Is the 'Pacific Solution' unravelling?

[flag of convenience]

Cornelia Rau? That was 2004 flag

 

Yes she is the person I was referring to. My mistake. It somehow felt far longer.

[Harpodom]

Yes she is the person I was referring to. My mistake. It somehow felt far longer.

 

compared to confusing a person exercising a basic human right for a criminal/terrorist, that's no biggie!

[Parley]

That was hardly deliberate. Not sure what you are driving at.

 

We have to protect our country and has been said numerous times we can't assume everyone who lands on our shore in a leaky boat is a nice person and doesn't mean us harm.

We also need an effective deterrent.

 

Has it never occurred to you that you might be wrong given 80% agree with the current approach.

[Harpodom]

That was hardly deliberate. Not sure what you are driving at.

 

We have to protect our country and has been said numerous times we can't assume everyone who lands on our shore in a leaky boat is a nice person and doesn't mean us harm.

We also need an effective deterrent.

 

Has it never occurred to you that you might be wrong given 80% agree with the current approach.

 

No

[wakeboard1980]

Why do they come to Australia anyway, they do pass through a lot of countries that are safer than where they left on their way to the boat ride to Aus

[Parley]

Why do they come to Australia anyway, they do pass through a lot of countries that are safer than where they left on their way to the boat ride to Aus

 

The answer is fairly obvious.

[Harpodom]

The answer is fairly obvious.

 

I'm glad you're finally learning: that's right parley, the countries they pass through offer them no protection (or rights) as they aren't signatory to the 1951 refugee convention.

 

Well done parley:notworthy::hug:

[MARYROSE02]

I'm glad you're finally learning: that's right parley, the countries they pass through offer them no protection (or rights) as they aren't signatory to the 1951 refugee convention.

 

Well done parley:notworthy::hug:

 

Sounds like they are all far, far worse than Australia in that case, which begs the question, why are we worried about our international reputation being supposedly sullied. But it also begs the question, if they are fleeing a particularly awful situation in their own countries, then surely they would head for the first, relatively safe country they could find? If you are adrift in a life boat, would you care which boat rescued you just as long as you WERE rescued. You get the same situation in Europe anyway, with asylum seekers rejecting various democratic countries because they all want to get to the UK.

[Harpodom]

Sounds like they are all far, far worse than Australia in that case, which begs the question, why are we worried about our international reputation being supposedly sullied. But it also begs the question, if they are fleeing a particularly awful situation in their own countries, then surely they would head for the first, relatively safe country they could find? If you are adrift in a life boat, would you care which boat rescued you just as long as you WERE rescued. You get the same situation in Europe anyway, with asylum seekers rejecting various democratic countries because they all want to get to the UK.

The thing that's changed since the 'Pacific Solution', then Rudd's 'you'll never call Australia home', and then OSB, is that Australia ALSO offers no protection or rights, unless you call indefinite detention in a remote tropical prison, far away from pesky journalists, 'protection'.

 

Australia is now not just as $hit, its actually worse than those places, which at least offer a glimmer of hope, arguably.

 

Congrats mate: lowest common denominator achieved, pretty much your raison d'etre, you must be pleased.

[wakeboard1980]

The answer is fairly obvious.

There are also a lot of countries a lot closer to where they have fled as well that are a lot safer. Why make such a long journey to Australia, and drag your kids along as well?

[MARYROSE02]

The thing that's changed since the 'Pacific Solution', then Rudd's 'you'll never call Australia home', and then OSB, is that Australia ALSO offers no protection or rights, unless you call indefinite detention in a remote tropical prison, far away from pesky journalists, 'protection'.

 

Australia is now not just as $hit, its actually worse than those places, which at least offer a glimmer of hope, arguably.

 

Congrats mate: lowest common denominator achieved, pretty much your raison d'etre, you must be pleased.

 

How can Australia be WORSE than those other places? If that was the case, not only would people no longer want to come here, but also there would be people living in Australia, clamouring to be allowed to leave!

 

Detention centres are not suppoesd to be luxury hotels or even holiday camps. They are supposed to house people securely whilst we find out if they are who they say they are. Would you want Jihadi John to be allowed to come into Australia without any checks, just because he destroyed his papers and said he was fleeing for his life?

[Jessiejam]

Jihadi john doesn't want to come here, he's left England to go to Iraq to establish an Islamic state. If he did decide to come here, he may just apply for a whv using his British passport.

[Harpodom]

How can Australia be WORSE than those other places? If that was the case, not only would people no longer want to come here, but also there would be people living in Australia, clamouring to be allowed to leave!

 

Detention centres are not suppoesd to be luxury hotels or even holiday camps. They are supposed to house people securely whilst we find out if they are who they say they are. Would you want Jihadi John to be allowed to come into Australia without any checks, just because he destroyed his papers and said he was fleeing for his life?

 

Oh FFS.

 

By 'other places' I was referring to the ones they passed through, whereas you seem to be confusing 'other places' with the ones they escaped.

 

 

There's is quite a difference. But I can see again semantics isn't one of your strong points, what with the whole asylum seeker = jihadist confusion. Seriously, ISIS (sorry, Jihadi John, so catchy!) turning up on boats, claiming asylum? Sounds like one of Baldrick's 'cunning plans' :biglaugh:.

 

 

 

Again, you resort to the 'well what do they expect, the Hilton?' argument.

 

The reality of Manus/Nauru (as you know but won't acknowledge or accept) is a million times worse:

 

 

• they are imprisoned in horrific conditions (YOU KNOW THAT), with no prospect of ever being allowed to set foot in Australia (except when they are medivacced out)

• God only knows if their asylum claims are being looked at (or indeed, the quality of the assessment process).

• In the case of Manus, IF they are found to be genuine refugees, PNG won't accept them, Australia won't accept them.

• This after more than a FKING YEAR IN DETENTION, HAVING WITNESSED ONE ON THE 'TRANSFEREES' BEING MURDERED BY ONE OF THE GUARDS

 

 

I've put it in bullet points to make it easier for you to read and understand. You must have been an awful student at school, I pity your teachers, did you often see them banging their head against the wall?

Edited September 6, 2014 by Harpodom

[MARYROSE02]

Oh FFS.

 

By 'other places' I was referring to the ones they passed through, whereas you seem to be confusing 'other places' with the ones they escaped.

 

 

There's is quite a difference. But I can see again semantics isn't one of your strong points, what with the whole asylum seeker = jihadist confusion. Seriously, ISIS (sorry, Jihadi John, so catchy!) turning up on boats, claiming asylum? Sounds like one of Baldrick's 'cunning plans' :biglaugh:.

 

 

 

Again, you resort to the 'well what do they expect, the Hilton?' argument.

 

The reality of Manus/Nauru (as you know but won't acknowledge or accept) is a million times worse:

 

 

• they are imprisoned in horrific conditions (YOU KNOW THAT), with no prospect of ever being allowed to set foot in Australia (except when they are medivacced out)

• God only knows if their asylum claims are being looked at (or indeed, the quality of the assessment process).

• In the case of Manus, IF they are found to be genuine refugees, PNG won't accept them, Australia won't accept them.

• This after more than a FKING YEAR IN DETENTION, HAVING WITNESSED ONE ON THE 'TRANSFEREES' BEING MURDERED BY ONE OF THE GUARDS

 

 

I've put it in bullet points to make it easier for you to read and understand. You must have been an awful student at school, I pity your teachers, did you often see them banging their head against the wall?

 

They are not 'horrific conditions.' Austere, certainly, but not a concentration camp, and as you well know, if it was as bad as you say it is, then nobody would ever risk coming to Australia again.

 

You want anybody and everybody who tries to come to Australia to be treated as genuine and you don't want them held in any form of detention, which means that if 'Jihadi John' or Charles Manson, or Adolf Hitler, or Pol Pot, arrived here claiming to be a refugee, you would accept them.

 

One person murdered, one died from an illness which may or may not have been due to medical malpractice. What about the hundreds who drowned on the boats? And as I said before, but you ignored, why don't you show some compassion for the Aussies who died in the pink batts fiasco. I care about Australians first, last and everything and I'm not ashamed of it.

 

And remember, I have no problems with Australia's official refugee program.

[Harpodom]

Again your learning disability, that of semantic dyslexia, comes to the fore.

 

I only want people to be treated humanely, to have their asylum claim ACTUALLY treated seriously, in fact, actually dealt with AT ALL.

 

You assume that means I am encouraging terrorists to come here, but TBH, that just betrays your paranoid rightard mindset: assume everything, learn nothing. Treat ALL these people, even defenceless toddlers, as terrorists, out to blow us all up.

 

Again, to equate desperate people taking the massive risk of arriving by boat to an act of terrorist sabotage is.....laughable. Priceless, and laughable.:biglaugh:.

 

Do you REALLY think that someone contemplating a terrorist atrocity in Australia is going to come here by boat? :biglaugh:

 

Of course not, they will come by much more subversive means: fake passport, fake ID, by plane.

 

 

 

They are not 'horrific conditions.' Austere, certainly, but not a concentration camp, and as you well know, if it was as bad as you say it is, then nobody would ever risk coming to Australia again.

 

You want anybody and everybody who tries to come to Australia to be treated as genuine and you don't want them held in any form of detention, which means that if 'Jihadi John' or Charles Manson, or Adolf Hitler, or Pol Pot, arrived here claiming to be a refugee, you would accept them.

 

One person murdered, one died from an illness which may or may not have been due to medical malpractice. What about the hundreds who drowned on the boats? And as I said before, but you ignored, why don't you show some compassion for the Aussies who died in the pink batts fiasco. I care about Australians first, last and everything and I'm not ashamed of it.

 

And remember, I have no problems with Australia's official refugee program.

[Katie22]

I just saw on the news this morning some pictures of the conditions these detainees have been living in - it was on the ABC so may very well be propaganda?! - and if that was genuine Australia should be ashamed of itself. Just because some refugees may not be genuine or may just (?!) be escaping a pretty **** life, surely it does't justify imprisoning them in squalid conditions and not being able to access immediate medical care.

 

There does seem to be such anger and resentment towards these people - what are we scared of? Of course none of us want terrorists to come in and spread havoc but are they seriously the majority of the asylum seekers? Of course people need to be investigated etc. but at least have the human decency to keep them in decent accommodation with proper health care in the meantime.

 

I would have thought the terrorists we should be most scared of probably already live here and possess Australian passports.

[Joebloggs]

 

I would have thought the terrorists we should be most scared of probably already live here and possess Australian passports.

 

 

Indeed it's only a matter of time before some sort of atrocity happens and we will need to introduce Internment/concentration camps for home grown terrorists and sympathisers, in the mean time there's no harm in quarantining potential imported terrorists.

[flag of convenience]

I just saw on the news this morning some pictures of the conditions these detainees have been living in - it was on the ABC so may very well be propaganda?! - and if that was genuine Australia should be ashamed of itself. Just because some refugees may not be genuine or may just (?!) be escaping a pretty **** life, surely it does't justify imprisoning them in squalid conditions and not being able to access immediate medical care.

 

There does seem to be such anger and resentment towards these people - what are we scared of? Of course none of us want terrorists to come in and spread havoc but are they seriously the majority of the asylum seekers? Of course people need to be investigated etc. but at least have the human decency to keep them in decent accommodation with proper health care in the meantime.

 

I would have thought the terrorists we should be most scared of probably already live here and possess Australian passports.

 

Few if any so named terrorists would come in such a manner. Much more likely to be home grown than otherwise. ABC propaganda? One of the few reliable news outlets in a very controlled media nation. Of course the fear being created goes further to attempt credibility with regards to locking up people indefinitely in harsh conditions.

 

Shame on those that support such measures with such justification.

[flag of convenience]

Indeed it's only a matter of time before some sort of atrocity happens and we will need to introduce Internment/concentration camps for home grown terrorists and sympathisers, in the mean time there's no harm in quarantining potential imported terrorists.

 

Certainly will if the focus and pre judgement towards guilt of a community persists. Australia has by and large avoided any incidents over the decades. Government can only prosper in raising the fear levels.

[flag of convenience]

Why do they come to Australia anyway, they do pass through a lot of countries that are safer than where they left on their way to the boat ride to Aus

 

Wow. That question has never been asked before. I wonder why? Or could it be the answer passed you by?

[wakeboard1980]

All the people on here that disagree with the way the asylum seekers are treated, do you do anything about it? Do you go to marches? Do you write to your local MP? Do you give to the charities that support asylum seekers?

[Harpodom]

All the people on here that disagree with the way the asylum seekers are treated, do you do anything about it? Do you go to marches? Do you write to your local MP? Do you give to the charities that support asylum seekers?

 

yes

[wakeboard1980]

yes

Yes to all of them or only some?

[Harpodom]

yes to all 3

[wakeboard1980]

yes to all 3

Has your MP responded? If so what have they said?