amanda97 Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Hi there, After reading a lot of useful advice on these forums to help my mum and dad's situation, it's time for me to post to ask for help ! mum and dad were rejected yesterday by the migration tribunal for the aged care 804 visa based on my mums health as she has macular degeneration and requires monthly injections here in Australia. We had initially appealed and got letters written by 3 doctors to support that fact that we could reduce the cost of the drugs she is given to come under the cost threshold to be accepted. However, the medical review officer did not take any of mum's individual circumstances into account and bases the cost of the drugs on a fictitious person on an expensive PBS drug and hence they were rejected yesterday. So we are looking at the next steps , where we need to apply directly to the Minister of Immigration. I'm looking for any advice on how to approach this and what we need to do next . I'm assuming it's writing a letter with social and emotional factors tied in and her individual situation. Any advice would be more than welcome as we have been told they have 28 days and must then leave ! As as you can imagine we are all abit stressed but think we have a strong case and I just want to make sure we go through the correct steps to get the results we want thanks for reading and would love to hear from you if you have been in a similar situation. Amanda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parley Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Have you engaged a migration agent. It doesn't sound promising based on what you have posted so might need to prepare yourself for not getting what you want. The minister is unlikely to intervene. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Pom Queen Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 This is terrible I am so sorry. I would quickly get hold of @Alan Collett or @George Lombard but Alan would be my first call as he is the expert in parent visas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Pom Queen Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Something else I thought, I wonder if they think once your mum has the visa she could then take the expensive drug instead of the cheap one as they can't keep a watch on this. I wonder if you could maybe do some kind of stat dec saying you would use the cheap one or whether they can exclude cover for certain conditions. I really don't know but wish you all the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 In my experience it's unlikely the minister will grant the appeal. My husbands aunt and his brother in law were both rejected due to medical reasons. In both cases they had the financial means to support their medical conditions. Aunt has arthritis and brother in law diabetes. Sadly i can't see you getting the outcome you want. There's a strict criteria they use and if it's not met it's a no. Good luck however you never know if you don't try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Pom Queen Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 In my experience it's unlikely the minister will grant the appeal. My husbands aunt and his brother in law were both rejected due to medical reasons. In both cases they had the financial means to support their medical conditions. Aunt has arthritis and brother in law diabetes. Sadly i can't see you getting the outcome you want. There's a strict criteria they use and if it's not met it's a no. Good luck however you never know if you don't try. Wow that seems really harsh, I could understand if it was cancer etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quoll Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Try George Lombard or Peter Bollard they are usually the two who give best advice for medical conditions but I'm guessing that your no means no in this case - it's not just the medications it's also the prospective care for vision impairment, accommodations etc. Talk to one of them, they'll know what your chances are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Wow that seems really harsh, I could understand if it was cancer etc. Yes we thought it was very harsh but unfortunately sometimes you just have to accept that no means no. It's a fact of life that we don't always get what we want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Collett Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 http://www.border.gov.au/Trav/Visa-1/602- Hello Amanda. Time is not on your side here - so I encourage you to consult with agents suggested and to have progressed matters significantly by this time next week. Consider a subclass 602 Medical Treatment visa. Best regards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Collett Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 PS. Your mother would be seeking a subclass 602 visa on the grounds she is unfit to depart. Here is an extract from DIBP policy regarding being fit to depart Australia: An applicant is fit to depart if they: are able to travel unassisted and unaccompanied on an international flight and require no special health arrangements for the flight and are able to travel without undue discomfort and are unlikely to suffer significant psychological trauma or distress, for example by being parted from family in Australia. Best regards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amanda97 Posted November 20, 2015 Author Share Posted November 20, 2015 Thank you so much all for your speedy replies. What I just don't understand is she was knocked back as treatment is too expensive but we have a strong case for a much cheaper drug option recommend by 3 experts in the field. It was just that a hypothetical case was reviewed for cost not her's. Alan thank you so much for your replies, I called your office very late this I afternoon as we would really like your help. I will give you a buzz Monday. Mum and dad have been here 3 and 1/2 years so connected well in the community and help out with the grand kids a lot. She would be devastated if she had to head back to the UK. I've got everything crossed ! thanks again everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Is that not just a short term visa that allows you to stay while you are getting treatment. Wouldnt really solve their problem, but might buy them some more time for an appeal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Collett Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Is that not just a short term visa that allows you to stay while you are getting treatment. Wouldnt really solve their problem, but might buy them some more time for an appeal. If granted on the grounds the main applicant is unfit to travel the visa permits a stay in Australia until the applicant is fit to travel - see the requirements in this regard above. Note that all 4 points are to be satisfied if an applicant is to be considered fit to travel. Of course, it may well be that the applicant never becomes fit to travel during the remainder of his/her lifetime. Best regards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Thank you so much all for your speedy replies. What I just don't understand is she was knocked back as treatment is too expensive but we have a strong case for a much cheaper drug option recommend by 3 experts in the field. It was just that a hypothetical case was reviewed for cost not her's. Alan thank you so much for your replies, I called your office very late this I afternoon as we would really like your help. I will give you a buzz Monday. Mum and dad have been here 3 and 1/2 years so connected well in the community and help out with the grand kids a lot. She would be devastated if she had to head back to the UK. I've got everything crossed ! thanks again everyone. Unfortunately Amanda it's not just the cost of the treatment they need now it's further costs in the future they look at too. If you have already appealed and that's been refused it's unlikely to be granted. I do wish you the best of luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freesia Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 It would be a shame to end this thread on a downer though - let's hope that Alan Collett's wise strategy advice does the trick - too sad to think it wouldn't have a positive outcome . just a note on the drugs side of things though- I have treatment for a similar condition & they don't go for the 'cheaper' ones - Avastin or Lucentis are the only ones mentioned IME as they are proven to be the most effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Of course, it may well be that the applicant never becomes fit to travel during the remainder of his/her lifetime. Best regards. So that would mean they could never leave, even for a holiday and keep the visa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marisawright Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Thank you so much all for your speedy replies. What I just don't understand is she was knocked back as treatment is too expensive but we have a strong case for a much cheaper drug option recommend by 3 experts in the field. It was just that a hypothetical case was reviewed for cost not her's. The thing is, as ThePomQueen says, once the visa is granted they can't force her to go on using the cheaper drug - she might go to a different specialist who will say she has to take the more expensive one. Or the cheaper drug may become unavailable in Australia and she'll have to switch to the dearer one (this happened to me recently for a medication I was taking). So they feel they have to cover all possibilities. I know it's hard but you can see the logic of that attitude. Fingers crossed an agent can pull a rabbit out of the hat for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amanda97 Posted November 20, 2015 Author Share Posted November 20, 2015 Thanks again for the replies guys. Fressia thanks for the positive words ! Mum is currently on lucentis and that was the drug the medical review officer used to predict her ongoing costs. If she is switched to avastin, as you mentioned a commonly used drug for her condition, she would come under the medical costs threshold. So we where surprised she got knocked back after we asked for a second medical review looking at avastin, but realised it's not done on her individual situation , it was done on a hypothetical case on the more expensive drug. i understand some of the logic but how can you assess an individual's medical costs if you are not looking at the individual themselves and looking at a hypothetical case ? That's the frustration ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marisawright Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 i understand some of the logic but how can you assess an individual's medical costs if you are not looking at the individual themselves and looking at a hypothetical case ? That's the frustration ! The point is, it's not just a hypothetical case for someone else - your mother IS currently on the more expensive drug! In their shoes I'd be a little suspicious - surely if her doctors were really happy with the alternative treatment she'd be on it already? So their concern would be, the cheaper drug proposal is just to get approval, and once she's approved they'll go on prescribing Lucentis and there would be nothing they could do about it. In hindsight it would've been a lot better if her doctors had switched her to the new regime before reapplying, then you'd have had more solid grounds to argue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amanda97 Posted November 20, 2015 Author Share Posted November 20, 2015 Hi Marisawright, Fair points, but she is now on avastin and she was switched before we appealed. But like another poster said how does the medical review officer guarantee she remains on this and is not switched back to the more expensive option. I see the logic in it , just don't like it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marisawright Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Hi Marisawright, Fair points, but she is now on avastin and she was switched before we appealed. But like another poster said how does the medical review officer guarantee she remains on this and is not switched back to the more expensive option. I see the logic in it , just don't like it That's exactly it, and I can see why you don't like it, but I guess they're paid to be cautious. Here's hoping you can find a way around it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ali Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 If granted on the grounds the main applicant is unfit to travel the visa permits a stay in Australia until the applicant is fit to travel - see the requirements in this regard above. Note that all 4 points are to be satisfied if an applicant is to be considered fit to travel. Of course, it may well be that the applicant never becomes fit to travel during the remainder of his/her lifetime. Best regards. Would they not have to undergo medical examination from an independent Dr from time to time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 It would be a shame to end this thread on a downer though - let's hope that Alan Collett's wise strategy advice does the trick - too sad to think it wouldn't have a positive outcome .just a note on the drugs side of things though- I have treatment for a similar condition & they don't go for the 'cheaper' ones - Avastin or Lucentis are the only ones mentioned IME as they are proven to be the most effective. I"m sorry if that's the way my comment comes across. I do sincerly hope that Amanda has a happy outcome. I was only trying to give an honest account of how likely her success would be given our experience. As i've said previously best of luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrussell Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Consider a subclass 602 Medical Treatment visa I agree entirely. Disputing the MOC findings would probably be a huge waste of time and money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raul Senise Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 If proceeding with "Ministerial Intervention", seek professional advice about the ramifications if it fails. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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