mdkys Posted January 31, 2014 Share Posted January 31, 2014 Thank you all for your replies! comments about space, weather and outdoorsy lifestyle were to be expected. Although I have to say (we live in London, well surrey zone 6 and commute to CL if to be precise) quality and variety of food and restaurants in Surrey/London are brilliant and it would be hard to beat that. As for chavs... Never had any issues with them being around or causing trouble so it does depend where you live in both countries I suppose. We are moving to Sydney and I really hope "troubles with bogans' is not going to be an issue as for "less intellectual snobbery" that's a bit of a concern... We are more academic types and have more degrees between us than money which is not an issue in the uk at all. But if people in Aus are purely measured by how much they make and we are going to be looked down on by people making a fortune on mines etc than I don't really see it as a positive... That's a very shallow approach in my view... Hi I don't think you should worry about the intellectual or financial snobbery as mentioned...certainly we all know mine workers make good money - but (at the risk of being intellectually snobbish) they are still mine workers. Most people have the attitude, good on yer mate, go for it, but I wouldn't like to do what you do!!! Essentially if you present well, are articulate and intelligent, friendly, self possessed and open minded, doesn't matter what you do or earn, no one will look down on you here, whether they are CEOs or office workers. At least that's what I've found in regional QLD! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MARYROSE02 Posted January 31, 2014 Share Posted January 31, 2014 You are misunderstanding. It is not bad luck to have the minerals, but it is bad luck to invest your future in a labouring economy. I don;t think that's what Saudi Arabia and the gulf states have done - by and large they have migrant workers for the muscle and have invested the mineral proceeds in a knowledge economy. If you want a closer parallel to what Australia risks doing now, look at Nauru. What is a 'labouring economy?' The mines employ skilled workers, surely, not just labourers? Do they even need 'navvies' there? The mines are mostly in WA and QLD anyway, so NSW and Victoria, where the bulk of the population live, are not reliant on the mines. Nauru? Can you compare a tiny island state to a first world economy like Australia? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 31, 2014 Share Posted January 31, 2014 Just our bad luck to have all these minerals lying around. Still, it could have been worse. We might have been cursed with Saudi Arabia's oil. You have been, didn't you see the recent news about the oil fields found in South Australia which equal Saudi Arabia's?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MARYROSE02 Posted January 31, 2014 Share Posted January 31, 2014 This, though, is not going to stand Australia in good stead for the future. I see heaps of young people (we have three boys under 20) who see that rewards do not necessarily flow from success in schools. That's just because the pay-off matrix in Australia right now is based on huge income from overseas for mined products. So we see schoolkids deciding not to bother with school because they believe they will hit the big time driving an excavator in the WA desert. However, tomorrow belongs not to the nations that dig up their minerals and sell them to others, it belongs to the other nations that buy the minerals and do something useful with them. The sustainable future is in a knowledge based economy. Australia will soon pay a price unless it wakes up to this. I wasn't aware that Australia's universities are reporting a huge decrease in the number of prospective students, because they are all heading off to work as FIFO workers in WA? I saw a multi-page lift-out in the Daily Telegraph today with the second round of place offers at NSW universities. Australia has always had a mining sector and mining towns and cities going back to the 19th century and the gold rushes. Broken Hill and Mt Isa are still going strong. I'm no economist, but where is the evidence that Australia has mis-managed its economy generally, and mining sector specifically? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MARYROSE02 Posted January 31, 2014 Share Posted January 31, 2014 You have been, didn't you see the recent news about the oil fields found in South Australia which equal Saudi Arabia's?? I missed that. Another wasted opportunity for the Aussie dimwits! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MARYROSE02 Posted January 31, 2014 Share Posted January 31, 2014 ....but everything he says is true. The job market has slowed right down - its important to let newbies know its not like 20 years ago when folk came here for cheap houses and lots of well paid work. Hmmm! If the Pommie 'newbies' (God I HATE that word) come here and then go home disillusioned, the Aussie haters on PIO will finally be vindicated when, for the first time in the history of Pommie migration to Australia, more go home than stay! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 31, 2014 Share Posted January 31, 2014 Hmmm! If the Pommie 'newbies' (God I HATE that word) come here and then go home disillusioned, the Aussie haters on PIO will finally be vindicated when, for the first time in the history of Pommie migration to Australia, more go home than stay! The majority can't return either for financial reasons or because of children - I certainly don't hate Australia and for 2-3 years was very clear that whilst it was no better than the UK it wasn't bad enough to migrate again. The shift in the exchange rate and a housing market mini-boom in Perth changed the tide and I consider myself lucky to have been able to return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MARYROSE02 Posted January 31, 2014 Share Posted January 31, 2014 Exchange rates, interest rates, boom and bust, house prices, etc, you can't do anything about them, except enjoy them in the good times, and put up with them in the bad. I never paid them any heed and it did not affect my decision to come here. The FX rate in late 1978, when I first came was a measly $1.45 or so to the GBP. When I bought my home in 1987, the interest rate was 17.5 per cent. When I was transferring money from England in the last couple of years to supplement my income, the FX rate was awful again. A decade or so ago, the Barmy Army were singing '$3 to a pound' or something like that? This year, the Aussie dollar has started to slip again against the GBP, so it's happy days for Pommies again. Last year, they would come here on holiday and complain about how dear everything is. This year, it's a bargain again. Anybody who tries to weigh up Australia versus Britain in terms of a debit and credit sheet is setting themselves up for failure. Trying to compare supermarket prices, quality of clothes, setting a comparable salary rate in dollars to pounds, etc, is just all so much BS, in my opinion. Try to come here with a positive attitude, and don't spend your time looking backwards to 'Home,' and after a couple of years, most people have settled in well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 31, 2014 Share Posted January 31, 2014 This, though, is not going to stand Australia in good stead for the future. I see heaps of young people (we have three boys under 20) who see that rewards do not necessarily flow from success in schools. That's just because the pay-off matrix in Australia right now is based on huge income from overseas for mined products. So we see schoolkids deciding not to bother with school because they believe they will hit the big time driving an excavator in the WA desert. However, tomorrow belongs not to the nations that dig up their minerals and sell them to others, it belongs to the other nations that buy the minerals and do something useful with them. The sustainable future is in a knowledge based economy. Australia will soon pay a price unless it wakes up to this. An interesting perspective, although it is absolutely right to say that rewards do not necessarily flow from success in school - in the UK people seem to believe it does and I guess that's what I mean by 'intellectual snobbery'. At this point I'll pause to say that I am a 'success' of the education system, I was a teacher and associate university lecturer and then moved into business. I am now a company director - early days as I only started trading in September but first year profits are projected in 6 figures GBP I have no chip on my shoulder whatsoever about UK education! However as a teacher it was absolutely plain to me that at least 50% of my students should not have been there - regardless of motivation not everyone has the basic intellect required for a higher education but these young people felt like they had no other options. The sad thing is they were usually right, apprenticeships were extremely hard to come by. When young people have no options at 16 or even 18 it results in problems for us all in society - hence my assertion that it is a positive in Australia. What I hadn't considered was those perfectly capable of higher education may opt for other options and whether that is something to be concerned about. I haven't given it much thought but I tend to question why it would be. Thinking that it is somehow better to have a degree is the 'intellectual snobbery' I was talking about in the UK. Resilience and adaptability are what our young people need because economies will change and our education system (particularly in the UK) is very poor at this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MARYROSE02 Posted February 1, 2014 Share Posted February 1, 2014 I started thinking about my own education, mostly in England, but I did a degree at UNSW in Sydney. I wonder if passing the Eleven Plus was a disaster for me? If I'd failed it, I would have gone to my local secondary-modern school,, and perhaps studied at a level, more suited to my abilities? I was next to useless in many of my subjects at the grammar school, "the worst in a very weak class", "seems to have no understanding whatsoever of this subject,' "occasionally emerges from his dream world to show spasms of interest!" You see, I wasn't practical, so I was useless in woodwork, metalwork, technical drawing, pottery, music, useless at maths, which probably carried over to physics, biology and chemistry, and not much better at English, history, geography, French. The girls were lucky in a way, because they got to do useful stuff like typewriting, shorthand, and domestic science. Putting a single boy in those classes would have been a death sentence, of course, when the worst, the very worst insult, you could hurl at a bloke was 'Woman!' I probably learnt all I really needed for adult life at infants and junior schools - 'the three "R"'s'. Just add in a few office-based subjects. Leave metalwork and woodwork to the ones destinied for apprenticeships. I learnt to type, not long after I left school, once I realized you could not do most office work without it. And I did do that BA at UNSW as a mature age student, so I wasn't completely thick after all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quinkla Posted February 1, 2014 Share Posted February 1, 2014 Nauru? Can you compare a tiny island state to a first world economy like Australia? Yes - and I just did. A nation that had an absolute ball spending all their finite mineral wealth on planes, trains and automobiles (except trains) and is now one of the poorest nations on earth with precisely nothing to show for it other than a scarred landscape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 1, 2014 Share Posted February 1, 2014 Yes - and I just did. A nation that had an absolute ball spending all their finite mineral wealth on planes, trains and automobiles (except trains) and is now one of the poorest nations on earth with precisely nothing to show for it other than a scarred landscape. Very good point. Now is the time for Australia to capitalise on this bounty that it's been gifted, and invest in 21st century infrastructure like a state of the art national broadband network and not do it on the cheap. Future generations will reap the rewards of that kind of future thinking, but it takes politicians with vision and a real sense of the national interest (as opposed to just looking towards re-election) to make it happen. Can't say that I think Australia (or the UK for the sake of balance) has those kinds of people in power. Sadly, I think that it will end up a bit like North-Sea gas was in the UK, a windfall that wasn't used for nation building. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MARYROSE02 Posted February 1, 2014 Share Posted February 1, 2014 Yes - and I just did. A nation that had an absolute ball spending all their finite mineral wealth on planes, trains and automobiles (except trains) and is now one of the poorest nations on earth with precisely nothing to show for it other than a scarred landscape. Is that Australia's future then? 'Just a quarry surrounded by sea?" Russia, Canada, the USA, etc all got it right, but Australia has got it wrong!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wakeboard1980 Posted February 1, 2014 Share Posted February 1, 2014 Very good point. Now is the time for Australia to capitalise on this bounty that it's been gifted, and invest in 21st century infrastructure like a state of the art national broadband network and not do it on the cheap. Future generations will reap the rewards of that kind of future thinking, but it takes politicians with vision and a real sense of the national interest (as opposed to just looking towards re-election) to make it happen. Can't say that I think Australia (or the UK for the sake of balance) has those kinds of people in power. Sadly, I think that it will end up a bit like North-Sea gas was in the UK, a windfall that wasn't used for nation building. Youre right, I don't think many, if any, think 10-20-30 years ahead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
janlo Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Exchange rates, interest rates, boom and bust, house prices, etc, you can't do anything about them, except enjoy them in the good times, and put up with them in the bad. I never paid them any heed and it did not affect my decision to come here. The FX rate in late 1978, when I first came was a measly $1.45 or so to the GBP. When I bought my home in 1987, the interest rate was 17.5 per cent. When I was transferring money from England in the last couple of years to supplement my income, the FX rate was awful again. A decade or so ago, the Barmy Army were singing '$3 to a pound' or something like that? This year, the Aussie dollar has started to slip again against the GBP, so it's happy days for Pommies again. Last year, they would come here on holiday and complain about how dear everything is. This year, it's a bargain again. Anybody who tries to weigh up Australia versus Britain in terms of a debit and credit sheet is setting themselves up for failure. Trying to compare supermarket prices, quality of clothes, setting a comparable salary rate in dollars to pounds, etc, is just all so much BS, in my opinion. Try to come here with a positive attitude, and don't spend your time looking backwards to 'Home,' and after a couple of years, most people have settled in well. Of course people are going to weigh up Australia versus Britain in a financial way ? Its why historically people imigrated ! Unless you just came for the weather ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MARYROSE02 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Of course people are going to weigh up Australia versus Britain in a financial way ? Its why historically people imigrated ! Unless you just came for the weather ? I came for the 'adventure' and the lure of the 'unknown,' Perhaps, rationally, logically, I should have worried about FX rates, getting a job, comparing supermarkets, clothes, cost of living, ad nauseam, but if I had, I probably would not have come. The only thing I DID worry about, was how the Aussies would react to a Pom, (I listened to much to 'propaganda' from blokes at home who had been here.) That worry was dissipated when the three young Aussies in my cabin on the ship from Singapore to Freemantle all shook my hand! Naturally, families who are considering migrating should consider those factors more seriously than I did, but you still can't treat the process as a simple credit/debit sheet. It's still got to be an adventure, surely? You want to get off the plane, and think 'WOW, we are here at last, let's get out and explore, let's have some fun!' I am 'laying it on' a bit now, but do you really want to be one of those people who gets off the plane and thinks, 'Right, let's get straight down to Coles and Target, and see if those people on PIO who came back to England, were right about the rubbish food and clothes!' ('And why is it so HOT?! I hate this, let's find some air condtioning. And put the tellie on. Oh God, I'd forgotten about how crap the Aussie TV is!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flag of convenience Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 I came for the 'adventure' and the lure of the 'unknown,' Perhaps, rationally, logically, I should have worried about FX rates, getting a job, comparing supermarkets, clothes, cost of living, ad nauseam, but if I had, I probably would not have come. The only thing I DID worry about, was how the Aussies would react to a Pom, (I listened to much to 'propaganda' from blokes at home who had been here.) That worry was dissipated when the three young Aussies in my cabin on the ship from Singapore to Freemantle all shook my hand! Naturally, families who are considering migrating should consider those factors more seriously than I did, but you still can't treat the process as a simple credit/debit sheet. It's still got to be an adventure, surely? You want to get off the plane, and think 'WOW, we are here at last, let's get out and explore, let's have some fun!' I am 'laying it on' a bit now, but do you really want to be one of those people who gets off the plane and thinks, 'Right, let's get straight down to Coles and Target, and see if those people on PIO who came back to England, were right about the rubbish food and clothes!' ('And why is it so HOT?! I hate this, let's find some air condtioning. And put the tellie on. Oh God, I'd forgotten about how crap the Aussie TV is!) But then you came out as a young man equivalent to today's backpackers. They have a come what ever attitude as well. Hardly comparable to arriving in one of the most expensive countries in the world with a family in tow as many do today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest66881 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Sand/sea/wildlife, almost a year round out door lifestyle for us as well as the kids, lack of any real litter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jessica Berry Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 We have been here almost 7 years now. My OH works in IT so we came as a result of his skills. We sold up in the UK, our property, all the furniture, took the equity and ran! We arrived in Adelaide with 3 suitcases and 2 holdalls (basically our clothes and shoes), with nowhere to live, no jobs and not knowing anyone in Adelaide and got stuck in! We have had a few ups and downs along the way, probably no different to most people, but we feel we have a good life here and we still think Adelaide has plenty to offer people. It isn't for everyone and I think some people come with unrealistic expectations about life in Adelaide/Australia and then can be disappointed. I think people have to be honest with themselves about whether in their heart of hearts they would be happy to start off on a lower level job if they needed to, rent for a period (if they have been used to owning their own home), if they can adapt to change, be flexible in their approach and attitude and have the ability that if things go wrong they can pick themselves up, dust themselves down and keep going. My OH has had a dream migration experience, his skills are in demand, he earns more than double what he did in the UK which enables him to drive a nice car and we live in a nice house in a good location. On the other hand I have had mixed experiences on the job front, had to work hard/had some setbacks in employment/study in my own time and at my own expense to get to the place I want to be, but I rise to the challenge and always try to look at the big picture. I am not sure whether programs like Wanted Down Under help or hinder in the process of selling Australia and 'living the dream'. I was also talking to a couple not long ago that were over on a reccie and I was very concerned about the information they had been given at a migration seminar in the UK about the availability of jobs in their sector and also the salaries they were told they were going to earn, which in my experience and knowledge of the Adelaide job market was wildly inaccurate and very damaging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul1Perth Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 ....but everything he says is true. The job market has slowed right down - its important to let newbies know its not like 20 years ago when folk came here for cheap houses and lots of well paid work. There might have been a lot more cheap housing but you're wrong on the job front. Aus got the same recession that the UK and most of the rest of the world got about then. The job market might be slowing a bit but it's booming compared to 20 years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul1Perth Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 This, though, is not going to stand Australia in good stead for the future. I see heaps of young people (we have three boys under 20) who see that rewards do not necessarily flow from success in schools. That's just because the pay-off matrix in Australia right now is based on huge income from overseas for mined products. So we see schoolkids deciding not to bother with school because they believe they will hit the big time driving an excavator in the WA desert. However, tomorrow belongs not to the nations that dig up their minerals and sell them to others, it belongs to the other nations that buy the minerals and do something useful with them. The sustainable future is in a knowledge based economy. Australia will soon pay a price unless it wakes up to this. The schoolkids that make the decision not to try at school are in for a rude awakening. There are lots of opportunities for kids who don't want to take the Uni path but that doesn't mean they should stop trying at school and think they can get a driving job in the mines without any qualifications. The miners don't want kids who's shown no initiative and thought they can have any easy ride, they are just like every employee and everyone knows it's not easy to get a job on good money, with the miners. I know plenty of people who have been trying for years. Some with degrees and can't get a start. My eldest son never wanted to go to Uni. He knew there was a different path to take but he also knew that didn't mean slacking off at school as apprenticeship places aren't 2 a penny either. He did OK at school and got the same results as friends of his who went to Uni. He got the choice of 2 apprenticeships and chose electrical. This meant going to tafe for 4 years and getting through his trade tests. He now works FIFO, week on week off, on good money. Had to work at it though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul1Perth Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Of course people are going to weigh up Australia versus Britain in a financial way ? Its why historically people imigrated ! Unless you just came for the weather ? Maybe that's why we are such a success story? We just came for the weather, sea and beach life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flag of convenience Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 There might have been a lot more cheap housing but you're wrong on the job front. Aus got the same recession that the UK and most of the rest of the world got about then. The job market might be slowing a bit but it's booming compared to 20 years ago. Due largely to a course of economic events that benefited Australia t not created by Australia. I'd argue the job situation is far worse in the respect that a quarter of the work force work on a casual or temp basis which doesn't reflect the realities of the requirements to living in Australia at this time. 20 years ago while the job market was slow, rentals were easy to come by and houses affordable. Even the dole folk could get by on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul1Perth Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Due largely to a course of economic events that benefited Australia t not created by Australia. I'd argue the job situation is far worse in the respect that a quarter of the work force work on a casual or temp basis which doesn't reflect the realities of the requirements to living in Australia at this time. 20 years ago while the job market was slow, rentals were easy to come by and houses affordable. Even the dole folk could get by on. Depends what your definition of affordable is. Salaries were a lot lower then too and I remember buying our house in 92 and thinking "can we really afford this?" Exactly the same when we got our first house in the UK. 20 odd years down the track, salaries have risen, we manage the mortgage pretty easily, have a good life. Took me 5 months to find a job but never been out of work since. Don't think young people trying to get a start have ever found things any different have they? My parents had to start in a small terrace with an outside toilet in the UK. No cars, phones, 1 shower in the kitchen, bath would have been a luxury. My Dad didn't learn to drive until after me and my Mum never has. We've come a long way and young peoples expectations are a lot higher these days. Maybe that needs to be adjusted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akiralx Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Depends what your definition of affordable is. Salaries were a lot lower then too and I remember buying our house in 92 and thinking "can we really afford this?" Exactly the same when we got our first house in the UK. 20 odd years down the track, salaries have risen, we manage the mortgage pretty easily, have a good life. Took me 5 months to find a job but never been out of work since. Don't think young people trying to get a start have ever found things any different have they? But I think in Aus housing for young buyers has become pretty unaffordable, if the experiences of my younger colleagues are anything to go by. Many starter houses are snapped up by buy to let investors (using negative gearing of course), and a 25% deposit is needed in many cases. Not easy to save $80,000 - $100,000 when you earn $70,000. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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