Unemployment is climbing rapidly in Oz.

[Kezzles]

Not surprised so many Pommy HR advisors are struggling to get a job in Oz. No disrespect intended, but what do they know about Australian labour laws? Next to nothing. If I was an Australian employer I wouldn't touch them with a barge pole. Another thing I don't get is why anyone would want to leave the UK at the moment. The economy (and weather) is picking up. The feel good factor is back. 2013 has been an awesome year so far for Britain on so many levels. I have Aussie PR but I am in no rush right now to leave a country in recovery for one that is in sharp decline. Britain is beginning to boom and I'm lovin' it.

 

i find this really insulting! Every HR professional I know has the intellect to learn employment law and international legislation! Apart for the fair work act in oz HR is exactly the same in both countries.

Good job you're not an Australian employer looking for good HR people from the Uk!

[Kezzles]

You are absolutely right, as an HR specialist, we know nothing about Australian Labour Laws and unfortunately, no matter how much we have read up, we don't stand a chance against local candidates. The same would be the case for an Australian HR person coming to the UK. I have no problem with that. The problem or where many of us HR people got caught out, was that when we applied for our visas, the market was booming, there were more jobs than candidates and had we got out here at the time, we would have secured work because we had a pulse and had some HR experience, even if it was not local. However, it took 5 months from start to finish to get the visa (including time for ILETS, Skills Assessment/Medicals etc) and a further 5 months for my husband to be able to leave the armed forces, and in that time the market changed for the worse, much worse. Now it is the case that there are more candidates than jobs, so naturally they will go to the candidates with local experience. As an employer, if I had a choice of an HR person with local experience or one without, I would go for the one with local experience.

 

Unfortunately, HR people in the UK do not want to listen to what is happening here and are only wanting to hear good news. I see story after story from other HR people who are having the same issues. The HR people I have met who are working all moved out here during the boom years. Those who are planning to move and think that they will walk into a job if they try hard enough are setting themselves up for a huge fall and I would hate others to feel as despondent as I am feeling. Suffice to say, if we were still in the UK right now, we would be coming out to activate our visas, but delaying the move until the market improves. The irony is, that the area of HR I worked in is booming and I could get a contract in London tomorrow if I was back there, but our circumstances now mean that, even if I wanted to, we could not move back, so I just have to keep my fingers crossed and keep trying.

 

thats a bit of a generalisation stating that HR people on here don't want to hear the truth! All information is good to know whether its positive or negative. I'm keeping an open mind and remaining positive! We have just taken on an Aussie HR professional with noUK experience and she was replaced in Brisbane by UK HR girl with no local experience so one size does not fit all! I don't think anyone thinks they will be walking into a job as they step off the plane that's just ignorant and I think if you go with some of the attitudes I've seen on here you don't stand a chance whatever profession! I'm willing to move into another area of work if it means gaining 'local ' experience and hoping word of mouth with friends and family already in Oz will boost this along! I guess I'm lucky we don't have child commitments we are both flexible and treating this as an adventure if it don't work out hey ho at least we tried!

[fourcorners]

We have already seen evidence of desperation from those unemployed looking for a job. One guy was seen walking along the Kalgoorlie bypass road holding a placard saying 'give me a job', others are offering cash or rum (?) to anyone who can find them a job. I know about 4 people who have been made redundant and forced to return to the UK as they are on 457 visas. A couple others, who are Australian, have gone travelling as they know they won't be able to get a job for a while.

 

Personally, even though my job is in demand, I would not consider moving here without a secure permanent job lined up. If we didn't have jobs lined up we would have maybe lasted 3 months, which when it is said that it takes at least 3 months to find work, leads to a very stressful situation. Not exactly a dream lifestyle....

[Que Sera Sera]

But your job isn't secure for the first year anyway , your employer can dismiss you at any time during that year. Even if you have a job lined up you may get here and the employer decides at the end of your trial that you aren't up to it.

[Jessica Berry]

Apart for the fair work act in oz HR is exactly the same in both countries.

 

Having worked in HR in the UK and Australia, I don't believe this statement is true. There are many differences and as you are not yet living/working in HR in Australia, I think it shows your lack of knowledge making this statement.

[fourcorners]

But your job isn't secure for the first year anyway , your employer can dismiss you at any time during that year. Even if you have a job lined up you may get here and the employer decides at the end of your trial that you aren't up to it.

 

It's pretty rare to hear of people being let go before their trial period, it usually means they are useless or the company is in a dire financial position. My trial period was 6 months, and I had no worries about retaining my job. In any case a job is far better than no job, even if it only lasts a couple of months. At least you get some Au$ in the bank and some Aus experience on your CV.

 

I personally don't believe any job is totally secure. At the end of the day anyone could be laid off at any time.

[Que Sera Sera]

It's pretty rare to hear of people being let go before their trial period, it usually means they are useless or the company is in a dire financial position. My trial period was 6 months, and I had no worries about retaining my job. In any case a job is far better than no job, even if it only lasts a couple of months. At least you get some Au$ in the bank and some Aus experience on your CV.

 

I personally don't believe any job is totally secure. At the end of the day anyone could be laid off at any time.

 

Its actually happened in my OH's workplace a number of times in the 3 years my OH has been there. It becomes apparent quite quickly that these guys are " bigging" themselves up on their cv's saying they can do jobs that quickly become apparent they haven't a clue.

[fourcorners]

Its actually happened in my OH's workplace a number of times in the 3 years my OH has been there. It becomes apparent quite quickly that these guys are " bigging" themselves up on their cv's saying they can do jobs that quickly become apparent they haven't a clue.

 

Sounds like they need to employ one of the many HR people that are struggling to find work, someone needs to check references properly!

[Que Sera Sera]

Sounds like they need to employ one of the many HR people that are struggling to find work, someone needs to check references properly!

 

Yeah like me! :wink:

[Jessica Berry]

Having worked in HR/recruitment in Australia, I know people that have been 'let go' simply because someone took a dislike to them or they upset the wrong person. In my experience, it is more common here than what I experienced in the UK, to terminate somones employment in their probation period. A lot of people are now on temporary contracts or contracts through recruitment agencies and the termination period in the contracts I have signed at the agencies have been between 1 and 4 hours.

 

We never worried in the UK about losing our jobs, but here I do feel it is more of a reality. I have personally made sure that I am skilled/experienced/qualified in several areas of work so that if one area dries up I can move into another area. My partner and I make sure we have a set amount of money saved up as a backup in case anything happens, we feel that we need to make that provision here.

 

I suppose I see things from the other side having worked in HR/recruitment and I see how the majority of people never see it coming when they lose their jobs. Statistically it is saying that the average time it takes to secure work is 3 months, so in my opinion people need to make provision in case it happens to them.

[Kezzles]

Having worked in HR in the UK and Australia, I don't believe this statement is true. There are many differences and as you are not yet living/working in HR in Australia, I think it shows your lack of knowledge making this statement.

 

Im not getting into a slanging match about this as I appreciate as much info as possible! As you don't know me or know where I have lived and worked etc I don't think you have any right to tell me what Knowledge I do have or not!

[VERYSTORMY]

i find this really insulting! Every HR professional I know has the intellect to learn employment law and international legislation! Apart for the fair work act in oz HR is exactly the same in both countries.

Good job you're not an Australian employer looking for good HR people from the Uk!

 

I don't think you understood what the comment was. There are a LOT of HR people looking for work at the moment. There are a number of members on here desperate for work. So, your CV lands on the desk of the person recruiting. Do they take you, or one of the 200 that already know the legislation and things? It's a bit of a no brainer. It is like my game. I recently recruited. I had loads of CV's. Some from people I know, respect and regard highly, but for the role in question, they would have needed some training. At the same time, I had a lot from people that were a 100% match - in fact better than. I had to take the one that could walk into it immediately. All the companies here are slashing training budgets so the last thing they want to do is recruit someone who needs training.

 

There are also cultural type issues that only a local HR person will be familiar with. For example, a lot of the HR people in Perth recently will have been involved in making redundancies. Now, in mining, you can follow the law and pay out accordingly. In which case you will see a strike pretty quick as it is accepted that miners get a MUCH higher pay out. There are a million other similar things.

[Kezzles]

I don't think you understood what the comment was. There are a LOT of HR people looking for work at the moment. There are a number of members on here desperate for work. So, your CV lands on the desk of the person recruiting. Do they take you, or one of the 200 that already know the legislation and things? It's a bit of a no brainer. It is like my game. I recently recruited. I had loads of CV's. Some from people I know, respect and regard highly, but for the role in question, they would have needed some training. At the same time, I had a lot from people that were a 100% match - in fact better than. I had to take the one that could walk into it immediately. All the companies here are slashing training budgets so the last thing they want to do is recruit someone who needs training.

 

There are also cultural type issues that only a local HR person will be familiar with. For example, a lot of the HR people in Perth recently will have been involved in making redundancies. Now, in mining, you can follow the law and pay out accordingly. In which case you will see a strike pretty quick as it is accepted that miners get a MUCH higher pay out. There are a million other similar things.

 

Everyone is entitled to their opinion but that one I quoted on was not adding any value to anyone looking for advice! I appreciate your reply as its far more informative.

I work in a highly unionised environment so fully aware of strikes and threats etc. I also won't be asking for training as I have been advised what I need to do beforehand with AHRI. Each place I've worked as a different culture (inc my time in oz) so I know how difficult getting to grips with 'the way things are done round here' I'm can adapt and pick up things really quickly and like I said if it don't work out then least we gave it a go eh!

[VERYSTORMY]

Everyone is entitled to their opinion but that one I quoted on was not adding any value to anyone looking for advice! I appreciate your reply as its far more informative.

I work in a highly unionised environment so fully aware of strikes and threats etc. I also won't be asking for training as I have been advised what I need to do beforehand with AHRI. Each place I've worked as a different culture (inc my time in oz) so I know how difficult getting to grips with 'the way things are done round here' I'm can adapt and pick up things really quickly and like I said if it don't work out then least we gave it a go eh!

 

It's not being aware of dealing with unions. It is being aware of the sub cultures. For example, if you make a miner redundant, the law says something like 2 weeks pay per year of service. But, the culture is an expectation of 4 months salary per year.

 

Putting on my employers head. Why would I employ you? If I have advertised for a HR advisor and I have a couple of hundred qualified people's CV's on my desk do you think I am even going to interview the ones that have none of the elusive Oz experience? No. They would be the first ones to get the standard email. Thank you for your application......

[Paul1Perth]

What did Oz do before the mining boom?

 

We came out in 92, without a thought about what Australians did for jobs. Just figured it would be like the UK, plenty of people living here and managing, in big City's to country towns, so must be jobs around eh. I'm in IT with a degree but with a mechanical background with an apprenticeship too, wife is a nurse, just figured something will turn up and it did. What did parts of the UK do after Maggie managed to shut down the pits? Might be a bad comparison, as I know some places have never really recovered, but people still lived and worked in Derbyshire, Yorkshire, Nottinghamshire, Rhonda Valleys, Newcastle and people are still there now.

 

They might be working in Tesco's but they are still there doing something and getting by.

[Red Rose]

It's not being aware of dealing with unions. It is being aware of the sub cultures. For example, if you make a miner redundant, the law says something like 2 weeks pay per year of service. But, the culture is an expectation of 4 months salary per year.

 

Putting on my employers head. Why would I employ you? If I have advertised for a HR advisor and I have a couple of hundred qualified people's CV's on my desk do you think I am even going to interview the ones that have none of the elusive Oz experience? No. They would be the first ones to get the standard email. Thank you for your application......

 

Exactly.

[Kezzles]

We came out in 92, without a thought about what Australians did for jobs. Just figured it would be like the UK, plenty of people living here and managing, in big City's to country towns, so must be jobs around eh. I'm in IT with a degree but with a mechanical background with an apprenticeship too, wife is a nurse, just figured something will turn up and it did. What did parts of the UK do after Maggie managed to shut down the pits? Might be a bad comparison, as I know some places have never really recovered, but people still lived and worked in Derbyshire, Yorkshire, Nottinghamshire, Rhonda Valleys, Newcastle and people are still there now.

 

They might be working in Tesco's but they are still there doing something and getting by.

 

Good on you! Well said :biggrin:

[Paul1Perth]

So, what you are saying is, take a big knock back on career. A big knock on salary and a big knock on lifestyle. Particularly for more senior staff. It begs the question as to why bother. Oz has the highest working hours in the developed world. Some of the highest cost housing. Some of the highest cost of living and your answer is to take a cut?

 

If you are not that fussed about being in Aus then don't bother. If, on the other hand you like it here and think you can get by and stay here by doing something for less money then go for it. Less money might mean less stress, less working hours, more of a chance to relax, go down the beach and enjoy what Aus has to offer for free in spades.

[Paul1Perth]

Ultimately people migrate to improve their standard of living. It's impossible to make sweeping generalisations as everyone's circumstances and priorities are different, that includes where they are going from and to.

 

I have met people that by the sounds of it had quite nice lives in the UK, came to Australia found it a real struggle and eventually went home. Sure you could tell them to give it longer, take a step back to increase chances of getting a job etc. But I can fully understand people not being willing to make such hardships if they believe they had a better standard of living at home, so long as they give it a good go in Australia first (ie at least a few months).

 

And before anyone points out that such people shouldn't bother trying, there is no way anyone can know for sure without trying for real and hindsight is a wonderful thing.

 

Standard of living didn't come into our considerations. Lifestyle did, but the things we enjoy doing are mostly free.

[Paul1Perth]

Fryertuck..I have to agree.

 

My brother is here to look for work. Like you and your wife he is highly skilled in the Boilermaker arena and fills three positions on the short skills Immigration list. He paid thousands of pounds to get the visa and jump through hoops to get his certificates through.

 

He hit the ground running when he got here, updating his CV, sending information to the recruiters such as Seek etc. and visiting recruiters at their offices. And still NOTHING. He's been here about 7 weeks and is fed up.

 

I don't get it. How can Australia say they need these skilled workers and when they get here there is no job and its a not what you know but who you know network. And this major wall of having to go through **** recruiters that don't know what they are looking for is just damned intolerable.

 

He's now resorting to looking for any job. What a waste of his 25 years plus of hard earned skills - it just gets me mad.

 

Anyhow - He's given himself another couple of months and then he has to review what he is going to do.

 

Maybe you're right Fryertuck - come back in 2 years but by then he will have to do his PR visa again. So a bit of a quandary.

 

I'm wishing luck to everyone searching for job. Keep up the searching and keep your chins up.

 

& weeks in not that long really. If he had moved to somewhere new in the UK and had to get a resume together, submit it, apply for jobs and wait for interviews I doubt whether he would be fixed up in less than 7 weeks there either. Unless he knew someone who knew someone else with a job going, bit like here really. I got made redundant once in the UK and was panicking, not long married, first mortgage, newly born, recession, out of work a couple of months and then got offered 3 jobs in a week, hopefully it'll turn round for your brother.

 

I was out of work for 5 months when we first came but never been out of work in 22 years.

[Kezzles]

It's not being aware of dealing with unions. It is being aware of the sub cultures. For example, if you make a miner redundant, the law says something like 2 weeks pay per year of service. But, the culture is an expectation of 4 months salary per year.

 

Putting on my employers head. Why would I employ you? If I have advertised for a HR advisor and I have a couple of hundred qualified people's CV's on my desk do you think I am even going to interview the ones that have none of the elusive Oz experience? No. They would be the first ones to get the standard email. Thank you for your application......

 

You obviously wouldn't! putting on my employers head I'd recruit the best person for job with or without 'local' experience but I guess maybe some in oz have different views on this. I'm still hopeful I can crack it and land myself some work! I'll shear sheep if it pays my way lol!

[Incata]

We have already seen evidence of desperation from those unemployed looking for a job. One guy was seen walking along the Kalgoorlie bypass road holding a placard saying 'give me a job', others are offering cash or rum (?) to anyone who can find them a job. I know about 4 people who have been made redundant and forced to return to the UK as they are on 457 visas. A couple others, who are Australian, have gone travelling as they know they won't be able to get a job for a while.

 

Personally, even though my job is in demand, I would not consider moving here without a secure permanent job lined up. If we didn't have jobs lined up we would have maybe lasted 3 months, which when it is said that it takes at least 3 months to find work, leads to a very stressful situation. Not exactly a dream lifestyle....

 

Those offering rum will be ex-Navy :wink:

[Diane]

You obviously wouldn't! putting on my employers head I'd recruit the best person for job with or without 'local' experience but I guess maybe some in oz have different views on this. I'm still hopeful I can crack it and land myself some work! I'll shear sheep if it pays my way lol!

 

You'd of course be competing with several others who had intimate knowledge of the local sheep... so probably wouldn't stand a chance!

 

I admire your positivity, but think you may be burying your head in the sand a little, only hearing what you want to hear and assuming all those that say the opposite don't know what they are talking about. The way things were even just two years ago is totally different to how it is now.... there are a lot of locals in all cities really struggling to either find work, or to hold onto the jobs they already have, through no fault of their own. Several companies are working shorter weeks, with correspondingly lower wages, just to try and keep their staff on through the tough times, the 'published' unemployment figures are way below the actual numbers, even in fields such as nursing and teaching - traditionally the areas there has always been a need of skilled migrants. The shortages that were identified a few years ago have now disappeared, and it's no longer the case that those 'who want to work and are prepared to work hard at anything they can get' will be ok.

[Kezzles]

You'd of course be competing with several others who had intimate knowledge of the local sheep... so probably wouldn't stand a chance!

 

I admire your positivity, but think you may be burying your head in the sand a little, only hearing what you want to hear and assuming all those that say the opposite don't know what they are talking about. The way things were even just two years ago is totally different to how it is now.... there are a lot of locals in all cities really struggling to either find work, or to hold onto the jobs they already have, through no fault of their own. Several companies are working shorter weeks, with correspondingly lower wages, just to try and keep their staff on through the tough times, the 'published' unemployment figures are way below the actual numbers, even in fields such as nursing and teaching - traditionally the areas there has always been a need of skilled migrants. The shortages that were identified a few years ago have now disappeared, and it's no longer the case that those 'who want to work and are prepared to work hard at anything they can get' will be ok.

 

Ive never once said that people on here don't know what they are talking about why would I, I don't know them or their experiences! I've said information on here is invaluable to those lOoking to move but when you get flippant comments from some people it's not helpful! Majority of people on here are helpful informative and friendly! I do not bury my head in the sand so don't know why you have said that??? I can only go on what my friends and family have said from living and working in oz, they all have jObs etc and have settled in well so why wouldn't I or others be able to do the same? I know it won't be easy but I have the determination to try that's all I can do! If that's burying my head in the sand so be it!

[beach pig]

i find this really insulting! Every HR professional I know has the intellect to learn employment law and international legislation! Apart for the fair work act in oz HR is exactly the same in both countries.

Good job you're not an Australian employer looking for good HR people from the Uk!

 

no disrespect but tell that to the plumbers and electricians who come out here.They find they have to go back to school to retrain to tell them what they was taught 20yrs ago .