Teacher Accreditation advice, please?

[Sammy1]

Easily the best piece of advice I've had so far on this forum.

 

Having waded through the threats of doom and the fear peddling, the only thing that concerns me about rural or regional living is the prospects for my own children. The whole idea of moving to Australia is to improve our standard of living and to increase opportunities for the kids; certainly can't do either of those things if we're stuck out in the back of beyond!

 

 

I'm just not sure if you're aware how dogmatic this statement is. It's flawed in the extreme due to the blatant nature of the generalisation it contains. So no one from the UK has any concept of what the reality is of remote, rural and regional? How about you talk to the teacher who works on the Isle of Muck, I'm sure they could open your eyes a little to the realities of rural living, too.

 

I'm here for advice, research and evidence. In order to make a decision like this one, I need hard facts, statistics and evidence and I need to question anecdotal hearsay.

 

Here, for example, we find an academic piece with hard data that clearly shows the teacher 'surplus' in Australia is considerably more complicated than I've been led to believe:

 

http://www.onlineopinion.com.au/view.asp?article=16801

Many thanks!

 

 

 

Not dogmatic, simply true. Australian remote and rural is very different to anywhere else in the UK, including the 'Isle of Muck', wherever that may be I have lived in both rural and city locations across the UK and indeed across the world, so I do have more than a little basis to my statement.

 

Like I said before, good luck in achieving your goal. Determination always wins through, just make sure that you can satisfy AITSL.

Edited September 11, 2016 by Sammy1

[Nemesis]

Not dogmatic, simply true. Australian remote and rural is very different to anywhere else in the UK, including the 'Isle of Muck', wherever that may be I have lived in both rural and city locations across the UK and indeed across the world, so I do have more than a little basis to my statement.

 

Like I said before, good luck in achieving your goal. Determination always wins through, just make sure that you can satisfy AITSL.

 

Teaching and living in remote Australia can't be compared to anywhere else on earth, certainly not a Scottish Island.

 

Have to askwhether the OP has experience of living in remote Australia?

[Rossmoyne]

Teaching and living in remote Australia can't be compared to anywhere else on earth, certainly not a Scottish Island.

 

Have to askwhether the OP has experience of living in remote Australia?

 

Probably not I am guessing....

[Quoll]

Probably not I am guessing....

Yup, and we haven't even mentioned the flies!

[VERYSTORMY]

Easily the best piece of advice I've had so far on this forum.

 

Having waded through the threats of doom and the fear peddling, the only thing that concerns me about rural or regional living is the prospects for my own children. The whole idea of moving to Australia is to improve our standard of living and to increase opportunities for the kids; certainly can't do either of those things if we're stuck out in the back of beyond!

 

 

I'm just not sure if you're aware how dogmatic this statement is. It's flawed in the extreme due to the blatant nature of the generalisation it contains. So no one from the UK has any concept of what the reality is of remote, rural and regional? How about you talk to the teacher who works on the Isle of Muck, I'm sure they could open your eyes a little to the realities of rural living, too.

 

I'm here for advice, research and evidence. In order to make a decision like this one, I need hard facts, statistics and evidence and I need to question anecdotal hearsay.

 

Here, for example, we find an academic piece with hard data that clearly shows the teacher 'surplus' in Australia is considerably more complicated than I've been led to believe:

 

http://www.onlineopinion.com.au/view.asp?article=16801

Many thanks!

 

 

 

As mentioned, at the moment, it is all academic until you are capable of getting a visa.

 

.i do wonder if you read my post on living in regional areas?

 

It it is nothing like the UK. I have lived / worked in remote areas all over the world including some of the remotest places on the planet such as jungles of Congo, Chinese Siberia, the high Andes. Regional small towns in Australia would be as challenging as any of them.

[TeacherTom]

Not dogmatic, simply true. Australian remote and rural is very different to anywhere else in the UK, including the 'Isle of Muck', wherever that may be I have lived in both rural and city locations across the UK and indeed across the world, so I do have more than a little basis to my statement.

 

Like I said before, good luck in achieving your goal. Determination always wins through, just make sure that you can satisfy AITSL.

 

Not dogmatic, simply true. Australian remote and rural is very different to anywhere else in the UK, including the 'Isle of Muck', wherever that may be I have lived in both rural and city locations across the UK and indeed across the world, so I do have more than a little basis to my statement.

 

 

Like I said before, good luck in achieving your goal. Determination always wins through, just make sure that you can satisfy AITSL.

 

 

I'll put it in perspective for ya. 30 people live there. It's accessible by boat 3 days a week (if the sea conditions allow), it suffers extreme weather conditions most of the year and doesn't have a permanent electricity supply. Electric generally turns off around 11pm as the Islanders share the single generator that runs the island- no cars allowed. There are no shops and most islanders have 3 or 4 and often more jobs just to keep the community working. Maybe it's moved on since I was last there, but my guess is that you've never lived anywhere rural like this in the UK. My point is a simple one Sammy- everywhere has difficult conditions. I visited Mozambique many years ago- that was tough. There are areas of Africa that I saw that I'm pretty sure would make the worst rural areas of Australia seem like Harrogate. Let's be honest about our experiences and put them in perspective. This isn't a contest and you're not dealing with an infant. Thanks for making me aware of the difficulties working rural, I appreciate it very much, but it's starting to feel a little like you guys feel that the only tough place to work in the cosmos is rural Australia and in turn if you've not experienced that, then you're just 'not getting it'. This isn't really the issue and we've all got better things to be discussing. Yes, rural Australia is horrendous for some I'm sure. Some probably love it. Fair enough, let's move on.

 

 

What bothers me about 'big bad nasty frightening rural OZ' is how my children would benefit. The answer is, they wouldn't. So, in that sense, that's the end of it.

 

 

Now, determined I am. What you've successfully done is fire me up to the point where I'm now more determined than ever, and there isn't a better feeling than that of being vindicated, is there? Cant thank you all enough for that, that's for sure! If I get my family to Australia and land myself a job (even under the circumstances with which you describe) then I'll certainly have you all to thank in part for that.

 

 

Now, onto the more serious issues. I have two teaching friends in WA and a colleague in NSW who are currently working on my behalf to establish what a 'one year top up' may or may not look like. Any ideas there? Any suggestions? I think it may be worth getting in touch with training providers in Australia (HE providers and universities) and finding out what a one year top up would look like to them, credit wise etc. If you think that's of value, please let me know.

 

 

Many thanks again.

[Quoll]

You could try some of the UK universities - a quick google came up with some, I am sure there must be more

http://www.northampton.ac.uk/study/courses/graduate-teacher-programme-gtp-topup-pgce-award-primaryearly-yearssecondary-pgcert/

http://www.worc.ac.uk/courses/postgraduate-certificate-in-education-pgce-top-up.html

 

You would have to enquire if they met Australian requirements (the Aussies are hung up on supervised teaching practice hours which is generally part of the PGCE and how many hours of specific subject areas etc) but this would be a damn sight cheaper and quicker than trying to do it in Australia where you would be stung for international student fees for both you and your kids schooling, you and your dependents restricted to working 20 hpw and no guarantee that your occupation will be on the list at the end of it.

 

I think you've made your point, you don't like what people who have experienced difficult communities in Australia to tell you how bad they are, we get that. I think a teacher from Aurukun would probably fall on your neck and kiss the ground if offered a position on the Isle of Muck but there ya go, with your attitude I am sure you will be a great success in Australia. Go for your life as they say!

[TeacherTom]

Quoll, it's not personal. I'm not offended by what you or anyone else has said. I just need more help than 'rural is horrific, you don't know what you're talking about'. Say what you like, seriously, but be prepared for me to reply with evidence or an opinion in kind. That's how it works, surely? All's good!

 

I immediately clicked on the second link and that already looks awesome! I imagine that's precisely what they're after. I'll look into it further and it's excited me even more.

 

Ah, Aurukun are looking for a principal I think. I did some research on that town... NOT GOOD!

 

Aren't you up a little late/early, anyways?

[Nemesis]

Quoll, it's not personal. I'm not offended by what you or anyone else has said. I just need more help than 'rural is horrific, you don't know what you're talking about'. Say what you like, seriously, but be prepared for me to reply with evidence or an opinion in kind. That's how it works, surely? All's good!

 

I immediately clicked on the second link and that already looks awesome! I imagine that's precisely what they're after. I'll look into it further and it's excited me even more.

 

Ah, Aurukun are looking for a principal I think. I did some research on that town... NOT GOOD!

 

Aren't you up a little late/early, anyways?

 

I'll put it in perspective for ya. 30 people live there. It's accessible by boat 3 days a week (if the sea conditions allow), it suffers extreme weather conditions most of the year and doesn't have a permanent electricity supply. Electric generally turns off around 11pm as the Islanders share the single generator that runs the island- no cars allowed. There are no shops and most islanders have 3 or 4 and often more jobs just to keep the community working. Maybe it's moved on since I was last there, but my guess is that you've never lived anywhere rural like this in the UK. My point is a simple one Sammy- everywhere has difficult conditions. I visited Mozambique many years ago- that was tough. There are areas of Africa that I saw that I'm pretty sure would make the worst rural areas of Australia seem like Harrogate. Let's be honest about our experiences and put them in perspective. This isn't a contest and you're not dealing with an infant. Thanks for making me aware of the difficulties working rural, I appreciate it very much, but it's starting to feel a little like you guys feel that the only tough place to work in the cosmos is rural Australia and in turn if you've not experienced that, then you're just 'not getting it'. This isn't really the issue and we've all got better things to be discussing. Yes, rural Australia is horrendous for some I'm sure. Some probably love it. Fair enough, let's move on.

 

 

What bothers me about 'big bad nasty frightening rural OZ' is how my children would benefit. The answer is, they wouldn't. So, in that sense, that's the end of it.

 

 

Now, determined I am. What you've successfully done is fire me up to the point where I'm now more determined than ever, and there isn't a better feeling than that of being vindicated, is there? Cant thank you all enough for that, that's for sure! If I get my family to Australia and land myself a job (even under the circumstances with which you describe) then I'll certainly have you all to thank in part for that.

 

 

Now, onto the more serious issues. I have two teaching friends in WA and a colleague in NSW who are currently working on my behalf to establish what a 'one year top up' may or may not look like. Any ideas there? Any suggestions? I think it may be worth getting in touch with training providers in Australia (HE providers and universities) and finding out what a one year top up would look like to them, credit wise etc. If you think that's of value, please let me know.

 

 

Many thanks again.

 

Aurukun is fairly typical of a lot of remote Ozzie communities. Obviously every country has remote areas, but equally every country's remote areas have problems that are unique to that country. As a former resident of Harrogate I can tell you it is vastly different from remote Australia.So vastly different that comparison is pretty pointless.

[TeacherTom]

Aurukun is fairly typical of a lot of remote Ozzie communities. Obviously every country has remote areas, but equally every country's remote areas have problems that are unique to that country.

Yes. That's the point I was making. You can't beat me up with 'Australia is so hardzzcoreeee' and then not like it when I give an alternative example.

 

As a former resident of Harrogate I can tell you it is vastly different from remote Australia.So vastly different that comparison is pretty pointless.

 

I've been to 'remote' Australia and live 30 minutes up the road from Harrogate. Is there any chance you can provide something constructive, though? Like sharing your knowledge of which courses may be accepted as an 'extra year' without breaking the bank? Or impart wisdom on the conundrum of which state is more likely to give the best chance of actually getting a job when I arrive? Or how about considering the problems that arise when looking at a course at home vs a course in Australia?

 

Cheers.

[Quoll]

Quoll, it's not personal. I'm not offended by what you or anyone else has said. I just need more help than 'rural is horrific, you don't know what you're talking about'. Say what you like, seriously, but be prepared for me to reply with evidence or an opinion in kind. That's how it works, surely? All's good!

 

I immediately clicked on the second link and that already looks awesome! I imagine that's precisely what they're after. I'll look into it further and it's excited me even more.

 

Ah, Aurukun are looking for a principal I think. I did some research on that town... NOT GOOD!

 

Aren't you up a little late/early, anyways?

Look at the location! Mid afternoon here in Cambridge after a wonderful garden party with our fabulous neighbours but over 3 decades in Australia, most of that in education! You should be clear with the provider about the validity of their course for Australian registration purposes, they should know, if they are spruiking it as equivalence to PGCE (as I said, supervised teaching practice is usually the crunch point issue). Unless you are very well heeled (think $10k pa for each of your kids' schooling plus $10-15kpa for your course plus limited income, no benefits and the probability of having to return at the end of the course then I would say is a no brainer to seek the additional qualification in UK unless you can take a career break and live in savings for the year. An alternative might be an MEd in special Ed or something like that.

[E2306]

Hi Tom. Just wanted to let you know that all is not lost on the job front. We are a family of five who have secured a 189 visa based on me as a teacher...this is a skills based permanent visa. We are moving to Perth in a few weeks and I have secured a post. As for qualifications all I can tell you is my experience...you must have the four years whether it's a Bachelor in Ed or a degree with PGCE. You also need to provide evidence of 45 supervised teaching practice. It might be an idea to contact AITSL for advice on your situation. Unfortunately you will not get a visa without your skills assessment if you go this route. Feel free to PM me

[TeacherTom]

Look at the location! Mid afternoon here in Cambridge after a wonderful garden party with our fabulous neighbours but over 3 decades in Australia, most of that in education! You should be clear with the provider about the validity of their course for Australian registration purposes, they should know, if they are spruiking it as equivalence to PGCE (as I said, supervised teaching practice is usually the crunch point issue). Unless you are very well heeled (think $10k pa for each of your kids' schooling plus $10-15kpa for your course plus limited income, no benefits and the probability of having to return at the end of the course then I would say is a no brainer to seek the additional qualification in UK unless you can take a career break and live in savings for the year. An alternative might be an MEd in special Ed or something like that.

 

Ahhhh Cambridge! I assumed that there may have been a Cambridge in Australia- when I was there I had a ridiculous conversation with a taxi driver in Melbourne. I'd been out to meet a friend in the city and had caught a taxi home. As we started to talk, I asked him where he was from. 'Russia,' he replied. 'Where are you from?' he said. I told him I was from England.

'I know that!' he said.

'Well, I'm from Doncaster originally,' I said back to him. At which point he pointed out the window to a sign post that said Doncaster on it. Unbelievable!!

 

Ah, so.. tell me more about paying for my kids education over there. What's that about?

 

Cheers

Edited September 11, 2016 by TeacherTom

[TeacherTom]

Hi Tom. Just wanted to let you know that all is not lost on the job front. We are a family of five who have secured a 189 visa based on me as a teacher...this is a skills based permanent visa. We are moving to Perth in a few weeks and I have secured a post. As for qualifications all I can tell you is my experience...you must have the four years whether it's a Bachelor in Ed or a degree with PGCE. You also need to provide evidence of 45 supervised teaching practice. It might be an idea to contact AITSL for advice on your situation. Unfortunately you will not get a visa without your skills assessment if you go this route. Feel free to PM me

 

Superb news, E2306! Many thanks. I'll PM you when I've worked out how to do it....

 

As a side note, I've already been in touch with AITSL. Their response was legendary! They basically told me that they could offer no advice that would provide a positive outcome, or give a pre assessment service. I was asking if my qualifications were enough. Bah...

Edited September 11, 2016 by TeacherTom

[Beaty]

Hi Tom. Just wanted to let you know that all is not lost on the job front. We are a family of five who have secured a 189 visa based on me as a teacher...this is a skills based permanent visa. We are moving to Perth in a few weeks and I have secured a post. As for qualifications all I can tell you is my experience...you must have the four years whether it's a Bachelor in Ed or a degree with PGCE. You also need to provide evidence of 45 supervised teaching practice. It might be an idea to contact AITSL for advice on your situation. Unfortunately you will not get a visa without your skills assessment if you go this route. Feel free to PM me

 

Congratulations on the move and the post!

 

B

[Quoll]

Ahhhh Cambridge! I assumed that there may have been a Cambridge in Australia- when I was there I had a ridiculous conversation with a taxi driver in Melbourne. I'd been out to meet a friend in the city and had caught a taxi home. As we started to talk, I asked him where he was from. 'Russia,' he replied. 'Where are you from?' he said. I told him I was from England.

'I know that!' he said.

'Well, I'm from Doncaster originally,' I said back to him. At which point he pointed out the window to a sign post that said Doncaster on it. Unbelievable!!

 

Ah, so.. tell me more about paying for my kids education over there. What's that about?

 

Cheers

 

If you go as an International student - which is the visa you would have to use if you intended to study in Australia - then your children would also be charged International Student fees for their school education as your dependents and that can be around $10k pa per child. Student visas are not for the impoverished and they do expect you to leave once your course is over, it's be very risky with a family in tow. So, far more sensible to do any further education in UK.

 

I live just up the road from Melbourn as it happens!

[Nemesis]

Yes. That's the point I was making. You can't beat me up with 'Australia is so hardzzcoreeee' and then not like it when I give an alternative example.

 

 

 

I've been to 'remote' Australia and live 30 minutes up the road from Harrogate. Is there any chance you can provide something constructive, though? Like sharing your knowledge of which courses may be accepted as an 'extra year' without breaking the bank? Or impart wisdom on the conundrum of which state is more likely to give the best chance of actually getting a job when I arrive? Or how about considering the problems that arise when looking at a course at home vs a course in Australia?

 

Cheers.

No, I can't. If I could, I would. I know when I left Australia I had mates who were going back to univsity to do further study as they couldn't get jobs in primary school teaching. That was in Brisbane.

[Sammy1]

I'll put it in perspective for ya. 30 people live there. It's accessible by boat 3 days a week (if the sea conditions allow), it suffers extreme weather conditions most of the year and doesn't have a permanent electricity supply. Electric generally turns off around 11pm as the Islanders share the single generator that runs the island- no cars allowed. There are no shops and most islanders have 3 or 4 and often more jobs just to keep the community working. Maybe it's moved on since I was last there, but my guess is that you've never lived anywhere rural like this in the UK. My point is a simple one Sammy- everywhere has difficult conditions. I visited Mozambique many years ago- that was tough. There are areas of Africa that I saw that I'm pretty sure would make the worst rural areas of Australia seem like Harrogate. Let's be honest about our experiences and put them in perspective. This isn't a contest and you're not dealing with an infant. Thanks for making me aware of the difficulties working rural, I appreciate it very much, but it's starting to feel a little like you guys feel that the only tough place to work in the cosmos is rural Australia and in turn if you've not experienced that, then you're just 'not getting it'. This isn't really the issue and we've all got better things to be discussing. Yes, rural Australia is horrendous for some I'm sure. Some probably love it. Fair enough, let's move on.

 

 

What bothers me about 'big bad nasty frightening rural OZ' is how my children would benefit. The answer is, they wouldn't. So, in that sense, that's the end of it.

 

 

Now, determined I am. What you've successfully done is fire me up to the point where I'm now more determined than ever, and there isn't a better feeling than that of being vindicated, is there? Cant thank you all enough for that, that's for sure! If I get my family to Australia and land myself a job (even under the circumstances with which you describe) then I'll certainly have you all to thank in part for that.

 

 

Now, onto the more serious issues. I have two teaching friends in WA and a colleague in NSW who are currently working on my behalf to establish what a 'one year top up' may or may not look like. Any ideas there? Any suggestions? I think it may be worth getting in touch with training providers in Australia (HE providers and universities) and finding out what a one year top up would look like to them, credit wise etc. If you think that's of value, please let me know.

 

 

Many thanks again.

 

Still nothing compared to living remote here, which I did for five years in the middle of the outback. After that I spent seven years living regionally etc etc. Is that good enough for 'ya'?

 

I have lived and worked all over the world, so no need to be obnoxious about it, I really do know what I am talking about - you do not. It's lovely that you have 'visited' places, try living in them.

 

There is a surplus of primary teachers all over Australia. Two years ago, every single university in WA wrote to all of its primary ed students advising them to reconsider and switch to secondary teaching. The Department of Ed also retrained hundreds of primary teachers in secondary courses. Oh, but according to you, this is all in my imagination.

 

As for a top up year, they disappeared a few years ago for three year trained teachers. However, you do have other options, research very carefully which course AITSL might accept, a one year Masters for example in special needs. Just remember that student fees would be at an international rate for you, if you decided to study here, so be prepared to spend a lot of money. However, it seems you ask for advice but are not prepared to accept the reality. Just be prepared for the hard yards when you get here to get you to where you want to be.

 

 

You are welcome.

Edited September 12, 2016 by Sammy1

[Sammy1]

Hi Tom. Just wanted to let you know that all is not lost on the job front. We are a family of five who have secured a 189 visa based on me as a teacher...this is a skills based permanent visa. We are moving to Perth in a few weeks and I have secured a post. As for qualifications all I can tell you is my experience...you must have the four years whether it's a Bachelor in Ed or a degree with PGCE. You also need to provide evidence of 45 supervised teaching practice. It might be an idea to contact AITSL for advice on your situation. Unfortunately you will not get a visa without your skills assessment if you go this route. Feel free to PM me

 

From memory, I believe that you are a secondary teacher trained in a high need area, rather than primary trained?

 

Well done on your position

[TeacherTom]

Still nothing compared to living remote here, which I did for five years in the middle of the outback. I have lived and worked all over the world, so no need to be obnoxious about it, I really do know what I am talking about - you do not. It's lovely that you have 'visited' places, try living in them

A comment like this wouldn't wash with my year 6 students. It's riddled with assumption and generalisation. You also know nothing about the person with whom you're speaking, either. Beware in the future of making such vitriolic assumptions- they just make you look silly. Saying 'I know what I'm talking about- you do not' means absolutely nothing. I might as well say 'I can fly an aeroplane and you massage pineapples after shrove Tuesday'. It's just meaningless waffle and a bizarre, utterly dogmatic thing to say from someone who is meant to be providing advice.

 

After that I spent seven years living regionally etc etc. Is that good enough for 'ya'?

Well, not really, as I didn't ask for a synopsis of your CV or resume and find none of the above to be useful in the slightest. Let's move on, shall we? What do you want, Sammy. A medal? Would you like me to congratulate you somehow? I fear that you're simply used to having other teachers prostrate themselves before you and cow tow to your every word on this forum- I've done my research and seen many of your previous posts. You're dealing with a highly experienced senior professional who in all likelihood would be your line manager in any school. You see how I too can make ridiculous sweeping generalisations that are meaningless in the extreme? Relax, slow down, and behave. Don't make it personal.

 

There is a surplus of primary teachers all over Australia. Two years ago, every single university in WA wrote to all of its primary ed students advising them to reconsider and switch to secondary teaching. The Department of Ed also retrained hundreds of primary teachers in secondary courses. Oh, but according to you, this is all in my imagination.

 

As for a top up year, they disappeared a few years ago for three year trained teachers. However, you do have other options, research very carefully which course AITSL might accept, a one year Masters for example in special needs. Just remember that student fees would be at an international rate for you, if you decided to study here, so be prepared to spend a lot of money. However, it seems you ask for advice but are not prepared to accept the reality. Just be prepared for the hard yards when you get here to get you to where you want to be.

 

 

You are welcome.

 

What you're saying is 'Don't disagree with me. No one is allowed an opinion that differs from mine, as I know more about this than you'. I just get the feeling you're not used to people saying things that oppose your view point or position in certain areas. It's called debate, Sammy- it's healthy, it's the way we move forward. I've got to question EVERYTHING you say as I can't base such a huge decision as emigrating to Australia on something someone says on a forum. That's not being 'obnoxious', it's being sensible. Don't be offended by it, just take it for what it is. I've heard everything you've said and am aware of every word you've typed. Rural is exceptionally hard. Regional is exceptionally hard. There are few jobs for immigrants and particularly in the Primary sector as there's a surplus of teaching staff across the nation. You need 4 years of tertiary education to gain accreditation by the AITSL.

 

I guess that's it. Thanks for your time, Sammy. I can't really see this getting anywhere, so think it's probably best to call it a day.

[Quoll]

I think, Tom, that you find it hard to accept that you are being offered good information from people who actually know what is going on in Australia (I admit, my knowledge these days comes second hand from friends still wrestling with the department I could not wait to leave.). If you want good advice then Sammy is the person to listen to, you don't need to be nasty to her - a quick "thanks, that's given me lots to think about " would suffice. (Not that Sammy needs my defence!). I'm sure you've been everywhere, done everything etc etc. You may even, for all I know have spent a couple of years VSO in some remote part of Africa amidst tribal wars - that's good background, just add ICE for a remote Australian community and bobs your uncle.

 

I daresay none of us could give a toss if you decide after all to uproot your family, chuck in a good job, spend a fortune and then spend a few years whingeing about how hard done by you are when it isn't all unicorns and roses. But we do try to alert folk to what might happen - forewarned is forewarned and all that. Many of us have been on this and other forums for years, we try and help where we can but we still have people not heeding then coming back on to tell us how difficult it all is and why didn't we tell them! Duh!

 

Just don't quit your job, take a career break and rent out your house just in case (when you've got your qualifications sorted)

Edited September 12, 2016 by Quoll

[TeacherTom]

Quoll, what I do find hard is the conflicting information I receive. I've several friends (British) who are teachers in Australia and have all moved there within the last 4 years and have all found employment etc. The noises they're all making are 'go for it, it's not as bad as you're being led to believe, after all we did it...' So, that being the case, both you and Sammy need to accept that people clearly do get permanent jobs in Australia, and I've already accepted that it's difficult to do so. There isn't really anywhere else for it to go.

 

I'm not being nasty, it wasn't me who accused someone else of being obnoxious, that was someone else saying that to me. I'm doing what I tell every little kid in my school- stick up for yourself, question the evidence, research research research and never give up. It's all felt a little like a group of bullies having a go at the new kid- keep at it, you'll not get far. Your job here is to impart advice and help and surely not to get shirty when someone questions the advice given. That's my right, after all.

 

I've absolutely NO intention of leaving an assistant headship and the consultant opportunities this provides across the authority unless I'm 250,000% convinced it's for the best. No way!

 

Your advice has been incredibly valuable and I can't thank you enough. I think I've gotten everything I need from the thread and so will leave you all in peace to enjoy whatever is left of the day!

Edited September 12, 2016 by TeacherTom

[Quoll]

Ah but we have no job here at all. You asked a question, people on the ground told you what the situation is. If you choose to believe your British friends instead then go for it! If they are primary teachers and they've scored permanent jobs in government schools in nice places then they should go and buy lottery tickets because that's not the general experience.

 

We do this because we feel like it, no obligation at all, we choose to spend the time but it loses its appeal when all you get is abuse in response - it struck me that the bullying was coming from the other side but there ya go, that's perception! I'm sure you feel you are in the right.

[Nemesis]

A comment like this wouldn't wash with my year 6 students. It's riddled with assumption and generalisation. You also know nothing about the person with whom you're speaking, either. Beware in the future of making such vitriolic assumptions- they just make you look silly. Saying 'I know what I'm talking about- you do not' means absolutely nothing. I might as well say 'I can fly an aeroplane and you massage pineapples after shrove Tuesday'. It's just meaningless waffle and a bizarre, utterly dogmatic thing to say from someone who is meant to be providing advice.

 

Well, not really, as I didn't ask for a synopsis of your CV or resume and find none of the above to be useful in the slightest. Let's move on, shall we? What do you want, Sammy. A medal? Would you like me to congratulate you somehow? I fear that you're simply used to having other teachers prostrate themselves before you and cow tow to your every word on this forum- I've done my research and seen many of your previous posts. You're dealing with a highly experienced senior professional who in all likelihood would be your line manager in any school. You see how I too can make ridiculous sweeping generalisations that are meaningless in the extreme? Relax, slow down, and behave. Don't make it personal.

 

 

 

What you're saying is 'Don't disagree with me. No one is allowed an opinion that differs from mine, as I know more about this than you'. I just get the feeling you're not used to people saying things that oppose your view point or position in certain areas. It's called debate, Sammy- it's healthy, it's the way we move forward. I've got to question EVERYTHING you say as I can't base such a huge decision as emigrating to Australia on something someone says on a forum. That's not being 'obnoxious', it's being sensible. Don't be offended by it, just take it for what it is. I've heard everything you've said and am aware of every word you've typed. Rural is exceptionally hard. Regional is exceptionally hard. There are few jobs for immigrants and particularly in the Primary sector as there's a surplus of teaching staff across the nation. You need 4 years of tertiary education to gain accreditation by the AITSL.

 

I guess that's it. Thanks for your time, Sammy. I can't really see this getting anywhere, so think it's probably best to call it a day.

Ye gods you remind me of all the teachers I loathed at school, the ones who spent their time looking down on the ignorant peasants who surrounded them. Not sure how well the attitude will go down in Australia..........probably as well as its going down with people who have genuiney tried to help you.

[Petals]

Teacher Tom from the tone of your posts you seem to be one of the people we used to sigh when they came to our office, oh teacher we would say, um.

 

That said if teaching jobs are so easy to come by why are so many teachers here in Aus looking for work. Its seems to me that the Aus migration people should give jobs to the Aus before anyone else. My son is maths science teacher, the holy grail of getting a job and he told me recently that people were not changing jobs and sticking in as things were not that good in teaching these days. He is a permanent teacher as opposed to most teachers here in Vic who are on contracts. The reason he is a permanent teacher and employed by the education department is because he spent three years in the bush teaching. He knew he would have to do that to become a permanent teacher. Obviously in the private system its different so maybe the people you know who are permanent teachers work there.

 

Its not a walk in the park, graduates are coming out of uni now and they get first pick of jobs because they are cheap.

 

Jobs advertised are often already filled, just the system has to advertise them.

 

Its what you know and who you know as well.