tonyman Posted June 19, 2011 Author Share Posted June 19, 2011 thanks girls and guys for all you advice , the groomer is a lovely lady she sent me a 3 page text ...i think she is more worried than us ...she has told me to not blame pepper or ourselves and to give her the same amount of love and hugs...she is the first dog she has not been able to do , she blames herself , she is going to think about what she needs as pepper is an exception to all the rules ......ive trimmed her face tonight and i will groom her tmoz ...... and she doesnt flinch too much with me , she has never growled at me ........the only thing that will bother me is the nail clipping .....im not too confident with that any advice ...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Yuills Posted June 19, 2011 Share Posted June 19, 2011 Nick....you can buy powder to put on nails if you go too short....it helps to curb the bleeding.....it is hard to describe where to cut without showing you. Vets will cut nails....muzzle her maybe and take her and ask them to show you this time so you can do it in future. That is what I had to do with one of my dogs back in the UK. Good luck Suex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest37336 Posted June 19, 2011 Share Posted June 19, 2011 thanks girls and guys for all you advice , the groomer is a lovely lady she sent me a 3 page text ...i think she is more worried than us ...she has told me to not blame pepper or ourselves and to give her the same amount of love and hugs...she is the first dog she has not been able to do , she blames herself , she is going to think about what she needs as pepper is an exception to all the rules ......ive trimmed her face tonight and i will groom her tmoz ...... and she doesnt flinch too much with me , she has never growled at me ........the only thing that will bother me is the nail clipping .....im not too confident with that any advice ...? Hi Nick. Our smallest dog, a cross corgi/jack russell was left in a squat when 2 months old and took ages to trust anyone. Her nails were abysmal. The only thing we found that helped was to gently stroke her paws over a long period of time, she didn't like it at first, but after many weeks she was confident enough to lets us scratch them and fiddle with them. We slowly introduced the nail clippers, just sitting them in front of her at first, then laying them on her feet, and basically making a game of it. After again several weeks she allowed us to clip the tiniest piece of nail off, but now, though she looks very disgruntled we can clip them fairly easily. It takes time to get the dogs trusty mate, and is at times a long process, but eventually they come around when they realise that it won't hurt and that ultimate emotion, TRUST,:yes:. Cheers Tony.:wink: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyman Posted June 19, 2011 Author Share Posted June 19, 2011 thats exactly what the groomer asked me to do after her first groom , keep stroking her toes/paws and under neath, was she talking about my wife:confused: im going to groom her tmoz with my old clippers , ive done her before put now i know i have to get down to the close bits ........this may sound silly but where she pees , and its a little long ,can i cut that right back ,ie there is nothing hanging out is there , it is all just discoloured hair isnt it ......:confused: i will buy some good dog clippers , they should pay for themselves within a few cuts :yes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petals Posted June 19, 2011 Share Posted June 19, 2011 thats exactly what the groomer asked me to do after her first groom , keep stroking her toes/paws and under neath, was she talking about my wife:confused: im going to groom her tmoz with my old clippers , ive done her before put now i know i have to get down to the close bits ........this may sound silly but where she pees , and its a little long ,can i cut that right back ,ie there is nothing hanging out is there , it is all just discoloured hair isnt it ......:confused: i will buy some good dog clippers , they should pay for themselves within a few cuts :yes: Good luck with that, I decided to do that and bought some very expensive dog clippers which I still have and they were hardly used. You see the dog groomers have a hook from the ceiling, put the dog on a lead and on the hook and table and it immobilise the dog so they can get to those places the dog does not like. I would not give up on a groomer you just have to find the right one. When having a dog groomed I learned the hard way, its so important to get the right groomer because dogs can pick up skin conditions from grooming parlours if they are not top notch. If its hard to get into a groomer then they are the good ones. I used to have to have an ongoing appointment with mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Joker Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 OK - to start off with - dogs that bite CAN be re-educated and rehabilitated. I currently have a dog that is a rescue from an RSPCA pound. She was the typical "scared of her own shadow" dog that had been badly treated. As a result, whenever she got stressed she would bite. After the second event (we didn't see the start of the first one so couldn't be sure what triggered it) we could see we had a problem. What you need to do is identify what triggers the stress and the behaviour of your dog in the lead up to it biting - with a bit of observation you should easily be able to see their behaviour start to change and you need to get them early in the change to prevent it escalating into an attack and remove them from the situation. Being blunt - a lot of dog behavioural problems are due to incorrect treatment of your dog. Now I don't mean beating and abuse but that humans "love the dog too much" and treat them as a human. For smaller dogs in particular, this is what causes them anxiety as they don't know their real position in their "pack" and so try and assert it. If this behaviour is happening when you are not around then I think you have a dog that thinks it is a pack leader. It needs to be put in its place through a bit of focused training. In fact, although I am an experienced dog owner and have trained several, I enlisted the help of a great trainer close to us to help with my dog. The process is long and slow and you really need to understand the triggers. You need to initially avoid the situations that cause the anxiety and do lots and lots of regular obedience training with positive reward and, as Ceasar Milan would say, be calm and assertive so that the dog knows you are in control and it can only do things on your say so. You need to then gradually (and I am talking about over periods of months, not hours, days or weeks) add experiences that might cause stress (noise, exposure to lots of people, dogs etc) and keep the training going in a way that keeps the dog's focus on you and not the source of stress and only reward for the positive behaviour you are after. If you grab the dog and cuddle it after it has just bitten someone then that reinforces that biting - in the context of leading and protecting his pack - is a positive attribute. So should be avoided - but I would NEVER condone beating a dog. So in essence I am saying go to training classes and get good help if you want to keep your dog. Even though I am a dog "lover" (that's dog love not human love) I do support the view from ItCouldBeWorse - unless you are prepared to put in the effort to rehabilitate then the dog has to be put down. You cannot trust it and a law suit is not going to be a happy experience. Oh, and even though my girl is now calm and a confident dog, I still will keep her on a lead and close to me, with a muzzle in my pocket, if we are going into potentially stressful situations. Being a dog owner is a serious responsibility!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petals Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 thanks girls and guys for all you advice , the groomer is a lovely lady she sent me a 3 page text ...i think she is more worried than us ...she has told me to not blame pepper or ourselves and to give her the same amount of love and hugs...she is the first dog she has not been able to do , she blames herself , she is going to think about what she needs as pepper is an exception to all the rules ......ive trimmed her face tonight and i will groom her tmoz ...... and she doesnt flinch too much with me , she has never growled at me ........the only thing that will bother me is the nail clipping .....im not too confident with that any advice ...? I am so pleased for you, its not your fault or the dogs. My dog with attitude was given to me by the vet, one of mine had died and the other was lonely without him. The vet knew and they gave me a little dog that someone was having put down because they were having a baby and she was a bit of a problem. Well she was and we used to laugh every time I went to the vet about the attitude dog. However the people who had her before had not realised she was stone deaf and had not treat her like a deaf dog so that was part of her problem. Once everyone was aware of it things improved and we had to face her. She was the most magic little dog and you would never know she was deaf and we were so sad to lose her at 15. I agree with the previous poster its patience that makes the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest30038 Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 Good Post Joker, and in particular the reference to just how much work it needs to get a dog to realise that it is a subordinate member of a "pack" and not the Alpha male/female. That "re-programming" by the owner can also come undone if the owner reverts to treating the dog as they had previously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyman Posted June 20, 2011 Author Share Posted June 20, 2011 thanks again for all your advice , ive trimmed her today with scissors as i couldnt find the clippers i used on her last time and the other old ones just didnt cut her fur ......and i wasnt going to use my good ones ....she actually looks great , the 3 girls all commented on how good she looks ......the hardest part was trying to trim around her anus and front bum ,she was very twitchy .....i just needed more hands .....Petals like you said, i have a hook on the eves that the lead went on and an old baby changing unit .....so pretty much well set up ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest 47403 Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 thanks again for all your advice , ive trimmed her today with scissors as i couldnt find the clippers i used on her last time and the other old ones just didnt cut her fur ......and i wasnt going to use my good ones ....she actually looks great , the 3 girls all commented on how good she looks ......the hardest part was trying to trim around her anus and front bum ,she was very twitchy .....i just needed more hands .....Petals like you said, i have a hook on the eves that the lead went on and an old baby changing unit .....so pretty much well set up ........ Fancy a career change pal sounds like you have it sussed ad in the local paper away you go :biggrin: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyman Posted June 20, 2011 Author Share Posted June 20, 2011 Fancy a career change pal sounds like you have it sussed ad in the local paper away you go :biggrin: id love to pal , if it payed ...........my wife has just said to me this minute did she go or snarl at me and no she didnt she is territorial , it took a lot of perserverance doing her private regions ........but im sure she will get use to that ...she would not dare bite/turn/go for me ......she knows she has a good thing going with me ......the 2yr old boys toss roll and jump on her and she loves it , she cant wait to play with them .......she does have that giddy time of the day when im with her , she runs ect and i pretend to miss her , but when she catches me , she bites to the temp that i trained her to ......the old owww oww at a certain point and she has stuck to that , otherwise i would not play with her ...but she does love her and my play ........:yes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest51810 Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 Hey, thats me just noticed this thread, not been on in a while! Sorry to hear about your dog tony, im glad that the groomer was nice about it tho, you must feel guilty as it is so helps for the lady to be understanding. My mums dog is the exact same with the groomer and the vets, he HATES the vets and turns into a completely different dog! Im sorry i didnt read all the posts so i might be repeating peoples advice but have you thought of giving the dog a light sedative before grooming? We have tablets over here called Zyklene, they prob have them in australia, maybe under another name? Ive saw them work wonders on some dogs, they dont work for everyone tho. :mad: Im glad that you didnt rush into anything like Pts like some people might of done. If you can find a good dog trainer they can work wonders, in the UK theres a program on the now - Cesar Milans in australia!! Give him a call lol :biggrin: I hope you can solve your problem, stacey x Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petals Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 Reading this thread has made me realise how much I miss my dogs, both of them passed away within months of each other, one fifteen the other thirteen. OH said no more dogs and definitely no more dachshunds, I have had quite a few of those over the years. So now I just have my three cats and would really like another little doggy but that is not going to happen unless I want a divorce :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest51810 Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 You can have my dogs if u want lol ill lend u them for a few months haha :biggrin: Ill be devastated when my dogs pass away, the oldest one is 10, sometimes he acts like a pup and he definitely doesnt look his age then other times he acts like hes 20, ill miss him so much. At least youve got your lovely cats, maybe your husband will change his mind about a dog lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest klezmer Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 Hi guys Partners a vet, bitten a few times, never held it against the dog ..or cat! Worse one I can recall was a police dog which bit her on the arm as she attempted to cover her face. Vet's partner..bitten once or twice..dogs have teeth and no voice..dogs aren't human so don't think human when thinking reaction..they're stressed scared sometimes in pain, unfortunately they react via bites. The guys at the groomers are assumed to be trained to read this behaviour. If not it's not the dogs fault...IT WAS JUST REACTING TO A STRESSFUL SITUATION!! that's all..It wasn't personal. For those who would like to see the dog given 'old bluey!' (PTS)...Oh ok (put to sleep) DON"T KEEP ANIMALS!!! for the owner..groom your own dog or warn the groomers in future....For all....Dogs are wild animals living in your home! They read your behaviour, and react accordingly ...Maybe the groomer is an arse...ask the dog...sorry they cant speak, making this a one sided story!! With the human side coming out on top as usual. Before you start kicking my butt!! I agree some dogs are dangerous...Just not dogs who 'Nip' the groomer!! You don't ban cars because someone has a road accident!! Done OH Rachtev agree's!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawny Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 We had a lovely dog once named Molly, she was as good as gold, A kid rode over her tail and broke it, the boy got off and was very apologetic, However after that, she was terrified of bikes, she would show her teeth and lunge at them, the same with a male voice, she would growl at them, Someone reported us to the rspca saying we had a dangerous dog, One woman and a bloke turned up, She loved the woman, but as soon as the man spoke, she went mad, he said she wasn't dangerous just scared, and take caution when we took her out! Dogs do get scared and they will act on it! x Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MontyClaude Posted June 24, 2011 Share Posted June 24, 2011 Oh your poor dog, that's good that the groomer is okay about it. In fairness she's probably a bit embarrssed too. Have you tried a behaviourist? There's one in my vet and she had a black eye when I was there one day, she was working with a malamute and he headbutted her! She said it was her fault and didn't blame the dog at all. All par for the course I suppose. I have a golden retriever and a Bernense mountain dog. Some people tend to be nervous of my Bernese because she's a pup and can be quite excitable, she was 45 kgs at 9 months! She is the biggest softest coward you would ever meet, we were minding a miniture jack russell recently and she was a nippy little thing. Small dogs tend to be much worse, maybe because we train big dogs not to jump, nip etc but little dogs get away with it. Your poor dog must be nervous. With regards to grooming, does she have to be clipped? Would something like a furminator be any good? Mine both let me groom them and clip their nails, it took a while for my Bernese to come around to that though and she has dew claws so they need to be done. I'm probably going to have to get her clipped right back in OZ due to the heat so fingers crossed I'm not posting the same as you in a couple of months Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest51810 Posted June 29, 2011 Share Posted June 29, 2011 Small dogs tend to be much worse, maybe because we train big dogs not to jump, nip etc but little dogs get away with it. We have two staffies and we get a lot of people who give us dirty looks when we're walking them, grab their children away from them or cross the road. We have a neighbour across the road who has a bichon frise - one of those little cute dogs that look like cotton wool lol she is a a complete terror!! She chases the postman down the street nipping his heels, she chases every dog/person that walks past her house including my two who are completely scared of her! lol Its okay for her to do all this 'cos shes a small dog and all the neighbours find it hilarious ( except us) we did at first but it gets very annoying after once or twice. It annoys me that nothing is done by this but our two dogs are treated like the monsters of the street just because of the way they look and a few bad news articles on tv/paper. Sorry for taking over thread ( bad habit of mine) and ive probably went completely off topic but just had to had a rant! :laugh: Feel better now!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyman Posted June 29, 2011 Author Share Posted June 29, 2011 Oh your poor dog, that's good that the groomer is okay about it. In fairness she's probably a bit embarrssed too. Have you tried a behaviourist? There's one in my vet and she had a black eye when I was there one day, she was working with a malamute and he headbutted her! She said it was her fault and didn't blame the dog at all. All par for the course I suppose. I have a golden retriever and a Bernense mountain dog. Some people tend to be nervous of my Bernese because she's a pup and can be quite excitable, she was 45 kgs at 9 months! She is the biggest softest coward you would ever meet, we were minding a miniture jack russell recently and she was a nippy little thing. Small dogs tend to be much worse, maybe because we train big dogs not to jump, nip etc but little dogs get away with it. Your poor dog must be nervous. With regards to grooming, does she have to be clipped? Would something like a furminator be any good? Mine both let me groom them and clip their nails, it took a while for my Bernese to come around to that though and she has dew claws so they need to be done. I'm probably going to have to get her clipped right back in OZ due to the heat so fingers crossed I'm not posting the same as you in a couple of months I ended up using scissors on her as my old clippers wouldnt get through her thick hair this time ....i will probs invest in some good clipper asap.......what is .....a firminator ..?how often do you do the dew claws ..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MontyClaude Posted June 29, 2011 Share Posted June 29, 2011 I'm not sure if the furminator would be of any use to you, it's more for dogs with undercoats but I use it on the cats too and it's great. It's a bit like a nit comb! It has two sets of teeth and bascially removes loose or dead hair. The amount of hair that comes off mine compared to a normal brush is unbelievable, my retriever looks like he's been clipped after it. I've only done the dew claws once so far, but I was looking at them the other day and they're starting to get a bit long again. I'd be afraid she'd catch them on something and hurt herself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest scottish mum Posted July 2, 2011 Share Posted July 2, 2011 We have a Yorkie Chihuahua males cross and cross is his middle name!! He also tries to nip vets, people that try to pick him up and the dog groomer. I always advise that they muzzle him though he has came to an understanding with the dog groomer now!! She says he is as good as gold for her now and gets clipped minus the muzzle. I don't know what magic wand she used. The last time he had his yearly jabs the vet had to leave the jag hanging from his neck whilst she tried to get a better grip!! Yet he is the sweetest pet at home with us!! Our vet thinks it is small dog syndrome...which I tend to agree with..especially after he stood up to the bully at the dog park. Our little fella only weighs 3kg and had the Chow cross running for it's life!! Anyway sorry getting back to your worry....I think people that work with animals are aware of the risks and I am sure it is actually part of their insurance. Nothing can be done to pepper as the dog groomer was aware of the risks. I would send a box of chocs and bunch of flowers to her from Pepper then find a new groomer and muzzle him. Even just send pepper for a 5 minute visit, muzzle on, quick brush and back out the door before he knows whats going on, then gradually increase the grooming time. You might have a messy dog for a few months but hopefully he will get used to it. Also maybe try Sleeptime we use it on our hyper yorkie. The first time we gave it too her I thought I had killed her!! I stood on her squeeky toy which normally ensures bedlam but she didn't move from her bed. I had to poke her to check was she still with us and she just gave me a mellow lick on the hand and went back for a snooze. This stuff really calms her down for long car trips etc.... so might be worth a try. It is a herbal dog remedy. God I have waffled on.....anyway good luck and hopefully the dog groomer might be glad of a few war wounds to show off :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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