Man Arrested in Madeline mcnann case

[calNgary]

For her parents and siblings sake i hope she is found, preferably safe and well rather than the other option.

 

Cal x

[Sustain]

Its terrible but unfortunately she is not the only small child who is missing and there are many cases that are never solved which do not get this much publicity.

 

But it gives them all faith

 

And puts the perpetrators on notice that they will be looking over their shoulders

[calNgary]

Just to add , if she is alive i do not think she will remember her family.

 

She is roughly the same age as my daughter, she went missing around the time we left the UK for Aus. My daughter doesnt remember very much about her old life, old house, close friends, family who we are not regularly in touch with etc, so if Maddy was taken to be someone elses child i find highly unlikely she will remember her old life at all, so almost impossible for her to escape and alert authorities like the girls in America who had been kept hidden away for years.

 

Cal x

[starlight7]

My granddaughter is the double of madeleine- so much so several have commented. I wouldn't think she'd be alive either, unfortuantely

[Parley]

Must say I hate the response that many people give when talking about any missing child, "yes but there are lots of other missing children".

 

I always find this remark upsetting, as though we shouldn't care about this one because there are others missing too.

Just seems such a cruel attitude.

[Guest The Pom Queen]

Must say I hate the response that many people give when talking about any missing child, "yes but there are lots of other missing children".

 

I always find this remark upsetting, as though we shouldn't care about this one because there are others missing too.

Just seems such a cruel attitude.

 

I don't think anyone would have the couldn't care less attitude at all. I suppose we think that the police/media should be pulling out all the stops for every missing child. You have to admit the Madeline case has had lots of publicity, and show it should, but other cases need putting in the lime light as well.

 

Not related to missing children but I was watching a series called the Bridge which was about the crime and abductions in Mexico. I didn't know that the abductions in Mexico are actually true stories until Rob told me and showed me a few articles. Over 26,000 people have gone missing since 2006 :no: Now I know I don't read the news much so I am a little behind but things like this need to be brought out in to the public eye more and get dealt with not swept under the carpet. Anyway I suppose that is a subject for a different thread not this.

I pray Madeline is alive, it can happen look at Amanda Berry, Gina DeJesus and Michelle Knight held for 10 years.

[legoman]

The parents need closure on this either way. I hope she is alive but I fear the worst too.

[Guest Guest66881]

I have a very strange feeling that the police do indeed now know who done what and where.

[Kapri]

I have a very strange feeling that the police do indeed now know who done what and where.

 

OH and I just had similar conversation.

The jist of this arrest seems to be that Maddie is being "introduced" to men. I wonder if pictures have turned up?

 

i can't get my head around this arrest. Why would a man boast to a barrister, at a party, about having been "introduced" to Maddie. It's not typical party conversation.

 

Still, we don't know the facts yet. I think the police know something though, otherwise why would the investigation still be alive and kicking.

[Guest The Pom Queen]

This is circulating around at the moment so I thought I would share in case you haven't seen it. I believe there is a group set up attacking the parents. Personally I just want this poor little girl found.

 

100 REASONS WHY THE PARENTS BELONG IN JAIL

 

1. Did they use the babysitting service provided? NO

2. Did they use any listening devices? NO

3. Did they leave three children under 4 alone while going out drinking? YES

4. Did they do this every night? YES

5. Did they,under British law,endanger Maddie? YES

6. In the UK is significant harm a form of child abuse? YES

7. Is significant harm used by the UK courts in child abuse cases? YES

8. Does leaving the children as they did qualify under these rules ? YES

9. Did Kate sit writing timelines instead of searching for Maddie? YES

10. Are the frequent checks by the Tapas group challenged by other witnesses? YES

11. Was the bedroom withing sight of where they sat? NO

12, Were they within earshot? NO

13. Did anyone other than Tanner see any abductor? NO

14. Has anyone come up with a credible abductor? NO

15. Is there any evidence of an abduction? NO

16. Were the shutters in the room tampered with? NO

17. Did Kate say the shutters were tampered with? YES

18. Did Kate change her story to saying the door was unlocked? YES

19. Was the door unlocked on any other night? NO

20. Is there any physical evidence at all of a break in? NO

21. Is there any physical evidence of another party being in the room? NO

23. Were the McCann's told not to inform the media? YES

24. Were they told it might harm the chances of finding Maddie alive? YES

25. Were the media informed by a McCann family member? YES

26. Were specially trained British dogs brought in to search the apartment ? YES

27. Did they find anything? YES

28. Have these dogs been successful in over 200 cases? YES

29. Do sniffer dogs lie? NO

30. Do the specially trained dogs get confused by other smells? NO

31. Did they find cadaver(dead body) scent in the apartment? YES

32. Did they find blood? YES

33. Did they find cadaver scent behind the sofa? YES

34. On the child's toy? YES

35. In a cupboard in the room? YES

36. Did they find cadaver scent on Kate's clothes? YES

37. Did Kate explain this by saying she had examined dead bodies before holiday? YES

38. Is there any record of her doing so? NO

39. Has anyone come forward to say they saw her doing so? NO

40. Was the hire car rented after Maddie disappeared ? YES

41. Were tests done on DNA found in the car? YES

42. Did the dogs alert to the hire car? YES

43. Is a billion to one odds that it may be someone else's DNA? YES

44. Were the doors and boot left open to get rid of the smell in the car? YES

45. Did the parents explain it away as rotting meat? YES

46. Smelling due to taking rubbish to the tip in the hire car? YES

47. Smelling due to dirty nappies in the hire car? YES

48. Smell due to sea bass in the hire car? YES

49. Did the parents say the dogs were wrong? YES

50. Do you need tons of excuses if the dogs are just plain wrong? NO

51. Have the dogs ever been wrong? NO

52. Did Kate & Gerry flee Portugal? YES

53. Did they hire extradition lawyers? YES

54. Did the McCann's hire libel lawyers to gag anyone with a different view? YES

55. Did the government lend spin doctor Clarence Mitchell to the parents? YES

56. Dio spin doctors twist the truth for a favourable outcome? YES

57. Are they paid to do this? YES

58. Did the McCann's set up a fund in order to search for Maddie? YES

59. Did they use the money donated for anything other than searching? YES

60. Do the parents have a media monitoring unit? YES

61. Are there internet trolls helping the parents to quash getting at the truth? YES

62. Have the Portuguese police been portrayed as incompetent? YES

63. Did they look at all aspects of the case? YES

64. Did they conclude any abduction took place? NO

65. Did they conclude that Maddie was dead and the parents responsible? YES

66. Are there two British investigations into Maddie being missing? YES

67. Are they investigating ALL aspects of the case? NO

68. Have they been told by the government to focus on abduction only? YES

69. Have they come up with any evidence of an abduction? NO

70. Have they come up with any credible suspects? NO

71. Have they questioned the tapas group or parents over the case? NO

72. Have the parents made millions from Maddie being missing? YES

73. Did Kate write a book mentioning torn genitalia that the twins might read? YES

74. Did Gerry have his wallet stolen at Waterloo station as he claimed? NO

75. Does the CCTV footage from that day bear out his claims? NO

76. Did the Portuguese police ask British government for medical records? YES

77. Were they handed over? NO

78. Did they ask for bank statements? YES

79. Were they handed over ? NO

80. Did they ask for mobile phone records? YES

81. Were they handed over? NO

82. Have the media printed the McCann version of events? YES

83. Are the media intimidated by threats of libel? YES

84. Have the parents admitted they are responsible for Maddie's disappearance? NO

85. Have the parents faced any criminal charges to date? NO

86. No charges for manslaughter? NO

87. For neglect? NO

88. Did the McCann's say they would take a polygraph(lie detector test) ? YES

89. Did the McCann "people" contact Don Cargill head of polygraph studies?YES

90. Did the McCann's tell the world they would take one to prove innocence? YES

91. Have they taken one in the 2'000+ days since saying they would? NO

92. Did the parents impose a list of conditions for taking one? YES

93. Did Don Cargill say the list was "impossible to satisfy"? YES

94. Did Don Cargill state "They had no intention of taking one"? YES

95. Did Clarence Mitchell say they were innocent and did not need to do one? YES

96. IS Amaral on trial because he wrote a book stating the facts of the case? YES

97. Is it a proper account of the police investigation ? YES

98. Have the McCann's fought desperately to have this book banned? YES

99. Is it banned? NO

100. Is maddie missing because of the actions of the parents? YES

[Que Sera Sera]

I think it's easy to jump in and knock them, easy targets and all that. What they did that night for two intelligent professional people was stupid in the extreme BUT I reckon a life of unimaginable guilt and pain is punishment enough. For the girls sake I hope she's alive and well and if not I sincerely hope the end was as quick and pain free as possible , the poor little mite.

[calNgary]

I agree with the above post and would also hazard a guess that the members of this group are far from perfect themselves, lets face it , who is ?

 

Cal x

[caramac]

There are lots of people who do things with their kids that others might find odd, but they get away with it so no one bats an eyelid.

My friend in Perth used to leave her baby/toddler asleep at home while she picked the others up from school. I found that completely bizarre and would never have done the same. I know people who put their kids to bed then would go down the garden, much further away from the house than the Mc'Cann's were from their children, but because they were still on their own property no one thought it was strange and just today I was in town when a mother stopped her car, left the engine running and walked round the corner, out of sight and left two children who were preschool age in the back!

I hate this witch hunt. Those parents must live through hell every day thinking about what they would do differently given their time over again (just like every parent who has made mistakes and isn't perfect) without having others vilifying them.

They and their daughter are the victims - the person/people who took Madeleine is/are the criminals. They were the ones who entered someone else's property and took a little girl from her bed. Who's to say that, even if her parents had been in the next room,or just outside the apartment, they would have heard anything.

[jac2011]

I agree the parents have lost their daughter and I think its easy to blame the parents.

 

We all mistakes, it wasn't until the Crimewatch appeal that I realised how close they were to their apartment. I have a really long garden and in the summer my husband and I sit outside whilst the front of the house is locked up and spend some time together. I bet there are times when I have accidently left a window open. It doesn't mean that my children aren't my world and I still try to hold my 9 year old daughters hand to cross the road. I just don't think like a criminal. The resort in itself should take a share of responsibility. It looks like there were a lot of dodgy things going on during that time and security was not increased from what we know.

[Peach]

This is circulating around at the moment so I thought I would share in case you haven't seen it. I believe there is a group set up attacking the parents. Personally I just want this poor little girl found.

 

100 REASONS WHY THE PARENTS BELONG IN JAIL

 

Reason #84 why there should be an intelligence test before letting people on the internet. Scratching my head at how someone decided compiling this list or hounding the parents would be helpful..

[jodipodi]

There are lots of people who do things with their kids that others might find odd, but they get away with it so no one bats an eyelid.

My friend in Perth used to leave her baby/toddler asleep at home while she picked the others up from school. I found that completely bizarre and would never have done the same. I know people who put their kids to bed then would go down the garden, much further away from the house than the Mc'Cann's were from their children, but because they were still on their own property no one thought it was strange and just today I was in town when a mother stopped her car, left the engine running and walked round the corner, out of sight and left two children who were preschool age in the back!

I hate this witch hunt. Those parents must live through hell every day thinking about what they would do differently given their time over again (just like every parent who has made mistakes and isn't perfect) without having others vilifying them.

They and their daughter are the victims - the person/people who took Madeleine is/are the criminals. They were the ones who entered someone else's property and took a little girl from her bed. Who's to say that, even if her parents had been in the next room,or just outside the apartment, they would have heard anything.

 

I agree whole heartedly with this post. It goes without saying that obviously it is not advisable and in many people's opinion unthinkable to leave children alone in a room and go elsewhere, maybe especially so in a foreign country, but all this 'burn the witch' crap gets on my wick and in my eyes without wanting to sound like a bible basher here, because I'm not into bashing of any sort and certainly aint no saint believe me- those without sin can cast the first stone....we all make mistakes and we all do things differently, especially the way we choose to parent our children. I remember going to a meeting at the school about new sex education lessons for primary school children and we were asked our thoughts on whether we thought the prospective contents of these lessons were thought out well....I distinctly remember one mother going on and on that 'we should all work together and agree on what we are going to say to the children when they ask this, that or whatever' and thinking are you for real woman??!! Who the hell parents their kids the same way as someone else does?!! I found it hard to comprehend how she thought this 'agreement' would 'work'. She was disgusted when she knew I didn't agree with her way of thinking and she herself couldn't comprehend how I didn't think her way of doing things was right- but it just wasn't right for me. I read a post on facebook the other day and had to stop myself from an outburst..it went along the lines ''The evil b@st@rds, who leaves kids on their own for gods sake they deserve everything they get. I think she's dead, why are they doing all these appeals again its all been done, its their own fault. What about all the other kids who have went missing, who is looking for them?'' This disturbed me to say the least. I say God help people like this.. as well as poor Madeleine McCann and her family, I hope they find and end to their torture in some way or another.

[Petals]

The longer they seek to be in the papers all the time the more flack these parents will get for leaving the children, so its a choice have the publicity and take the flack or stay quiet and let the police do their job. Just because missing children are not in the paper every day does not mean that the authorities have stopped looking, these cases get rotated and looked at for ever. Lets face it there are a lot of children who are missing this little girl was not the first child to disappear. I have the thought that if she was alive maybe she is not now due to publicity. The children that are found later on and often as adults seem to be the ones who were not the subject of mass media exposure.

[Arbrodin]

I agree whole heartedly with this post. It goes without saying that obviously it is not advisable and in many people's opinion unthinkable to leave children alone in a room and go elsewhere, maybe especially so in a foreign country, but all this 'burn the witch' crap gets on my wick and in my eyes without wanting to sound like a bible basher here, because I'm not into bashing of any sort and certainly aint no saint believe me- those without sin can cast the first stone....we all make mistakes and we all do things differently, especially the way we choose to parent our children. I remember going to a meeting at the school about new sex education lessons for primary school children and we were asked our thoughts on whether we thought the prospective contents of these lessons were thought out well....I distinctly remember one mother going on and on that 'we should all work together and agree on what we are going to say to the children when they ask this, that or whatever' and thinking are you for real woman??!! Who the hell parents their kids the same way as someone else does?!! I found it hard to comprehend how she thought this 'agreement' would 'work'. She was disgusted when she knew I didn't agree with her way of thinking and she herself couldn't comprehend how I didn't think her way of doing things was right- but it just wasn't right for me. I read a post on facebook the other day and had to stop myself from an outburst..it went along the lines ''The evil b@st@rds, who leaves kids on their own for gods sake they deserve everything they get. I think she's dead, why are they doing all these appeals again its all been done, its their own fault. What about all the other kids who have went missing, who is looking for them?'' This disturbed me to say the least. I say God help people like this.. as well as poor Madeleine McCann and her family, I hope they find and end to their torture in some way or another.

 

 

 

I have to say it is very difficult situation, as much as I feel desperate for the family, I do not know anyone who would while on holiday in a foreign country, put their children to bed and go out to a bar, out of sight of the apartment. Especially the ages of the children, the youngest ones being about 1 yrs. then to hear that on previous nights this happened and one of the children asked their mum where she was when she had woken up, the following day. Hindsight is a great thing, however, hoe many parents would really do this. I would not leave my children in bed at home and go out let alone when on holiday in a strange country.

Maybe working in the NhS and experience of the child protection and adult safeguarding issues, I am over cautious with my own children.

[Guest51810]

I have to say it is very difficult situation, as much as I feel desperate for the family, I do not know anyone who would while on holiday in a foreign country, put their children to bed and go out to a bar, out of sight of the apartment. Especially the ages of the children, the youngest ones being about 1 yrs. then to hear that on previous nights this happened and one of the children asked their mum where she was when she had woken up, the following day. Hindsight is a great thing, however, hoe many parents would really do this. I would not leave my children in bed at home and go out let alone when on holiday in a strange country.

Maybe working in the NhS and experience of the child protection and adult safeguarding issues, I am over cautious with my own children.

 

Well I'm the same and I don't have children at all and maybe never will. Maybe its easy for me to say/judge but I honestly just can't imagine leaving children so young like that. Anyway I agree - hindsight is a wonderful thing

[cki2011]

I have 3 kids and my youngest daughter is exactly the same age as Maddie so we felt it very upsetting when it happened and have followed the case as everyone else over the years but we look at the time since Maddie went missing we have had with our daughter and realise just how much her family have missed....

 

 

i understand everyone keep going on about them leaving the kids while they went for dinner and how wrong it is but no one will know more than them what a mistake it was and people should focus on finding her and others that are missing and get over wanting to blame them and makeing the ridiculous comments how they shouldn't do this and that.... everyone already knows and is sick of hearing it....

[Katie Birdie]

When I went on holiday to Europe when my children were young we took them out with us in buggies even when they were 4 years old (too big for buggies but sleeping) - I wouldn't have gone on the night out otherwise. My 'professional' friends did not agree with this (teachers) they thought it better to leave the children in the hotel room and check on them periodically. Since the McCann incident we have had many discussions and now they agree they would not choose that way of looking after their children and they should've chosen my way (which they were very against previously).

[Katie Birdie]

I do think today's news that a 4 year old has been found in a Greek gypsy camp not belonging to the 'parents' by DNA will give the McCann's some hope. It would be the best news for everyone if they found Madeline in the same way. It just seems incomprehensible that someone could take some else's child and pass them off as their own.

[Lisa Anne Pope]

There will probably be information that the police have that will not have been released I would suppose. I find it interesting that opinion today seems to be not to let your children out of sight - I remember going on holiday to the then Butlins in Ayr (now Haven Craig Tara I think) in the early 1980's and remember the red coats going round the chalets at night (when the parents were out enjoying themselves at the various things going on in the camp) and reporting back on babies and children crying. There were large boards with numbers on them which were light up with a sign - "baby crying in chalet no ......" so the parents could go back and settle their child! Also a point to note that children are abducted from their homes while the parents are there in bed sleeping or just in another room. There was the young girl in England who was in the bath and someone came in and took her out of the bath under her parents nose. I lived in Melbourne in the Airport West/Essendon area during the "Mr Cruel" child abductions and murder - girls taken from their bedrooms at night while other siblings were in the same room and parents in their bedroom and taken to a house somewhere on the flight path to Melbourne Airport. Despite all the publicity about the girls reporting hearing planes overhead - we never had a visit from the police at all (and we were on the flight path) - the only thing was a flyer put through the door asking if we had noticed anything suspicious going on???

[Diane]

Maybe working in the NhS and experience of the child protection and adult safeguarding issues, I am over cautious with my own children.

 

I think people that work in areas such as you do obviously have a slightly skewed vision of what happens in the world, as you see so many of the bad things in comparison to all the good things. I'm not having a go at you honestly, I couldn't do your job and have great admiration for those that do work in such areas. But I still believe there are vastly more good people in the world than bad, and if we never let our kids do anything that might be the slightest bit dangerous, because of what might happen, we would have to keep them in a bubble sealed off from the world! A friend of mine who works in child protection in the UK has recently stopped her 18 year old daughter coming over to Aus to travel for a few months with a friend, because she "knows what goes on in the world" - she probably thinks everyone that 'allows' their adult kids to come over on a WHV is totally stupid, but in my view, she's just being ridiculous herself!

 

I once went out to the car to get something while my baby was asleep inside, and the door slammed in the wind leaving me locked outside without a key! Yes, something bad could have happened and after that I was doubly careful to prop the front door open if I ever did that again, but you can't turn the clock back - however much Madeleine's parents probably wish they could.

[Que Sera Sera]

We left hospital with our day old daughter and decided to nip in Macdonalds on the way home with our 3 year old daughter as a treat to her from her new Sister ( and to save me cooking and washing up ! ) We ate our food with the baby asleep in her carrytot car seat under the table. We got up to leave I walked towards the door and my OH said, have you forgot something? Yes baby was still under the table ! Baby brain ! I often wonder if Id been in my own how far I'd have got :laugh: