Guest Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Warning - long post I just thought I would share our experiences at the start of our journey out of Oz. We came here in 2003 net expecting better or worse, just different. I was lucky enough to get a job before I came and we settled in well to the Northern Suburbs of Brisbane. We have had a fantastic time travelling all over the country, 4WDing on Fraser etc etc. The kids were 5 and 18 months when we moved out here and are now 17 (just finishing yr 12) and 13.(yr 8) Over the last couple of years things haven't been so great. I was made redundant and the 2 years before that were horrible. Its really hard to work somewhere where you know you are not wanted, but because you are so busy trying to defend your existence, don't have time to find another job. I did get a job pretty much straight away but on a lot less money, so things have been tight. IN addition to that we have a small business that is bleeding money. Its up for sale but no takers as yet. this is causing lots of stress and worry. Finally life is just too damn complicated. We have made the decision to move but there is soooo much to sort out and until the business is sold (if ever!) we can't do anything. WE have let our parents know what we want to do and they think we are insane - apparently Australia is paradise on earth and they doth get what we want to do. Not that it matters but the comments get a bit tiring. We had my father in law over here for 2 weeks and the whole time he was telling us what we were were thinking about was stupid. they keep telling us if we MUST move, then leave something behind just in case. This sounds reasonable in principle but I am not sure we will ever come back. I just can't see myself growing old here. Regardless of the last couple of years, I think we have got itchy feet because we have been in the same place for too long. 12 years is a long time in one place and in one house and i think it is time to try something else. If I could get work in Canada we would go there for a bit but it looks very difficult so with the language as a barrier, it only leaves the US, South Africa or the UK. (NZ is too close). I don't want to go to the US or SA so it looks like the UK for a bit at least. My issue at the moment is the decision is made BUT we can't set a date as we have so much to clear up here. Its like being in limbo - knowing that we are off but not knowing when and having to wait for things to fall in to place and it all seems to happen so slowly. Just a bit of a whinge really but it is nice to get it off my chest. There is only so many times you can talk about it between yourselves and I can't really tell anyone else because I don't want work to know. We don't hate OZ, there have been some good times but more recently some bad ones and this maybe colouring our perspective and pushing the move but I think our time here is at an end. WE have 'done' Australia and its time for some new adventures. I just wish it would happen sooner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aunt Agatha Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Sorry you've had a tough time lately. I completely agree re limbo, it's a really difficult state to be in. We just set a return date (Feb next year) a couple of days ago and it feels like a massive weight has been lifted. Like you, we waiting for some financial things to fall into place and now that is imminent we can plan the move. For a while it felt like it was never going to happen but now it's all systems go - you'll get to that point too. As for people telling you that you're mad etc. Just ignore it the best you can or ask them how many foreign countries they have lived in! Whatever happens, leaving Australia is obviously right for you and your immediate family and it really isn't anyone else's business. There are things you can start doing towards the move which will make you feel like you are being proactive rather than just waiting. Start decluttering now - sell/donate anything you know you won't ship. Get quotes for shipping and pet transport (if you have them) so you can make a budget to fund the move. Open a savings account (I like Ubank) and call your account "The big move" or something and send a bit of cash into it each month and watch the moving fund grow. It all helps to make you feel more in control and when the time comes you'll have a head start. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyHeart Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Good luck with whatever you decide. No one else can make decisions about YOUR life. I would agree with the FIL though that to cut all ties may be counterproductive...don't forget you children will likely have stronger ties to Australia than you. Sometimes though you've just got to go and go with the flow, things usually work out for the best when we stop trying to micro-manage everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katie22 Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Once you decide to make the move back you will constantly have family, friends, and anyone you meet telling you you're mad for returning! But at the end of the day they are not you, they are on the outside looking in and have no idea (if they don't want to listen that is) how you are feeling and what will make you happy. So if you've made the decision to move then ignore the doubters and start planning your move. It certainly sounds as if the recent years have been difficult for you, maybe that is swaying your decision or maybe that's making you realise that you you've got in a rut and its time to get out of it. I know exactly how you feel as I'm in limbo too, hoping to go end of next year but it's dependent on finances and teenagers, so you feel as if you're neither here nor there. What Aunt Agatha said was pretty sensible with starting to declutter, savings account etc and just sit down with your family and make a list of all the things you need to clear up before you go and make plans to get it all done. Once it's all written down and broken down into tasks, it'll look more manageable and achievable. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quoll Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 The only thing you really need is citizenship. If you can afford to rent out your home then that's probably not a bad move as a belt and braces approach but if you can't afford that then just be content with the passport and shake the dust from your shoes (before your kids dig in their heels and refuse to move!). I'm really sorry that it has all gone pear shaped but moving on is probably a wise move - just don't move on to anywhere near the FiL he obviously chooses to live in the proverbial "sh*t hole" espoused by so many wannabee emigrants! Move on to one of the beautiful places that some of us other returnees inhabit! I hope your limbo is short lived - as the others have said, start preparing! There's something really cathartic about de Cluttering! Good Luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 I know exactly how you feel in limbo. We too are in limbo want to go but just as we were making plans i had a cancer diagnosis. So it's all on hold until i'm all done with i need to do. We have other things to sort out too but they will have to also wait for now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacaranda Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 It must be frustrating for you living in limbo.I agree with Quoll on the citizen option,thats sensible advice!How do the kids feel about the move back?Keen?Are you advertising your business with different places (apart from agents)?Gumtree?Ebay? I would'nt personally listen to any family or friends trying to put you off of returning.Remember your FIL is visiting on "holiday"which is totally different than actually living in Oz!They're viewing the UK through their own eyes not yours!Most people I know here actually have a really positive outlook of living in the UK,including myself and my two aussie grown up girls!Where are you planning on returning to?Best wishes for a happy future and Hope everything moves quickly for you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozee Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Except Quebec, rest of Canada is speaking English. Why the language barrier? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Hi All and thanks for the responses Hadn't thought of advertising on Gumtree - Will get some thing up over the weekend. Kids are really keen to go. DD has a work placement starting in January in the UK for a year and wants to go to Uni there anyway. DS will go wherever we go. Ozee - canada is not an option because of the difficulty in getting work there. I dont have any contacts and don't qualify for a permanent visa so would need to find an employer to sponsor me. Quoll - you shouldn't believe the Sxxt hole the FIL lives in. We are looking to head to the South West, although originally from the Midlands and as I pointed out to him, I shouldn't be competing with a Pole for a minimum wage job (hopefully :-)) so it should be ok. The biggest stress is the business which is losing money. Once that goes - either by selling or shutting then hopefully the stress will ease. I was planning to paint the lounge this weekend to try and get the house ready for sale but got distracted. Luckily it is a long weekend so still have 2 days left! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petals Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 You sound like my parents although you have not moved as much as they did. As the child and in my teens when they did the last big move, it was very hard for me. I did not fit in and it was hard to make new friends etc etc, education system completely different etc etc. So it helped me to stay put for my children and that is what I have done and it has paid for itself in spades. My brother and I still feel isolated and that we do not fit etc etc. and my brother more than me blames my parents. When we are kids and in our teens even we do what our parents want but its often not the best thing for us. Not trying to put a downer on it, just putting children's point of view. Four different countries and after I left home, my brother had it even worse with the wunderlust parents, living in every State and going to so many schools he cannot remember one he liked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Petals- we have agonised long and hard about moving the kids. The eldest is pretty much gone and she is happy with her plans. We are all citizens so she can come back if she wants. DS at 13 is happy to go to the UK. We have offered him the option to board here if he wants to. He fits in pretty well, and as long as we find him a rugby club and Scouts, he will be happy. This has all been discussed with the kids and their opinions taken on board. Had DS violently objected we would have waited for him to see out school Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diane Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 DD has a work placement starting in January in the UK for a year and wants to go to Uni there anyway. Hiya - as a fellow parent of a teenager who looked into studying in the UK, I wasn't sure if you or your daughter are aware that she will have to live in the UK for three years prior to Uni entry if she doesn't want to have to pay International fees (usually about 3 to 4 times what a local would pay - i.e. around GBP30k a year) This is regardless of whether she is a UK citizen - it is purely down to having to live there for three years (for a reason other than education) prior to Uni entry - this also affects Uni Loans (I don't knoiw what they are called in the UK - but equivalent of HECS here). Wish you luck with it all - but just thought that might be something you weren't aware of :wubclub: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Hi Dianne Sadly Very aware of that!. She will need to do a foundation year and will have the working year there too so she might just delay one more to get the local fees. Just something else we will deal with when we get there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wanderer Returns Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Warning - long post WE have let our parents know what we want to do and they think we are insane - apparently Australia is paradise on earth and they doth get what we want to do. Not that it matters but the comments get a bit tiring. We had my father in law over here for 2 weeks and the whole time he was telling us what we were were thinking about was stupid. they keep telling us if we MUST move, then leave something behind just in case. This sounds reasonable in principle but I am not sure we will ever come back. I just can't see myself growing old here. .... We don't hate OZ, there have been some good times but more recently some bad ones and this maybe colouring our perspective and pushing the move but I think our time here is at an end. WE have 'done' Australia and its time for some new adventures. I just wish it would happen sooner. As a professional who works with teenagers every day, I can assure you that migration (in any direction) is a major upheaval to their lives, regardless of whether they say they are 'up for it' or not. A new country, culture, school, friends etc - it's a massive adjustment. This is especially true if they have lived their entire formative years in one place - in this case, Australia. To say that you have 'done' Australia suggest that you still have the mindset of a backpacker or traveller who never intended their move here to be permanent. This may be the reason why you have not been successful in settling in Australia, even though you have been here 11 years already. Whatever problems you have experienced probably have a lot more do to with your own life choices rather than what you perceive to be wrong with Australia. Your father-in-law has offered you some pearls of wisdom and not without good reason. If you've found it tough here in the last few years, you would have found it 10 times harder back in the UK. You've no idea how much things have changed since you left - and not for the better. I also left the UK in 2003 and have been back on several occasions, so have witnessed these changes personally. It's not been pretty. Good luck with whatever you decide to do. I firmly believe you'll find what you're looking for a lot closer to home than the UK, Canada or the next exotic destination. Martin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Martin I was waiting for the "things have been so bad back in the UK" post. You assume we haven't been back or haven't got any idea of what changes have occurred. On what basis do you think we have "no idea"? Your tone seems to suggest that not intending the move to be permanent is a bad thing? Why is that? I also don't think I said anything was wrong with Australia, All I said was it wasn't a paradise on earth. We are ready to move, our children are ready to move, infact one will go whether we go or not. I also don't think we have been unsuccessful in settling here - we have had 10 great years and 2 bad ones. the fact we don't want to stay for good doesn't make us "unsuccessful". In fact I don't see moving in terms of success of failure, I see it in terms of experiencing life and then moving on to new experiences. Yes life has been tough, and that could have happened anywhere, but it has spurred us on to make decisions about what we want to do as a family, rather than what others want us to do. The FIL has given "pearls of wisdom" from one who has visited twice in 12 years, this year and 12 years ago, and from one who still lives in the house he was born in! I had a whinge on a public forum and therefore accept that anyone can have an opinion on whether we are doing the right thing or not. So far this thread has give me lots of encouragement and useful tips. Thank you Quoll, Katie, Aunt Agatha,Dianne and others. For those who look to question - I can give you the phone number of the FIL if you like - I am sure you can have a great chat :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chortlepuss Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Yeah hear a lot of the 'UK' gone to dogs' conversations but limited evidence. Mostly from my sis (two major holidays and a number of concerts in the last month alone) Back in SE UK last year - extended my holiday as got a job offer (was out of work in QLD so £ was very welcome). Fact is it can be grim for unskilled and new graduates anywhere - but the kind of people who migrated to Oz tend to be highly skilled - and rare to hear of people going back to UK struggling to find work. I have a well paid job here, a lovely rental in a great part of Brisbane - but I intend to head home in 18 months (youngest will be 18 so similar uni situation). Not getting any younger and I want to be home. Many people would look on what we have as paradise - not knocking it but for some of us, Oz is not for us long term. Do post when you get back - I love reading the stories of how happy people are! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucharmily Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 You know what is right for you and your family and I wish you the best of luck with everything Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katie22 Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 I think teenagers can be pretty resilient. Am sure that migration can turn out not so good for some, along with adults too, but if they want to go then where's the problem? I could understand if they were moving to a third world country or a war zone but I don't think Britain's got quite that bad yet! I'm sticking up for the OP here as I know how they feel. It sounds to me as if they've been here long enough to know exactly how they feel about living in Australia and not be labelled backpackers or travellers and I fully understand the need to do something different. It might not work for some who are happy to settle in the same house, town, city, or whatever indefinitely. But at the end of the day we are all different and value different things in life. And sometimes it can be going through the hard times and getting in a rut makes you realise that it's time to do something about it and move on. Once again good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacaranda Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Wanderer Returns:Abit harsh I thought on the OP,considering you yourself did'nt say anything positive about the UK !All Mrsdawnrazor said was Australia was'nt for them,but they feel ready to move on!Then you go on a rant about the UK's changes havent been for the better and its not been pretty?Can you please eloborate on this? OP I think how you view the UK will depend alot on where you're from and where you're going?Beauty is in the eye of the beholder so they say! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abz123 Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Best of luck with whatever decision you make but just as an aside, most of Canada is English speaking - Quebec is the French speaking province. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wanderer Returns Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 Wanderer Returns:Abit harsh I thought on the OP,considering you yourself did'nt say anything positive about the UK !All Mrsdawnrazor said was Australia was'nt for them,but they feel ready to move on! Then you go on a rant about the UK's changes havent been for the better and its not been pretty?Can you please eloborate on this? Apologies if my post came across as 'a bit harsh' but I feel quite strongly about the issue of moving children at this stage in their lives. Some kids are absolutely fine and adapt well - others don't and have real trouble adjusting. A previous poster mentioned the negative effect it had on her and her brother and vowed to give her own children the stability they didn't have. I also got moved by my parents when I was 16 (just finished my O'levels) because my father retired and my parents wanted to move back to the north of England from Bedfordshire. I was okay with that at the time, but I never really settled and it may have even been a catalyst for my move to Australia. My mum mentioned to me a while ago that in hindsight, she thought they'd made a mistake to move at that time. I don't subscribe to the notion that if the kids are 'okay' with the parent's ideas, then that should be taken as an automatic endorsement. They don't have the life experience to fully understand the impact until it has happened. They also have a tendency to nurture any 'seed' planted by over-enthusiastic parents and take ownership of that! ;-) I absolutely love the UK and certainly don't consider myself to be a 'UK basher'. I've been back home every year since I emigrated except 2005 and that seemed like the longest year ever! Most years we try and get back for Christmas and New Year, although not always possible due to the expense. And much as though it's great to visit, there's no better feeling than checking into Heathrow around the 3rd January, usually to enjoy a couple of weeks in Sri Lanka, Thailand or Malaysia en route back to Oz. I could not even dream of doing that if I was a public sector worker in the UK (whose wages have been frozen for the last 3 years), earning 60% of what I do here. I'm sure some people move back and enjoy better economic conditions than they do here in Australia, but all the statistics show that they are in the minority. I appreciate that a lot of people come to this forum for support and validation of their ideas, so I'm sorry if I've offended the OP by being 'a bit harsh'. If I was feeling uncertain about a decision I was about to make, I might well have written a similar post. Personally I find it more helpful when people offer constructive criticism regarding my ideas, rather than simply endorsing whatever it is I plan to do without any justification for the feel-good factor. And good luck to you Mrsdawnrazor, whatever you choose to do :-) Martin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peach Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 Over the last couple of years things haven't been so great. I was made redundant and the 2 years before that were horrible. Its really hard to work somewhere where you know you are not wanted, but because you are so busy trying to defend your existence, don't have time to find another job. I did get a job pretty much straight away but on a lot less money, so things have been tight. IN addition to that we have a small business that is bleeding money. Its up for sale but no takers as yet. this is causing lots of stress and worry. Finally life is just too damn complicated. We have made the decision to move but there is soooo much to sort out and until the business is sold (if ever!) we can't do anything. Just curious as to how you think it will be better by moving to the UK, or how life will be less complicated? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 Its not the move that will decomplicate things, we could actually do that here, its just combining everything. We have fallen in to the trap of high pressure careers, big house, investments, business etc and have realised that what that means is that if we want to change things then it means a lot of undoing. I don't think the stress we have put ourselves under (yes I fully accept we made these decisions) is delivering or going to deliver what we actually want. Its kind of like doing the things you are supposed to do without considering if that is actually what you want to do. The move is what we want to do, we will probably only be in the UK for 5 years or so before moving to France. (My french is OK, just not good enough to get a job!) We probably wont buy a house, just rent for a few years and really take the time to work out what and where we want to be. Could we do that here - yes but we don't want to. WE really don't think it will be better in the UK, in the same way we didn't expect it to be better when we came here - just different. I also get the concerns about moving the kids, but if we are honest we are talking about one, as the other had already decided to move. She is nearly 18 and it is time for her to live her life as she sees fit. We will be there to support her but we trust that we have brought her up well enough to be able to manage her life and make her own choices. Our son will be fine. I guess I know him better than anyone on an anonymous forum and as a mother, would not make decisions that were not thought through or that I thought would harm him. to be honest, being nearer his family rather than the other side of the world will have some major benefits for him. Wanderer returns - I am not unsure about my decision, I just am frustrated at not begin able to make it happen more quickly. We have 2 move dates per year based around schooling Dec/Jan or June/July. This is to minimise the disruption for DS. The window is closing fast on Dec/Jan so there is a level of frustration that we will probably have to wait another 6-9 months. I am the sort of person who once a decision is made, likes to make things happen, and I can't make things go quicker than they are. In respect to your comments about not settling and prompting the move to Australia - I would see that as a fantastic opportunity. what would have happened if you had stayed in Bedfordshire? Would you be here now, would you have experienced all the wonderful things Australia has to offer. Maybe - or from your comments, maybe not and what a lot you would have missed out on. Are we making the right decision - who knows, but at least we are making one. I think that is much better than drifting on from year to year because "this is what we do and this is where we are". Our kids have the wonderful opportunity of dual citizenship, we can ping pong if we like, nothing is impossible. I just have to decomplicate to allow that flexibility:-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NicF Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 Good for you. We moved to Australia partly because we had a bit of an 'is this it?' moment. We had lived in the same house for 8 years and felt like life had stagnated and we needed a change. And, like you, the house and area were never meant to be a forever place. My Oh is Australian and we had always said we would move over one day. And the time was just right. Sounds like the time is right for you guys so you should just do what is best for you and go. As as for the other stuff, the business and the moving dates, I wouldn't get too hung up on trying to move at the end of school years. While it may be slightly better starting at the beginning of a term it's not going to be an issue if your son starts at a different time. Or you could try and time it for him to start after a half term, or after the Easter break. With the business I'd be tempted to just cut my loses and close it down as quickly as possible. Good luck with it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacaranda Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 WR:Thanks for the reply,which I appreciate.I myself moved to Oz aged 9 with my family in 1970.Years later returned to the UK with my own kids (aussies).We did discuss it for a year beforehand a decision was made,and luckily the kids settled in no probs!They are now both in their 20's and love it here. I work in the public sectre,and my OH and I manage very well.Infact since being in the UK,I have travelled so much,places I only used to dream about when I lived in Oz.We're about to jet off to Sri Lanka,been before a couple of times,and its a great country! Sounds like Mrsdawnrazor has it all under control,and they know what they're doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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