Guest leeob77 Posted February 22, 2009 Share Posted February 22, 2009 OCBA - office of consumer and bussiness affairs.OCBA - Contact us Just found email from peer 26/01/09 with all the prices and upskilling info for the course gonna ring them t onight and find out WTF is going on hopefully get in before thay shut the gate,will let everyone know tmrw wht has ben said.. just remember if you want to go down the peer route you will need an artc certificate. you cant get a sa license with an ostr and a pass of the regs. if you email the ocba they have a good little guide for licensing (for both tra applicants and vetassess applicants). good luck. lee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest James.S Posted February 22, 2009 Share Posted February 22, 2009 I'm going to call TAFE this morning to find out WTF is happening, if this is going to be case for sure..! Watch this space...! James... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest chilli Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 Hi guys not been on for a while,whats going on with the qualification aspect now,it seems to of gone mad,going out on my recie trip in april to validate visa,not sure i like the sound of all this retraining nonsense,can anyone fill in the gaps please Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mike&lou Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 Hi everyone. Like I said i was gonna phone PEER,and i did they have told me that the only people that can still do Peer is people that have an ARTC and not vetasses. I also spoke to my visa agent,and she has told me she doesnt understand why when you have done vetasses you still have to do the gap training on that side, because that was the whole point of vetasses to cut out the lengthly process of retraining????. Now I was also informed by my agent this morning that there is another route that has just opened this year for electricians used to only be like floor tilers dry liners etc, called an AQF LEVEL 3 DIPLOMA this is like i said only this year come into effect for electricians,and how it works is you pay....£1500, 250 of which is paid up front as deposit. An assesor then comes from aus and asseses you on the job. Very expensive but apparantly you only then have to do the wiring regs on that side and not go college and do gap training. FInancially this seems like a better option. This is the website frequently asked Q..http://www.aqf.edu.au/faq.htm.# Will let everyone know how i get on, and info i found out tmrw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest leeob77 Posted February 23, 2009 Share Posted February 23, 2009 sounds promising. so do all the states recognise this AQF? the OCBA in south australia never mentioned it but perhaps its all new to them, or perhaps it is the same as the gap training you have to do. hope this is really an option for you guys and not another red herring. lee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mike&lou Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 Yes as far as i have found out the AQF LVL 3 is a fully recognised qaulification throughout australia as it is their level 3,the one you have to work towards when you get there, doesnt sound too bad considering the loss of earnings once you get to aus,and also the fact that to get licensed and go through colege costs in total bout 2k uas $.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest James.S Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 I have finally spoken to TAFE this afternoon and have had the definitive answer about the training... According to NSW fair trading website to get a full A license you have to complete the TAFE 9968 Cert III in Electrical Wiring course as well as have 12 months on site experience and be insured... etc.. however.. The TAFE 9968 course was discontinued at the end of 2008 but nothing is replacing it..! The only course TAFE will offer now is the TAFE 17751 Cert III in Electro-technology/Electrician, this will enable you to gain an A license (although it does not mention so on the office of fair trading website).. The snag is.... this course is 4 years..! It's 3 year course with a 1 year on site experience year allowing you upon completion to get the full A license, as I and I’m sure others applying will already have a shed load of experience and will have done the Vetassess they will tick of a whole load of modules of the course as pre-completed, but however they will not commit to what they are or how much shorter the duration of the course will be.... There is a guy who I now have the number of who is on the liaison committee between TAFE and the Office of Fair Trading who is looking at putting another course together for people in our situation to speed things up for us but nothing is on the table as yet. The official qualifications required by NSW office of fair trading to be eligible to apply for the full A class license is as follows; : All Other Applicants including Overseas Applicants (except New Zealand) Trades Recognition* as an Electrical Mechanic, Electrical Fitter/Mechanic, Electrical Tradesperson PLUS Minimum 12 months electrical wiring installation work in residential, commercial and/or industrial situations. THEN Completion of ‘Certificate III Electrical Wiring’ (Course 9968) through NSW TAFE** *Trades recognition is defined as a Craft Certificate or a Certificate of Proficiency issued by the NSW Vocational Training Tribunal or an Australian Recognised Tradesman’s Certificate issued by Trades Recognition Australia. ** Or accredited Registered Training Organisation Applicants may be required to undergo an oral test on the AS/NZS 3000:2000 and will be notified of the arrangements by the Department. NB: Persons submitting applications based on qualifications detailed are required to provide transcripts of academic record listing all completed course components. I am seeing the office of fair trading tomorrow so I will find out what ‘**Or accredited Registered Training Organisation’‘ actually means as obviously the TAFE 9968 is defunct. There is a link that specifies Vetassess applicants but the qualifications section is the same as for a normal applicant, all I can guess is that under that route the Vetassess qualification (OTSR / AQF) will be instead or as well as the ARTC (Australian Recognised Tradesman’s Certificate). Also just to clarify… the OTSR is the same as the AQF, theses are what Vetassess qualification will give you once successfully completed, it is also most part of the Cert III in Electrical Wiring qualification but none of them are the full qualification as there is this gap training to be done… the gap training is the 12 months worth of on site experience as well as the AS/NZS 3000:2000 regulations course. That is what you will be doing (or should be) through either TAFE or PEER as well as by working for an A class license holder. Hope that is all clear.. Any questions then feel free to ask… I will post again once I have seen the office of fair trading tomorrow… James... :jimlad: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mike&lou Posted February 24, 2009 Share Posted February 24, 2009 Great info james, really appreciate you spending the time to find this out. You get more of a straight answer out of some one when you actually see them face to face. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest James.S Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 So today I had a long meeting with the office of fair trading, their initial official response to gaining the full A license was….. ‘oh we’re not making this very easy for you are we!’ After disappearing for ages and making a shed load of phone calls she came back to agree that yes their system is showing that to gain a full A license the 9968 course has to be completed but as that is obsolete and doing a full 4 year course is unreasonable there will be a huge problem. Obviously gaining the provisional is alright but the full A license isn’t. Therefore what ‘Or Accredited Registered Training Organisation’ means is basically other private colleges as opposed to the TAFE college that is government owned. She has given me a list of every ‘Building Trade Qualification Providers’ within NSW, however on her sheet none of them specify that they do anything for electricians but she assumes they will do..! The way forward is then to basically pick one or two near to you, find out if they can do the ‘Gap Training’ as specified by Vetassess, pretty much just the AS/NZS 3000:2000 and they will then be able to grant the full class III AQF certificate, however like the TAFE 17751 course these will be designed as much longer courses and you will have to negotiate to have modules ticked off based on your level of experience from the UK. The college are; Phone no's Active Industry Woongarrah 4393 6900 Auswide Canberra 6497 5020 Back to Basics Lambton 4965 5119 BISC Castle Hill 9204 4670 Building Institute of Training and Development 8214 8644 Canberra Institute of Technology 6207 3100 CITC Canberra 6241 3977 CITEA Canberra 6257 8344 City-Wide Building & Training 9585 1135 Civil Train 9009 4000 HGT Newcastle 4652 7961 Hills Regional Skills Centre 8838 6832 Housing Industry Association 9978 3338 MAP Training 6652 9946 MBA Group Training ACT 6280 9119 MBA Group Training NSW 8586 3545 Skillswest Training Co. 4721 0099 TAFE www.tafensw.edu.au So it’s all pretty much a flippin mess and no-one knows what the hell is going on, there is no official answer and it’s basically just up to us to negotiate with the local college as to what they can offer and how long it will take…. Fan-bloody-tastic..! Once again feel free to ask and I will try my best to find out / answer..! James… :jimlad: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mike&lou Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 I feel so angry now and i can just scream at their slowness of getting things done...aaargh.... I gues once you are their and everything is sorted we probably gonna love it but this whole process is just crazy... James i cant thank you enough,once again your perseverence has paid of for us guys that are stuck here in limbo.. Can i ask you?...where did you find out who was a approved college,was this from the electrical regulators?. I have al their numbers,and have phone themajority of them.some twice and they have not said anything, not even vetasses has breathed a word...i tell you what a ****ing scam this is ridiculous.:Randy-git::arghh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mike&lou Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 Just spoke to the TAFE NSW course advisor, was imformed that that you will get assesed by vocational training tribunal going to phone them later as i couldnt get trough to them now,already shut.. their nr is 61 292 668459 for any one else that wants to hear the info from the horses mouth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest James.S Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 I feel so angry now and i can just scream at their slowness of getting things done...aaargh....I gues once you are their and everything is sorted we probably gonna love it but this whole process is just crazy... James i cant thank you enough,once again your perseverence has paid of for us guys that are stuck here in limbo.. Can i ask you?...where did you find out who was a approved college,was this from the electrical regulators?. I have al their numbers,and have phone themajority of them.some twice and they have not said anything, not even vetasses has breathed a word...i tell you what a ****ing scam this is ridiculous.:Randy-git: Hi, this whole situation sucks... and that's that... Bottom line is TAFE have nothing to offer, they can modify the 17751 but that's all.. other than that the list that i posted of other private colleges seem's to be the only other route, that list i got from the government (office of fair trading).. No one knows what the hell is going on, not the government, not the colleges and definitely not Vetassess, all they worry about is assessing you for the visa, they don't give a sod about you getting a job, know one does really... This is a scam your right and it's not looking like it's going to get resolved quickly, they get you over here butyou can then only work as an apprentice... it's insulting.... I'm seriously thinking of a career change…. James… :jimlad: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
esthapan Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 Hi, this whole situation sucks... and that's that... Bottom line is TAFE have nothing to offer, they can modify the 17751 but that's all.. other than that the list that i posted of other private colleges seem's to be the only other route, that list i got from the government (office of fair trading).. No one knows what the hell is going on, not the government, not the colleges and definitely not Vetassess, all they worry about is assessing you for the visa, they don't give a sod about you getting a job, know one does really... This is a scam your right and it's not looking like it's going to get resolved quickly, they get you over here butyou can then only work as an apprentice... it's insulting.... I'm seriously thinking of a career change…. James… :jimlad: hi, its outragious!!! after having a lot of experience as a spark, if u r not entitled to get a A licence.hoping auzzies "ll sort out the prob. soon. esthapan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest southerngent Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 Ok, now you`ve scared me. I thought the point of the vietess was that it gave you the right to AQF3 and you just needed the regs when you got there. Not that this applies to me as i done the tra as electrician (special class). I also have not be required to sit an exam, so simple this side of the water. My thoughts were ??? assesment by TRA in UK - done apply for ARTC in aus workplace.gov.au - 2 Skills assessment for Australian Recognised Trade Certificate (ARTC) What evidence do I need to supply? Proof of identity (birth certificate, passport identity page, or official government identification, two passport photos) Proof of Australian residency (passport visa page where applicable) Proof of any training, overseas apprenticeship or traineeship Proof of any industrial or occupational licensing or registration Detailed proof of relevant work experience. Contact details for TRA to confirm all claims and documents. No application fee is required for an initial ARTC application from Australian residents whose skills have been successfully assessed by TRA for migration purposes Apply for electrical work training permit (queensland) Overseas applicants Get RTO You will have to discuss your training needs with the RTO. The minimum requirement is for you to sit an examination on the Australian standards for electrical installations as the TRA assessment process does not cover this aspect of your trade skills. Examination requirements for each relevant trade work area are listed below. You will also be required to gain knowledge about legislation that is relative to electrical safety. Sit Reg and testing (may do training with distance learning) Electrical mechanic AS/NZS 3000 - Wiring Rules and installation testing procedures; OR Successful completion of Electrical Installation Testing and Inspection Course 39093 QLD Electrical fitter AS/NZS 3000 - Wiring Rules (as relevant to electrical fitters); AND Testing procedures as per AS/NZS 3760 - In-service safety inspection and testing of electrical equipment. P.S can anyone point me on the direction of a clear definition of the difference between mech and fitter? also has anyone downloaded the as/nzs 3000 from Solutions for Standards, Compliance, and Business Improvement - SAI Global in pdf, if so can it be shared, we could all contribute. I was given the 2000 addition if anyone wants to pm me. but obviously out of date now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jasonoldfield Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 I dont see the problem, if Australia require competent trades then why not set the standard they require? Unlike this country where you can be "qualified "in a matter of weeks. If it takes a year, then it takes a year, htfu and get over it!! If it does not mean that mutch to you to have a year out to comply with Australian rulings then maybe Australia is not for you, we all have a choice, so make your own choice, I know what mine is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sandy25 Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 I dont see the problem, if Australia require competent trades then why not set the standard they require? Unlike this country where you can be "qualified "in a matter of weeks. If it takes a year, then it takes a year, htfu and get over it!! If it does not mean that mutch to you to have a year out to comply with Australian rulings then maybe Australia is not for you, we all have a choice, so make your own choice, I know what mine is. I think this is a harsh, rude, hard line response! We are making our choices! I think the frustration is about being told different things all the time. The goalposts seem to be changing all the time and we don't know whether we're coming or going. Surely it can't be that difficult! The sparkies on here are experienced as my husband is also, with extensive 20 years experience and he has worked very hard. We want to go to Oz for a better quality of life, not to be retaught the basics over a lengthy period of time. A year is OK if necessary but 2-3 years retraining is insulting, especially when your the main breadwinner looking after a family. Anyway thanks to James and Mike and everyone else for your helpful posts and up to date information.:frown: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest James.S Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 I dont see the problem, if Australia require competent trades then why not set the standard they require? Unlike this country where you can be "qualified "in a matter of weeks. If it takes a year, then it takes a year, htfu and get over it!! If it does not mean that mutch to you to have a year out to comply with Australian rulings then maybe Australia is not for you, we all have a choice, so make your own choice, I know what mine is. I think your missing the point... as of the beginning of the year it was a year to get a full license, that's fine will can all put up with that, it's their way of assessing we are all competant in understanding they way things are done over here... The problem is now that route is closed, the offcial line is you have to sign up for a four year course... maybe reduced to three... this is after you have done the Vetassess and proved you are the standard they require. The wages will be about 40% of a full A license holder whilst an apprentice doing the years worth of gap training... fine ok you can just bout scrape through that. Now what they are proposing you to go to college full time for probably 2 years + the 1 year as an apprentice... I don't know about you but i cannot afford not to not work for two years and be able to support my family, pay rent buy food etc... It's not a choice, it's impossible.... James... :jimlad: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest James.S Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 hi,its outragious!!! after having a lot of experience as a spark, if u r not entitled to get a A licence.hoping auzzies "ll sort out the prob. soon. esthapan. Yes all i can hope is they sort out the appropriate course or test really quickly so we can all get to the A licencse ASAP..! James... :jimlad: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Daz & Claire Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 I think your missing the point... as of the beginning of the year it was a year to get a full license, that's fine will can all put up with that, it's their way of assessing we are all competant in understanding they way things are done over here... The problem is now that route is closed, the offcial line is you have to sign up for a four year course... maybe reduced to three... this is after you have done the Vetassess and proved you are the standard they require. The wages will be about 40% of a full A license holder whilst an apprentice doing the years worth of gap training... fine ok you can just bout scrape through that. Now what they are proposing you to go to college full time for probably 2 years + the 1 year as an apprentice... I don't know about you but i cannot afford not to not work for two years and be able to support my family, pay rent buy food etc... It's not a choice, it's impossible.... James... :jimlad: Yeah i'm in the same boat. We have 3 kids and our house sale has been reduced by £40,000 because of the UK market. Bottom line is when we arrive I need to find a job quickly so that i don't eat into my money. If i have to go back to full time college for two years then our dream will start slipping down the drain. I understand that we are making a fresh start, but at what cost. There is only one winner and thats Australia, i'm starting to think cash cow. we are being milked. Why the hell was vetassess set up?:arghh: they assessed our trade quals and work experience, tested us in the classroom. gave us the offshore certificate, and then turn thier backs on you when you arrive in Oz. Cheers James for setting this chat up, I would not have liked arriving in Oz without this prior knowledge from yourself and all the others. Cheers Daz & Claire Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest James.S Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 Hi Daz & Claire... Don't be pi**ed off with Vetassess they are doing everything they can as far as licensing is concerned. The OTSR will allow you to get the provisional. The problem lies with the government, they tell you to get the A class license you have to sit a course, although this course doesn't exist. They should have put a course into practice prior to stopping the 9968.. I am going to talk to the press here tomorrow as i have been told by a friend overhere that that they will love it. The government have just released $42 billion in financial support for the country, a good chunk of this will be spent on house building... although there are not enough people to build them.... especialy electricians..! Will post what happens.. All the best... James... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mylady's O/H Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 Hi I have read all your posts and am trying to get some answers myself from Australia.Things dont look good.Why are they making things so difficult and still claim there is a shortage of electricians? I think its a way for them to use us as cheap labour for a year.We should all write letters to the Australian government outlining the difficulties we face as proffessionals uprouting our families to go over to a country where we are told that we are nothing more than apprentices.From what I have heard Employers are reluctant in hiring electricians on restricted licenses.We should voice our concerns.What they are doing is morally wrong, and is costing us a fortune.I am seriously questioning if this is the right move for me ,I have worked in many countries and have never encountered anything like this.The only thing I agree with is doing the Australian regs ,the rest I have over twenty years experience. Does anyone know what they are building out there? space shuttles? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest windyonerz Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 Hi Daz & Claire... Don't be pi**ed off with Vetassess they are doing everything they can as far as licensing is concerned. The OTSR will allow you to get the provisional. The problem lies with the government, they tell you to get the A class license you have to sit a course, although this course doesn't exist. They should have put a course into practice prior to stopping the 9968.. I am going to talk to the press here tomorrow as i have been told by a friend overhere that that they will love it. The government have just released $42 billion in financial support for the country, a good chunk of this will be spent on house building... although there are not enough people to build them.... especialy electricians..! Will post what happens.. All the best... James... as far as i was aware u did a year on a b grade licence then sat a test ! is that no longer a case ? i can't afford 2 go back 2 college ! when did all this change ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mike&lou Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 HI Hi have spoken to the school of electrical studies in new south wales.sydney they are just outside central station in building K. 02 921 74778 / 3150 I have been told by a teacher there that they are busy trying to sort the problem out of there being no realistic course to fill the 9968 course, he said that what they are doing though is assesing your qaulifications and experience and based on that, the principal decides how much study you need to do. Get this though - nick.solazzo@det.nsw.edu.au 02 92173288/3277 who is the teacher said to me that he still has not heard of vetasses crazy huh.. He is gonna discuss our situation with the headteacher kenneth.moarcom@tafe.nsw.edu.au 02 9217 3288 (same nr a solazzo) I am waiting to hear back from the on Monday the latest fingers crossed something will happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mike&lou Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 as far as i was aware u did a year on a b grade licence then sat a test !is that no longer a case ? i can't afford 2 go back 2 college ! when did all this change ? What you ned to do is just read a little back in the thread all of this is explained. Basically if you have done vetasses and been succesful in it, you get a OTSR this goes towards gaining you lvl 3 cert in aus. But it is only some of the work,once you get there with your OTSR you get a provisional license,and then have to do 12mnths on site training, after which there is a test.Also while you on site you fill in a logbook,this is wht its supposed to be,but at the moment the course you were supposed to sit has falLen away and nothings replaced it since, the only one available at present requires you to do 3-4yrs college. Jamses.s and Myself are trying to get to the bottom of this and hopefully will have some answers soon.. Hope this helps,. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest boy of glass Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 hi all, i've been reading everything thats been posted and getting more and more worried about whats happening as i too am a spark waiting for a c/o for 175 visa. thanks to james and co i thought i'd try to find something out so i called peer. i spoke to a really helpfull girl,kate, and she said i would have to be assesed on what i already new as a spark when i got to oz and they would put me only on the courses i needed to learn,and still only have to do the 12 months gap training and no longer.as i say she was very helpfull and seemed to know what she was on about. i hope i havent given you all wrong info. will let you all know if i hear any more news.catch you all in oz soon!!!!!!!! hopefully!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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