How many people go home with nothing???

[Perthbum]

Something I have never seen asked on PIO

The reason I ask is a couple of people i know, came out to OZ,with money from the sale of their UK homes and savings

 

Things dident work out, one way or another, loosing jobs, not being able to find work,high cost of living, and their savings went very quickly

They have both returned to the UK, with their families, in a dire financial state, one now rents a caravan in Southend, and she will never own her own home again,due to her age etc

One family couldent even afford to ship back thier little dog, he had to be rehomed, and she had to sell of her furniture,as she could not afford shipping costs

 

We all think we will be ok, and when we plan this journey of a lifetime, I think most of us convince ourselves that we are making a one way trip

I never expected to be returning to the UK,when I left,so if someone had asked me what I would do, if I lost everything here, I think I would of just thought"oh everything will work out for us, we will get jobs, and be fine, we wont come back, we will be ok"

 

But what happens if it all goes wrong

To go back with nothing, or far less than what you came with

That is something most of us never think will happen to us

I wonder if its far more common than we know?

How do people cope,with loosing everything they have worked for,when it all goes wrong in Oz, and they have to head back to the UK

This is why so many remain unhappy in oz, they just cannot afford to go home.

[Paul1Perth]

I am amazed that many people no longer save for a rainy day. I feel it's my responsibility to have a nest egg in case things get tough financially, and even more so when there are dependent children. Too many people use their entire disposable income on living costs and never build up any savings, yet feel it is financially responsible to bring children into that. In my mind, having children is making a financial commitment as well as an emotional one.

 

That will fall on a lot of deaf ears with anyone under the age of about 45. They have been brought up to think their disposable income is what they can borrow on however many credit cards they have. Saving for a rainy day is a thing of the past, unfortunately, for the individual, governments and countries alike. It's what brought about the GFC and I fear most haven't learned anything from it.

 

We are forever telling our kids they have to save in case something goes wrong with their car for instance. Luckily the eldest learnt his lesson early on.

 

He had a car which was fairly old and he needed it to get to work. He had been in work a while and had nothing in the bank. We tried to tell him to save money but he didn't see why he had to. The day after we'd had the chat with him his car broke down and I had to go and pick him up from the RAC garage. We lent him the money and made him pay us back at a set figure a week, which didn't leave him much spare. He's never been totally broke since.

 

I can't believe some of the stories I read in the papers. Yesterday I was reading an article on the unemployment benefit and they focussed on a mother with 2 kids who was at Uni and complaining that she couldn't survive on what she was getting. Sorry but you have 2 kids and commitments. Now is not the time to be thinking about being a full time student. Should have done that before having kids. Shouldn't be up to the state to fund your education and the bringing up of your kids too.

[fourcorners]

That will fall on a lot of deaf ears with anyone under the age of about 45. They have been brought up to think their disposable income is what they can borrow on however many credit cards they have. Saving for a rainy day is a thing of the past, unfortunately, for the individual, governments and countries alike. It's what brought about the GFC and I fear most haven't learned anything from it.

 

We are forever telling our kids they have to save in case something goes wrong with their car for instance. Luckily the eldest learnt his lesson early on.

 

He had a car which was fairly old and he needed it to get to work. He had been in work a while and had nothing in the bank. We tried to tell him to save money but he didn't see why he had to. The day after we'd had the chat with him his car broke down and I had to go and pick him up from the RAC garage. We lent him the money and made him pay us back at a set figure a week, which didn't leave him much spare. He's never been totally broke since.

 

I can't believe some of the stories I read in the papers. Yesterday I was reading an article on the unemployment benefit and they focussed on a mother with 2 kids who was at Uni and complaining that she couldn't survive on what she was getting. Sorry but you have 2 kids and commitments. Now is not the time to be thinking about being a full time student. Should have done that before having kids. Shouldn't be up to the state to fund your education and the bringing up of your kids too.

 

Sorry Paul, but you can't tar all us young kids with the same brush. We (I'm 28 my partner is 36) have put together our whole life plan around savings and planning for the future. We have enough savings in the UK to take care of anything that may need doing to our house over there, and over here we send back any spare cash for the mortgage whilst maintaining at least $10k savings. Over the last 12 months we've paid down over $60k on our mortgage. Unfortunately a lot here in Oz view us as tight and we got criticised for buying a small car (which is now bought and paid for in the same 12 month period). Several of our other English friends are in a similar position to us, we're all savers. I have a credit card for emergencies but have only ever used that for some flights and paid it off the next day. We are not in Oz for the lifestyle, so many people prioritise their dream lifestyle and forget about how they are going to afford a $600k house next to the beach whilst working less hours. That's why many people do end up leaving Oz with nothing, that beachy sunny dream just isn't available to many in these times.

[calNgary]

Some friends of ours (under 45) have just returned to the UK, they had been here just over 4 years, bought a house, set up a business, got citizenship etc but a business deal went bad ,turned their dreams sour and they have returned home with the same amount of money they arrived with 4 years ago. Not everyone returns empty handed or have no savings.

If we too had to return home for some reason and sold what we have here (as we did in the UK when moving here) we too would probably take a similar amount back with us.

Everyone is different.

 

Cal x

[robfromdublin]

Haha! As if people over the age of 45 are somehow better with money! The amount of people approaching retirement that my partner (financial planner) sees with completely inadequate savings...

 

Realistically there will always be tough decisions with money:

Would my kids be better off living in a nicer area, or should I spend money sending them to a better school instead?

Should I buy a property with only a 10% deposit, which will wipe out my savings?

Can I afford to visit my first grandkid abroad this year, or should I wait and miss out on his first two years of life?

 

So what if people gamble their savings on a different life abroad? Their money, their choice. It doesn't mean they're incompetent with saving by any means.

[Paul1Perth]

Sorry Paul, but you can't tar all us young kids with the same brush. We (I'm 28 my partner is 36) have put together our whole life plan around savings and planning for the future. We have enough savings in the UK to take care of anything that may need doing to our house over there, and over here we send back any spare cash for the mortgage whilst maintaining at least $10k savings. Over the last 12 months we've paid down over $60k on our mortgage. Unfortunately a lot here in Oz view us as tight and we got criticised for buying a small car (which is now bought and paid for in the same 12 month period). Several of our other English friends are in a similar position to us, we're all savers. I have a credit card for emergencies but have only ever used that for some flights and paid it off the next day. We are not in Oz for the lifestyle, so many people prioritise their dream lifestyle and forget about how they are going to afford a $600k house next to the beach whilst working less hours. That's why many people do end up leaving Oz with nothing, that beachy sunny dream just isn't available to many in these times.

 

Sorry fourcorners I stand corrected. I generalise too much sometimes. Glad to see you have it together, a lot more than I ever did at your age, I always had money in my pocket, good cars, spent loads on booze and holidays the rest I just frittered away (to quote George Best). Always knew I would settle down someday and that would be when I started really having to budget and make a plan. Me and the wife refused to have credit cards whilst we were in the UK, found you can really keep control of income and outgooings that way and only got credit cards when we came to Oz and got an offset mortgage.

 

You have maximised your education and earning potential brilliantly, well done. I still reckon you are in a minority though and it's a pity that a few more don't do as you have. I know not everyone has the chance and opportunity to do what you have done but I'm sure it could fix you up for the rest of your lives.

[Paul1Perth]

Haha! As if people over the age of 45 are somehow better with money! The amount of people approaching retirement that my partner (financial planner) sees with completely inadequate savings...

 

Realistically there will always be tough decisions with money:

Would my kids be better off living in a nicer area, or should I spend money sending them to a better school instead?

Should I buy a property with only a 10% deposit, which will wipe out my savings?

Can I afford to visit my first grandkid abroad this year, or should I wait and miss out on his first two years of life?

 

So what if people gamble their savings on a different life abroad? Their money, their choice. It doesn't mean they're incompetent with saving by any means.

 

But at least they have savings. The way the last couple of generations are behaving a lot will get to retirement age and have the same mortgage they had when they started (should they ever be able to afford their own home) as they have been paying interest only, have a debt to several credit card companies and then rely on the government to bail them out in their old age.

[robfromdublin]

You're hopelessly wrong if you think that lack of money sense is a generational thing.

 

Besides, it is widely acknowledged that baby boomers had it easier financially than any other generation before or since. As that generation reaches retirement, the tax burden on those of us working will increase massively, because most of them will need to "rely on the government to bail them out in their old age".

 

Of course, it's much easier (and lazier) to pretend that young people are just rubbish with money for some reason. When the reality is that to live the life the previous generation did (buy a house and a car, have one holiday a year), costs much more now than it was 30 years ago (after adjusting for inflation, obviously). Even migrating to Australia was cheaper and easier back then (ten pound poms anyone?)!

 

Some interesting reading for you from a respected journal:

http://www.economist.com/node/21563725

[HayleyC]

Of we went home we'd have nothing and spent all our savings. We always say we will stick it out two years even if we hated it and have a think about what to do after that, we've nearly made it to a year it's been hard at times but doing ok!!

[Skani]

Besides, it is widely acknowledged that baby boomers had it easier financially than any other generation before or since. As that generation reaches retirement, the tax burden on those of us working will increase massively, because most of them will need to "rely on the government to bail them out in their old age".

 

 

As a baby boomer I know that the "easier financially" thing is garbage. Most things for most people were more difficult financially. The difference was that expectations were so much less. I note that the article you refer to is from an American journal. The economics and politics were/are very different to Australia.

 

PS: Judging by the rate at which my baby boomer friends and relatives are dying off, you won't have to expend any money in keeping us alive.

[Paul1Perth]

You're hopelessly wrong if you think that lack of money sense is a generational thing.

 

Besides, it is widely acknowledged that baby boomers had it easier financially than any other generation before or since. As that generation reaches retirement, the tax burden on those of us working will increase massively, because most of them will need to "rely on the government to bail them out in their old age".

 

Of course, it's much easier (and lazier) to pretend that young people are just rubbish with money for some reason. When the reality is that to live the life the previous generation did (buy a house and a car, have one holiday a year), costs much more now than it was 30 years ago (after adjusting for inflation, obviously). Even migrating to Australia was cheaper and easier back then (ten pound poms anyone?)!

 

Some interesting reading for you from a respected journal:

http://www.economist.com/node/21563725

 

The previous generation, baby boomers if you like, probably had a house and a car and paid for it. I agree we probably had it better (baby boomer myself) than any generation before. What we didn't have was credit card bills, mobile phone bills, internet access bills that seem to be part of everyday life and a necessity now and are often paid for by parents for a long time. We had to pay for things when we got them in cash and that gave us lessons in how to manage money.

 

Generations since the introduction of easy credit have moved from saving up for something, like a car and paying cash for it, like I had to, to just taking out a loan at an early age and paying for it over a number of years. What I see here a lot is parents stumping up for a car for their kids as soon as they can drive, they don't even pay for it themselves on most occasions.

 

My parents didn't have a car, I was the first in our family to drive and have one. I used to take my Dad out on driving lessons when he was in his 50's, he never really got the hang of it.

 

Since easy credit has come along people don't save up any more for anything, just whack it on the card, it will be OK, everyone else does it. I've actually heard that from my nieces when they were here on holiday, both of them at Uni, both had cars, laptops, mobiles, massive loans and were out spending money on clothes here like there was no tomorrow. We got chatting about being at uni and comparing it to when I was there in the early 80's ( I went back as a mature student). I got a full grant and had a car from being about 17. When I went to Uni I had been in work about 15 years and had a fair bit of saving. I was driving a Lotus Cortina at the time. At the end of the second year I ran out of cash, took the car home and used public transport. Thought that was the only thing to do because of how I had been brought up. Definitely didn't think just take out a massive loan and carry on running the car and spending, assuming that "everything will be OK". Living within my means was the order of the day.

 

Getting back to the chat with my nieces, I was amazed when they told me how much they already owed and what massive loans they already had. When I questioned them about what they were spending (one of them had bought a pair of pink designer ugg boots for about $150) and weren't they worried I just got strange looks and the "why should we, everyone else does it".

 

So I do think the lack of money sense is a generational thing. If you had asked me how much I had as a 25 year old I would have been able to work it out pretty quick. What was in my pocket + what I had in the bank, that was it. If you asked the same of any 25 year old now my guess is they wouldn't have a clue and if they tried to work it out they wouldn't know even how many bills they had to pay in that month. Most of them don't deal in cash any more, everything is automated and bills are just deducted from their accounts (hopefully). If they are anything like my eldest there are a few bank statements sitting unopened in his bedroom, he wouldn't have a clue what he's worth. He's lucky 'cos he's on FIFO, earning good money, so knows he is in the black at least.

 

My nieces on the other hand are still paying back student loans, mortgages, one has 2 kids and another on the way, negative equity in the house and still buzzed off to Las Vegas to get married. Someday it's all going to come home to roost and they are going to get a real shock.

[fourcorners]

Sorry fourcorners I stand corrected. I generalise too much sometimes. Glad to see you have it together, a lot more than I ever did at your age, I always had money in my pocket, good cars, spent loads on booze and holidays the rest I just frittered away (to quote George Best). Always knew I would settle down someday and that would be when I started really having to budget and make a plan. Me and the wife refused to have credit cards whilst we were in the UK, found you can really keep control of income and outgooings that way and only got credit cards when we came to Oz and got an offset mortgage.

 

You have maximised your education and earning potential brilliantly, well done. I still reckon you are in a minority though and it's a pity that a few more don't do as you have. I know not everyone has the chance and opportunity to do what you have done but I'm sure it could fix you up for the rest of your lives.

 

Interestingly, I don't think its down to the parents to instil this in their children. My brother seems to be getting by ok although I have no idea what his finances are really like, then there's my sister who is jobless, decided not to do a degree to do a tattoo apprentice instead, that fell through. She seems to have solved the problem for herself by finding a nice steady boyfriend who seems to pay for everything!

 

I believe we're either born spenders or born savers, it is in our genetic make-up and personality. If you ever see Child of our Time with Prof Robert Winston, it looks into this trait in some depth - even at 4 or 5 years old you can tell which children will be savers and which will be spenders.

 

By I totally agree with you, easy credit is the bane of modern day society. We hate being in any debt whereas others are completely happy and view it is normal.

[robfromdublin]

Skani, whatever about your personal experience (and my commiserations on losing friends and family, it must be a difficult time for you). Boomers did not have to fund the level of the welfare state that our generation will have to in years to come. There were many more of them, so the the specific tax burden was lower. Also, land was cheaper. Property was cheaper. There were many more single income families.

 

The economics of Australia are different, but fundamentally the boomers will live for twenty years after retirement and many will have to rely on welfare to do it. Paying for this is something that boomers were spared in Australia, but the next generation will have to look after the preceding and the following generation during a period of the highest house prices ever seen and the aftermath of a mining boom where no money was saved for the future.

 

Paul, undoubtedly there are many people who have an unhealthy relationship with debt of all ages. It is not a generational thing. Debt is cheaper and easier to access now than it has ever been, which is the main problem. It's funny you give the example of going to uni because I was exactly like you when I went. You cut your coat to suit your cloth. All of my circle of friends have a healthy relationship with debt and are sensible about it. Having said that, I know of people who go into retirement with money owing on their mortgage, which is equally as irresponsible as your nieces seem to be. Sure our personal experiences are different but it's not a sound basis for making generalisations about entire groups of people.

[Guest]

We were what you might call 'affluent' in the UK - not rich as we tended to spend what we earnt but had some money in the bank and some investments. We pretty much used these 'life savings' on our move to Oz - we still have a small house in the UK but any investment value in that was wiped out in the GFC. Part of us using those savings was on building a house in Australia but it is unlikely if we sell we will get back what we put in - we built a home not an investment and prices have been pretty static in the last two years. So whilst we won't move back with 'nothing' we will move back in a considerably worse position than we left, especially once we pay the return shipping costs etc. I am mostly philosophical about it, the GFC could easily have brought us down to this position anyway, I was self-employed and the majority of our family income came from that, towards the end of our time in the UK it was becoming harder to get contracts so it is possible we could have lost our family home and afluent lifestyle anyway, my OH was employed and there was a merger and restructure after we left so he could have been unemployed and whilst we'd have survived that it would have been uncomfortable - my income paid the bills, his paid for the fun! Essentially we have no idea what our life would have been like if we'd stayed and whilst I can't say for us the experience was 'worth' what we spent but I think our future life in the UK will be better as a result, even if it less financially secure so in that sense it was worth it. Money has never really interested me anyway, happiness is more important and Australia has really affirned my belief in that, if they paid me a million bucks I wouldn't stay :biggrin: