MelbournePhom Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 About 1 month ago I got invited to apply for the 189 PR visa. I lodged the visa and have got to the stage where I now just need my medicals and police checks. However, I had an enhanced CRB check done recently for my job and to my amazement a very old caution (I got when I was 14, I am now 25 and have never had police contact since). It was for a VERY minor criminal damage offence (spray-painting an old fence, we were shocked the police even cared). To be honest I had forgotten about it until it came back on my recent CRB check. So now I'm very concerned this will now come back on my ACPO checks, the data is obviously out there somewhere! :confused: I have already lodged my 189 visa and have now been asked to do ACPO checks and medicals by my case officer. When I lodged the Visa I answered "No" to the question about ever being cautioned including deleted cautions etc. so I don't want this to cause any trouble! I have a few options I guess: - Hope the ACPO checks come back as "No trace" (the offence is over 10 years old). - If the ACPO check comes back "No live trace", then wait for the case officer to ask about it. - Declare it now to my case officer before I even have the ACPO check done (not mentioning it coming back on the CRB check, just mentioning that I have a very old caution that I forgot to declare when I lodged). Any advice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blossom Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 They ask about convictions, not cautions, so you should be fine. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ali Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 Declare it now and tell them the circumstances. The police check may likely come back as no live trace meaning there have been some. Honesty in the visa process really is the best policy as it usually comes back to bit you on the bum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelbournePhom Posted December 10, 2012 Author Share Posted December 10, 2012 They ask about convictions, not cautions, so you should be fine. :-) Ah yes the question was: Has any applicant ever been convicted of a crime or offence in any country (including any conviction which is now removed from official records)? I guess a caution doesn't apply to this then. I think I'm going to wait for my ACPO checks in that case, I don't want to start getting paperwork details and then find the ACPO check comes back "No trace". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthernSoul Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 They ask about convictions, not cautions, so you should be fine. :-) I used to work in youth criminal justice system in UK and afraid to say a caution IS actually formally classed as a conviction - the person has to 'accept' the disposal of a caution (the Police can chose to take the matters to court if they don't) so technically is accepting their guilt with regards to committing the offence. The police (nor solicitors) don't explain this well in my experience but hence why they'll always come back on CRB checks and PCC. As others have advised, I'd declare it now to DIAC highlighting your error - and don't forget to declare on landing cards too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelbournePhom Posted December 26, 2012 Author Share Posted December 26, 2012 I used to work in youth criminal justice system in UK and afraid to say a caution IS actually formally classed as a conviction - the person has to 'accept' the disposal of a caution (the Police can chose to take the matters to court if they don't) so technically is accepting their guilt with regards to committing the offence. The police (nor solicitors) don't explain this well in my experience but hence why they'll always come back on CRB checks and PCC. As others have advised, I'd declare it now to DIAC highlighting your error - and don't forget to declare on landing cards too. Thanks for your advice. Very frustrating as I was told when arrested when I was 14 that the caution would be wiped once I turned 16. Since searching around online I've found a lot of different advice about whether this will show up on the ACPO certificate, some threads people have reported they got "no trace" even though they declared a juvenile caution themselves on the ACPO forms, which is promising (could it be the police using common sense about spent convictions?). I've sent off my ACPO forms off this morning and have decided to declare the caution myself and explain that I was told this would be wiped at 16 (which is true). If it comes back "No trace", I'll submit it and not mention it to my CO at all. If it comes back "No Live Trace", then I'll explain to my CO. Will see in a few days! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattybe Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 I had a police caution. I was debating about the question too. In the end I came to the conclusion I would declare it upfront and answered 'yes'. My PCC came back as 'no live trace' , wifes came back as 'no trace'. I dont believe its an issue though. Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert Posted December 27, 2012 Share Posted December 27, 2012 I had a police caution. I was debating about the question too. In the end I came to the conclusion I would declare it upfront and answered 'yes'. My PCC came back as 'no live trace' , wifes came back as 'no trace'. I dont believe its an issue though. Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2 You made a good call then, "no live trace" means there has been a conviction (or caution) in the past. As the offence dd not involve 12 months in prison, it won't present an issue. To OP, at this stage, I would probably just wait a few more days and see, PCCs dont take long to come through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattybe Posted December 27, 2012 Share Posted December 27, 2012 yep wait for pcc. Mine took 7 days and i only had standard service. Hope it comes back ok. My brother in law also had a minor offence when he had a scrap at school (14yrs old). his came back as 'no live trace'. As Rupert says 'no live trace' means you have something on you record. Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelbournePhom Posted January 6, 2013 Author Share Posted January 6, 2013 Right so got my certificate through a couple of days back, and as expected, it does indeed show "NO LIVE TRACE" (as mentioned before, I declared my police caution from 2001 when I submitted the ACPO checks). I'm going to scan and send to my case officer, with some sort of explanation as to why it has come back like this, and apologising for not declaring this as a conviction. Does anyone have any advice of what they might do at DIAC? Is it possible they might just say "Ok, no worries" and process the visa, or am I likely to be asked to do even more paperwork? It's quite annoying that the ACPO checks don't list the reasons it comes back as NO LIVE TRACE. Could I now add the Enhanced CRB check as supporting documentation? This does actually list the offence as the only offence on my record, so it might help I think... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hubbert0403 Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 Can I just add anything after 5 years is classed as SPENT, so it should not make any difference really Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_shel Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 Can I just add anything after 5 years is classed as SPENT, so it should not make any difference really Being spent under UK law means nothing to migration and to Australian Law. Nothing is spent when applying for immigration. Plus 5yrs is not necessarily true, depends on the age at time of offence and sentence. Could be 6 months could be 10yrs. http://www.nacro.org.uk/data/files/nacro-2007021302-65.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thombatt Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 The thing about this is the first question that comes to mind to a Co is "what else have they not been truthful about in their application?" Expect the rest of the application to be treated with trepidation and lots of checks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MelbournePhom Posted January 12, 2013 Author Share Posted January 12, 2013 Right have finally got around to attaching my ACPO, AFP and Enhanced CRB checks to my visa application this evening. I've sent an email to my case officer explaining the "No live trace" result, and basically apologising for not declaring the caution from 2001 as I considered it a spent caution and not classed as a conviction (although I accept that may not be the case, TBH I still find it a bit confusing now!). Will let you all know what happens! *Crosses fingers...* My medicals have been finalised, so this ACPO business should be the final hurdle :biggrin: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sineadallen Posted April 2, 2013 Share Posted April 2, 2013 HEY what happened? any news? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluxetrolley Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Right have finally got around to attaching my ACPO, AFP and Enhanced CRB checks to my visa application this evening. I've sent an email to my case officer explaining the "No live trace" result, and basically apologising for not declaring the caution from 2001 as I considered it a spent caution and not classed as a conviction (although I accept that may not be the case, TBH I still find it a bit confusing now!). Will let you all know what happens! *Crosses fingers...* My medicals have been finalised, so this ACPO business should be the final hurdle :biggrin: Hi, sorry to raise this given this post is really quite old now but jus wondering what the outcome of this was? I am in the same situation currently so would really appreciate a reply. Many thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.