fleabo Posted June 23, 2011 Share Posted June 23, 2011 I am interested in what other folks think of the $37B (minimum) plan for the NBN. I rekon there are much better things the spend that sort of cash on. If you had $37B to spend, and were (un)fortunate enough to be Julia Gillard, what would you spend it on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petals Posted June 23, 2011 Share Posted June 23, 2011 I think its a very good idea, its about time we had good cover for "all Australians" not just the city slickers. Yes, its going to cost but given that most of our money is made in outlandish places, farming and mining they deserve a share of the booty in services. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Billy Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 I think its great, broadband here sucks outside the cities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parley Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 Do we actually have the money though, or are they borrowing to fund it? I am not in favour if we are borrowing the money and going in to massive debt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest16631 Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 ........................there are parts of the health care system that could use this money........................ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parley Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 Also if we don't have the money and are borrowing it... Now if you need a car, I would have no problems you getting a loan to buy a commodore or a falcon, after all you need a car. But if you get a loan for a Ferrari or a Lamborghini I would question the justification for such a purchase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fleabo Posted June 24, 2011 Author Share Posted June 24, 2011 Do we actually have the money though, or are they borrowing to fund it?I am not in favour if we are borrowing the money and going in to massive debt. Assume a best case scenario - that the Government has the money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fleabo Posted June 24, 2011 Author Share Posted June 24, 2011 Yes, its going to cost but given that most of our money is made in outlandish places, farming and mining they deserve a share of the booty in services. I agree with the sentiment but not the solution. Also, many of these areas don't have access to other state-of-the-art services (medical, power, water etc.). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quoll Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 As I understand it the NBN still isnt going to cover those out of the way places where satellite and wireless would be a far better option. It's interesting that with the same sort of distance issues, the US is going wireless in its move forward technologically. The NBN will be obsolete before it is even rolled out and it looks very much as if your average Joe isnt going to be able to afford it anyway - it's going to be very relatively expensive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fleabo Posted June 24, 2011 Author Share Posted June 24, 2011 As I understand it the NBN still isnt going to cover those out of the way places where satellite and wireless would be a far better option. It's interesting that with the same sort of distance issues, the US is going wireless in its move forward technologically. The NBN will be obsolete before it is even rolled out and it looks very much as if your average Joe isnt going to be able to afford it anyway - it's going to be very relatively expensive I think that too - but then satellite comms coverage over an unpopoulated area doesn't come cheap? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quoll Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 I think that too - but then satellite comms coverage over an unpopoulated area doesn't come cheap? LOL neither does the NBN!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fleabo Posted June 24, 2011 Author Share Posted June 24, 2011 OK. So I found this on the web: http://www.nbnco.com.au/wps/wcm/connect/main/site-base/main-areas/publications-and-announcements/announcements/Remote-Australians-the-priority-for-new-NBN-Interim-Satellite-Service.html So it seems that the out of the way places will be covered (7% of the population apparently) for an interim period at a cost of $300M for satellite and wireless. That sounds like $300M well spent. Just got to work out where the other $36.7B is being spent other than Telstra and Optus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul1Perth Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 Trouble is the government knows that the fibre to the node idea that they first thought about would be a lot cheaper and give almost as good service. The cities would be fine and it's going to be the outlying areas and farms that are going to cost the most to get services to. Think for a minute how much data is needed for a TV to work. They have to transmit enough to keep the picture and sound in sync, at a resonable quality. They have been managing to do this for a long time, even in fairly remote areas over wireless. Now the transmission of TV is going to digital they are going to hit snags in the country areas when the analogue network is turned off. There is a big push on at the moment for TV's to be connected to the internet and stream transmission via that. Sure it would give a lot more flexibilty and more choice but at a massive cost to everyone to roll out the NBN. They have no idea yet the real costs of it, how much it will cost for the end user and when it will be finished. I think they should have stuck with the fibre to the node and wireless services to remote areas. No matter how they try to market the NBN the real reason there is a big push for it is the money that is going to be spent on big business (cisco, alcatel, iinet, telstra). Just about all the so-called "experts" I have heard on TV have been from one of the parties that is going to make a lot of money out of the investment. Of course they are going to be all for it. I haven't ever liked Malcolm Turnbull, comes across as a bit of an arrogant bully and anyone who doesn't agree with him is wrong, but he has spoken a lot of sense about the NBN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petals Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 For me I like to see new innovation and going forward, not dissecting every little thing down to the last penny. If this had been done in the past we would not have had penicllin, xrays, telephone, railways all things that cost money and had to be paid for. Do we want to remain in the dark ages no, I think we need to move forward, maybe its right maybe its wrong but if we do not have a go and have such negativity about every little thing then no hope. Innovators take to your caves you are not wanted. I am just sick of negativity about every little thing, greed is a live and well, if it might hit my hip pocket oh goodness I might just have to do without a latte once a week. I see no future for the world with all the negativity at the moment, what happened to lets have a go and hope. If they had not tried insulin on humans I would not have my daughter now. Not the same I know but its the same sentiment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parley Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 This is not a little thing though. It is a massive enormous huge gigantic thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petals Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 Snowy River Scheme was a massive scheme. They did it though. We have to do things for the good of the country, and to take us forward and keep up. If we do not do this we will not be keeping up at all as far as I am concerned. Because believe me there will always be an excuse not to do it. Look at our trains here, disaster, old fashioned. Just imagine if they had taken a chance and upgraded. Asian cities leave us for dead with technology and this is a chance for us to show that we want to move into the modern world and out of the going backwards brigade which I believe we are doing at present, both at State level and Federal Level. Its not just the NBN its everything that needs upgrading and if we want the standard of living then we have to pay for it. There are other things that need doing as well but good communication is essential in our modern world. This will mean people in the bush can be on line and run their businesses efficiently and maybe just maybe more people will move to country areas away from the congestion in the cities which is a good thing. Do not give me the wireless potato either, I am all wirelessed out, ok for those who are close to the towers no good for those that are not. Was dire in the UK when we were there, its dire in the middle of Melbourne just ask my daughter. This thread is dejavu as there was a thread a little while ago on BE about the same subject and some good posts were made for and against. I have been reading up a lot about this as I am interested in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul1Perth Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 For me I like to see new innovation and going forward, not dissecting every little thing down to the last penny. If this had been done in the past we would not have had penicllin, xrays, telephone, railways all things that cost money and had to be paid for. Do we want to remain in the dark ages no, I think we need to move forward, maybe its right maybe its wrong but if we do not have a go and have such negativity about every little thing then no hope. Innovators take to your caves you are not wanted. I am just sick of negativity about every little thing, greed is a live and well, if it might hit my hip pocket oh goodness I might just have to do without a latte once a week. I see no future for the world with all the negativity at the moment, what happened to lets have a go and hope. If they had not tried insulin on humans I would not have my daughter now. Not the same I know but its the same sentiment. Innovation and going forward is all well and good. The technology is there to make this happen and it's not really a risk that it won't work. I just think this sort of money is wasted to let the gamers have faster real time gaming, faster porn downloads, faster links to twitter, facebook and other social networking sites. I truly believe this is what the majority of net usage is. The government are trying to sell it as a cure all for big business and advertising it as though it's going to enhance our standard of living somehow. I feel sorry for the people that feel like they are missing something when they are not on-line or reachable 24 x 7. It's just too much pressure. Lets spend the money on building that much maligned canal from the Kimberleys to Perth and cure our water shortages for ever, or invest some in medical research or new railways, cheaper health care, better aged care or something. It's not as though most of us don't have broadband already. America set aside $7.2 billion in grants and loans to encourage the installation of broadband networks in areas with little or no access to it because "The Obama Administration considers access to high-speed Internet connections a critical way of bridging socioeconomic gaps, creating jobs, and spurring economic growth." I don't see them lurching out of recession too quickly. The countries with the fastest brodband connections are listed as South Korea, Finland, Japan, Sweden and most of Eurpoe and America have faster broadband than here. I don't see that it's helped them get over the GFC anywhere near as our investements in good old mining and producing something worth-while that other people want. There are plenty of other worthwhile, innovative things we could be spending $40 billion on. :cool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewebweazel Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 As I understand it the NBN still isnt going to cover those out of the way places where satellite and wireless would be a far better option. It's interesting that with the same sort of distance issues, the US is going wireless in its move forward technologically. The NBN will be obsolete before it is even rolled out and it looks very much as if your average Joe isnt going to be able to afford it anyway - it's going to be very relatively expensive Wireless is not the answer, the only thing wireless has over fiber is mobility. With Wireless you have to share the Radio spectrum with other users and its getting pretty crowded already. In a given area you will have limit on the number of users that can use a frequency before your broadband speed start to suffer. With Fiber you just add more circuits (cable + equipment) with no threshold. Fiber is more secure then wireless, all you need to access wireless is a wireless card on your PC, time and cracking software that you can down load off the internet, with fibre you have to physically access the cable. Fibre is not affected by atmospheric conditions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewebweazel Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 Innovation and going forward is all well and good. The technology is there to make this happen and it's not really a risk that it won't work. I just think this sort of money is wasted to let the gamers have faster real time gaming, faster porn downloads, faster links to twitter, facebook and other social networking sites. I truly believe this is what the majority of net usage is. The government are trying to sell it as a cure all for big business and advertising it as though it's going to enhance our standard of living somehow. I feel sorry for the people that feel like they are missing something when they are not on-line or reachable 24 x 7. It's just too much pressure.Lets spend the money on building that much maligned canal from the Kimberleys to Perth and cure our water shortages for ever, or invest some in medical research or new railways, cheaper health care, better aged care or something. It's not as though most of us don't have broadband already. America set aside $7.2 billion in grants and loans to encourage the installation of broadband networks in areas with little or no access to it because "The Obama Administration considers access to high-speed Internet connections a critical way of bridging socioeconomic gaps, creating jobs, and spurring economic growth." I don't see them lurching out of recession too quickly. The countries with the fastest brodband connections are listed as South Korea, Finland, Japan, Sweden and most of Eurpoe and America have faster broadband than here. I don't see that it's helped them get over the GFC anywhere near as our investements in good old mining and producing something worth-while that other people want. There are plenty of other worthwhile, innovative things we could be spending $40 billion on. :cool: 100 years ago we had horse drawn carriages and ox wagons, there was opposition to motor vehicles then as well. Do you think that we would be able to sustain our economies and standard of living with animal drawn transport now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fleabo Posted June 24, 2011 Author Share Posted June 24, 2011 100 years ago we had horse drawn carriages and ox wagons, there was opposition to motor vehicles then as well. Do you think that we would be able to sustain our economies and standard of living with animal drawn transport now? I don't think anyone has said that having broadband is a bad thing. And the US government didn't go out and furnish the public with Ford's. It was left to the 'market' to decide. From what I have read so far about the NBN, it is costing very little of the $37B to equip those that do not have broadband access with some form of connectivity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewebweazel Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 I don't think anyone has said that having broadband is a bad thing. And the US government didn't go out and furnish the public with Ford's. It was left to the 'market' to decide. From what I have read so far about the NBN, it is costing very little of the $37B to equip those that do not have broadband access with some form of connectivity. What I'm trying to say is that broad band access needs to be continuously upgraded to make provision for new technologies in the pipe line Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fleabo Posted June 25, 2011 Author Share Posted June 25, 2011 What I'm trying to say is that broad band access needs to be continuously upgraded to make provision for new technologies in the pipe line Ok - understood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Go1ngH0me Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 Waste of money Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest siamsusie Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 I will go with anything that gives me a decent service! Strange a wee mining town in northern WA received excellent BB but we suffer here in Tasmania in many instances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest36187 Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 I have had hassle in major cities getting connected sometimes. I walked to the end of mooloolabah spit with dad and got a wireless connection (through someone's phone!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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