Emigrating with child from previous marriage

[Louella]

Good afternoon,

I am looking into emigrating with my husband and daughter (from a previous marriage) 

 

Has anyone done this before or have any knowledge on the success rates for this? My ex husband does not want us to go, he sees our daughter twice a month currently. My daughter is 11 and would like to stay with myself and husband in a Australia. We are thinking it may have to go to court but not sure of our chance. We would be offering to pay for our daughter to go home once a year and keep regular contact with her father.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Lousie x

[Tulip1]

If she father won’t give his approval then it will have to go to court. Not sure of your chances but I understand it’s difficult, costly and lengthy.  You will have to show evidence it will be better for your child which of course isn’t easy as the uk is a first world country and more importantly, her father lives here and she sees him regularly. Hopefully someone will be along with actual experience of this to help you. 

[Jon the Hat]

http://www.alternativefamilylaw.co.uk/international/relocating-abroad-children/

Some pointers there; on what basis could you establish Australia would offer a better life for your daughter without her father?  Looks very difficult to me.  I would be thinking very very hard about this.  Sound like a long a painful journey, with an uncertain outcome which could sour relations with your ex a great deal.  Is it really worth it?  Also 11 year olds change their mind all the time!

[Tulip1]

33 minutes ago, Jon the Hat said:

http://www.alternativefamilylaw.co.uk/international/relocating-abroad-children/

Some pointers there; on what basis could you establish Australia would offer a better life for your daughter without her father?  Looks very difficult to me.  I would be thinking very very hard about this.  Sound like a long a painful journey, with an uncertain outcome which could sour relations with your ex a great deal.  Is it really worth it?  Also 11 year olds change their mind all the time!

Agree, they certainly wouldn’t take what an 11 year old says they want. Most kids would probably say they want to live in Disneyland but that’s not reality. The child doesn’t know how life will be seeing her father once a year. I think the OP has a big battle on her hands. 

[Amber2106]

I too am emigrating with a child from a previous relationship, I sought legal advice as did my ex and we were told that if we couldn’t agree and we took it to court we would have to undergo mandatory mediation first, then court at our own expense. The courts look at all sorts of factors including relationship with each parent, the benefit to the child either leaving or staying, how each parent would support that child, how contact would be maintained. In my personal circumstances my solicitors opinion was I had the stronger case due to me having other children with new hubby and therefore my son had siblings to maintain a relationship with too, also that my ex had only recently been in a stable job and financial position with a home. 

After a heart to heart he agreed to sign paperwork and let our son come but with both our agreement that he could come home to his dad if he didn’t settle and his dad keeps up with the responsibility of parenting and keeps his job and home 

Consider your position carefully, the visa application process is long but the court process is too and it could take years!

[ali]

In these instances, I always thing one should look at if the shoe was on the other foot and your partner was wanting to take your child would you easily say yes?  I had an acquaintance a few years ago whose partner had said yes to her brining her child to Australia, here daughter experienced some problems emotionally later alternating questioning why her dad didn't love her enough to want her to stay .. and how her mother could have taken her away.  It soured relationships with both her parents for awhile.

[Tulip1]

1 hour ago, ali said:

In these instances, I always thing one should look at if the shoe was on the other foot and your partner was wanting to take your child would you easily say yes?  I had an acquaintance a few years ago whose partner had said yes to her brining her child to Australia, here daughter experienced some problems emotionally later alternating questioning why her dad didn't love her enough to want her to stay .. and how her mother could have taken her away.  It soured relationships with both her parents for awhile.

Totally agree. If you wouldn’t be ok with seeing your child just once a year then you shouldn’t think it ok to expect another parent to accept that. Sorry, tough but true. 

[can1983]

38 minutes ago, Tulip1 said:

Totally agree. If you wouldn’t be ok with seeing your child just once a year then you shouldn’t think it ok to expect another parent to accept that. Sorry, tough but true. 

agree also surely any agreement for 'one trip home a year' isn't legally binding, you can just say you can no longer afford it.

[Jon the Hat]

I completely agree as well;  It is tough enough having separated parents without one of them being on the other side of the world.  Fair enough at 15 or 16 maybe but 11 is too young in my opinion.  I think the OP should reconsider what she is asking her ex to accept, and for what?  Swapping one developed Western country for another.  What about wider family, Grandparents etc?

[Parley]

Despite all the above valid points. It does seem that the courts often/usually do give the mother permission to go to Australia.

They have to give a spiel about why it will be in the child's interests to go etc, and usually get their way.

As Ali points out though, one can only imagine the Op's reaction if her ex husband annnounced a plan to move overseas with his daughter.

[LMCAR2612]

We to will be in the same position as you, we want to take my son from previous marriage who is 11 and his 15 year old sister (daughter) to Australia, after going to court 4 years ago for custody over the children, my son now sees his father twice a month and my daughter does not see him at all after his current girlfriend banned her from the house for not wanting to spend Christmas with them 3 years ago. 

Anyway, even after the court issued an order for the care of the children, their father does not follow this and chooses to have his son in the holidays when he wants and not what is stated in the court order. I am prepared to take my ex to court if he refuses to let my son move to Australia, they rarely see his side of the family so I cant see that being an issue.

I hope like amber2106 ex that he signs the papers and lets him go. This move is for my children to better themselves and become who they are meant to be.

[ali]

4 hours ago, LMCAR2612 said:

We to will be in the same position as you, we want to take my son from previous marriage who is 11 and his 15 year old sister (daughter) to Australia, after going to court 4 years ago for custody over the children, my son now sees his father twice a month and my daughter does not see him at all after his current girlfriend banned her from the house for not wanting to spend Christmas with them 3 years ago. 

Anyway, even after the court issued an order for the care of the children, their father does not follow this and chooses to have his son in the holidays when he wants and not what is stated in the court order. I am prepared to take my ex to court if he refuses to let my son move to Australia, they rarely see his side of the family so I cant see that being an issue.

I hope like amber2106 ex that he signs the papers and lets him go. This move is for my children to better themselves and become who they are meant to be.

If you go to court, it will be up to you to prove how the move is going to allow your children to better themselves - you will have to be specific, what do you mean, become who they are meant to be?  Not trying to be rude, but that statement is so very subjective - the questions would be - how would their life be better, what would they be getting that they aren't getting now, how would you quantify becoming who they are meant to be - what is stopping them doing that where they are and what does it look like.  Your son sees his dad regularly - how will it be better for your son not seeing him?  What will you propose to do in order to maintain his relationship with his father e.g. pay for trips for son to visit UK or pay his dads fare?

These are some of the things you will need to highlight, in addition to perhaps presenting to the court some evidence of where you're going to be living/schools/jobs etc.,

[VERYSTORMY]

11 hours ago, LMCAR2612 said:

This move is for my children to better themselves and become who they are meant to be.

How do you think moving from one first world country to another first world country will achieve this?

[Tulip1]

12 hours ago, LMCAR2612 said:

We to will be in the same position as you, we want to take my son from previous marriage who is 11 and his 15 year old sister (daughter) to Australia, after going to court 4 years ago for custody over the children, my son now sees his father twice a month and my daughter does not see him at all after his current girlfriend banned her from the house for not wanting to spend Christmas with them 3 years ago. 

Anyway, even after the court issued an order for the care of the children, their father does not follow this and chooses to have his son in the holidays when he wants and not what is stated in the court order. I am prepared to take my ex to court if he refuses to let my son move to Australia, they rarely see his side of the family so I cant see that being an issue.

I hope like amber2106 ex that he signs the papers and lets him go. This move is for my children to better themselves and become who they are meant to be.

It is not possible for you to predict that your children will be better in Oz. It may well be the opposite. Your kids could struggle with the move, they could become depressed and miss their friends/life/father. You cannot possibily say that won’t happen. I’m not sure how you know ‘who they are meant to be’ and how that can only be achieved in Oz. Your evidence on this would be most interesting to see. Going to court will be lengthly and expensive and you are going to need to pull some magic out of a hat to evidence it’s better than the uk which is hard to do. 

[Phoenix16]

I can only reiterate the excellent point previously made; if your ex wanted to take your children to the other side of the world from you in order to ‘better themselves and become who they are meant to be’.. you would willingly make the sacrifice and sign the papers, if you can honestly put your hand on your heart and say you would then fair play to you, however, I suspect that wouldn’t be the case.

[Louella]

It’s been a while since I checked this post. Thank you for everyone’s replies. I do however feel the need to say that a lot of the replies are very personal and not at all in keeping with the question. If you do not have experience of this post then you have no need to be commenting a reply. You have no idea of people’s back story and in no position to comment otherwise. 

I asked a very brief question relating to a family migrating situation. I did not and do not require anyone’s opinion on why and furthermore question mine and the other ladies morals. If you have so much time on your hands that you enjoy sitting and replying to posts that don’t involve you I suggest you go find a book to read. To worry about how our children will grow up? Please don’t worry yourself, I would be more concerned how your children will grow up with such patronising, self opiniated parents.

 

To the ladies that have posted their same predicament, I understand how much of a life changing decision this must be for you and I doubt very much you have made it in haste. I wish you all the best with mediation/court. X

 

 

 

[Amber2106]

Well said! 

I personally believe that moving to Australia will benefit my son in ways that the UK won’t.

He has a medical condition which in layman’s terms means that any exposure to alcohol substances and smoke toxins will significantly damage his liver and lung function. 

I feel that the Australian lifestyle and environment reduces his exposure and risk. 

Secondly we have family members over in Australia, more so than in the uk, another reason for our move is so that my children can grow up with their cousins and auntie and uncle and In turn their offspring, ensuring that future generations have family support and bonds , if we stay in the uk we have just a set of grandparents who are happy for us to put out children’s future first. 

I am fortunate that my ex realised that he can’t provide the same lifestyle and choices for my son and he wants him to have options in life and to remain healthy 

it’s not a matter of taking a child away from a parent, it’s avout the parent thinking of the child’s future

[Phoenix16]

4 minutes ago, Louella said:

It’s been a while since I checked this post. Thank you for everyone’s replies. I do however feel the need to say that a lot of the replies are very personal and not at all in keeping with the question. If you do not have experience of this post then you have no need to be commenting a reply. You have no idea of people’s back story and in no position to comment otherwise. 

I asked a very brief question relating to a family migrating situation. I did not and do not require anyone’s opinion on why and furthermore question mine and the other ladies morals. If you have so much time on your hands that you enjoy sitting and replying to posts that don’t involve you I suggest you go find a book to read. To worry about how our children will grow up? Please don’t worry yourself, I would be more concerned how your children will grow up with such patronising, self opiniated parents.

 

To the ladies that have posted their same predicament, I understand how much of a life changing decision this must be for you and I doubt very much you have made it in haste. I wish you all the best with mediation/court. X

 

 

 

It would seem a nerve has been touched after reading your defensive response,  you are indeed correct that you are making life changing decisions that affect the other parent and it would be interesting to hear your perspective on the ‘boot on the other foot’ comments. People are not questioning your moral judgements, this is an open forum and you put your thoughts out there,  Many replying to you have been in this situation or are close to those who have been in this situation.  When you have a child the decisions you make for the next 18 years of your life affect your child and the other parent as well as you, whether you like it or not.  I would never ever allow my child to be moved half way around the world from me, my partner equally would never allow that to happen, I do not know your situation whatsoever and I am not judging you but it’s a pretty big thing to come onto an open forum and state very blasé that you would like to move to OZ, ex doesn’t want this, what are our chances in court? I think most responders hoped you could put yourself in your ex’s shoes and perhaps consider his relationship with his child above your own desires to emigrate.  My bestest wishes to you xxxxxxx

[Phoenix16]

8 minutes ago, Amber2106 said:

Well said! 

I personally believe that moving to Australia will benefit my son in ways that the UK won’t.

He has a medical condition which in layman’s terms means that any exposure to alcohol substances and smoke toxins will significantly damage his liver and lung function. 

I feel that the Australian lifestyle and environment reduces his exposure and risk. 

Secondly we have family members over in Australia, more so than in the uk, another reason for our move is so that my children can grow up with their cousins and auntie and uncle and In turn their offspring, ensuring that future generations have family support and bonds , if we stay in the uk we have just a set of grandparents who are happy for us to put out children’s future first. 

I am fortunate that my ex realised that he can’t provide the same lifestyle and choices for my son and he wants him to have options in life and to remain healthy 

it’s not a matter of taking a child away from a parent, it’s avout the parent thinking of the child’s future

 

9 minutes ago, Amber2106 said:

it’s not a matter of taking a child away from a parent, it’s avout the parent thinking of the child’s future

Exactly.  You have made a decision together with you child's other parent and both agreed this is best thing for them, you have not enforced this on the other parent and dragged them into court in order to satisfy your own wants and needs.  This is completely different and the point most responders were making on here was that decisions should be made  by mutually consenting parents who both put their Childs best interests at the forefront of their decision making, not themselves. xxx

[VERYSTORMY]

1 hour ago, Amber2106 said:

 

He has a medical condition which in layman’s terms means that any exposure to alcohol substances and smoke toxins will significantly damage his liver and lung function. 

I feel that the Australian lifestyle and environment reduces his exposure and risk. 

This makes me laugh.

I am a smoker. Smoking is far more common than anywhere else I have lived in the world other than China.

Australia has one of the biggest drinking cultures in the world. It is only outstripped by Eastern Europe and Russia. This is a place where cock ups at work are measured in cartons - a pack of beer. Where I have worked in offices that have a beer fridge for Friday afternoons company supplied beer. 

[Phoenix16]

12 minutes ago, VERYSTORMY said:

This makes me laugh.

I am a smoker. Smoking is far more common than anywhere else I have lived in the world other than China.

Australia has one of the biggest drinking cultures in the world. It is only outstripped by Eastern Europe and Russia. This is a place where cock ups at work are measured in cartons - a pack of beer. Where I have worked in offices that have a beer fridge for Friday afternoons company supplied beer. 

Could not agree with you more!  Hubby is in construction albeit director level and despairs of the Friday arvo BBQ and booze culture, the police seem to be wise to it too, seen many a 3pm booze bus set up with discarded cars and utes abandoned around it!!

[Amber2106]

My point is that there are more opportunities for healthier lifestyle choices and he can choose to avoid smoking and drinking when he has other things to do socially, and with more focus on family time in our circumstances where I can discourage smoking and drinking as a teenagager. In the uk it’s the Norm to drink smoke through boredom. It’s also environmental factors from living in city smog to fresh open air. 

[Phoenix16]

4 minutes ago, Amber2106 said:

My point is that there are more opportunities for healthier lifestyle choices and he can choose to avoid smoking and drinking when he has other things to do socially, and with more focus on family time in our circumstances where I can discourage smoking and drinking as a teenagager. In the uk it’s the Norm to drink smoke through boredom. It’s also environmental factors from living in city smog to fresh open air. 

Now I’m really confused! Who can choose to avoid drinking and smoking? Are you referring to your child? Surely you don’t think emigrating to OZ will alleviate that?!!! So you think he will be so busy down the beach surfing and breathing fresh air he won’t consider booze or alcohol, unlike the Uk where it’s so cold everyone drinks and smokes to cure the boredom? You might be right, he might not bother with booze and alcohol, he might just jump right into Australia’s biggest problem - METH.  Is that big in the UK? Surely it must be if the weather is so bad people don’t get fresh air?  I think you just shot yourself in the foot, your earlier post sounded pretty rational but now I’m wondering.... do check out METH, it really is a big problem here, so is smoking, so is drinking, it’s no different from the UK, I doubt it’s depentant on the country they live in whether they choose to smoke and drink, I think that decision lies much more closer to home xxxx

[Phoenix16]

18 minutes ago, Amber2106 said:

My point is that there are more opportunities for healthier lifestyle choices and he can choose to avoid smoking and drinking when he has other things to do socially, and with more focus on family time in our circumstances where I can discourage smoking and drinking as a teenagager. In the uk it’s the Norm to drink smoke through boredom. It’s also environmental factors from living in city smog to fresh open air. 

I also think it’s worth acknowledging that a disenfranchised child is more likely to drink alcohol and smoke, your close family connections may not be his, his closest family connections are his parents and no amount of cousins, aunties and uncles can compensate for this.  I think you are so invested in being with YOUR family you forget this might not feel the same for him xxx

[Amber2106]

41 minutes ago, Phoenix16 said:

Now I’m really confused! Who can choose to avoid drinking and smoking? Are you referring to your child? Surely you don’t think emigrating to OZ will alleviate that?!!! So you think he will be so busy down the beach surfing and breathing fresh air he won’t consider booze or alcohol, unlike the Uk where it’s so cold everyone drinks and smokes to cure the boredom? You might be right, he might not bother with booze and alcohol, he might just jump right into Australia’s biggest problem - METH.  Is that big in the UK? Surely it must be if the weather is so bad people don’t get fresh air?  I think you just shot yourself in the foot, your earlier post sounded pretty rational but now I’m wondering.... do check out METH, it really is a big problem here, so is smoking, so is drinking, it’s no different from the UK, I doubt it’s depentant on the country they live in whether they choose to smoke and drink, I think that decision lies much more closer to home xxxx

Some people clearly need to use these forums to put people down and oppose every opinion, get a life! My reasons for going are my own as is my opinion! I didn’t ask for yours I simply stated MY personal opinion!