Back from Oz

[Guest pudley]

i Grew Up In England And Moved To Oz With My Australian Girlfriend After I Graduated . I Lived In Melbourne For The Next 3 Years And Had A Great Time, But Towards The End Of The 3 Years Realised That Better Weather Wasn’t Everything In Life. I Had Reached A Bit Of A Dead-end Career-wise (due In No Small Part To Aussie Bureaucracy) And Decided To Move Home About A Year Ago.

Coming Back To The Uk Felt Like Waking Up From A Deep Sleep. The Speed With Which Things Happen Was Really Refreshing And Things That I’d Taken For Granted Previously Suddenly Became Really Appreciated.

Some Of The People On This Website (and In General) Strike Me As Incredibly Naive With Regards To Australia, Making Comments About The Place Either Without Ever Being There Or Having Just Arrived And Blinded By Sunshine. They Seem To Think That Moving To Oz Will Result In One Big Beach Party, One Never Ending Barbeque And Talk About The Place As If It Was The Garden Of Eden. Sorry, It Isn’t.

Being Realistic, You Will Do Essentially The Same Things As You Do Here: Commute To Work, Work, Commute To Home, Eat, Watch Tv, Go Out, Sleep, Repeat, Repeat, Weekend. Having Held Several Jobs In Oz, I Worked With A Vast Number Of Different Of Local People, Primarily In A Similar Age Bracket (20-30) And Of A Similar Background (relatively Middle-class And Mostly Degree-educated). This Pattern Generally Holds True.

Unless You Live In London You Are Likely To Spend Longer On Your Commute In Australian Cities. Many Of My Friends Thought Nothing Of Travelling An Hour Each Way To Work, In Fact Several Even Had Longer Journeys Combining Driving To Their Local Train Station, Catching A Train Into The City And Then Tram To Their Office. Very Concentrated Cbds And Virtually Unchecked Suburban Sprawl Means That People Often Live Huge Distances From Their Place Work. I Now Live On The Edge Of Leeds, 5 Miles From The City Centre. In Melbourne This Would Be Classed As An Inner Suburb. Where I Live Now Is Walking Distance From Rolling Hills, Cows, Sheep, Literally A Couple Of Miles To The Dales.

The Unemployment Rate Is Higher In Oz And Depending On What Industry You Work In, You Are Likely To Find More Job Opportunities In The Uk And Likely To Get Paid More For The Same Work, Especially If You Are A Skilled Professional. If You Don’t Live In The South-east Of England, The Cost Of Living Is Very Similar. Coming From The Yorkshire, I Actually Found Sydney Expensive And Melbourne Comparable. There Are Overs And Unders, Sure, But Averaged Out Across A ‘basket Of Goods’ Prices Were Very Close – Its Certainly Not As Cheap As The States And Not Nearly As Cheap As Smug Locals Would Have You Believe.

You Seem To Get More Public Holidays In Australia But Less Annual Leave. 4 Weeks Is Standard, Where Many Employers In The Uk Now Offer 5 Or Even 6 Weeks (even If It Is Salary-sacrificed Into Flexible Benefits Packages). The Holidays Are All Bunched Up Around Christmas – That’s Also Their Summer Holiday Because Of The Reversed Seasons. Apart From Afl, Nothing Seems To Happen There Over Winter (actually Most Of The Year Round Come To Think Of It).

With Your Time Off Their Is Infinitely More Things To Do In The Uk, Or At Least From The Uk. Generally 2 Hours Travelling Time Is What You Want To Arrive At Your Destination Of Choice. Within 2 Hours I Could Be In Paris. 2 Hours From Melbourne And I’d Be Driving Through Never-ending Nothingness, On The Way To Wolf Creek Probably.

Having Been Back In The Uk For About 12 Months, I Have Had A Much Outdoors Lifestyle Than In Oz. It May Be Warmer There, But You Seem To Spend Your Life In An Air-conditioned Cocoon. Since Being Back I Have Played More Golf, Gone Walking In The Dales And The Lake District (there Is Nothing That I Saw In Oz That Can Compare To These In Terms Of Beauty). From Where I Now Live, I Can Go On Day Trips To York And Harrogate And Go To Lovely Country Pubs For Sunday Dinner. I Have Only Been Back A Year But Have Already Been For Weekends Away To Prague And Paris, Worked In Chicago For A Fortnight And Am Going To Tuscany In June. These Sort Of Opportunities Simply Do Not Exist From Australia. Once You Are There, It Is Very Long Way To Anything Else.

Don’t Get Me Started On Australian Tv (non-stop American Reality Show Imports Littered With Adverts). The Music Scene Is Awful. The Food Is Strictly Greek/italian Or Viet/thai. Nobody Has Heard Of Tapas. Curries Are Almost Impossible To Find. And French Food Might As Well Not Exist.

A Lot Of People Cite Their Children As The Prime Reason For Emigrating Which I Find Quite Strange. As If A Bigger Garden And A Bit More Sunshine Is All Kids Need!

Did I Think My Friends And Colleagues Were Any Happier Or More Rounded Individuals As A Result Of Growing Up In Australia? Certainly Not. For Most Of The People I Know In Australia, Many Have Rarely Been Outside The State Of Victoria. The Vast Majority Have Only Been Outside Of Their Home Country Once Or Twice, Generally On A Year Out Working In A Bar In London, ‘doing’ All Of Europe In A 3 Week Contiki Tour.

Whilst, I Count Many Australians Amongst My Best Friends, I Have To Admit That On The Whole, The Geographic Isolation And Inward-focused Media Leaves Them Relatively Uncultured, Often Quite Narrow-minded And Occassionally Extremely Bigotted When Compared To People Of Similar Socio-economic Backgrounds In The Uk. Those That Don’t Believe Me Should Have Been In Oz When The Shappelle Corby Case Was In The News. The Way People I Knew (and The Country As A Whole) Reacted To It Made Me Embarrassed To Be In The Country At The Time.

There Is Massive Problems Of Drug Abuse (especially Crystal Meth And Heroin) And Gambling Is Seen As Socially Acceptable, Normal Even. People Who Think That Anti-social Behaviour Is Purely A British Problem Are Absolutely Deluding Themselves. My ‘neighbours’ In Melbourne Used To Use Our Stairwell As A Urinal. Fights In Pubs And On The Street Are Commonplace, Often Much More Violent Than In The Uk. My Girlfriend’s Cousin Recently Had A Freind Die In Her Arms From Stab Wounds Inflicted After A Fight Out In Perth. Another Friends Of Mine Has Permanent Damage To His Eyes After A Gang Jumped Him In St Kilda And Kicked And Scratched And Gouged At Him, Completely Unprovoked. Young People Get Involved In Illegal Drag-races Out In The Suburbs Every Single Weekend. If You Keep An Eye On The Local News You May Also Have Heard About The Cronulla Race Riots, Premier Brack’s Daughter Recently Being Taken To A & E After Underage Binge-drinking And Yobs Defacing The Anzac Memorial. People Who Think This Stuff Doesn’t Happen In Australia Are, Frankly, Living In Cloud Cuckoo Land.

Because Of The Nature Of The Work I Do, Most Of The People I Worked With Had Been To University. Because Of The Financial Constraints Of Tertiary Education In Australia, The Majority Of People I Knew Had Both Lived At Home And Worked Part Time To Fund Their Studies. University Was 3 Of The Best Years Of My Life, Mostly As A Result Of Living Away From Home And Being Completely Immersed In The Student Way Of Life. The Australians I Know Have A Massive Void In Their Experience As A Result.

I Grew Up In A Small Village In A Rural Area. As A Result We Had Big A Massive Garden. Did This Make My Childhood More Enjoyable? No. The Things I Enjoyed Most Were Trips Abroad Or Knowing That I Would Be Able To Do What I Wanted In Life, Going Away To University And Having The World At My Feet.

I Used To Go On Holiday At Least Once A Year Either With My Family Or With School. The Furthest Kids Go In Oz Is On School Camp To Maloooonlongatta Or Somewhere Else Completely Irrelevant.

 

For People Like Myself, Young, Ambitious And Cultured, Australia Has Very Little To Offer. From England I May Not Have The Time And Money To Do Everything That I Want To Do. Trapped In Australia, However, There Simply Weren’t Enough Things To Keep Me Occupied. The World Is An Amazing Place, I Couldn’t Be Removed That Far Removed From It Again. People Contemplating A Move To Oz Should Really Look Beyond The Beaches And Shiny Office Buildings Before They Decide To Sacrifice All The Things They Take For Granted.

Agree With Every Thing You Said And When My Kids Reach 16 And Their Father Has No Say I Shall Be Right There Matey !! No More Shrimps On The Barbie For Me Cobber !!!!

[Guest earlswood]

A lot of people cite their children as the prime reason for emigrating which I find quite strange. As if a bigger garden and a bit more sunshine is all kids need!

 

 

Dear Gags,

 

Not everyone on here who wants to move to Oz are middle class, university educated people who only associate themselves with other middle class snobs which i assume you do going by the amount of times you felt compelled to bring it up. Personally i believe that qualifications do not make anyone a better person, i work with someone who has degrees coming out his pores but is a very nasty person. However one of my best friends has practically no qualifications but spends her life looking after children with leukemia and cancer and helps their families have happier lives - i know which of these two people are more worthwhile!!

 

Obviously you prefer Britain to Oz and that is your prerogative but it does not mean that you should criticise other people for wanting to find out if there is a better life for them elsewhere - just as you originally did!

 

You quoted that you seem to think that people who claim to want a better life for their children, believe this means a bigger garden with sunshine will accomplish this. I live in Scotland and have a huge beautiful garden which is totally pointless when all we can do is look at it through wet french doors. It is too wet for my children to play out and on the occasion it is dry, it is too cold. We live near numerous adventure parks, farm parks and nature areas but they're not much fun when they are full of muddy puddles. Children in this country tend to spend their time in the house avoiding the weather so therefore a large garden WITH SUNSHINE would improve their lives. They would also be able to enjoy fresh air during school breaks and not have to sit in damp clothes at school all day because they got drenched just going from the car to the school door.

 

If we all get to Oz and its everything we hoped for then great, if not and we hate it then we will come home but nobody should be made to feel foolish and naive for hoping for a better life!

 

Maz

 

That's Scotland for you Mag's...ever thought of the south coast of England which gets good mild weather almost all year around....infact Perth has more annual rainfall than London.

 

 

 

Just a thought.

[Maz]

Dear Earlswood,

 

Thanks for your suggestion about South England instead of Oz but unfortunately thats not quite what my lifes ambition has been, still reckon Oz has more to offer than Britain, especially at the moment with a full blown recession on its way.

 

I got made redundant on Monday and my oh also got paid off on Tuesday with no sign of another job for either of us anytime soon. Between trying to save for a wedding in 2 months time, honeymoon to Oz and moving to Oz hopefully asap, South England would probably be more financially within our reach at the moment! Plus wouldn't take as long :sad:

 

So you never know it might be England after all!

 

Maz

[Guest caza75]

hi gags,

while everyone will have their own thoughts on oz you are coming across as someone who had a bad experience while there..

 

i feel you are being unfair to the country as this is only your view an maybe when you have been livin back in the uk for A few years you will think differently.

 

people come on to this site to gain info about the country not to listen to some one who has sour grapes an slag oz off:realmad:

we are not all livin in cloud cuckoo land but we should not be slated for wantin a better life outside the uk an if oz is the dump you portray it to be why were there 40,000

visa applications last year?????

 

you can share your experience but not to the degree that you have as we just dont want to hear about it:nah:

 

caza

[MACDONALDO67]

We're waiting for the next £10 Pomes deal coz that's the only way we're going to get over there, FACT!

 

Bloody credit crunch !

[buckbuchanan]

Unfortunately (what you don't hear) is that of these 40,000 visas issued, 20,000 of these end up going back home within the first 3 years. I guess the remaining 20,000 can't afford to get home so are stuck over here!

I think having a go at gags is a bit dumb. Partly because he is right, but also because he is trying to help. People "wanting to make a better life for themselves" should take his words onboard and think very carefully before moving here - they may just make a worse life for themselves.

The most concerning line in your post was "we don't want to hear about your gripes" - that is a line which has massive potential to come back and bite you in the bum!!

[Mongrel]

hi gags,

while everyone will have their own thoughts on oz you are coming across as someone who had a bad experience while there..

 

i feel you are being unfair to the country as this is only your view an maybe when you have been livin back in the uk for A few years you will think differently.

 

people come on to this site to gain info about the country not to listen to some one who has sour grapes an slag oz off:realmad:

we are not all livin in cloud cuckoo land but we should not be slated for wantin a better life outside the uk an if oz is the dump you portray it to be why were there 40,000

visa applications last year?????

 

you can share your experience but not to the degree that you have as we just dont want to hear about it:nah:

 

caza

 

There was an article in the West australian (WA newspaper) about the state industry and commerce want a relaxation on the visa process(language) because they want to invite more chinese and indians

 

Malx

[saunders clan]

Unfortunately (what you don't hear) is that of these 40,000 visas issued, 20,000 of these end up going back home within the first 3 years. I guess the remaining 20,000 can't afford to get home so are stuck over here!

I think having a go at gags is a bit dumb. Partly because he is right, but also because he is trying to help. People "wanting to make a better life for themselves" should take his words onboard and think very carefully before moving here - they may just make a worse life for themselves.

The most concerning line in your post was "we don't want to hear about your gripes" - that is a line which has massive potential to come back and bite you in the bum!!

 

 

And a percentage of those 20,000 just love life in Oz and will never return home.

[Guest caza75]

i am not dumb, an as for havin a go i am only voicing my opinion an if i thought for one minute oz was not for me i would not be on this site .... it seems that people are usin it for a slanging match when things piss them off

dont go to oz if it not for you but please do not try an put others off an i also dont believe that if you wanted to come back ,that you would get the plane ticket from somewhere:realmad: it not that expensive for a one way ticket

[Guest austibeach]

I'm not quite sure why this thread continues to run, as it's origin is over 12 months old. Gags was, and is, perfectly within the rights of this forum to voice his opinions, (even though I disagree with most of them ), but one man's experience is highly unlikely to be the same as any other person's view.

You will all make your decisions to go to Australia, or indeed return from Australia, based on what is happening in your life not someone elses. To point out what you have found to be negatives can be helpful to some, but it is unlikely that there are many on here that consider a move to Australia is a positive experience all the way. Of course there are pitfalls and a good many things that you won't like about the country, but in making your decision to go, it will be because for you in any case, the positives as you see them, outweigh the negatives.

The streets are not paved with gold, the sun doesn't always shine, but for most of the people on this forum, the need for them to move on and try a new stage in their life is something they have thought long and hard about.

I would suggest that anyone wishing to highlight anything that they consider is a negative about life in Australia, does it in a more constructive manner and not merely assume that everyone is approaching the move with their "head in the clouds", or looking through " rose tinted glasses".

Good luck to everyone in pursuit of their happiness.

 

Eric.

[joetrac]

i am not dumb, an as for havin a go i am only voicing my opinion an if i thought for one minute oz was not for me i would not be on this site .... it seems that people are usin it for a slanging match when things piss them off

dont go to oz if it not for you but please do not try an put others off an i also dont believe that if you wanted to come back ,that you would get the plane ticket from somewhere:realmad: it not that expensive for a one way ticket

 

Listen we are the people who were on this site looking for advice...we have been in your shoes...and before we came over not alot of people had landed so we didnt hear these views....GOD I wish we had. We have a right to come on here and say how we find OZ good or Bad.... And its not just about a plane ticket is it??? People have shipped there whole life here and as you know how long that can take you will appreciate that it takes the same to ship back......do you really think people emigrated to hate this place..... It called POMSIN OZ.....for people who are emigrating...AND LIVING HERE !!

[Quoll]

hi gags,

while everyone will have their own thoughts on oz you are coming across as someone who had a bad experience while there..

 

i feel you are being unfair to the country as this is only your view an maybe when you have been livin back in the uk for A few years you will think differently.

 

people come on to this site to gain info about the country not to listen to some one who has sour grapes an slag oz off:realmad:

we are not all livin in cloud cuckoo land but we should not be slated for wantin a better life outside the uk an if oz is the dump you portray it to be why were there 40,000

visa applications last year?????

 

you can share your experience but not to the degree that you have as we just dont want to hear about it

 

caza

 

One hesitates to say that if you dont want to hear about it, dont read it.

 

I have no idea why this thread got resurrected a little while ago but it did and it seems to have riled people no end. The bloke gave what, IMHO was actually quite a reasonable view of his experience and his experience of being back in UK. I must also say that there is a great deal of truth in what he said from my experience too and I have absolutely no doubt that my son, who now lives in UK would agree with him too (I showed him the post and he said it was spot on but he didnt write it!). To knock the bloke for having a contrary view is quite unfair. To knock those of us who happen to have actually lived here and who agree with him is similarly unfair.

 

I have absolutely no difficulty with people wanting a bit of adventure in their lives, heck, we all did it - I even lived in Papua New Guinea, now that WAS an adventure. But when people tell you that your life experiences are wrong just because they saw a tv program which said so (and you wouldnt believe the power of the telly in persuading people to chuck in perfectly good lives in UK to come and live here with possibly less good outcomes) then a rebuttal is quite justifiable. One wonders how many of the 40,000 visa applicants were addicted to Wanted Down Under!

 

Of course there are some outrageous statements on here by people who just love stirring and if you cant see the tongue in cheek and black humour associated with them then you are going to be in for a hard time as a settler here:no:

 

I sometimes think that if people put as much time, energy and enthusiasm into their lives in UK as they do in trying to get to Australia they would have such a bloody good time there that they would never want to leave.

[ali]

I don't think Gags ever posted again - or replied to his own thread. Lets hope that means he's happy wherever he is living .... at the end of the day that's what really matters

 

Ali

[Guest BIG_E]

well ive been here 4 months now, ive read pio quite a lot and im a bit surprised that no one has mentioned what a really dislikeable bunch the aussies are, and in response to the guy who said that the aussies are rascists i have to say that its a fair description.

[Guest Aldo]

well ive been here 4 months now, ive read pio quite a lot and im a bit surprised that no one has mentioned what a really dislikeable bunch the aussies are, and in response to the guy who said that the aussies are rascists i have to say that its a fair description.

 

i've said it a thousand times "aussies are the most unfriendly, rude, ignorant and up-them-self people i have ever met.... That siad i have met a few good uns, although they usualy have a pommie partner or european conections...

[Petals]

Very interesting thread and if you want to go back to the UK its fine, put your stay down to experience.

 

However I take issue with entertainment and things to do, I believe you make your own entertainment wherever you live, don't expect to be entertained, you can be happy anywhere if you have the right mindset and outlook on life. If our lives are boring is out own fault not where we are.

 

In Australia in the wheat belt where my son taught for three years, he was never home, he was always somewhere doing something involved in so many things, people there have a real life because they make it themselves, do not rely on a city or a theatre or cafes, restaurants to entertain them. They are real people, most of them are wealthy but they choose to stay there. They travel overseas just the same as everyone else but they are so happy with their lot.

 

You can look all your life and never be happy with your lot. Live every day of your life don't wish it away long time dead.

 

In my experience people who move around a lot are not happy and often flit backwards and forwards always looking.

[buckbuchanan]

I have to disagree strongly with this post. I've made some of the most negative posts about Australia on this site, but the one thing that I have said since day 1 is that I have found the aussies great people. I have never come accross such friendly and helpful people anywhere else. If you walk down the street strangers say g'day to you. When you go to shops or cafes the waiters come and chat to you (you don't get that in the UK).

 

I'm sure there are lots of exceptions to this, but I haven't experienced it. I think you have either been very unlucky with the people you came into contact with, or you have taken them too seriously.

[Guest cobblers]

Well here we are - another can of worms well and truly opened!

 

Gags - Personally I agree with most of your sentiments, that is how my OH and I feel about Oz (hence we are returning to UK next year).

 

May I just say to everyone that have once again jumped on someone for stating his disappointment with Australia and joy at being 'home' - you may think that these posts are 'having a go' at your supposed stupidity for wanting to or for living in Australia and you all seem to take them so personally. I know the journey is hard, I know that you have all researched, reckied, whatever, I know that you are disillusioned with the UK, I know that you want better for your family, I know that these posts can make uncomfortable reading. But anyone who feels like this has just the same right to post about it as anyone who is 'living the dream'. And how do you think that makes us that don't settle or like it feel? You all slam anyone who poo,poo's Australia, but are very quick to gloat about how well things have worked out for you - well whoopy doo, good for you!!! Has it ever occurred to any of you that these posts can make some of us feel like failures, that we haven't worked hard enough at making it work?

 

There are some serious double standards going on here and it seriously infuriates me! It is NOT Utopia and we have the right to say so!!

[Guest earlswood]

Well here we are - another can of worms well and truly opened!

 

Gags - Personally I agree with most of your sentiments, that is how my OH and I feel about Oz (hence we are returning to UK next year).

 

May I just say to everyone that have once again jumped on someone for stating his disappointment with Australia and joy at being 'home' - you may think that these posts are 'having a go' at your supposed stupidity for wanting to or for living in Australia and you all seem to take them so personally. I know the journey is hard, I know that you have all researched, reckied, whatever, I know that you are disillusioned with the UK, I know that you want better for your family, I know that these posts can make uncomfortable reading. But anyone who feels like this has just the same right to post about it as anyone who is 'living the dream'. And how do you think that makes us that don't settle or like it feel? You all slam anyone who poo,poo's Australia, but are very quick to gloat about how well things have worked out for you - well whoopy doo, good for you!!! Has it ever occurred to any of you that these posts can make some of us feel like failures, that we haven't worked hard enough at making it work?

 

There are some serious double standards going on here and it seriously infuriates me! It is NOT Utopia and we have the right to say so!!

Good post and soooo true.

[Guest kdal]

well whoopy doo, good for you!!! Has it ever occurred to any of you that these posts can make some of us feel like failures, that we haven't worked hard enough at making it work?

 

There are some serious double standards going on here and it seriously infuriates me! It is NOT Utopia and we have the right to say so!!

 

...

 

This is such an old post and I am amazed to think that anyone new has the time to read all the pages so that they can get a clear understanding of the whole Thread.

 

Isnt it time to put this post to bed as looks like Gags has as his not interested in it anymore and start your own thread that will be up to date on how you feel.

 

I dont think you can 'whoopy doo' anyone for finding success or happiness in Aus, as surely that is what we all hope to find and it is just sad that some find it and not others.

 

Regards

[Guest cobblers]

It may be an old post, but I hadn't read it! - And if you think it's sad that some of us aren't 'Living the Dream' why not tell us that instead of having a go at us for voicing our opinions? - that's all we're doing just as those who love it are - that's my point.

[Guest kdal]

It may be an old post, but I hadn't read it! - And if you think it's sad that some of us aren't 'Living the Dream' why not tell us that instead of having a go at us for voicing our opinions? - that's all we're doing just as those who love it are - that's my point.

..

 

The point I was trying to make is that if you would like to 'say how you feel' and want to be heard then maybe open a new thread, as lots of members of PIO might see how long the thread is and not want to read it, which you can understand as it could take alot of time as it is literally pages and pages long.

 

And where do you get if I think your sad ?? Did I say that?

 

You will always get the odd few people who may not see your side but on an open forum that is what will happen.

 

I am sorry that you took my post to you as 'having a go' , you must have the flamming hump and be bl**dy miserable at the moment if thats how you took it, so for now ile say goodbye and hope to catch you on another post another day in a better frame of mind

 

:yes:

[Guest cobblers]

If you read my post, it says 'if you think IT'S sad' not if you think I'M sad. You did say in your first post that it's sad some people don't find success or happiness here. I have no problem with anyone feeling sad or upset for me for not being happy here - but I do not want to feel vilified for stating my case, and nor should anyone else - that was my first point and a general one. I never once said that you personally were 'having a go' at me - it was a comment made regarding the whole thread.

 

As it happens, I didn't particularly have the hump today - but I certainly have now! Please re-read the last sentence of your post and ask yourself if that was in any way patronising!

[Guest kdal]

Cobblers I am sorry but I have no time for people like you, that just want an argument. I have explained myself and if you cant except what I have to say then there is nothing further to say.

[Guest Pinhead]

I don't remember anyone who has settled in Australia describing it as being 'utopia'.

 

Perhaps the ones who have settled happily in Australia have accepted it's flaws and post here in a positive way because they are so happy with their new life?

 

People who are unhappy with life will by nature post negatively slanted comments and the oppositive is true of those who are happy.

 

Perhaps rather than thinking people are gloating at their happiness or your lack of it, you should just be pleased for them that it worked out for them?

 

If things aren't working out for you then you should make changes. The only ones who are 'failures' in life are the ones who are happy to do nothing about their unhappiness and just moan & whinge.