brit1 Posted February 16, 2016 Share Posted February 16, 2016 Hello all, Just seeking some advice from anyone who has moved back to the UK with children? I'm British and my hubby is Australian. We moved to Oz 7 years ago so that my husband could be close to his family whom he obviously missed in the UK. We now have a 2.5 year old and a 5 month old. Im concerned about taking our toddler away from everything he knows, including family here who he sees regularly. On the other side, he will then get to know my family back in the UK (a major reason for me wanting to move back there now). Our toddler is quite soft and I have found many parents and children here to be hard and competitive, so he often gets shoved out of the way whilst the parents look on. I do not wish to offend anyone as I know not everyone is like this, but in general I did find people (and children) to be kinder and more down to earth in the uk? Has anyone found pre-school is better in either country? My husband is also sick of working here again and feels he had much more opportunity in the UK. It's a really difficult decision to make and I really am stuck between countries at the moment. I would be grateful for any helpful advice? Thank you. (P.S) Im definitely a northern hemisphere person, so the weather here isn't really appealing to me either! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caramac Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 Lots of people move both ways with kids the ages yours are and they're generally fine. We moved to Aus when ours were nearly five, three and 13 months. We knew no one when we arrived, but the kids were fine after the initial settling period. As long as the parents are happy, the kids will be ok (at this age). There are lots of different preschool settings - day nurseries, which have long opening hours for working parents (like daycare), playgroups which are sessional - mornings or afternoons. Unlike the usual meaning of 'playgroup' in Australia, you can leave your child at playgroup here and they can be a bit more structured in what they offer, although each one will be slightly different. There are also nursery classes which are attached to primary or independent schools. These have a more structured day, a bit like prep/pp in Australia, and there are nursery schools which are stand alone settings usually run along the nursery class lines. Sometimes the nursery classes/schools don't have the extended opening hours of a day nursery, but will have facilities (after school clubs) for supervision of children past the end of the school day. Funding is available for three and four year olds and its up to you how you use that money https://www.gov.uk/help-with-childcare-costs/free-childcare-and-education-for-2-to-4-year-olds I'm not convinced people are kinder here. Kids are kids and can be horrible to each other and parents often see no problem with their children's behaviour . Maybe your perception is wonky because you've not had children here? The only thing I would say that is different in our experience of six schools (3 here and 3 there) is that schools are better at recognising bullying and putting a stop to it here. Your son will have to develop some resilience to stand up for himself. I know how difficult it is - our middle daughter was exactly the same. She's still kind and gentle, but lets no one push her around anymore! Has your husband got a visa to live and work here? If not, can he get one? Or do you have savings/can you work in a job earning over £24k a year (£18k without children, £24k with two children). The rules re bringing a non EEA partner into the UK changed in 2012. This explains it quite well, and what people do to get around it http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-23029195 Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolman Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 Our kids were around 10 when we moved back and they slotted straight back in wonderfully. Young kids like yours adapt extremely quickly and also forget things extremely quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bound4Tassie Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 We've moved our eldest twice in her short life. Only within the UK though but it meant new house & new nursery each time...once when she was16 months....went smooth enough, 2nd time at 2.5yrs which took her months and months to get used to. Some children will take it in their stride of course and people always say kids are resilient / adaptable but I think sometimes we underestimate the effect that the lack of stability/continuity can have on a young child . I'm not saying don't move but just be prepared for potentially a longer adjustment period than you might imagine. It depends on the child. Oh , and the parents are no different here at the park, nursery, soft play centre etc etc. There are loads of "those" parents who either turn a blind eye to their kid shoving yours out of the way, or are completely oblivious as they're too busy with their gossiping/bitching to notice! There are of course some nice people too but if you go to somewhere busy / popular , you will come across the rude kids/ parents regularly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rachel Tilley Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 I think that wherever you and your husband are happy and settled then your children will be happy and settled. If one of your children is a little sensitive to certain situations then they will be sensitive to that situation regardless of what country you're in. When my son was a toddler we came across 'little horrors' in the UK and Oz. Sadly, my son also became a 'little horror' too at one point - probably reacting to the stress I was under at the time in Oz. I know there were times when parents weren't happy with me due to my son's behaviour at a play date. Live where the family will be happiest - and that's not always dictated by the weather! The amount of people that think they'll always be happier in Australia because the sun shines a lot never ceases to amaze me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gbye grey sky Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 What Rachel said. If the parents are settled and happy then kids will normally slot right in. As Caramac said though, unless your husband acquired UK citizenship when he was there last you would be well-advised to look into the visa requirements. It is not straightforward and the British government are making it harder and harder for non-EU migrants to get in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brit1 Posted February 18, 2016 Author Share Posted February 18, 2016 Thank you everyone for your kind responses and honest feedback on your personal experiences of moving to and fro with little ones. I think we are definitely leaning towards going back to the UK, we are aware of the new visa rules thank you and will have to sell our house here to raise enough funds to show that we can support ourselves. As I am currently staying home with the little ones, my husband is the main bread-winner and can earn a far higher wage than I can in the UK so once we are there he will get back into London and we will be fine. It is good to know about the different options re playgroup which I think would do my son's confidence some good, and great to know that bullying is taken more seriously in the UK. Looking back, I think my husband and I were happier living in the UK. The hard fact that we have family (and ageing parents) on both sides of the planet will never be resolved though, and this is the hardest part of falling in love with someone from that far away. Thanks again everyone, the only one i'll worry about now is our nervous cat who is terrified of travelling......hurrumph! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bound4Tassie Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Thank you everyone for your kind responses and honest feedback on your personal experiences of moving to and fro with little ones. I think we are definitely leaning towards going back to the UK, we are aware of the new visa rules thank you and will have to sell our house here to raise enough funds to show that we can support ourselves. As I am currently staying home with the little ones, my husband is the main bread-winner and can earn a far higher wage than I can in the UK so once we are there he will get back into London and we will be fine. It is good to know about the different options re playgroup which I think would do my son's confidence some good, and great to know that bullying is taken more seriously in the UK. Looking back, I think my husband and I were happier living in the UK. The hard fact that we have family (and ageing parents) on both sides of the planet will never be resolved though, and this is the hardest part of falling in love with someone from that far away.Thanks again everyone, the only one i'll worry about now is our nervous cat who is terrified of travelling......hurrumph! I hear you on that one!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thinker78 Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 If he can get a visa, go for it. I have been back 6 months and my Miss 6 had only ever known Australia. We have all our family in the UK however. To all intents and purposes she was very much Aussie. She found everything strange and foreign here, and out of sync with British kids at first. British kids are a)more grown up due to earlier schooling and b) more reserved maybe. It has taken this time for her to find her groove in the country and school system. She has had to grow up faster in the last 6 months and also catch up on schooling. I find the education here both better but more pressured. I find the schools way better at pastoral care- there is more support in place on all sorts of levels. Free school dinners for the entire infants school is also a nice bonus. I found that she had to learn to adapt- she had only known the hot weather, and we have had to find things to do in the cold but it has made little difference- we go to an indoor pool, we wrap up and go to the park, we do other things- kids honestly adapt. At a younger age, they won't even notice it that much. She loves having her extended family- that's made it all worthwhile. So, it has taken 6 months but she's well and truly acclimatised to a 'new' country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilliboy Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 We found our little 4 yr old daughter has had a terrible time adjusting to our recent move to Oz.So many things have gone wrong for us that we have already decided to go home to the uk (roll on July).I definitely underestimated the emotional and psychological affect the move would have on her.However,despite saying this children are resilient and she is now showing good signs of progress.Ultimately you have to do what's right for you and your children have to adapt.All you can do is take advice from the good people on this forum,your friends and family and see that the transition is as smooth as you can possibly make it.Id suggest doing all you can to have children their ages around them and family - try to make everything as familiar as possible. I initially thought Aussie kids were a bit rougher than uk kids but theyre just the same difference.The Aussies have "bogan" kids in daycare,parks,soft play and us Brits have "chav" kids.My wife works in education and says generally that the British preschool and primary school systems are more refined and have better systems of governance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rachel Tilley Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 My son did all of his primary school education in England and then did four months of Year 7 at primary school in Oz. He said he was way ahead of everyone there, the work was really easy and he couldn't believe how layed back it all was. I accept he'd already done a year in senior school in England before going back to primary school in Oz, but he has told me that school in England is more strict and there are more consequences for bad behaviour in England. One of the positives he said about his Aussie primary school was that there was no bullying whatsoever and everyone was really nice and got on well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fish.01 Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 Very few of us have enough experiences to compare properly. Much of what we see is situation dependent and apples vs oranges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenix16 Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 At the age your children are I can't see any adverse issues, however, don't wear your rose tinted glasses! you will no doubt be welcomed back with much fuss and it will be lovely, however, real life will then kick in and everyone will resume theirs, perhaps you will see parents aren't really that different. I personally have noticed the inclination to have 3/4 children here in OZ (WA) and i have to say by my observations, much loved and treasured by their parents. And in terms of schooling, well I totally disagree with comments, my daughter is supposed to do 20 minutes homework and 15 minutes reading, in reality, its more like an hour plus the reading, every night, with maths and spelling tests on Fridays based totally on the homework, she is year 3, and she is thriving, I don't believe she would be behind if we returned to the UK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johndoe Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 Hello all, Our toddler is quite soft and I have found many parents and children here to be hard and competitive, ! Sorry? "Hard and competitive"? "quite soft"? Unique to Australia? Sorry hun, but without even reading others' responses, I have to ask, "is it your child who is this way, or you"? That said, what do you think would make a difference in the UK? Is it your memory of "but in general I did find people (and children) to be kinder and more down to earth in the uk? " if that's the case, then what do you mean by "more down to earth" Australians are often criticised for "gobbing off" (my words meaning down to earth) Lets be honest with ourselves here (from what I read between the lines) ..............Stop using your toddler as an excuse..............you want to go back.............then discuss it with hubby but don't think that your child's education and upbringing, really has anything at all to do with it, despite the fact that you have put emphasis on it.....................is it advice that you're seeking or approval?..................you really can't get either, because each case is subjective, and approval from others will always be clouded by their personal circumstance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenix16 Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 Sorry? "Hard and competitive"? "quite soft"? Unique to Australia? Sorry hun, but without even reading others' responses, I have to ask, "is it your child who is this way, or you"? That said, what do you think would make a difference in the UK? Is it your memory of "but in general I did find people (and children) to be kinder and more down to earth in the uk? " if that's the case, then what do you mean by "more down to earth" Australians are often criticised for "gobbing off" (my words meaning down to earth) Lets be honest with ourselves here (from what I read between the lines) ..............Stop using your toddler as an excuse..............you want to go back.............then discuss it with hubby but don't think that your child's education and upbringing, really has anything at all to do with it, despite the fact that you have put emphasis on it.....................is it advice that you're seeking or approval?..................you really can't get either, because each case is subjective, and approval from others will always be clouded by their personal circumstance Yeah I agree... my observations of parents here is that they do so much stuff with their kids, bike rides, beaches, picnics, everything actually seems to revolve around kids at weekends and its lovely actually xxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johndoe Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 Yeah I agree... my observations of parents here is that they do so much stuff with their kids, bike rides, beaches, picnics, everything actually seems to revolve around kids at weekends and its lovely actually xxx Yes............parents here do so much stuff with their kids, bike rides, beaches, picnics, everything actually seems to revolve around kids at weekends and its lovely actually. Who are these parents though? Bogans, Chavs, or f*ckwits as would be described by Billy Connolly? At the risk of inviting absolute hatred and cyberstalking................WTF do Brit parents.....................generally...............do with their kids at weekends? I'm not judging..............I'm asking Most parents I knew back in the UK had the Sunday papers through their letterbox, read them in bed, and, after an argument as to who should get up and get 'em, came back to bed..................brekky was about 11.30 in time for the pubs opening at 12.00 Sunday lunch..............heavy as a dinner...................usually resulted in whingeing about why the brussel sprouts or roast spuds were soft (Because closing time 14.10 usually took longer14.30 + ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caramac Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 Most do exactly the same as their peers anywhere. IME anyway. Swimming, bike riding, walking, socialising with friends etc. especially on Sundays. Organisations like scouts, brownies etc tend to hold activities at weekends too. Our girls used to spend their time sailing, windsurfing, canoeing with Scouts, or in summer, at camps. They used to ride horses and do drama classes too, just like most of their friends. You get disinterested parents everywhere, just as you get involved, interested ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brit1 Posted February 19, 2016 Author Share Posted February 19, 2016 Thanks again everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brit1 Posted February 19, 2016 Author Share Posted February 19, 2016 Oh dear Johndoe, Perhaps you were offended by my comments, that's just what I have experienced personally whist out at playgroups and at the playground. As I said in my comments, I know not everyone is like this. As for your second paragraph, how hurtful, you have no idea what our reasons are for wanting to move back overseas. My Mum has been sick and was in hospital for 3 months at the end of last year. I have only spent 2 weeks with her in the past 5 years as we cannot afford to visit each year. Our boys are the only grandchildren they have and they would dearly love us to be back in the UK for a while. It is a struggle financially to survive here on one wage, it is our choice to have me stay at home with the little ones until they go to school as we do not wish to place them in childcare - again, I understand that many don't have a choice - I am not judging anyone. If we go back to the UK money wont be an issue (we have done our sums). As I said, my husband preferred working in the UK so that is why he wants to go back there. Yes, we are being honest here! We do want to go back, but want to make sure that our boys would have the best opportunities in life. It is actually because of them that we have not moved back already. Life here is pretty much the same as life over their, we get up, go to work, food shopping then spend time together on the weekends. But we feel we would have a better quality of life over there. Thank you to all who have posted, we are still making up our minds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 All IMHO of course I think at the ages your children are, they soon settle and adapt so long as they have you, their parents around. New faces soon become familiar faces and playgroup is playgroup to a 2 or 3 year old. Doesn't matter what country its in, its time to play. I'm British and my husband an Aussie. We had our son in the UK and moved here when he was 5. You are going the opposite way. There isn't much difference really IMHO. If you prefer the UK then go for it. Kids at that age are far less problematic than when they get older usually. We wanted our son to know both countries, both families and so on. We have never put a timeframe on our move to Aus being a forever move or anything like that. We are just going with the flow and if our needs/wants change in time then we'll address them. I enjoyed pre school in the UK but it was a struggle to get a placement in some of them. The wait list was long for any placement in an actual daycare nursery that ran a pre school within that. Stand alone pre schools via a church or some such were better for placements but these can vary in quality and staff (same anywhere I guess) etc and also the religious aspect may be an issue for some. You get 15 hours free pre school atm in England but I think that is going up to 30 hours a week for some as a trial in the not too distant future. This is not a given for the rest of the country and it may come too late for you guys should it happen nationally. http://www.nurseryworld.co.uk/nursery-world/news/1155788/dfe-names-30-hour-childcare-pilot-areas http://www.bbc.com/news/education-34934482 I've found primary in the UK and here to be comparable. I prefer the more laid back Aussie approach although that is changing now with the new standards being rolled out. England is far to test centric for little ones IMHO and I didn't enjoy that aspect at all. Also the whole OFSTED ratings and the desire to go to an 'outstanding' school and pressure on school places was high in our area. Only a few of the local primaries were zoned in our area of England and most of those were the village ones which only took from the village and surrounding area. Otherwise it was pick your 4 choices and hope you get one of them, ideally your first choice. I do know quite a few parents who didn't get their first or second choice and had to go with their 3rd or last choice and were unhappy with this. We actually opted out of the village school (rated outstanding) and 2 minutes walk from us and listed a school 1.8km away that was rated good as our first choice. We did this as we wanted our son to stay with his friends from pre school if possible as we were moving a year or so later and didn't want to keep making so many changes to his life if we could avoid it. I found the school decent but very small and cramped and stuck behind an 8 ft tall thick metal wire fence was quite intimidating. I love schools here often don't have that and it feels more open and less prison like. Sure there is fencing but not 8ft high and padlocked outside of school hours. Our local schools, you can go onto the ovals outside of school hours, the fencing is 4-5 ft along the roads and so on. Things like that might not strike a cord with everyone but for me, who remembers schools without fencing, its a big thing. Having seen both primary systems now I much prefer the Aussie one. Kids are kids longer here I feel and I think this has big benefits for their high school years. There is no being behind or ahead, just the school year starts at a different time, different way of doing things, subjects etc. By the time high school and exams come round, kids in both countries will be working hard. A child who enjoys school, is happy there, wants to work (and work pretty hard later on) will probably do so and do well in either country. A child who doesn't enjoy school, who is perhaps awkward socially for whatever reason, who struggles to make friends or settle, those kids could struggle in either country too. They could flourish also. Much comes down to the child, the parents and the environment and the support (ie kindy teachers, school staff etc). I've met plenty of competitive parents in England. Standing on the sidelines of a 7 year olds soccer game, listening to the parents yelling at their kids was a horrible experience. We had our 5 year old watching and it wasn't language I wanted him to hear from adults thats for sure. Same in schools. Sometimes it really was about where you lived or some such. Some parents avoided other parents and didn't encourage friendships because the other kid lived in a not so great part of town or some such. Lots of looking down the noses went on from some. I remember one friend who was so upset and hated doing the school run (different school to us) as not one single other Mum spoke to her, attempted to speak to her or anything. She was frozen out from day 1. Her kids were happy but the school experience for her was miserable and she couldn't share in any of it with other parents. End of the day, if you feel the move is a good thing for you all, as individuals and as a family then go for it. There is nothing set in stone or that is has to be forever. So long as your husband holds UK citizenship or can qualify for it somehow or you can afford the partner visa if not, then give it a try and find out. Worst that can happen is you have a year or two in the UK and realise its not where you want to be and you make plans to return to Aus at some point, depending on your circumstances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brit1 Posted February 20, 2016 Author Share Posted February 20, 2016 Thank you some good information and insights here. I agree, probably best to just go with the flow and know that no decision is irreversible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booma Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 At the age your children are I can't see any adverse issues, however, don't wear your rose tinted glasses! you will no doubt be welcomed back with much fuss and it will be lovely, however, real life will then kick in and everyone will resume theirs, perhaps you will see parents aren't really that different. I personally have noticed the inclination to have 3/4 children here in OZ (WA) and i have to say by my observations, much loved and treasured by their parents. And in terms of schooling, well I totally disagree with comments, my daughter is supposed to do 20 minutes homework and 15 minutes reading, in reality, its more like an hour plus the reading, every night, with maths and spelling tests on Fridays based totally on the homework, she is year 3, and she is thriving, I don't believe she would be behind if we returned to the UK. after teaching in both countries i dont think she would be behind either. parents in the uk are conditioned to think constant testing is a good thing & dont always see the value of teachings kids to think instead of to pass exams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caramac Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 I don't think it's the parents who think constant testing is a good thing. I don't personally know anyone who does - everyone seems to hate it. It's imposed by a government who doesn't trust it's professionals and who thinks everyone should fit in a neat little box, but it is something to consider when making a decision to return. However, our girls were tested constantly in their secondary school in Australia and definitely ''taught to the textbook' - no deviation allowed - so unlike the two secondary schools they've attended here. That said, it was an awful school all round and the biggest reason we returned to the UK. Good and bad everywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolman Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 Yeah I have to agree, we have become conditioned to think it's a good thing and not sure anyone does really. Our kids are doing really well in their school here, they are 14 and don't seem to be tested constantly although the last few months the have understandably been tested more, they don't seem to mind and appear to thrive on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bristolman Posted February 20, 2016 Share Posted February 20, 2016 Yeah I agree... my observations of parents here is that they do so much stuff with their kids, bike rides, beaches, picnics, everything actually seems to revolve around kids at weekends and its lovely actually xxx Parents in both countries do this stuff, it certainly isn't restricted to one country or the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.