Is the 'Pacific Solution' unravelling?

[MARYROSE02]

It is the hypocrisy that gets to me the most. This week, the results of an inquiry into the complete cock up that was the pink batts installation was released, blaming the Rudd Government's incompetence for the deaths of four young Ausralian men. You would think this would provoke sustained outrage from Harpo and co, but instead there is silence. Why? Because they cannot bring themselves to criticise the ALP, , and after all the men who were killed were not alleged asylum seekers, just Aussies, and charity does not begin at home for them.

 

It will be the same when the Aussie jihadis start to make their way back. No, We MUST not treat them as criminals. They have been traumatised enough as it is. LET THEM IN. LET THEM ALL IN!

[Harpodom]

Why do you always believe the worst when it comes to Aussies who come into contact with alleged refugees in the course of their jobs, whether rescuing them from sea, or working in the camps, but you always believe the best when it comes to the asylum seekers themselves?

 

Maybe that Iraqi or Iranian bloke who became ill may have been a victim of medical malpractice, perhaps he was just unlucky, the same way all of us risk accidents, illness, etc, but we don't all automatically call foro enquiries and inquisitions blaming the authorities.

 

As I just said on another thread, if 'Jihadi John' came to Australia with his family, you would all demand that he be treated as innocent until proven guilty and immediately set free into the community.

 

I hope the conditions are as bad as you say they are, though I doubt it. If it really were as bad as that, then nobody would want to come here. It's not supposed to be a hotel.

 

I can just imagine Harpo, kneeling down wearing an orange jump suit with his hands tied behind his back.

 

Jihadi John is standing behind him wielding a large knife and Harpo is saying "He's just misunderstood really. He's a nice man deep down. It's all Tony Abbott's fault."

 

It is the hypocrisy that gets to me the most. This week, the results of an inquiry into the complete cock up that was the pink batts installation was released, blaming the Rudd Government's incompetence for the deaths of four young Ausralian men. You would think this would provoke sustained outrage from Harpo and co, but instead there is silence. Why? Because they cannot bring themselves to criticise the ALP, , and after all the men who were killed were not alleged asylum seekers, just Aussies, and charity does not begin at home for them.

 

It will be the same when the Aussie jihadis start to make their way back. No, We MUST not treat them as criminals. They have been traumatised enough as it is. LET THEM IN. LET THEM ALL IN!

Listen you two, when any process is covered in a veil of secrecy, with no independent oversight, no access to the press, no right of appeal, all done under the spurious guise of 'national security', all answerable to one man, does THAT strike you as good, safe governance?

Edited September 5, 2014 by Harpodom

[Harpodom]

Listen you two, when any process is covered in a veil of secrecy, with no independent oversight, no access to the press, no right of appeal, all done under the spurious guise of 'national security', all answerable to one man, does THAT strike you as good, safe governance?

Oh that's right parleymarcrossrose02, you don't give a crap, cos they're all terrorists!

 

Good work fellas.

[Booma]

I can just imagine Harpo, kneeling down wearing an orange jump suit with his hands tied behind his back.

 

Jihadi John is standing behind him wielding a large knife and Harpo is saying "He's just misunderstood really. He's a nice man deep down. It's all Tony Abbott's fault."

 

 

poetic justice that :biglaugh:

[Keith and Linda]

Listen you two, when any process is covered in a veil of secrecy, with no independent oversight, no access to the press, no right of appeal, all done under the spurious guise of 'national security', all answerable to one man, does THAT strike you as good, safe governance?

 

Do not terrorists work under a veil of secrecy too? no rights of appeal with them either, unlike any democratically elected government.

[Harpodom]

Sorry, the 'argument' from the other side appears to have morphed into the assumption that all the asylum seekers are suspected terrorists.

 

Seriously, WTF???!:goofy:

[Keith and Linda]

Sorry, the 'argument' from the other side appears to have morphed into the assumption that all the asylum seekers are suspected terrorists.

 

Seriously, WTF???!:goofy:

 

No! but the risk is there and real, with serious consequences. all the security we have to go through these days in all walks of life has arisen because of terrorists or threat there of. We have to, lets say, suffer these security checks which we generally accept, but in effect we are suspected of being a bad one until proved otherwise.

[flag of convenience]

No! but the risk is there and real, with serious consequences. all the security we have to go through these days in all walks of life has arisen because of terrorists or threat there of. We have to, lets say, suffer these security checks which we generally accept, but in effect we are suspected of being a bad one until proved otherwise.

 

Security checks are one thing and have always been in place. A convenient smokescreen for the reffo bashers to hide behind while justifying government sanctioned ever ongoing incarceration of innocent people.

[flag of convenience]

Do not terrorists work under a veil of secrecy too? no rights of appeal with them either, unlike any democratically elected government.

 

No reason to use this as an excuse to ebb away at citizens freedoms as is the case in growing instances.

[flag of convenience]

It is the hypocrisy that gets to me the most. This week, the results of an inquiry into the complete cock up that was the pink batts installation was released, blaming the Rudd Government's incompetence for the deaths of four young Ausralian men. You would think this would provoke sustained outrage from Harpo and co, but instead there is silence. Why? Because they cannot bring themselves to criticise the ALP, , and after all the men who were killed were not alleged asylum seekers, just Aussies, and charity does not begin at home for them.

 

It will be the same when the Aussie jihadis start to make their way back. No, We MUST not treat them as criminals. They have been traumatised enough as it is. LET THEM IN. LET THEM ALL IN!

 

The inept governments of Australia in recent times have been correctly been brought to task over policy. Just continues to remain odd how a person as yourself continues to defend a party that has little consideration for the likes of yourself.

[MARYROSE02]

Listen you two, when any process is covered in a veil of secrecy, with no independent oversight, no access to the press, no right of appeal, all done under the spurious guise of 'national security', all answerable to one man, does THAT strike you as good, safe governance?

 

So what? They are not Australian citizens. They are suspected illegal immigrants. Australian citizens are not subject to this treatment and I would not expect them to. How do we know they are what they say they are? How do we know they are not terrorists or criminals?

 

And you are dodging the question. Why is their fate so much more important than that of the Australian blokes killed in the pink batts catastrophe? I've heard you go on about asylum seekers ever since Abbott came to power.

[MARYROSE02]

The inept governments of Australia in recent times have been correctly been brought to task over policy. Just continues to remain odd how a person as yourself continues to defend a party that has little consideration for the likes of yourself.

 

I am 100 per cent happy with Tony Abbott's performance.

[Keith and Linda]

]Security checks are one thing and have always been in place[/color]. A convenient smokescreen for the reffo bashers to hide behind while justifying government sanctioned ever ongoing incarceration of innocent people.

 

No they have not, they were once called safety checks, now they are security brought about by terrorist activity.

[Keith and Linda]

No reason to use this as an excuse to ebb away at citizens freedoms as is the case in growing instances.

 

It's not an excuse but a valid reason.

[Harpodom]

So what? They are not Australian citizens. They are suspected illegal immigrants. Australian citizens are not subject to this treatment and I would not expect them to. How do we know they are what they say they are? How do we know they are not terrorists or criminals?

 

And you are dodging the question. Why is their fate so much more important than that of the Australian blokes killed in the pink batts catastrophe? I've heard you go on about asylum seekers ever since Abbott came to power.

 

'So what'....is this the extent of your reasoning? 'SO WHAT?' Cos they're not.....STRAYAN. The're 'illegal'. We don't know them so we must assume they are terrorists and/or criminals. :swoon:

 

I'll repeat just in case you haven't heard this before: it is NOT illegal to seek asylum. It is actually a fundamental human right.

 

And why do you insist on crapping on about pink batts? There's a Royal Commission ALREADY going on, what else do you want me to say???

[Keith and Linda]

'So what'....is this the extent of your reasoning? 'SO WHAT?' Cos they're not.....STRAYAN. The're 'illegal'. We don't know them so we must assume they are terrorists and/or criminals. :swoon:

 

I'll repeat just in case you haven't heard this before: it is NOT illegal to seek asylum. It is actually a fundamental human right.

 

And why do you insist on crapping on about pink batts? There's a Royal Commission ALREADY going on, what else do you want me to say???

 

It is also not illegal to check on the validity of asylum sought. Please raise your fundamental human rights issue with the terrorist groups.

[Harpodom]

It is also not illegal to check on the validity of asylum sought. Please raise your fundamental human rights issue with the terrorist groups.

Who is arguing otherwise?:goofy:

[Keith and Linda]

Who is arguing otherwise?:goofy:

 

So lets see now, we agree that valid asylum seekers be allowed into Australia, and we agree that a check on the validity of any asylum sought be carried out, the Australian government must also agree as it is doing just that on both counts. We do seem to have a lot of agreements here don't we! so much so that this thread is going to get boring now!

[Harpodom]

So lets see now, we agree that valid asylum seekers be allowed into Australia, and we agree that a check on the validity of any asylum sought be carried out, the Australian government must also agree as it is doing just that on both counts. We do seem to have a lot of agreements here don't we! so much so that this thread is going to get boring now!

Yes I agree with that, but the Australian govt doesn't, hence the 'illegal maritime arrivals' have been told they will NEVER set foot in Australia, regardless of whether they have a valid claim and turn out to be genuine refugees fleeing civil war, persecution or whatever else......PURELY AND ONLY BECAUSE THEY ARRIVED BY BOAT.

[Harpodom]

Some *really* basic facts, could form part of a book, 'Human Rights for Dummies':

 

http://www.asrc.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/ASRCMythBusterJuly30_2013-one-page-FINAL.pdf

[flag of convenience]

I am 100 per cent happy with Tony Abbott's performance.

 

You deserve little pity then further down the road if the present government unleashes the policy it would really desire.

[flag of convenience]

So lets see now, we agree that valid asylum seekers be allowed into Australia, and we agree that a check on the validity of any asylum sought be carried out, the Australian government must also agree as it is doing just that on both counts. We do seem to have a lot of agreements here don't we! so much so that this thread is going to get boring now!

 

Very boring. If not disheartening to read such stringent and ill informed views from migrants in justification of inhumane policy.

[flag of convenience]

So what? They are not Australian citizens. They are suspected illegal immigrants. Australian citizens are not subject to this treatment and I would not expect them to. How do we know they are what they say they are? How do we know they are not terrorists or criminals?

 

And you are dodging the question. Why is their fate so much more important than that of the Australian blokes killed in the pink batts catastrophe? I've heard you go on about asylum seekers ever since Abbott came to power.

 

Certainly Australian residents with legal rights to be in the country have been. You may recall in the 90's a German born female was detained illegally and in another case a Philippines born female. Quite a stoir caused at the time.

 

We live in a global world with stretches beyond the back fence and how people are treated regardless of nationality is of concern in the wider picture even if not to yourself.

The another matter is entirely different to the one under discussion.

 

Main thing being the Pacific Solution is unravelling as unworkable and ill thought out as apparent to many of us on its construction. Policy done in haste without due consideration usually ends in failure. Not to say the billions poured down the drain.

[Keith and Linda]

Very boring. If not disheartening to read such stringent and ill informed views from migrants in justification of inhumane policy.

 

well at least you've proved me right on the boring!

[Harpodom]

Certainly Australian residents with legal rights to be in the country have been. You may recall in the 90's a German born female was detained illegally and in another case a Philippines born female. Quite a stoir caused at the time.

 

We live in a global world with stretches beyond the back fence and how people are treated regardless of nationality is of concern in the wider picture even if not to yourself.

The another matter is entirely different to the one under discussion.

 

Main thing being the Pacific Solution is unravelling as unworkable and ill thought out as apparent to many of us on its construction. Policy done in haste without due consideration usually ends in failure. Not to say the billions poured down the drain.

 

Cornelia Rau? That was 2004 flag