Job situation in UK

[Guest rgaskell]

The job market is definitely picking up especially in London for IT.

 

Look on cwjobs + jobserve.

 

Not sure about other areas but it looks like businesses are releasing money to fund new projects...

[freebo]

Hi my OH works in the IT sector- there have been major cuts and he was made redundant from a large and well known national company in September- he has not worked in IT since. No jobs around.

 

The recession has also lowered the wages massively so a £18,000-£20,000 job would be expecting 5 years experience and an MCSE. Not sure which sector of IT youre in but think long and hard before coming to UK to look for IT jobs- the recession is still going strong unfortunately, which is partly why we are heading to Oz!!

Sorry for the doom and gloom!! Goodluck x

 

I second that, I'm been in IT for 25 years and its absolutely awful in the UK right now, a combination of "best shoring" (i.e. moving the jobs overseas to less experienced people able to work for 25% of the pay) and the recession. I'm a contractor but have had some periods (thankfully fairly short) of involuntary rest over the last year or so, there's huge competition for work, or was last time I was looking (Sept 09). Because there are so many applicants employers are becoming incredibly picky, like listing 8-10 skills and industries needed and insisting on someone with all of them, in the past if you had 50-70% you'd get an interview, but not now. Some are also listing what where £60K jobs 18 months ago at £40k and presumably getting applicants. I've worked at a lot of places recently and they're all laying people off and off shoring their work at a fairly senior level too. I've never seen it even remotely as bad as this, and I can't wait to get out (when my current contract finishes BTW).

 

Don't come to the UK if you want IT work is my advice, I've heard of many IT people becoming "long term" unemployed, like 6+ months and that's unheard of until recently.

 

I also believe that the UK is one of the next Greece's and can look forward to more tax & less public spending after the next election (and its miserable and raining today too )

[Woofyhugger]

I'll have to tell my Aussie mates working in IT in London that. One of them is often getting head hunted for new work. Then again both of my mates are high up on the Hewlett Packard food chain. They totally disagree with IT being affected and believe it's an individual thing based on your skills and field.

 

It's all well and good to tell someone not to come back to the UK. But what are they supposed to do? Be miserable in a country with equally dismal unemployment wasting their life waiting for things to magically improve in the IT employment sector back home. They'll be retiring age if they follow that advice.

 

Sorry. Just can't stand people telling others not to come back based on generalizations, or because they got laid off work, it means the whole country is on a downward spiral into oblivion.

[Peach]

Then again both of my mates are high up on the Hewlett Packard food chain.

 

Is that the same HP that hasn't given anyone a pay rise in two years, in fact given pay cuts where ever they can. Where the management is almost universally despised:

 

HP | By Employees

 

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/eds-staff-asked-to-take-pay-cut/story-e6freo8c-1225712976490

 

Loved in both hemispheres

[Woofyhugger]

That's them, but they aren't management. But high up enough to be sent to various countries for work.

 

I am sure if it was that bad though, HP would have no employees. Regardless, I can't get over the amount of doom and gloom mongering some people carry on with. Why are they viewing the "Moving back to the UK forum" ? lol Purely to troll I suspect.

[Peach]

If you work in Europe, being sent to other countries is pretty common place. I don't say that to be smug, but one of the things that Aussies love about London is the proximity you have with Europe and the US.

 

I think during the present financial crisis - like most corporations - HP, IBM, CSC etc realise that they have employees by the balls and can squeeze as hard as they like. Until the situation improves and people do start quitting for better jobs, things will only get worse for the employees.

[Woofyhugger]

All I can say is I am glad I work in Healthcare. I wouldn't like to work in any other field as far as job security goes, though even job conditions in Health aren't wonderful. As long as it pays the bills I reckon.

[KIRK AND CO]

I second that, I'm been in IT for 25 years and its absolutely awful in the UK right now, a combination of "best shoring" (i.e. moving the jobs overseas to less experienced people able to work for 25% of the pay) and the recession. I'm a contractor but have had some periods (thankfully fairly short) of involuntary rest over the last year or so, there's huge competition for work, or was last time I was looking (Sept 09). Because there are so many applicants employers are becoming incredibly picky, like listing 8-10 skills and industries needed and insisting on someone with all of them, in the past if you had 50-70% you'd get an interview, but not now. Some are also listing what where £60K jobs 18 months ago at £40k and presumably getting applicants. I've worked at a lot of places recently and they're all laying people off and off shoring their work at a fairly senior level too. I've never seen it even remotely as bad as this, and I can't wait to get out (when my current contract finishes BTW).

 

Don't come to the UK if you want IT work is my advice, I've heard of many IT people becoming "long term" unemployed, like 6+ months and that's unheard of until recently.

 

I also believe that the UK is one of the next Greece's and can look forward to more tax & less public spending after the next election (and its miserable and raining today too )

£40,000 not enough ???????????????????????????????????????????????????:wacko::wacko:

[Peach]

£40,000 not enough ???????????????????????????????????????????????????:wacko::wacko:

 

It's a great salary, but would still come as big a shock if your earning potential dropped from £24k to £16k overnight and you then lost your income. Mortgages and credit card payments suddenly become unaffordable.

[Guest boa]

About half of the people I know have either been put on a short working week or made redundant. 2 friends have been out of work for 8 months and they are really struggling to find employment.

 

I don't know of a single friend in the UK who has had their hours cut or has been made redundant.

 

It does take a while to get your jobseekers allowance, if you can get it at all, so if you do come back, make sure you have a good level of savings behind you. Property is expensive too and, depending on where you re-locate, you'll be looking at approx. £450.00 per month plus just to rent (Manchester/North West area). It will probably be considerably more the further South you travel.

 

I hope you aren't expecting property to be cheap over here, if you are you will be very disappointed. 450 a month is less than $800 which would get you very little here, closer to $1200 a month for anythin worth renting in Brisbane, not close to the city.

 

On the bright side, because of the recession, supermarkets and high street shops (if they haven't already gone out of business) are battling it out with each other and groceries and clothes are quite cheap right now. I can do a weekly shop for 2 people and 2 dogs for about £70.00 (but then it's mostly vegan and vegetarian food - meat tends to be quite expensive in some places).

 

Grocery prices here have risen faster than any other Western nation. We would spend $100 and get a few bags of food, I would hate to think what a whole weekly shop would be especially for a Vegan as weird food is very expensive.

 

Cars, as always, are a rip off and petrol is selling at an average price of £1.12 per litre.

 

Crime is at a ridiculous level too and the criminals generally have more rights than their victims. The law abiding citizen can't do anything to protect themselves and, if they try, they're the ones that get arrested or retribution attacks. Every night on the news you hear about another teenager being shot or stabbed or another gang of teenagers killing somebody outside of their own house because they were trying to protect their property or family. Just take a look at the BBC News website.

 

I do view the BBC website but it doesn't seem to cover these nightly massacres you mention, I hope you aren't expecting low crime rates here ?

 

The other posts on here are correct. The government has run the country into the ground. We're no longer Great Britain but now ****ty Britty. We are living in a nanny state where we're told by the politicians to "Hug a Hoodie" (they're the buggers who dress in their "black uniform" so they all look alike, cover their faces with hoods / baseball caps and scarves and cause most of the trouble) and it's becoming like little Islamabad (sorry for the racist comment, but it's true). The Eastern Europeans will work for a pittance so they're the preferred employee to save money, and all the illegal immigrants have to do is hold their hands out and say "Asylum". They get a house, benefits and the open invitation to bring the rest of their family into the country.

 

Mmm, you had better choose your location VERY carefully when you get here if that is how you feel :laugh:

 

Good luck with your move home though, if you do decide to come back, we're trying to get out there. Shame we can't just swap places. One comes back to the UK, one is allowed from the UK into Oz. In a perferct world.

The problem I see is that a great many people have an unrealistic view of life here, they seem to imagine some kind of Utopia where everyone gets on and everyone, even the criminals, have a nice cheery disposition and nothing goes wrong. This is a lovely country to live in as is the UK in my experience. Australia has got to be a pretty expensive country to live in, houses have gone through the roof as has food and many other essentials. I just think people need to be a bit more grounded in firstly what they expect of this country and a bit more realistic when describing where they are (UK).

[Life on easy street]

I second that, I'm been in IT for 25 years and its absolutely awful in the UK right now, a combination of "best shoring" (i.e. moving the jobs overseas to less experienced people able to work for 25% of the pay) and the recession. I'm a contractor but have had some periods (thankfully fairly short) of involuntary rest over the last year or so, there's huge competition for work, or was last time I was looking (Sept 09). Because there are so many applicants employers are becoming incredibly picky, like listing 8-10 skills and industries needed and insisting on someone with all of them, in the past if you had 50-70% you'd get an interview, but not now. Some are also listing what where £60K jobs 18 months ago at £40k and presumably getting applicants. I've worked at a lot of places recently and they're all laying people off and off shoring their work at a fairly senior level too. I've never seen it even remotely as bad as this, and I can't wait to get out (when my current contract finishes BTW).

 

Don't come to the UK if you want IT work is my advice, I've heard of many IT people becoming "long term" unemployed, like 6+ months and that's unheard of until recently.

 

I also believe that the UK is one of the next Greece's and can look forward to more tax & less public spending after the next election (and its miserable and raining today too )

 

The same thing happened to the electronics manufacturing industry in the 1990’s.

If my experience in manufacturing industry is anything to go by wages will not pickup

Again for the average IT worker.

 

I was paid exactly the same pay in 2002 as in 1992 for doing essentially the same job.

Previous employer went bankrupt.

 

(Only accepted the job as required to be in my trade to get my PR visa.).

[KIRK AND CO]

It's a great salary, but would still come as big a shock if your earning potential dropped from £24k to £16k overnight and you then lost your income. Mortgages and credit card payments suddenly become unaffordable.

I dont know about credit cards dont use them but if you are earning £40-£60,000 why do you need credit cards & have outstanding debt on them ?plus would you not have savings out of this sum ?. Why blame the credit crunch when it was big earners who thought they could have it all suddenly having the rug pulled from under them & then carried on spending on credit.

[Peach]

My point was that people have a tendancy to live to their means - and if those means have built up over many years and are irreversably gone it's a shock. Bigger salary tends to mean bigger house, bigger car and more outgoings. You'd have to have some mighty big savings to be able to swallow a permanent 30% loss of income - regardless of your income bracket.

[KIRK AND CO]

My point was that people have a tendancy to live to their means - and if those means have built up over many years and are irreversably gone it's a shock. Bigger salary tends to mean bigger house, bigger car and more outgoings. You'd have to have some mighty big savings to be able to swallow a permanent 30% loss of income - regardless of your income bracket.

Not always so. I live in a excouncil house with a modest car no frills, takeaway saturday night, cans from suppermarket, no sky but occasional visit to pub to watch the football.Used to earn £18,000 the started my own business now take home more than the £60,000 quoted but my life style has not changed all it has done is allowed me to go to oz with more $ than some. Its not what you have got its how you use it.

[freebo]

That's them, but they aren't management. But high up enough to be sent to various countries for work.

 

I am sure if it was that bad though, HP would have no employees. Regardless, I can't get over the amount of doom and gloom mongering some people carry on with. Why are they viewing the "Moving back to the UK forum" ? lol Purely to troll I suspect.

 

I came onto moving back to the UK to see if anyone was selling a car prior to heading home, I don't troll. The OP asked for opinions on the UK IT market and I gave my honest impressions, its not uncommon to be sent overseas for work, I do have long knowledge of HP having consulted for them for many years, while I won't comment directly on them I recently read that a number of their UK employees went on strike due to pay cuts and layoffs http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/01/21/hp_strike_government/

 

You're right in that my post was based on my own experiences and I've been lucky to continue gainful employment during most of the crisis however I'll qualify my recommendation and say that for the majority of IT workers the UK is not a good place to be out of work right now. Of course if someone wants to come back they will do so and good luck to them, but make no mistake the economic outlook is worse in the UK than Australia the most recent figures show unemployment in the UK is 7.8% and 5.5% in Australia about 40% higher.

 

As to the £40k not enough comment, that was an example of a field I know which would seem low to people used to £60k (30% pay cut), which is an averageish salrary bad for mid-level project managers and highly skilled engineers, with the exchange rate at the moment similar roles seem to be better paid in Australia ($120-$150k) and for clarity I wasn't reffering to my situation, I've worked freelance for the last 15 years, not as an employee.

[Peach]

Not always so. I live in a excouncil house with a modest car no frills, takeaway saturday night, cans from suppermarket, no sky but occasional visit to pub to watch the football.Used to earn £18,000 the started my own business now take home more than the £60,000 quoted but my life style has not changed all it has done is allowed me to go to oz with more $ than some. Its not what you have got its how you use it.

 

Good for you. But you are the exception rather than the norm.

[Guest Tom the Pom]

Not always so. I live in a excouncil house with a modest car no frills, takeaway saturday night, cans from suppermarket, no sky but occasional visit to pub to watch the football.Used to earn £18,000 the started my own business now take home more than the £60,000 quoted but my life style has not changed all it has done is allowed me to go to oz with more $ than some. Its not what you have got its how you use it.

 

What do you do now???

[KIRK AND CO]

What do you do now???

Dental Technician.

[Jackboots]

has anyone seen this website ? its really good.

 

www.welcomehome.co.uk

[Peach]

Not always so. I live in a excouncil house with a modest car no frills, takeaway saturday night, cans from suppermarket, no sky but occasional visit to pub to watch the football.Used to earn £18,000 the started my own business now take home more than the £60,000 quoted but my life style has not changed all it has done is allowed me to go to oz with more $ than some. Its not what you have got its how you use it.

 

I'm also curious, had you not been planning a move to Oz (and thus had something to save for) what would you otherwise have done with the extra money?

[pablo]

For any bricklayers coming back...............................dont! not unless yer've got a start

2 years ago we were getting £10 a metre for 100mm rough blockwork,10 blk per metre

The other day i was offered a start by a subbie in BAE wharton,nr blackburn

Prices for 150 mm FACE blockwork (both sides),14 midi blk per metre? £6.75!!!ffs

I know all the subbies in the north west and have a decent name,ive done 4months work since last dec,and no i didnt take up the job offer,told him he was a thief and id rather starve.

[heyyu]

Dental Technician.

 

that dont pay much here if you work for a boss:wink:

[Guest paulwbafc]

i have heard off family it is grim, no jobs, 13% unemployment in places, people in jobs not getting pay rises and over last few years elec and gas has gone up a whopping 80%. utility bills now around $3000 per annum over there. Just phone about employment there. The only potential areas for work in IT is in telecoms in the broadband infrastructure as that is where the jobs are if any. The UK is investing in this technology.

[freebo]

i have heard off family it is grim, no jobs, 13% unemployment in places, people in jobs not getting pay rises and over last few years elec and gas has gone up a whopping 80%. utility bills now around $3000 per annum over there. Just phone about employment there. The only potential areas for work in IT is in telecoms in the broadband infrastructure as that is where the jobs are if any. The UK is investing in this technology.

 

Fair enough, I hadn't heard of that but I'm guessing you mean in the area of installing the network hardware & laying the cable, which is fine but a fairly niche area & not the best paid, this company seems to be where BT hire most of its IT workers from (they part own the company) Tech Mahindra - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Graemsay]

Like Freebo I'm an IT freelancer.

 

2009 was dire. In the first half of the year everyone was panicking about it being the end of the world, and there was little recruitment. If anything moved then it moved slowly.

 

Things improved in the last quarter, but I still don't think that they're great.

 

However, if you're in finance then it's a different matter. The banks are paying similar rates to what they did in 2007. The real kicker is that you can't work for them without prior experience in that sector.

 

My inclination would be to put off a move back to the UK for six or twelve months and see if things improve. I don't think that the Oz economy is necessarily great, but it's probably better than the UK.