First update.

[Guest KG1978]

Extreme poverty isn't as widespread in Oz, that's my point, supported by evidence.

 

But there is a little of everything, everywhere, all the time, yes!

[Guest girlwizz99]

It's not pathetic at all. It's the natural - and obvious - consequence of being a pioneer society. It's especially not pathetic if you understand the history of the country.

 

Consider how much physical and social infrastructure existed in Britain in 1788.

Then compare that with what existed when the British colonised this land in 1788. Zero -buildings, roads, wharves, agriculture, no brickworks, no coal mines.

 

So you had to have the practical skills to build your own dwelling, fence your land, look after your livestock and transport, grow your own food, provide your own cooking and heating fuel - all in an environment which was completely alien geographically, climatically, in soil types and seasons, in native animals which could destroy your crops completely, and very hostile compared to the "park like" British countryside.

 

It didn't matter how intellectual you were or what social pretensions you had - if you didn't have the practical skills to survive you died. Simple as that.

 

In generational terms it is not that long ago. There could still be Australians living today whose great grandparents were part of that original British colonisation.

 

And it continued into the 1940s and 50s. Most post WW2 European migrants came here with absolutely nothing and had to start from scratch. There wasn't enough housing, there weren't enough tradesmen, building materials were rationed, they had very little money, so you either learned to build your house yourself with whatever was available or you went without.

 

It is possible to have practical skills and not be macho, sexist and racist.... I do appreciate the history of the country in terms of how the pioneer spirit has led to a 'working class' country but it doesn't make any of the more vulgar traits you find so often here any more palatable.

[Guest KG1978]

Why don't we all start focusing on the best in people, instead of the worst? This is depressing.

 

Let's go back to Chris talking about how lovely the UK is!

[Guest guest36762]

Why don't we all start focusing on the best in people, instead of the worst? This is depressing.

 

Let's go back to Chris talking about how lovely the UK is!

 

Fair do's. I'd forgotten what the point of the argument anway.

Sorry chris

day 7:

breakfast, dump whilst reading the Argos catalogue, shower, shave, slap on some bo killer and off you boldly go, where no Australian englishman born in geelong has gone before.

[Guest KG1978]

Fair do's. I'd forgotten what the point of the argument anway.

Sorry chris

day 7:

breakfast, dump whilst reading the Argos catalogue, shower, shave, slap on some bo killer and off you boldly go, where no Australian englishman born in geelong has gone before.

 

hahaha, thanks.:biglaugh:

 

I seriously miss the Argos catalogue! I'll be heading down there next week to get myself one - gotta love a shop where you can buy a vacuum cleaner AND a diamond ring!

[Skani]

but doesn't make any of the more vulgar traits you find so often here any more palatable.

 

No, wasn't trying to excuse vulgarity or bogan ockerism. But I can understand the origins of the ute/chainsaw culture which harpodom seems to find "pathetic" in white collar workers.

 

Knowing some of the people/organisations some white collar workers have to put up with I can see that wielding a chainsaw at the weekend would be excellent stress relief therapy :biggrin:

[Guest girlwizz99]

hahaha, thanks.:biglaugh:

 

I seriously miss the Argos catalogue! I'll be heading down there next week to get myself one - gotta love a shop where you can buy a vacuum cleaner AND a diamond ring!

 

Don't you mean diamante by Elizabeth Duke! Love it...

[Guest chris955]

No offense to anyone but can we please get rid of all the way off topic chat and get back to the thread topic ?

I'm still having a great time by the way.

[Guest KG1978]

No offense to anyone but can we please get rid of all the way off topic chat and get back to the thread topic ?

I'm still having a great time by the way.

 

Yeah I said that yesterday Chris.

 

Though, I'm not sure there is a topic that anyone else can contribute to here except you? No offense.

[mrcatania]

OK, day 6 and I'm still enjoying myself, it doesn't seem right somehow as I was truly expecting to encounter a generally rude, miserable and unhelpful population but I'm genuinely not seeing it. Met up with another old friend today and she didn't question my state of mind when I mentioned our plans to return. I'm almost disappointed, I kind of expected less positivity.

I had a relaxing day today so not much to report really, I still haven't found anything to put me off.

This is all amusing reading.... are you sure you are in the UK? Sounds like you got on the wrong plane to some green and pleasant land....anyway, I will be in your shoes next week on a part work/leave trip and am getting more excited than a bothered pig. First trip back since arriving down here, and so far I feel I will have to be kicked back on the plane for the flight back to Oz.

[pablo]

hi pabs

I'm guilty of the snobbery you mentioned, and I'm sorry if my comments have caused offence. I'll say this. You admit you're working class, I'm middle class. People will probably attack me for the above statement....

Who are your mates? What do they do? Maybe I'm pigeon holing again but I'll hazard a guess that they're also working class. My best mates are also middle class blokes. That's life: people crave the company of others with a similar background, on the whole. Obviously there are exceptions.

With the above classist bigoted ignorant statement of the truth in mind, those who come to oz will naturally seek people who are similar to them:shocked:.

I've said before that australia is a country proud of it's working class society.

Enough said

dom

 

I was out with my mates(close mates)a week saturday gone dom.

Joe WAS a pharmacist,he now runs a large computer dept for the NHS,he is also a millionaire because him and his bro mikey developed some software/game and sold it to a gaming company for we believe 6mill,altho he seems more embarrased about it than anything tbh,and doesnt mention it,WE take the p7ss however.

 

Marc manages a large architectural ironmongers,his wife is in girobank she's a manager as well,two kids in uni.

 

John has a scrapyard in mcster,earnings last yr 150k,which is why he's moving to cyprus(tax reasons),his girl is in uni,his son(RAF)is a "listener" for the gvnmt in some secret place down south,he's multi lingual obviously.

 

Mick and wezo run a small sub contract cable laying company,they havnt had to draw wages for 18 months they make that much on the scrap cable(copper),wezo lives 6 months a yr in thailand with his wife,and they both do very well thankyou.

 

Are they all working class?they would say yes i think.

Does their status change because they have money?because they are "professional btw?

 

We were brought up on a council estate,a VERY well kept council estate btw,were we skint?jam butties and conny onny etc?

No ,my dad was a haulage contractor,3 wagons(units)and two employees,we done ok tbh,but there was no stigma in living on a council estate back then.

 

This all started because of the job snobs,if (god forbid)your mam or dad were dying in bed,bedridden,lying in their own mess,days to live,then the care worker comes round,the poor girl who is on minimum wage,washes and bathes her,gives her some dignity back,makes her comfortable,are people telling me that that care worker is not as valuable to society as the "professional" sitting crunching numbers in an office somewhere? because to me she's EVERY bit as valuable,just because she's on minimum wage and has no letters after her name mean nothing.

 

You EARN respect,you DONT demand/expect it because of your occupation,the fact that the aussies value tradies/blue collar AS WELL AS professionals shouldnt matter,professionals get their reward in the pay packet,dont expect to be hero worshipped because you've got a masters degree for jesus sake.

[Guest siamsusie]

Another excellent post Pabs!

[pablo]

Another excellent post Pabs!

 

Thx susie,now its half an hour to KO,must dash! apologies chris,enjoy your stay

[Guest siamsusie]

Thx susie,now its half an hour to KO,must dash! apologies chris,enjoy your stay

Hope Liverpool win x

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njG7p6CSbCU:notworthy:

 

"Working Class hero John Lennan"

[Guest guest30038]

You EARN respect,you DONT demand/expect it because of your occupation,the fact that the aussies value tradies/blue collar AS WELL AS professionals shouldnt matter,professionals get their reward in the pay packet,dont expect to be hero worshipped because you've got a masters degree for jesus sake.

 

I hate to say it, but I can't believe that eloquent truisms can be generated from an area that houses and spawns such thieving scumbags and dole bludgers as Liverpool does. :tongue: :wink:

 

You'll never walk alone mate.

 

kev

[tracy123]

Hope Liverpool win x

 

"

 

yes they better make the most of this year because they'll be going down the year after

[Paul1Perth]

When i said POVERTY ,i meant real poverty .

The real disparity between rich and poor .

The people that arent mentioned on here , such as the Aboriginals in Australia ,and large populations of non white Americans in the U.S

Would they seperate blacks and whites , if we had a New Orleans style situation occur in the U.K ? .........I VERY MUCH DOUBT IT .

We dont have people driving along the beach front in Maseratis and Ferraris , whilst ten yards away ,people are living under cardboard , which i saw on a recent visit to the worlds only super power

 

I though you would have been a bit more careful with your words about seperating blacks and whites, coming from Solihull. I went to a pub in Solihull with a black friend of mine when we were at Birmingham Uni. I had been telling him what a nice place it was to go for a drink. They wouldn't let him in the pub. They used some other excuse about footwear but as we both had on running shoes we really knew the real reason. Blacks and whites are already seperated to some extent in the UK.

I think the main reason they tried to seperate people after the New Orleans floods was a safety aspect.

Have you not noticed that difference in living standards say between Solihull and Sparkhill (not too far down the road). I lived in Sparkhill across from a Pakistani family. There were about 8 of them living in a run down terrace. I could see in the upstairs bedroom from my room whrere 4 kids shared a room. They broke a window just before Christmas one year and it didn't get fixed. They put some cardboard over the hole and it was still like that 18 months later when I finished Uni. It must have been freezing in that room in winter.

So you do have a massive disparity in the UK. It's just that people tend to turn a blind eye to it and deny it's happening. We also have the same disparity in Aus too. Take a walk from the affluent suburbs of Woolloomooloo through the backstreets to Kings Cross, about a 10 minute walk. You would go from Ferraris and the like driving by to people living under cardboard under the railway arches.

[Paul1Perth]

Hope Liverpool win x

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njG7p6CSbCU:notworthy:

 

"Working Class hero John Lennan"

 

I hope that's really John Lennon and not some imposter on You Tube.

[Guest guest36762]

I was out with my mates(close mates)a week saturday gone dom.

Joe WAS a pharmacist,he now runs a large computer dept for the NHS,he is also a millionaire because him and his bro mikey developed some software/game and sold it to a gaming company for we believe 6mill,altho he seems more embarrased about it than anything tbh,and doesnt mention it,WE take the p7ss however.

 

Marc manages a large architectural ironmongers,his wife is in girobank she's a manager as well,two kids in uni.

 

John has a scrapyard in mcster,earnings last yr 150k,which is why he's moving to cyprus(tax reasons),his girl is in uni,his son(RAF)is a "listener" for the gvnmt in some secret place down south,he's multi lingual obviously.

 

Mick and wezo run a small sub contract cable laying company,they havnt had to draw wages for 18 months they make that much on the scrap cable(copper),wezo lives 6 months a yr in thailand with his wife,and they both do very well thankyou.

 

Are they all working class?they would say yes i think.

Does their status change because they have money?because they are "professional btw?

 

We were brought up on a council estate,a VERY well kept council estate btw,were we skint?jam butties and conny onny etc?

No ,my dad was a haulage contractor,3 wagons(units)and two employees,we done ok tbh,but there was no stigma in living on a council estate back then.

 

This all started because of the job snobs,if (god forbid)your mam or dad were dying in bed,bedridden,lying in their own mess,days to live,then the care worker comes round,the poor girl who is on minimum wage,washes and bathes her,gives her some dignity back,makes her comfortable,are people telling me that that care worker is not as valuable to society as the "professional" sitting crunching numbers in an office somewhere? because to me she's EVERY bit as valuable,just because she's on minimum wage and has no letters after her name mean nothing.

 

You EARN respect,you DONT demand/expect it because of your occupation,the fact that the aussies value tradies/blue collar AS WELL AS professionals shouldnt matter,professionals get their reward in the pay packet,dont expect to be hero worshipped because you've got a masters degree for jesus sake.

 

pablo

you seem to basically agree with me that you mix with working class blokes...nothing controversial there then. but beyond that the lecture was a bit scatter gun, so not really worth responding to.

sorry Chris

[pablo]

pablo

you seem to basically agree with me that you mix with working class blokes...nothing controversial there then. but beyond that the lecture was a bit scatter gun, so not really worth responding to.

sorry Chris

 

 

I mix with working class fellahs because we grew up together on the same estate,i DONT limit my mates to working class,or exclude middle/upper class,its just its only the working classes could understand my grunts:wink:

It wasnt a lecture,nor was it directed solely at you, just my beliefs, scatter gun eh?MMMmmm:rolleyes:,theres plenty for you to respond to,thats why ive put a question mark on the end of posed questions.

 

I also emphasised that EVERYBODY has an occupation that is worthwhile in one way or another,or dont they?

 

You seem to have cast yourself in the role of "defender of the middle classes",and btw i have no problem with people who deem themselves the "middle classes" or high earners,you usually get out of life what you put into it,uni etc,so they SHOULD earn big£.

 

My objection is when they look down their nose at people who they deem below them,people who have a job that the middle classes deem unimportant,have you an opinion on my opinion?

 

IE WHAT makes you middle class? your upbringing..? your job? your parents occupation? will my mates sons/daughters be middle class when they qualify and get a good job?or cant they be because THEIR parents are working class?

How does all this pigeon holing work dom?You mention working/middle class quite often so i assume you know the criteria,so pls enlighten me?seriously,im interested.

 

 

Edited to add,can/could these "class debates" be moved so as not to ruin chris's thread?or too much hassle?

[Petals]

The people who make the world go round are the ones paper pushers have to call to fix things for them.

 

Why do people feel the need to think they are a cut above.

 

Be proud of what we achieve do not be superior because as long as we contribute we are all the same class.

[pablo]

The people who make the world go round are the ones paper pushers have to call to fix things for them.

 

Why do people feel the need to think they are a cut above.

 

Be proud of what we achieve do not be superior because as long as we contribute we are all the same class.

 

 

Thankyou Petals,thats all im saying:wubclub:

[Guest chris955]

Well I'm still having fun, haven't been knifed yet and the pubs are just wonderful. It's supposed to rain today so maybe something inside for me. Yesterday was 25C so I went out and took loads of photo's.

Thought I might go up to Gloucester today and have a look around.

[Peach]

This is all new (if the rain does come and you want go inside): Gloucester Quays Designer Outlet - 60% off everything except style

 

If you stray a little further, the villages around Nailsworth, Minchinhampton, Avening, Chalford are gorgeous to visit.

[Peach]

Oh and the Forest of Dean (Symonds Yat etc) are definitely worth a look-see too.