cluster of votes in an area CAN effect 1 seat IF there is a cluster of migrant votes, this still doesn't effect the outcome of a general election as a whole though.

 

The London mayoral election also proves that migrant votes don't always favour labour, London has more migrants in it that white British citizens yet borris Johnson won the election.

 

That is ACTUAL proof, not a report written by someone in a new room who has a bias toward one party or another!!

 

there is no point in debating if everytime someone points out a FACT you just state that its rubbish because it doesn't like up with your belief, you have to give a valid reason why, percentages are up for misinterpretation, and even when you get the numbers to have to analyse them properly to determine their ACTUAL effect. Try using your own mind to make a decision on what is actually happening rather than google!!!

 

 

No you're right, for once, a report doesn't constitute proof, but what it does show is that some one has done an investigation or some research and they have posted their findings

 

They may have misinterpreted the numbers, but it at least gives us a starting point to go from

 

You come from the PB school of facts and figures, just make it up as you go along and convince yourself you're right, then try and convince others

 

I have never studied voter demographics, so I do a bit of research before posting, I often find facts help to prove a point, but if you just want to say 'immigrant voters have no impact on an election outcome' then you must be right...after all you clearly know more than researchers and academics and in which case, you're wasted as a spark

 

Still waiting for that proof btw....just post a link to one website that backs your argument, even if you got it off the Sunday Sport....something that shows your train of thought, if what you're saying is correct it shouldn't be hard to do.

[MARYROSE02]

Why do you pop up with your ridiculous and pointless comments, you've added nothing to this discussion other than an extremist view with no real points made

 

The pot calls the kettle black, or in my case 'blue!' All you ever say on your posts is the same old rant about how much you hate the Tories. Talk about saying the same thing once then repeating it a thousand times. I hate the Tories, I hate the Tories, I HATE the Tories, ad nauseam.

 

My father was a 'real' 'working man' when I come to think of it, family of ten, raised in the Depression years of the 1930's, enlisted in 1939 and did not get out until 1946. How did he feel about the Labour Party? He LOATHED them for their failure to, borrowing a term from the First World War, to provide him with a 'land fit for heroes.' Of course he did betray his proletarian roots by refusing to join a union, buying his own house, and never taking a day on the dole. His reward from a grateful government when he was sick and needed round the clock care? We'll take your house and assets to pay for that, thanks very much.

[Skyba]

No you're right, for once, a report doesn't constitute proof, but what it does show is that some one has done an investigation or some research and they have posted their findings

 

They may have misinterpreted the numbers, but it at least gives us a starting point to go from

 

You come from the PB school of facts and figures, just make it up as you go along and convince yourself you're right, then try and convince others

 

I have never studied voter demographics, so I do a bit of research before posting, I often find facts help to prove a point, but if you just want to say 'immigrant voters have no impact on an election outcome' then you must be right...after all you clearly know more than researchers and academics and in which case, you're wasted as a spark

 

Still waiting for that proof btw....just post a link to one website that backs your argument, even if you got it off the Sunday Sport....something that shows your train of thought, if what you're saying is correct it shouldn't be hard to do.

 

 

Once again claiming that because you've said it its the only thing that makes sense! Do I really need to post a link to let you know that London has a minority of white British citizens, that boris Johnson won the mayoral election, Bradford is a migrant town and that their vote got George Galloway in and that one town only gives.1 seat??

 

You don't need to post links to papers on things that are there for all to see unless you have no real knowledge of what you're talking about on a day to day level and just google everything in the hope that it's correct.

[StevieF8]

God you are boring....have you a life outside of PIO.

 

Is this your new approach?

 

Usually you post rubbish, have it disproved in about 5 seconds and you just start a new thread, now you have taken to accusing people of being boring because they are on the very same website as you....with your 500 posts a month, every month for past 2 years.

[StevieF8]

Once again claiming that because you've said it its the only thing that makes sense! Do I really need to post a link to let you know that London has a minority of white British citizens, that boris Johnson won the mayoral election, Bradford is a migrant town and that their vote got George Galloway in and that one town only gives.1 seat??

 

You don't need to post links to papers on things that are there for all to see unless you have no real knowledge of what you're talking about on a day to day level and just google everything in the hope that it's correct.

 

 

So the answer is no.

 

You can't back up anything you've said.

 

Well as long as you have convinced yourself you're right, that's all that matters.

[Skyba]

The pot calls the kettle black, or in my case 'blue!' All you ever say on your posts is the same old rant about how much you hate the Tories. Talk about saying the same thing once then repeating it a thousand times. I hate the Tories, I hate the Tories, I HATE the Tories, ad nauseam.

 

My father was a 'real' 'working man' when I come to think of it, family of ten, raised in the Depression years of the 1930's, enlisted in 1939 and did not get out until 1946. How did he feel about the Labour Party? He LOATHED them for their failure to, borrowing a term from the First World War, to provide him with a 'land fit for heroes.' Of course he did betray his proletarian roots by refusing to join a union, buying his own house, and never taking a day on the dole. His reward from a grateful government when he was sick and needed round the clock care? We'll take your house and assets to pay for that, thanks very much.

 

 

You haven't read anything have you, you jus see opposition to Tory views and claim its all because I hate them lol. My grandparents were real working class, were enlisted etc, they bought their own house all but they didn't let the fact that they get on let them forget where they came from. And the fact you feel the need to mention the dole just shows your right wing blind view where you feel claiming a benefit defines you.

[Skyba]

So the answer is no.

 

You can't back up anything you've said.

 

Well as long as you have convinced yourself you're right, that's all that matters.

 

 

You honestly want me to post links for those actual facts I've stated, I'm sorry but if you don't know these things why are you making out you know about politics, these are things that have made massive headline news in the last 12 months

[Skyba]

George Galloway winning migrant votes

http://m.guardian.co.uk/politics/2012/mar/30/george-galloway-bradford-west-byelection

 

London being minority white British

http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21511904

 

Johnson wins mayoral election

http://m.guardian.co.uk/politics/blog/2012/may/04/boris-ken-london-mayor-election-result

 

Rules of the British voting system

http://www.parliament.uk/about/how/elections-and-voting/voting-systems/

 

now if you use your brain and not google to analyse this yourself and not use someone else's you can work out exactly what my point is, if you can't do that then you have no hope

 

 

Now do us a favour and stop using google to make out you know what you're on about because you obviously don't if this is all new to you

Edited March 29, 2013 by Skyba

[Johndoe]

 

you forgot to answer the question in the post, how long have you worked on construction sites for?

 

Probably for the same time as he worked as a fireman and the jobs he did probably numbered the amount of kid's lives he saved.

[StevieF8]

George Galloway winning migrant votes

http://m.guardian.co.uk/politics/2012/mar/30/george-galloway-bradford-west-byelection

 

London being minority white British

http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21511904

 

Johnson wins mayoral election

http://m.guardian.co.uk/politics/blog/2012/may/04/boris-ken-london-mayor-election-result

 

Rules of the British voting system

http://www.parliament.uk/about/how/elections-and-voting/voting-systems/

 

now if you use your brain and not google to analyse this yourself and not use someone else's you can work out exactly what my point is, if you can't do that then you have no hope

 

 

Now do us a favour and stop using google to make out you know what you're on about because you obviously don't if this is all new to you

 

 

 

You stated that letting migrants in would sway the vote toward labour

 

 

Labour admitted they did it

 

 

Labour admitted they got it wrong

 

 

You continue to deny it, this is a act of pure desperation

 

 

No-one is asking you to change who you vote for, but when your own party admits they were wrong, I fail to see what you are trying to achieve by continually denying it

 

 

 

 

 

 

Also, I don't keep records of UK voters at my house, so I've checked them out, why are people like you so afraid of someone doing a bit of research to back up what they say.....

[Skyba]

Labour admitted they did it

 

 

Labour admitted they got it wrong

 

 

You continue to deny it, this is a act of pure desperation

 

 

No-one is asking you to change who you vote for, but when your own party admits they were wrong, I fail to see what you are trying to achieve by continually denying it

 

 

 

 

 

 

Also, I don't keep records of UK voters at my house, so I've checked them out, why are people like you so afraid of someone doing a bit of research to back up what they say.....

 

 

Read back again!!! I also said that they got their immigration policy wrong, the despute is about the effect it had on voting, every time it's put in front of you you try and deflect attention.

 

you keep mentioning that labour admitted letting people in to change the voting yet I've seen no evidence which you pride yourself on bit hypocritical

Edited March 29, 2013 by Skyba

[MARYROSE02]

You haven't read anything have you, you jus see opposition to Tory views and claim its all because I hate them lol. My grandparents were real working class, were enlisted etc, they bought their own house all but they didn't let the fact that they get on let them forget where they came from. And the fact you feel the need to mention the dole just shows your right wing blind view where you feel claiming a benefit defines you.

 

Why not when I am not eligible for the dole in Australia because I made the foolish 'mistake' of saving my money rather than pouring it into beer, smokes, pokies and Ladbrokes. Now, out of work for four months and counting, I will get not a penny from the Australian Government (ALP the friend of the 'Working Man' remember) until I get rid of my assets, ie, spend them on beer, smokes, pokies and TAB, and then they MAY just offer me some help. But pay for an Indonesian people smuggler to ship me to Xmas Island, throwing away all my ID papers, pretending to be a refugee, no problem. Just how much would you like?

[Skyba]

Why not when I am not eligible for the dole in Australia because I made the foolish 'mistake' of saving my money rather than pouring it into beer, smokes, pokies and Ladbrokes. Now, out of work for four months and counting, I will get not a penny from the Australian Government (ALP the friend of the 'Working Man' remember) until I get rid of my assets, ie, spend them on beer, smokes, pokies and TAB, and then they MAY just offer me some help. But pay for an Indonesian people smuggler to ship me to Xmas Island, throwing away all my ID papers, pretending to be a refugee, no problem. Just how much would you like?

 

 

Wtf are you banging on about!!

 

if you're talking about what you think labour voters do you are the typical brain washed right the !! I neither smoke, drink and I out £10 in a William hill account and have £1 accumulators on the footy. I am self employed and last time I was out of work I had to spend ALL of my savings before I could get any help, my parents had some savings until my dad fell Ill and he was told he wasn't allowed anything as he was "fit to work" even though drs surgeons and a court of law all say he's not

Edited March 29, 2013 by Skyba

[StevieF8]

WHAT ARE THE ELECTORAL ADVANTAGES OF IMMIGRATION FOR LABOUR?

 

 

The migrants' desire to get into Britain is only half the story of why so many are here. The other half is the explanation of why the Government decided to let so many migrants into Britain. For the past 12 years, Labour has been convinced that allowing high levels of immigration should be a policy priority, and it has taken steps to ensure that it is relatively easy for migrants to get permanent, legally recognised residence here. Why has Labour done that?

 

 

In 1997, Tony Blair and his Cabinet had several reasons for wishing to increase the number of immigrants into Britain. One was that they perceived an electoral advantage. The outcome of elections in an increasing number of constituencies was, and is, dictated in large part by the votes from relatively recent immigrants. People who have moved here from, say, the Indian subcontinent understandably hated the rules that prevented their families joining them in Britain.

 

 

The most onerous of those rules was known as "the primary purpose rule", which was imposed by the Conservatives in 1993. It required that someone wishing to follow his or her spouse into Britain to prove that "the marriage was not entered into primarily to obtain admission to the UK". Proving a negative, as the rule obliged the candidate to do, was extremely difficult, and large numbers of spouses were refused entry into Britain as a result.

 

 

Labour abolished that rule soon after the election in 1997. The move was extremely popular in immigrant communities, because it made it far easier for families to move here. Immigration by spouses into Britain has increased by 50 per cent since the primary purpose rule was abolished. More than 40,000 people were granted citizenship here on the basis of marriage in 2008 alone.

 

 

Unless your not comfortable with my 'proof' and you just want me to come out with some unfounded statements.....

Edited March 29, 2013 by StevieF8
Sp.

[Skyba]

Anyway it's Good Friday and I'm going to enjoy my day off.

 

good bye