Reciprocal Agreement between UK and Australia - National Insurance payments?

[Northmavine14]

Hi Everyone,

Just wanted to say how much I enjoy reading this forum!

I lived in Australia for 3 years back in the 80s and really loved it but am guessing so many things have changed since, like everywhere. I met

some lovely people who I will remember forever, people from other countries as well as Australians and Brits.

Funnily enough I didn't realise just how homesick I had been until I actually returned home and that was after 6 months here!

Anyway, I wondered if anyone out there can help me? I worked full time in Australia for 3 years, paying tax and all the rest. However, stupidly

I kept no paper record of this and within the next 5 years I will be claiming my "old age" pension. Those years are missing from my record and

things have changed here recently it would seem and this means some kind of reduced pension for me.

I am keen to know which organisation I would contact in Australia to get some proof of what I paid as I was always led to believe that there is a reciprocal agreement between Australia and the UK in this matter.

Would be grateful for any snippets of info. I have looked on Google but remain confused!

Many thanks

[Marisawright]

There is no reciprocal agreement between the UK and Australia. There is for Medicare but nothing else. The good news is that back in the 80's, there was a reciprocal agreement so you should be able to get those three years recognised towards your UK pension.

 

However, how much tax you paid is irrelevant - it's not a direct equivalent. All you need is proof that you were resident in Australia during that time. Have you got some references from employers stating when you worked, for instance?

 

Your other option, if it's all too hard, is to pay the NI contributions for those missing years.

Edited October 12, 2016 by Marisawright

[pommysheila]

Hello

I am new to the site also with my own problems, but I would think the AUSTRALIAN TAX OFFICE could help you they seem to no everything about us hope it helps

Phone us | Australian Taxation Office

[Melbpom]

Your other option, if it's all too hard, is to pay the NI contributions for those missing years.

 

I thought there was a limit on how many years you could go back when it comes to paying the missing years? I've topped mine up recently and can't remember the details but I think I could back pay something like 5/6 years.

It is a good question though, how you prove you were resident and/or employed if haven't kept tax returns and employment details?

[Diane]

You would have got a Tax File Number (TFN) when you were here in Australia. I know that if you were to move back and re-apply for one, they would reinstate your old one rather than issuing a new one so if you can find that out that would be a good start. Have a read through here (as well as the Qs & As at the bottom) https://www.elodge.com.au/etax-au/lost-tfn-find-out-your-tax-file-number/#.V_8gEvl95hE

[Marisawright]

I thought there was a limit on how many years you could go back when it comes to paying the missing years? I've topped mine up recently and can't remember the details but I think I could back pay something like 5/6 years.

It is a good question though, how you prove you were resident and/or employed if haven't kept tax returns and employment details?

 

Oops you are right about the topping up. I think you can get stat decs from neighbours and friends

[Bungo]

Three years of missing contributions really would not make much difference to UK state pension would it? :err:

[BacktoDemocracy]

Hi Everyone,

Just wanted to say how much I enjoy reading this forum!

I lived in Australia for 3 years back in the 80s and really loved it but am guessing so many things have changed since, like everywhere. I met

some lovely people who I will remember forever, people from other countries as well as Australians and Brits.

Funnily enough I didn't realise just how homesick I had been until I actually returned home and that was after 6 months here!

Anyway, I wondered if anyone out there can help me? I worked full time in Australia for 3 years, paying tax and all the rest. However, stupidlyll

I kept no paper record of this and within the next 5 years I will be claiming my "old age" pension. Those years are missing from my record and

things have changed here recently it would seem and this means some kind of reduced pension for me.

I am keen to know which organisation I would contact in Australia to get some proof of what I paid as I was always led to believe that there is a reciprocal agreement between Australia and the UK in this matter.

Would be grateful for any snippets of info. I have looked on Google but remain confused!

Many thanks

 

Have you got a pension projection from the pension people at Newcastle, you can also log on the govt pension website and log into a part of it which will show you all the years you have paid NI contributions for and whether you have a full set of contributions for each year there may be other years where you do not have full contributions, if there are other gaps contact them to find out if you can bring them up to date, they are helpful and their maybe errors on their part, we were advised to do this by a adviser for my wife and found they had made a error with crediting payments for a self employed stamp in 2014 and so she was down a year which made a big difference, we are now rectifying the problem with their help.

[BacktoDemocracy]

Three years of missing contributions really would not make much difference to UK state pension would it? :err:

Yes it could be as much as 10% based on needing 30 years contribution history to qualify for full pension altho the whole system has changed this year to 35 years contributions (I THINK)

[ramot]

Three years of missing contributions really would not make much difference to UK state pension would it? :err:

 

I topped up my UK pension, having worked out that as long as I lived 2 years after it started I would be then be ahead with the extra received, 12 years later I am well ahead, so although I can't remember the % it was well worth it.

 

vaguely from memory I paid in 6,000pds. and had caught up within 2 years.

Edited October 13, 2016 by ramot

[DT55]

Three years of missing contributions really would not make much difference to UK state pension would it? :err:

 

I think with the new rules if you have less than 10 years you don't get anything at all so it could mean the difference between something and nothing at all

[AJ]

 

I think with the new rules if you have less than 10 years you don't get anything at all so it could mean the difference between something and nothing at all

So what happens with all the dole bludgers that have lived on the social all their days?

[Melbpom]

Have you got a pension projection from the pension people at Newcastle, you can also log on the govt pension website and log into a part of it which will show you all the years you have paid NI contributions for and whether you have a full set of contributions for each year

 

How do you log on? I can only find a section where you can order a statement which came in the mail. I did that a few years ago and maybe things have changed.

[BacktoDemocracy]

How do you log on? I can only find a section where you can order a statement which came in the mail. I did that a few years ago and maybe things have changed.

 

I've just checked myself and I can't find it, maybe they've taken it down because it generated so many queries like ours, but if you go onto the HMRC website and go to Check your NI record you will find a form to complete and telephone numbers, but the numbers are premium numbers, you can also order a pension forecast altho my forecast was 15%lower than I got eventually

[Wa7]

How do you log on? I can only find a section where you can order a statement which came in the mail. I did that a few years ago and maybe things have changed.

 

I looked at this in the last few days. I just typed uk pension and it brought up lots of gov.uk pages then I clicked on gov.uk check state pension and followed the prompts. It will ask you to have id so have some ready.

[BacktoDemocracy]

I've just checked myself and I can't find it, maybe they've taken it down because it generated so many queries like ours, but if you go onto the HMRC website and go to Check your NI record you will find a form to complete and telephone numbers, but the numbers are premium numbers, you can also order a pension forecast altho my forecast was 15%lower than I got eventually

There are 2 websites, NI is on HMRC and pensions is on dept of pensions, let me know if you can't find it and I'll check further.

[Northmavine14]

Hello

I am new to the site also with my own problems, but I would think the AUSTRALIAN TAX OFFICE could help you they seem to no everything about us hope it helps

Phone us | Australian Taxation Office

 

Thanks to you all for your help! All very useful. Yes, I do believe that 3 years makes a difference. The lesson here is, if you have lived in more than

one country, keep a note of NI number, payslips, everything I guess! The government gateway site in the UK is incredibly useful http://www.gateway.gov.uk/

for anyone wanting to check up on their UK pension, NHS pension, tax, NI payments. Does anyone know if there is a similar website for Australia?

I am guessing I will need to contact the Australian tax office as above for starters.

Thanks again, you are a grand bunch of folk!

[BacktoDemocracy]

How do you log on? I can only find a section where you can order a statement which came in the mail. I did that a few years ago and maybe things have changed.

I have checked again and I think they have changed it from an on line check to ordering a postal print out, I think because there were so many queries, it is still worth doing it tho.

[pommysheila]

Hi All

 

Just checked my paperwork and you have till 2017.

 

 

 

1. Home
2. Working, jobs and pensions
   
3. State Pension
   

 

 

 

1. [h=1]State Pension top up calculator[/h]
   

 

Until 5 April 2017 you’ll be able to apply to make a ‘Class 3A voluntary contribution’ to top up your State Pension by up to £25 per week.

Calculate how much you’ll need to contribute. You must be entitled to the State Pension and either:

 

 

• a man born before 6 April 1951
  
• a woman born before 6 April 1953
  

 

Start now

 

[h=3]What you need to know[/h]You can choose to top up your State Pension by between £1 and £25 per week. How much you’ll need to contribute depends on:

 

 

• how much extra pension you want to get each week
  
• how old you are when you make the contribution
  

 

 

ExampleYou are 68 years old in October 2015. You decide that you want to get an extra £5 per week (£260 a year) on top of your pension.

The cost of an extra £1 per week for a 68 year old is £827, so you multiply £827 by 5.

You’ll make a lump sum payment of £4,135.

 

 

Last updated: 13 October 2016

 

 

 

 

 

Is there anything wrong with this page?

[pommysheila]

You are still okay to pay NI.

 

 

 

1. Home
2. Working, jobs and pensions
   
3. State Pension
   

 

 

 

1. [h=1]State Pension top up calculator[/h]
   

 

Until 5 April 2017 you’ll be able to apply to make a ‘Class 3A voluntary contribution’ to top up your State Pension by up to £25 per week.

Calculate how much you’ll need to contribute. You must be entitled to the State Pension and either:

 

 

• a man born before 6 April 1951
  
• a woman born before 6 April 1953
  

 

Start now

 

[h=3]What you need to know[/h]You can choose to top up your State Pension by between £1 and £25 per week. How much you’ll need to contribute depends on:

 

 

• how much extra pension you want to get each week
  
• how old you are when you make the contribution
  

 

 

ExampleYou are 68 years old in October 2015. You decide that you want to get an extra £5 per week (£260 a year) on top of your pension.

The cost of an extra £1 per week for a 68 year old is £827, so you multiply £827 by 5.

You’ll make a lump sum payment of £4,135.

 

 

Last updated: 13 October 2016

 

 

 

 

 

Is there anything wrong with this page?

[Nemesis]

How do you log on? I can only find a section where you can order a statement which came in the mail. I did that a few years ago and maybe things have changed.

 

Try this link

 

https://www.tax.service.gov.uk/check-your-state-pension

 

You have to create an account but then it willgive you the figures.

[Marisawright]

I am guessing I will need to contact the Australian tax office as above for starters.

 

 

Like I said, as far as I'm aware they don't care two hoots about how much you earned, only that you were living in Australia during that time. Sworn statements (called statutory declarations in Australia) from your neighbours or friends would do the trick just as well. They can get a Justice of the Peace to witness them at most libraries.

[Melbpom]

Try this link

 

https://www.tax.service.gov.uk/check-your-state-pension

 

You have to create an account but then it willgive you the figures.

 

Thanks this worked.

[Northmavine14]

Have you got a pension projection from the pension people at Newcastle, you can also log on the govt pension website and log into a part of it which will show you all the years you have paid NI contributions for and whether you have a full set of contributions for each year there may be other years where you do not have full contributions, if there are other gaps contact them to find out if you can bring them up to date, they are helpful and their maybe errors on their part, we were advised to do this by a adviser for my wife and found they had made a error with crediting payments for a self employed stamp in 2014 and so she was down a year which made a big difference, we are now rectifying the problem with their help.

 

 

Have been investigating more! To get the full UK state pension it is still 35 years completed NI contributions. I contacted the International Pensions

Centre in the UK and it is only at the time of applying for the pension do they investigate and contact Australia themselves to see if I have anything due from there. As I already would have 35 years without that 3 years I worked in Oz it won't affect my pension. I can't see me having anything due

because someone has written here you have to have at least 10 years but it would appear that it won't affect me, I have still slogged for 38 years

so far and still have a reduced UK pension because of all the contracted out stuff (another story!).

Hope this helps in the future for anyone in my position. It is a minefield out there!

Thanks again everyone!

[Marisawright]

Have been investigating more! To get the full UK state pension it is still 35 years completed NI contributions. I contacted the International Pensions

Centre in the UK and it is only at the time of applying for the pension do they investigate and contact Australia themselves to see if I have anything due from there. As I already would have 35 years without that 3 years I worked in Oz it won't affect my pension.

 

If you've already got the 35 years then it probably doesn't affect you, BUT I have a pension forecast from the UK pensions office saying that once I'm resident in the UK, I can apply to have my years of work in Australia recognised towards the UK pension.

 

That is completely different from them checking to see whether I'm getting an Australian pension. It's getting years of residence in Australia recognised as equivalent to having paid NI contributions. You can only claim the years pre-2001 though.