Monthly living cost for a family of 5

[Cheery Thistle]

7 minutes ago, InnerVoice said:

Well you'd be a mug not to, wouldn't you? And apart from a clean and scale I've never had any other treatment on the NHS in over 20 years. My dentist would say maybe this or that might need doing in a few years, but we'll leave it for now - I don't go drilling holes in people's head for no reason! That isn't the same honesty you'll have over here, I can assure you.

Maybe the mugs are the UK taxpayers for allowing medical tourism!! Haha JOKES! Before you go in a big huff. 
 

Well, I’ll tell you one thing, the Aussie butchers are not getting my wisdom teeth!! 

[InnerVoice]

1 hour ago, Cheery Thistle said:

That’s because you’re tight!

It’s actually a bit different when you have kids as well. There’s other things to consider. OP has 3 children so would need to think about things they might need and weigh up potential costs. A lot of the contributors on here have kids who have long flown the nest! 
We have private healthcare here in UK so will be pricing and considering it in Aus. 

As usual a lot of splitting hairs on this forum and bickering which is not helpful to the OP. 

Main point is, regardless of whether you call it ‘extras’ ‘insurance cover’ ‘ambulance cover’ or just ‘invoices for medical care’, there will certainly be more costs involved in health are in Aus than there are in the UK. Charges for dental care, prescriptions, etc and that is what is relevant to the OP regarding general costs of living. 
 

I recall you pointed out in a previous post that people in the UK pay more for healthcare than we do due to significant NI contributions. You appear to have changed your tune!

[Cheery Thistle]

12 minutes ago, InnerVoice said:

I recall you pointed out in a previous post that people in the UK pay more for healthcare than we do due to significant NI contributions. You appear to have changed your tune!

I think the discussion was about value. 

[tahm563]

1 hour ago, Ausvisitor said:

I have health insurance, it's a no-brainer. The basic cover I have is $3,956 a year, the MLS (read tax) I'd have to pay if I didn't have private cover is over $5,500

So healthcare is actually cheaper than not having it. Add in we get $400 opticians, $1800 dental and $900 other remedies (between us) if we claim everything the insurance is only $800 and saves $5.5k 

You'd have to be a fool in my situation not to take it...

What's MLS? And how much is it? Is this NI equivalent contribution for medicare there? We pay 13.8% on NI currently. 

[Nemesis]

23 minutes ago, tahm563 said:

What's MLS? And how much is it? Is this NI equivalent contribution for medicare there? We pay 13.8% on NI currently. 

MLS= Medicare Levy Surcharge. Marisa mentions this additional tax in her excellent post earlier in the thread. I'm not going to try and explain it myself as like most Aussie medical things, its a complex nightmare

[tahm563]

2 hours ago, Ausvisitor said:

I have health insurance, it's a no-brainer. The basic cover I have is $3,956 a year, the MLS (read tax) I'd have to pay if I didn't have private cover is over $5,500

So healthcare is actually cheaper than not having it. Add in we get $400 opticians, $1800 dental and $900 other remedies (between us) if we claim everything the insurance is only $800 and saves $5.5k 

You'd have to be a fool in my situation not to take it...

Is the $3,956 for one person or your family? 

[Blue Manna]

10 hours ago, Marisawright said:

You're right. If you're on a long-term visit to Australia from overseas, you can get Overseas Visitors cover which, like the British system, covers everything.  However the annual premium is substantially higher, and I'm guessing that's why they don't offer full coverage here -- only the wealthy would be willing to pay the premiums.  How do premiums here compare with the UK?

You are also right that the 'gap' payments can be very high, depending on what level of cover/excess you choose.   I gave one example already.  Another example is my own spinal fusion op.  The operation cost $35,000 of which private insurance paid only $25,000, leaving me with a $10,000 bill.  And that didn't include the fees for specialist appointments before and after, scans etc.  

I don't know. When I've had it it's always come with the job. 

[FirstWorldProblems]

12 hours ago, Blue Manna said:

The thing I've never really understood about private health insurance is that when you have private health insurance in the UK it pays for everything. You do have to check first, but I've never been recommended for any treatment that wasn't fully covered.

When you have private health insurance in Australia, you still seem to pay an awful lot of money for treatment. And I am talking quite significant sums for major surgery. It can be quite staggering. So don't think just because you take private cover you are done and dusted.

You should expect this to change in the U.K.  unfortunately.  As access to care becomes harder via the NHS more of us are turning to private cover.   At the company where I work our insurer has increased our price because in 2023 we used 1/3rd more private health than prior years.  
 

If premiums go up, then it’s possible (probable) that deductibles enter the mix to bring the sticker price down.  

[FirstWorldProblems]

9 hours ago, tahm563 said:

My four siblings live in Sydney.  (sydney south west).  

Do you know how much they budget for tolls?  We clocked up $500 in two weeks last month during a visit based near castle hill.  

[Ausvisitor]

9 hours ago, tahm563 said:

Is the $3,956 for one person or your family? 

A couple 

[Ausvisitor]

3 hours ago, FirstWorldProblems said:

Do you know how much they budget for tolls?  We clocked up $500 in two weeks last month during a visit based near castle hill.  

The tolls are a tad on poverty (or at least on the low to middle income earners).

The lower paid live in the outer west and south and all the tolls are from there into the city, the north and east (which are more affluent) don't have tolls to the city except the harbour Bridge (which you can avoid most of the time)

[Ausvisitor]

Just now, Ausvisitor said:

The tolls are a tax on poverty (or at least on the low to middle income earners).

The lower paid live in the outer west and south and all the tolls are from there into the city, the north and east (which are more affluent) don't have tolls to the city except the harbour Bridge (which you can avoid most of the time)

 

[InnerVoice]

10 hours ago, tahm563 said:

What's MLS? And how much is it? Is this NI equivalent contribution for medicare there? We pay 13.8% on NI currently. 

We don't have NI here, but our higher rates of taxation mean that you'll likely pay at least as much in total deductions as you would in the UK. The Medicare Level Surcharge (MLS) is an additional tax you'll pay if, in your case as a family, you have a total household income over $186k (see table below). What you should bear in mind is that if you have to pay MLS, then you will pay it on the whole of your combined income once you reach the threshold. Earn $186k and you won't pay anything, but earn a dollar more and you'll pay $1,860. However, if you take out private health insurance you don't need to pay it.

The Medicare Levy is different, which nearly all tax payers have to pay on top of their general rates of taxation. Unless you're a very low earner, it will be a flat rate of 2% on your total income.

[can1983]

On 26/01/2024 at 09:20, InnerVoice said:

We don't have NI here, but our higher rates of taxation mean that you'll likely pay at least as much in total deductions as you would in the UK. The Medicare Level Surcharge (MLS) is an additional tax you'll pay if, in your case as a family, you have a total household income over $186k (see table below). What you should bear in mind is that if you have to pay MLS, then you will pay it on the whole of your combined income once you reach the threshold. Earn $186k and you won't pay anything, but earn a dollar more and you'll pay $1,860. However, if you take out private health insurance you don't need to pay it.

The Medicare Levy is different, which nearly all tax payers have to pay on top of their general rates of taxation. Unless you're a very low earner, it will be a flat rate of 2% on your total income.

Just a counter point last year we got stung with MLS of 1% of around $200,000 (couple)

That's $2000 extra tax

You cant get private medical insurance which makes you exempt from the MLS for $1k per person its at least twice or three times that

So id say private health cover to avoid MLS only really starts to make sense when the family income is nearly $300k

[tahm563]

On 25/01/2024 at 19:00, FirstWorldProblems said:

Do you know how much they budget for tolls?  We clocked up $500 in two weeks last month during a visit based near castle hill.  

They live near M5. They get rebates for M5 use - so not much. My brother works from home mostly and wife works locally, so don't need to go on motorway. 

[Ausvisitor]

14 hours ago, can1983 said:

Just a counter point last year we got stung with MLS of 1% of around $200,000 (couple)

That's $2000 extra tax

You cant get private medical insurance which makes you exempt from the MLS for $1k per person its at least twice or three times that

So id say private health cover to avoid MLS only really starts to make sense when the family income is nearly $300k

Yes (and no)...

If you need glasses or dental care, the benefits for those will almost certainly cover at least $1,000 per year for a couple, so it means that whilst in your example the tax is $2000,  

The cost for medical cover is around $3,500 for a couple, which makes cover actually cost $500.

Now if you've got good dental cover and cover for things like physio you can easily be getting treatments that you'd otherwise pay for covered to around $1,500 per year which makes the health cover better than free

Looking at it in terms of just tax saved isn't enough to work out value 

[Marisawright]

12 minutes ago, Ausvisitor said:

Yes (and no)...

If you need glasses or dental care, the benefits for those will almost certainly cover at least $1,000 per year for a couple

However, that's irrelevant. Extras cover doesn't count towards exemption from the Medicare levy.    Also, you can get Extras cover on its own, without the hospital cover.   So you can't count it in the arithmetic at all.  

 

[Ausvisitor]

8 hours ago, Marisawright said:

However, that's irrelevant. Extras cover doesn't count towards exemption from the Medicare levy.    Also, you can get Extras cover on its own, without the hospital cover.   So you can't count it in the arithmetic at all.  

 

In my case I could. The medibank cover I have includes some level of dental/optical/other in the package. You can't buy the medical cover without also getting that base level of extras included (I suppose you could buy this was a great deal).

So the premium to me is discounted by the amount I would have spent on dental and medical (that they are covering)

 

I do agree with your premise here, but some health coverage just includes some extras anyway so it's not always a simple comparison 

[Ken]

2 hours ago, Ausvisitor said:

In my case I could. The medibank cover I have includes some level of dental/optical/other in the package. You can't buy the medical cover without also getting that base level of extras included (I suppose you could buy this was a great deal).

So the premium to me is discounted by the amount I would have spent on dental and medical (that they are covering)

 

I do agree with your premise here, but some health coverage just includes some extras anyway so it's not always a simple comparison 

Yes, buying Extras cover with no Hospital Insurance is easy, but finding Hospital Cover with no Extras is a lot harder. Most of the providers just want to tag it on anyway and obviously even if they claim it's free, you are paying for it.