robbothejoiner Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 Hi, looking for some help. Yes, "aint we all" I here you cry. Looking to move from UK to Brisbane late 2015 and basically AM going to start my own business over there. I am self employed here in the UK and have been for 10 years and made it work. Because that's what you have to do in life. Make thinks work for you. Read some really negative things on these threads and no doubt there will be more to follow here. But..... you got to start somewhere. So here I am. I'll tell you what I am looking for. Have you had a quote aor a job done from a Carpenter? How much did it cost. Or even, if you have not had work carried out, how much do you think it would cost. Now I know here I charge £25-40.00 per interior door fit. I know I charge £6.00/m2 to lay laminate flooring. It's £20.00 per metre to install fencing and i know how to transfer the exchange rate from GBP to AUD. However I realise we live in the real world and that doesnt work. I apologise in advance if I sound bullish, or blunt, but sometimes you just got to ask. I have seen places like Doors Plus etc charging $768 to supply and fit 3 white primed 4 or 6 panel doors. An offer I put out at £165-£180.00 I did try to retrieve quotes from 4 different carpenters for fitting of 5 Interior doors. Shockingly, none got back to me. Maybe saying the job was located in Rocklea was my downfall here but you have to go where the work is.... right? I appreciate you taking the time to read this and appreciate ANY feedback. Good and bad. Life's not all sunshine and flowers. Sometimes you got to start with good manure! lol Thank you, Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbothejoiner Posted March 15, 2015 Author Share Posted March 15, 2015 *things Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shellybingobingo Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 Hi and welcome , my advice would be just come over and make it work ...because that's what you have to do in life lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johndoe Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 If you're going to make it work for you. I would do your own costings and not base your business on what others are doing. If you undercut them, you could be cutting your own throat, if you overcharge what they are charging, you could be pricing yourself out of the market. Also bear in mind that youn will not be able to trade on your reputation/recommendations initially. Take a look at the cost of living first..............rent, utilities etc and decide what you would consider to be your mimimum requiremnts to live as you wish to live. Cost your materials and factor in your labour, expenditure, depreciation etc. All the things that a cost accountant would take into consideration and work from there. Nobody can give you a definitive/appropriate answer because only you know what your financial needs are, cost of materials, depreceation factor, petrol/mileage etc for each individual job. You have to factor in travelling time to each job as well................sometimes travelling time/expense will cost out at the same as labour time actually on the job...................too many variables I would think for anyone to come up witjh an answer other than yourself.................you should be founding your business on your own knowledge/expectations not on hearsay from others...................sorry if I sound blunt but a long while ago I did some cost accountancy for three "start-ups" and they thought my costings weren't competetive enough............they ignored them and all three went bust within 2 yrs...............they tried too hard at the competetive side of things and didn't focus on the realities of what it was actually costing them to do the jobs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbothejoiner Posted March 15, 2015 Author Share Posted March 15, 2015 OK Johndoe thanks for..... well. Your time, if nothing else. Please do not put words into my post that I did not submit. I never mentioned under cutting anyone. Neither did I mention overcharging. I assume when you number crunch, you use numbers? No? I don't see any in your response! I am not looking for business advice. I am looking for figures and stats. OK you're a wonderful number cruncher. 2 out of the 3 businesses you talked to failed solely because they never listened to you. Nice of you to follow up on them for two years!!! I needed that info. Thanks again. I like blunt. But useful blunt! Ripped off by a dumb tradie for $800 to fit 4 door! Blunt and useful. Your long winded self me me me did I mention me, post, well. Wasted 90 seconds of my life. And now another 2 minutes writing this. Yes I want others to read this. To see I am not being rude. Just blunt. These posts are supposed to be helpful and imformative. Not just to me. But others. Thanks for your useful links attached to your post also. *Note to self! Don't add links to posts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbothejoiner Posted March 15, 2015 Author Share Posted March 15, 2015 Thanks for that. Extra number for your POSTS was that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Que Sera Sera Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 OK Johndoe thanks for..... well. Your time, if nothing else. Please do not put words into my post that I did not submit. I never mentioned under cutting anyone. Neither did I mention overcharging. I assume when you number crunch, you use numbers? No? I don't see any in your response! I am not looking for business advice. I am looking for figures and stats. OK you're a wonderful number cruncher. 2 out of the 3 businesses you talked to failed solely because they never listened to you. Nice of you to follow up on them for two years!!! I needed that info. Thanks again. I like blunt. But useful blunt! Ripped off by a dumb tradie for $800 to fit 4 door! Blunt and useful. Your long winded self me me me did I mention me, post, well. Wasted 90 seconds of my life. And now another 2 minutes writing this. Yes I want others to read this. To see I am not being rude. Just blunt. These posts are supposed to be helpful and imformative. Not just to me. But others. Thanks for your useful links attached to your post also. *Note to self! Don't add links to posts. Just wow! :swoon: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shellybingobingo Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 I think your response was abit harsh ....I think johndoe was trying help up there ....maybe you should work on your customer service before you arrive . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freckleface Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 If you're going to make it work for you. I would do your own costings and not base your business on what others are doing. If you undercut them, you could be cutting your own throat, if you overcharge what they are charging, you could be pricing yourself out of the market. Also bear in mind that youn will not be able to trade on your reputation/recommendations initially. Take a look at the cost of living first..............rent, utilities etc and decide what you would consider to be your mimimum requiremnts to live as you wish to live. Cost your materials and factor in your labour, expenditure, depreciation etc. All the things that a cost accountant would take into consideration and work from there. Nobody can give you a definitive/appropriate answer because only you know what your financial needs are, cost of materials, depreceation factor, petrol/mileage etc for each individual job. You have to factor in travelling time to each job as well................sometimes travelling time/expense will cost out at the same as labour time actually on the job...................too many variables I would think for anyone to come up witjh an answer other than yourself.................you should be founding your business on your own knowledge/expectations not on hearsay from others...................sorry if I sound blunt but a long while ago I did some cost accountancy for three "start-ups" and they thought my costings weren't competetive enough............they ignored them and all three went bust within 2 yrs...............they tried too hard at the competetive side of things and didn't focus on the realities of what it was actually costing them to do the jobs. Well that's a couple of minutes of your life you will never get back. Bet you are glad you bothered Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johndoe Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 I'm sure you'll be an absolute success. Your "communication skills" will guide you through no matter what, I'm sure, and your appreciation of those who attempt to guide you, will no doubt assure you of success in whatever venture that you embark upon...............welcome to Oz.................the land where you have to "make it" and not rely on the fact that you may think that you have "made it" before..................the "lucky country" is nothing but an illusion and independence means feck all to those who appreciate that independence won't get you to where you wish to be.....................seriously though...............I know wher you're coming from................self employed................self made man..............ego is a hard task master though..........and invariably, the downfall of fools. Links? or the lack thereof that you question? links to what...............blogs of poms that have come to Oz and "made a killing" or more "sedately" found utopia based on the fact that they were "successful" self employed tradies in the Uk and as such should command the same respect/living standards herer? I remebber "the Lump" and how sao many "respectable" tradies in my street obtained most of their work through it...........so don't think that being in a "working class" trade that has allowed you to rise above the (non) self employed, should afford you any prestige. My apoolgies if I have responded in a manner (as you or others on the forum may see it) non befitting to a "self made man" but TBH...............from experience................i see most "self made men" as being made from the graft of others and the "avoidance" (a loose term) of their tax liabilities to quote yourself " am self employed here in the UK and have been for 10 years and made it work. Because that's what you have to do in life"................yeah sure...............you "make it work" because " that5s what you have to do in life"..................who's life?.....................yours?..................or the lives of those who make it "work for you"? Personal this................and will probably be deleted despite my effort at trying to illustrate a social/ethical/political dilema in a non- aggresive manner............albeit based on a migratory question that may at first glance seem just an employment question I rest my case and will converse no further because clearly, whatever it is that you were seeking from your initial post, will not be served by appeasement or platitudes. Good luck in your endeavours to endear yourself to Aussies (your bread and butter).............I reckon that you'll need heaps of it. To others reading................I feel like a real bitch and feck me................it feels good! I await at the least, a ban...............how dare I confront a new member to the forum....................albeit someone who couldn't give a feck about the forum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johndoe Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 My apolgies my previous nresponse...............I've had a few and I don't suffer fools gladly when I have................despite the fact that some may thin that it's me that's the fooil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shellybingobingo Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 No need to apologize u av done nothing wrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shellybingobingo Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 I only posted initially , because nobody posted I know nothing about carpentry ...I was just having a bit of fun .....lol .....maybe I suffer from foot and mouth too but not intentionally to upset people ....when I first read the post I thought initially when the op said he reads a lot of negative posts on forums ...and u make it work ....because that's life ...my initial thought was ....people know that ...they haven't flew otherside of world for it to not to work ,...but for some industries ATM it's not that simple , so that's why u will hear so called negative comments , I am not being negative just realistic , I haven't a full understanding but I'm not daft enough to know there isn't a problem lol .....so it's not as simple as stating and u make it work ....if only it was so black and white I'd be rocking and a rolling now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbothejoiner Posted March 15, 2015 Author Share Posted March 15, 2015 (edited) . There's a time and place for blowing sunshine. Maybe I should have left no comment at all! But where's the fun in that? I would like to point out to the forum administrator that Johndoe is only speaking his mind and no bad feeling (on my side) nor harm has been done. Now I'll try again on another site and try to avoid the super posters. Edited March 16, 2015 by calNgary removed personal comments Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shellybingobingo Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 Fill ya boots sunshine ....hope you have more luck ! You'll need it ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbothejoiner Posted March 15, 2015 Author Share Posted March 15, 2015 I also apologise for being far too abrupt. Sometimes simple things are just that. People like to overcomplicate things to make themselves feel good. I asked a simple question.... how much does it cost? And in response.... well.... your read it once. It gets incredibly infuriating. Again. Sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyHeart Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 You did say you'd appreciate ANY feedback Brisbane...but then you didn't appreciate it at all? Strange....I'd say what JohnDoe said to you was genuinely good advice that he took time to impart...your response was less than gracious! There's direct...and then there's rude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saff Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 (edited) It really depends on what work you're going to be doing and in what capacity OP.. I can't speak for brisbane as such as I didn't engage any chippy's over there but in Perth you'd be looking at $130 upwards to hang a door, skirtings from $10/m Jarra floorboards supplied and fitted for around $150 m2. But if you're looking for a more commercial deployment, then this is all largely irrelevant. Then you also have to envisage if you can maintain a living as a startup with all the outlay and costs and work tricklng in. Not to teach anyone to suck eggs, but may well be worth securing work as a tradie on a site etc to give you time to tool up and do work in the local market on the side as you'd understand. You'd also be racking a much better and consistant income as a $50-90/hr tradie.. Your best bet is to jump on gumtree.com.au or serviceseek and search for carpentry services around Brisbane, then you can pick and compare from the people or companies that look like they provide the similar quality and size of work that you'd be looking to do; and which price bracket and project size fits within your business plan and associated costs.. Edited March 16, 2015 by saff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beach pig Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 It really depends on what work you're going to be doing and in what capacity OP.. I can't speak for brisbane as such as I didn't engage any chippy's over there but in Perth you'd be looking at $130 upwards to hang a door, skirtings from $10/m Jarra floorboards supplied and fitted for around $150 m2. But if you're looking for a more commercial deployment, then this is all largely irrelevant. Then you also have to envisage if you can maintain a living as a startup with all the outlay and costs and work tricklng in. Not to teach anyone to suck eggs, but may well be worth securing work as a tradie on a site etc to give you time to tool up and do work in the local market on the side as you'd understand. You'd also be racking a much better and consistant income as a $50-90/hr tradie.. Your best bet is to jump on gumtree.com.au or serviceseek and search for carpentry services around Brisbane, then you can pick and compare from the people or companies that look like they provide the similar quality and size of work that you'd be looking to do; and which price bracket and project size fits within your business plan and associated costs.. $50-90 an hour? Not if you work for a employer. Here in adelaide a chipys wage ranges from$25-40 an hour depending how proficient you are.always thought I was getting ripped off.:laugh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saff Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 $50-90 an hour? Not if you work for a employer. Here in adelaide a chipys wage ranges from$25-40 an hour depending how proficient you are.always thought I was getting ripped off.:laugh: :laugh: kind of reinforces the point of it being difficult to gauge without knowing how he wants to go about things. on my current project we're paying around $60 I believe, my last was 3 hours north of Brisbane and was around $65 standard rate for a chippy - not sure what that accounted of as far as any loaded days etc go.. the $90 end of the spectrum was more aiming at an hire out rate if you had your own business and were subbying to main contractors for larger works rather than being an employee per say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbothejoiner Posted March 28, 2015 Author Share Posted March 28, 2015 Thanks for you help everyone. $120 for door? Suppose after tax and insurance it's not as good as first looks. On our value fits here we're using Dale Hardware, from Gainsborough, in Melbourne. And I'm talking about here in the UK. I don't know how that works either. It doesn't seem as cheap in Oz for materials, however I'm comparing to Oz DIY prices. Anyways. Thank you again for your help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wakeboard1980 Posted March 28, 2015 Share Posted March 28, 2015 How long does it take you to hang a door? Is it fitting a new door to an existing door jamb, or new jamb and architraves? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbothejoiner Posted March 29, 2015 Author Share Posted March 29, 2015 How long does it take you to hang a door? Is it fitting a new door to an existing door jamb, or new jamb and architraves? Just fitting a door to existing. This is a genuine question. If someone asks for a price to fit a door, would they expect new door jambs and facings to be included? Surely they would ask for this in addition? No? As as for how long it takes to fit a door. That's not how price work, works. I didn't think. If you charge $120.00 you take as long as necessary to leave as good a finish as possible. Whether it be 1 hour or 3. Too many guys taking X amount per hour to fit a door and "hanging it out" to make more money. a little unfair on the customer I feel. Although price work, I understand can seem the same. One day could be 2 hours per door, another 50 minutes per door. But both customers should be happy as the price was pre set and upfront though. Also on the time point. I've spent a good bit of money on top end tools and maintaining them to make things quicker. Why should I earn less than the guy fitting doors with a hand saw and screw driver if my finish is just as good or better? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacaranda Posted March 29, 2015 Share Posted March 29, 2015 (edited) You like "blunt"but can't take a blunt reply?Johndoe was telling you how it is,and tbh if you don't/can't accept it,Australia isn't for you!Here's some wise advice,lose the attitude and you may get somewhere,either on this forum or "if you make it"in Australia!Boy I've read some posts on this forum but your's really takes the (insert whatever word you wish!) You said you were heading over to the other forum?Don;t let the door hit you on the butt on your way out!(Excuse the pun!):laugh: Edited March 29, 2015 by Jacaranda Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wakeboard1980 Posted March 29, 2015 Share Posted March 29, 2015 Just fitting a door to existing. This is a genuine question. If someone asks for a price to fit a door, would they expect new door jambs and facings to be included?Surely they would ask for this in addition? No? As as for how long it takes to fit a door. That's not how price work, works. I didn't think. If you charge $120.00 you take as long as necessary to leave as good a finish as possible. Whether it be 1 hour or 3. Too many guys taking X amount per hour to fit a door and "hanging it out" to make more money. a little unfair on the customer I feel. Although price work, I understand can seem the same. One day could be 2 hours per door, another 50 minutes per door. But both customers should be happy as the price was pre set and upfront though. Also on the time point. I've spent a good bit of money on top end tools and maintaining them to make things quicker. Why should I earn less than the guy fitting doors with a hand saw and screw driver if my finish is just as good or better? The reason I asked how long it takes you to hang a door was because that first and foremost will be a major factor in you setting your price. No you wont charge by the hour, you will give the customer a price but you can then 'convert' the labour element to an hourly rate. thats how price work works. No point charging $40 to hang a door and you can only hang a few a day. That's how all quotes/price work work. Comes back to Johndoes post, his points about underpricing and overpricing are therefore very relevant. so how much are you going to charge to hang a door? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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