Is Melbourne really Australia's biggest city?

[InnerVoice]

Just read this morning that Melbourne is now bigger than Sydney after Melbourne city limits were expanded to include the 'suburb' of Melton. I say suburb in the loosest sense of the word, as it is clearly a separate town with a good 10km of countryside between there and the most outer suburb of Melbourne.

Population growth doesn't seem like a statistic to be proud of in any case, but one wonders if this is just a continuation of the 'Which is better - Sydney or Melbourne?' argument, that some hold dear.

[Toots]

Sydney and Melbourne are both huge sprawling cities.  Melbourne pips Sydney with 2,453 square km.  Sydney covers 2,037 square km.  Both will be more now as those numbers are from 2017.  Which is better?  All down to personal preference.  I like both of them     ..........................  just to visit for a few days though.  Always glad to get out of them.

[Marisawright]

I agree, irrelevant, just silly media hype.

[Blue Flu]

Silly hype maybe. A bit akin to Perth being the longest city in the world. Oh well, is it Coffs Harbour with the biggest banana? 

[InnerVoice]

4 hours ago, Toots said:

Sydney and Melbourne are both huge sprawling cities.  Melbourne pips Sydney with 2,453 square km.  Sydney covers 2,037 square km.  Both will be more now as those numbers are from 2017.  Which is better?  All down to personal preference.  I like both of them     ..........................  just to visit for a few days though.  Always glad to get out of them.

I should've clarified it's about population, not urban area.

[Bulya]

If not now it certainly will be in the not too distant future..

[InnerVoice]

1 hour ago, Marisawright said:

I agree, irrelevant, just silly media hype.

 

33 minutes ago, Blue Flu said:

Silly hype maybe. A bit akin to Perth being the longest city in the world. Oh well, is it Coffs Harbour with the biggest banana? 

Indeed, although I'm sure they'll be a few Melburnians celebrating tonight that they've beat the Sydneysiders at something! 

[Tychen]

More important is the underlying causes for the changes. Why has internal emigration out of Sydney been so high? That's the kind of thing the government(s) should be thinking about.

[Marisawright]

10 hours ago, Tychen said:

More important is the underlying causes for the changes. Why has internal emigration out of Sydney been so high? That's the kind of thing the government(s) should be thinking about.

I think it's well known.  House prices.  Melbourne is expensive for housing too, but it's approximately two-thirds the cost of Sydney for an equivalent house in an equivalent suburb.

[InnerVoice]

6 minutes ago, Marisawright said:

I think it's well known.  House prices.  Melbourne is expensive for housing too, but it's approximately two-thirds the cost of Sydney for an equivalent house in an equivalent suburb.

I'd assume that salaries in Sydney and Melbourne are fairly similar, so the latter is probably more affordable in that respect.

[Steve Elliott]

To throw a spanner in the works, I believe when it comes to City council areas, Brisbane is bigger than both Sydney and Melbourne!!!! - 

[Parley]

Of course it isn't hype. It is a key metric used for planning.

The size of the population of Melbourne and its projected growth is analysed to plan for important infrastructure that takes decade to create.

For example the new outer ring rail loop being built over something like 25 years. As well as major freeways like Eastlink etc, Peninsula Link.

Not to mention new hospitals and schools etc needed in the fast growing areas.

Edited April 17, 2023 by Parley

[Blue Flu]

18 minutes ago, Parley said:

Of course it isn't hype. It is a key metric used for planning.

The size of the population of Melbourne and its projected growth is analysed to plan for important infrastructure that takes decade to create.

For example the new outer ring rail loop being built over something like 25 years. As well as major freeways like Eastlink etc, Peninsula Link.

Not to mention new hospitals and schools etc needed in the fast growing areas.

Which doesn't go towards answering the question in regards to why Australian cities in general are so poorly planned?  Indeed the decline in livability stakes within world measurement, (even if in doubt of the validity of such things) will to many go a way towards underlining the declining living standards in Australian cities. 

Edited April 18, 2023 by Blue Flu

[InnerVoice]

1 hour ago, Steve Elliott said:

To throw a spanner in the works, I believe when it comes to City council areas, Brisbane is bigger than both Sydney and Melbourne!!!! - 

One wonders how long before Brisbane and the GC will be classed as a single conurbation? It would have a combined population of about 3 million. There's certainly less open countryside between the two cities than there is between Melbourne and Melton!

[Ken]

1 hour ago, InnerVoice said:

One wonders how long before Brisbane and the GC will be classed as a single conurbation? It would have a combined population of about 3 million. There's certainly less open countryside between the two cities than there is between Melbourne and Melton!

There is no open countryside at all between the Melton suburb of Caroline Springs and the rest of Melbourne. Although there is countryside in Melton between Caroline Springs and the rest of Melton. Many people were blissfully unaware that Caroline Springs wasn't in Melbourne (until the whole of Melton was).

Edited April 18, 2023 by Ken

[Parley]

1 hour ago, InnerVoice said:

One wonders how long before Brisbane and the GC will be classed as a single conurbation? It would have a combined population of about 3 million. There's certainly less open countryside between the two cities than there is between Melbourne and Melton!

We don't use that term in Australia.

[InnerVoice]

1 hour ago, Ken said:

There is no open countryside at all between the Melton suburb of Caroline Springs and the rest of Melbourne. Although there is countryside in Melton between Caroline Springs and the rest of Melton. Many people were blissfully unaware that Caroline Springs wasn't in Melbourne (until the whole of Melton was).

I'll take your word on that, Ken - I wasn't aware that Melton was a region as well as a town. It just looks like a separate place to Melbourne on the map.

[welljock]

19 hours ago, Blue Flu said:

Silly hype maybe. A bit akin to Perth being the longest city in the world. Oh well, is it Coffs Harbour with the biggest banana? 

I hadn't heard that one before but when did Mandurah become part of Perth?

[Blue Flu]

18 minutes ago, welljock said:

I hadn't heard that one before but when did Mandurah become part of Perth?

Probably since the train line ended up there. But Merth never one to miss out claiming to be something or other, seems to wear that badge as fact now. 

[Bulya]

Left Melbourne in ‘73.  One of the happiest days of my life!

[InnerVoice]

11 hours ago, Bulya said:

Left Melbourne in ‘73.  One of the happiest days of my life!

I can't see the appeal either (don't like anywhere that's as flat as a pancake), but 5 million would beg to differ.

[Bulya]

45 minutes ago, InnerVoice said:

I can't see the appeal either (don't like anywhere that's as flat as a pancake), but 5 million would beg to differ.

Not as bad as Darwin or Rockhampton but that isn’t saying much..

[Ken]

21 hours ago, InnerVoice said:

I'll take your word on that, Ken - I wasn't aware that Melton was a region as well as a town. It just looks like a separate place to Melbourne on the map.

This map shows the city border:

[InnerVoice]

1 minute ago, Ken said:

This map shows the city border:

Oh, that's huge! I'm guessing that Sunbury is also considered part of Melbourne, even that's miles out too?

[Ken]

36 minutes ago, InnerVoice said:

Oh, that's huge! I'm guessing that Sunbury is also considered part of Melbourne, even that's miles out too?

Yes, Sunbury is part of the City of Hume (as is Craigieburn which you can also see on that map), one of the 28 cities (including Melton) and 3 shires which form Metropolitan Melbourne.

When I moved to Australia I first lived in the City of Maribyrnong before building in the City of Wyndham. It's weird having moved from Melbourne to the Gold Coast and discovering that everyone in the Gold Coast has the same city council!

Edited April 19, 2023 by Ken