Guest stayer Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 I see a light at the end of the tunnel, just am little bit worried about not keeping to the "low risk high risk" methodology word by DIAC... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RegDwight Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 I see a light at the end of the tunnel, just am little bit worried about not keeping to the "low risk high risk" methodology word by DIAC... What do you mean? Recently, there was document issued to Cat3 applicants close to getting a CO, and it was quite clear that they were going to process all the low risk applicants first. I think the LR/HR thing is silly anyhow and purely political. There's no real reason why someone from a HR country should not be processed at the same time as a LR one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stayer Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 What do you mean? Recently, there was document issued to Cat3 applicants close to getting a CO, and it was quite clear that they were going to process all the low risk applicants first. I think the LR/HR thing is silly anyhow and purely political. There's no real reason why someone from a HR country should not be processed at the same time as a LR one. There is an assumption that LR countries would be processed first even for cat 4 and HR slowly or not at all. Even I believe Australia should have the right chose the priorities based on anything they want (country risk, race, religion), doing it by the LR/HR methodology seems to be the safest for them so the media don't blame them of racism or so, even som will definitelly try. I strongly believe they should start checking employment in nominated occupations. Eved though I think most of accountants, haridressers and IT specialists, who work in carwashes, Coles and petrol stations, come from HR countries, it would be discriminatory to those who were fair and honest. So my suggestion would be not LR/HR but the work experience to be the basis for who to process first, if normal order is not possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RegDwight Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 There is an assumption that LR countries would be processed first even for cat 4 and HR slowly or not at all. Even I believe Australia should have the right chose the priorities based on anything they want (country risk, race, religion), doing it by the LR/HR methodology seems to be the safest for them so the media don't blame them of racism or so, even som will definitelly try. Huh? You are contradicting yourself. It's safe for them, but it suggests that they are paranoid nits. There is no compelling reason why a HR application cannot be glanced at and considered at the same time as an LR application. If further checks are required, then so be it - they can open the next case on their table. By having LR/HR they DO seem like they are discriminating. Racism is a form of discrimination. I strongly believe they should start checking employment in nominated occupations. Eved though I think most of accountants, haridressers and IT specialists, who work in carwashes, Coles and petrol stations, come from HR countries, it would be discriminatory to those who were fair and honest. Most of the individuals working in the above occupations work as such because the current visa which they hold severely prohibits them from gaining meaningful occupations. Fact is, nobody wants to hire someone on a bridging visa or a 485. There is no security for the employing firms who will have to invest time and money training them. So my suggestion would be not LR/HR but the work experience to be the basis for who to process first, if normal order is not possible. That isn't fair at all and not a workable solution, I think. How will they process recent skilled graduates that have no work experience? I think that is what they are doing from July 2011 with the new laws - it will restrict all but a few students who have been able to get additional points or find employment in their field. It's a vicious cycle, no job = no experience and no exp = no job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stayer Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 Huh? You are contradicting yourself. It's safe for them, but it suggests that they are paranoid nits. There is no compelling reason why a HR application cannot be glanced at and considered at the same time as an LR application. If further checks are required, then so be it - they can open the next case on their table. By having LR/HR they DO seem like they are discriminating. Racism is a form of discrimination. Everything is a form of discrimination. If you prefer red apples from green ones, are you a racist? Media brainwashed people that racism is bad but usually those who scream about discrimination are the true racists. However, LR/HR is not based on race and I pointed it out, because there will be attempts to blame goverment for it. LR/HR is purely based on economical and criminal background of a whole country and Australia should have the right to consider who they want to let in based on it. Most of the individuals working in the above occupations work as such because the current visa which they hold severely prohibits them from gaining meaningful occupations. Fact is, nobody wants to hire someone on a bridging visa or a 485. There is no security for the employing firms who will have to invest time and money training them. I used to follow this assumption and found out it is a bad one. Companies care if you have a work permit. And you don't start as a CEOin Macquarie Bank, so this is not a problem. That isn't fair at all and not a workable solution, I think. How will they process recent skilled graduates that have no work experience? I think that is what they are doing from July 2011 with the new laws - it will restrict all but a few students who have been able to get additional points or find employment in their field. They said there will not be any more PR without work experience. I agree. It's a vicious cycle, no job = no experience and no exp = no job. No it is not, only in someones mind. There are options to volunteer for couple of weeks and I know NO ONE who did not get a job after that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RegDwight Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 Everything is a form of discrimination. If you prefer red apples from green ones, are you a racist? Media brainwashed people that racism is bad but usually those who scream about discrimination are the true racists. However, LR/HR is not based on race and I pointed it out, because there will be attempts to blame goverment for it. LR/HR is purely based on economical and criminal background of a whole country and Australia should have the right to consider who they want to let in based on it. Yes, I am not arguing with you. There just wasn't enough clarity in your initial post. However, people are most certainly not apples and I'm suggesting looking at the simplicity of the point: LR/HR makes no difference to a person sifting through cases, does it? If Australia picks and chooses, it's because it has strong relations with European countries, most of its early immigrants being from there and it needs to reciprocate. All diplomatic ties, were you saying it was based on race? I used to follow this assumption and found out it is a bad one. Companies care if you have a work permit. And you don't start as a CEOin Macquarie Bank, so this is not a problem Really, is that the only reason? So, how do you explain your earlier remarks about "professionals" working at Coles? Better phrased, these seemingly very intelligent people, why do they take on menial jobs if they are so highly qualified? I'm confused about which side you are on. No it is not, only in someones mind. There are options to volunteer for couple of weeks and I know NO ONE who did not get a job after that. There is a difference between any job, and the job you are meant to do as determined by your professional training. A person, studying architecture doesn't graduate to work as a cashier at Coles. :wacko: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stayer Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 Yes, I am not arguing with you. There just wasn't enough clarity in your initial post. However, people are most certainly not apples and I'm suggesting looking at the simplicity of the point: LR/HR makes no difference to a person sifting through cases, does it? If Australia picks and chooses, it's because it has strong relations with European countries, most of its early immigrants being from there and it needs to reciprocate. All diplomatic ties, were you saying it was based on race? Diplomatic ties were probalbly based on cultural similarity, not race. Really, is that the only reason? So, how do you explain your earlier remarks about "professionals" working at Coles? Better phrased, these seemingly very intelligent people, why do they take on menial jobs if they are so highly qualified? I'm confused about which side you are on. Such "professionals" work at Coles and in similar jobs because their brother helped them to get the job. It was their choice to accept it. And they were not accepted in normal jobs because of their behaviour. They never adopted local values and ignore everything else but their traditions and religion. That is why they don't get regular jobs. I know people who stopped pushing their values (but did not deny it) and got the job. It is behavioral thing. I don't take sides here. There is a difference between any job, and the job you are meant to do as determined by your professional training. A person, studying architecture doesn't graduate to work as a cashier at Coles. :wacko: Yes you are right. So should not get a PR if he does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RegDwight Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 Diplomatic ties were probalbly based on cultural similarity, not race. Agreed Such "professionals" work at Coles and in similar jobs because their brother helped them to get the job. It was their choice to accept it. And they were not accepted in normal jobs because of their behaviour. They never adopted local values and ignore everything else but their traditions and religion. That is why they don't get regular jobs. I know people who stopped pushing their values (but did not deny it) and got the job. It is behavioral thing. I don't take sides here. I think both one's formal education and experience are both important. However, it isn't to say that one necessarily takes precedence over the other. The problem is that organizations cannot take on a liability. What will they do if the individual in question gets deported after all the investment they have made for him. It will be a terrible loss for them. Works rights are a formality, like ticking a box. Work rights don't give you the job by themselves. My concern is with individuals who are capable and adjusted to the cultural climate as you have validly justified. Even these fine and capable people get skipped over by the HR, deemed unsafe candidates because they possess *bogus* visas. So I'm saying work experience cannot be the only criteria - irrespective of the governments new senseless laws. Are we agreeing on the same thing now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
virtual_bajwa Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 Guys I do not know where do my application stand but one thing I know during last 4 years that nothing is predictable under DIAC. I was asked to upload my medical and PCC way back in 2008. It was expired and then in 2010 again I was asked to submit my medical and PCC again by my agent. And it is expired again. I do not want to know where do my my application stand now... Because I can not believe anything less than decision by DIAC. All other is rumor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RegDwight Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 Guys I do not know where do my application stand but one thing I know during last 4 years that nothing is predictable under DIAC. I was asked to upload my medical and PCC way back in 2008. It was expired and then in 2010 again I was asked to submit my medical and PCC again by my agent. And it is expired again. I do not want to know where do my my application stand now... Because I can not believe anything less than decision by DIAC. All other is rumor. You cannot un-do those things and nobody here can predict your actions - that is left to the scrutiny of your own conscience. The new regulations go some way in clarifying the matter: don't take your medicals and PCC if you are not yet assigned a case officer. I would recommend waiting until you hear from DIAC. Also, there are many people who have had to take there medicals at least twice. I took mine last year and it will expire in April - I doubt DIAC will look at my application by then. So I will spend nearly $1000 on this issue alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
virtual_bajwa Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 You cannot un-do those things and nobody here can predict your actions - that is left to the scrutiny of your own conscience. The new regulations go some way in clarifying the matter: don't take your medicals and PCC if you are not yet assigned a case officer. I would recommend waiting until you hear from DIAC. Also, there are many people who have had to take there medicals at least twice. I took mine last year and it will expire in April - I doubt DIAC will look at my application by then. So I will spend nearly $1000 on this issue alone. Hey Reg, I do not understand the motive behind holding the file for 4 years in the backlog without processing. Once It was asked by DIAC to submit the Medical and PCC but still waiting... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RegDwight Posted February 12, 2011 Share Posted February 12, 2011 Hey Reg,I do not understand the motive behind holding the file for 4 years in the backlog without processing. Once It was asked by DIAC to submit the Medical and PCC but still waiting... Well, if they specifically asked you and then did nothing about it - I'm sorry, I don't know. Are you an offshore applicant? In 2007, they applied the cap and 'kill' regulation to many offshore applications. Some confusion might have occurred with your file. I don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
User Name Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 I used to follow this assumption and found out it is a bad one. Companies care if you have a work permit. And you don't start as a CEOin Macquarie Bank, so this is not a problem. Wrong. Lot of them require PR especially those that have dealings with government. No it is not, only in someones mind. There are options to volunteer for couple of weeks and I know NO ONE who did not get a job after that. People who don't work in their nominated field fall in 2 different categories: 1) They studied cheap courses just to get PR. They never had the intention to work in their nominated field. Majority (not all but most) are HR applicants that did cookery/hairdressing. 2) Those that went to uni, had a degree but struggled heavily to find work. I myself got knocked back by employers countless times after graduating simply because I don't have "PR". Back then I thought I was the only one but looking around now there are countless international student grads in same boat. Government jobs are out of question, banks wont hire you. Others like Accenture and IBM wont consider you either. So if you are refering to group (2) then you are extremely wrong. People don't work in places like coles/woolies because they love the job, because people need to make a living. They better than those Aussie bums living of dole who (in my opinion) should be forced to do these jobs instead. Just because you got a job easily doesn't mean everyone falls in that category. As for volunteering, I know scores that did professional year and still couldn't land in jobs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RegDwight Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 Wrong. Lot of them require PR especially those that have dealings with government. People who don't work in their nominated field fall in 2 different categories: 1) They studied cheap courses just to get PR. They never had the intention to work in their nominated field. Majority (not all but most) are HR applicants that did cookery/hairdressing. 2) Those that went to uni, had a degree but struggled heavily to find work. I myself got knocked by countless times after graduating simply because I don't have "PR". Back then I thought I was the only one but looking around now there are countless international student grads in same boat. Government jobs are out of question, banks wont hire you. Others like Accenture and IBM wont consider you either. So if you are refering to group (2) then you are extremely wrong. People don't work in places like coles/woolies because they love the job, because people need to make a living. They better than those Aussie bums living of dole who (in my opinion) should be forced to do these jobs instead. Just because you got a job easily doesn't mean everyone falls in that category. As for volunteering, I know scores that did professional year and still couldn't land in jobs. Agreed. Recently, I came across an article in The Age about how Australia's Cabbie industry is doing it tough. I was rather outraged by the tongue in cheek assertion by the journalist that somehow the industry must depend on poor international students to service its cabs. What a ridiculous assumption, many of us who came to this country to study were chosen selectively, we are on scholarships and are the cream of the crop and yet we find ourselves in this despicable position where we have to take menial jobs to survive. We are relegated to the bottom of the HR heap, probably only one level higher than the bloodsuckers who survive on Centrelink and who are more than capable of working as cleaners, cabbies and porters. Perhaps the Howard government should have kept a tight lid on student visa allocations and then we would not find ourselves in this precarious situation. I for one am a reasonably competent individual, but our image having been tarnished by the opportunists from the subcontinent, I struggled to find work and gave up. Now, I would like to leave this dump and am unable to follow even that course of action. I'm all for peace and love and have no trouble integrating. I do quite well actually but it just means that I have to work that much harder to convince people of my capacity. What a long rant...how did this even start. Sigh....:no: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SusieOR Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 I'm am sorry but Cat 4 has not got a cat in hells chance! Sorry for the pun! I think the best decision is to try to look at other options open to you, or other states where you are on the smp. That is what we have had to do and basically start over which is a huge pain in the behind. I was told 2-4 years, by which time we would have been capped so that timeframe set by the DIAC is unreachable anyway! Hey Rach... I see from your timeline, they have declined your Vic SS??? What happened & what will you do now??? We have now applied to Vic for SS after moving down to Cat4 after WA no longer want us... Susie x Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Rennolds Posted February 13, 2011 Author Share Posted February 13, 2011 Hey Rach... I see from your timeline, they have declined your Vic SS??? What happened & what will you do now??? We have now applied to Vic for SS after moving down to Cat4 after WA no longer want us... Susie x Hi Susie & Rach We are considering applying for sponsorship from another state that does want my job on their smp. Can the application be moved sidewards by DIAC if sponsorship obtained or does it involve new application? I only ask as my age would now not get the required points to obtain visa if had to apply again. Thanks Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jobo Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 Hi Susie & Rach We are considering applying for sponsorship from another state that does want my job on their smp. Can the application be moved sidewards by DIAC if sponsorship obtained or does it involve new application? I only ask as my age would now not get the required points to obtain visa if had to apply again. Thanks Mark Hi there Mark As you applied for your original visa before July 2010 then you shoud be able to swap without making a new application or incurring costs. we swapped from family to SS once we got the SS and it was very straight forward....and we got the visa within a month of becoming a cat 2!! go for it and apply to a state where your skills are in demand just remember that you will need to live and work in that state for 2 years when you arrive...but better 2 years in the unknown that 2 years stuck in Cat 4. oh and be careful about applying to more than one other state if your skills are on more than one...some states don't like multiple state applicants as it doesn't show committment. good luck Jo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SusieOR Posted February 13, 2011 Share Posted February 13, 2011 Hi Susie & Rach We are considering applying for sponsorship from another state that does want my job on their smp. Can the application be moved sidewards by DIAC if sponsorship obtained or does it involve new application? I only ask as my age would now not get the required points to obtain visa if had to apply again. Thanks Mark Just wanted to agree with Jobo... as long as you applied before Jul 10 it can be moved over!!! Sx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
virtual_bajwa Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 Well, if they specifically asked you and then did nothing about it - I'm sorry, I don't know. Are you an offshore applicant? In 2007, they applied the cap and 'kill' regulation to many offshore applications. Some confusion might have occurred with your file. I don't know. Well, There is no possibility of any confusion on the application. They allocate case officer to my application, asked for medical and PCC, did job verification. Yes they have applied cap and cease on Pre September 2007 application but on some named visas like 136,138 and 137 . They are totally silent about 496 and 495. And one more thing there are 4 t 5 more applicants under this visa applications whom I know.There might be more.... Visa subclasses affected by the Minister’s determination under section 39 of the Migration Act 1958 (the Act) The following visa subclasses are affected by the Minister’s determination: ? Skill Matching (subclass 134) ? Skilled – Independent (subclass 136) ? Skilled – State/Territory-Nominated Independent (subclass 137) ? Skilled – Australian Sponsored (subclass 138) ? Skilled – Designated Area Sponsored (subclass 139). Here is the detail of message on the website... http://www.immi.gov.au/skilled/general-skilled-migration/pdf/vac-repay.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Rennolds Posted February 14, 2011 Author Share Posted February 14, 2011 Just wanted to agree with Jobo... as long as you applied before Jul 10 it can be moved over!!! Sx Hi Susie & Jo Great news & really good to see you are both going to get what you want!! We have found 1 state that have my occupation on their SMP. Will have to get our research done again & get that sponsorship sorted. Thanks for replying - feel much better we can move application over. Feel much happier again now that we can this back into our own hands!! :biggrin: Cheers Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mikewheble Posted February 14, 2011 Share Posted February 14, 2011 Hi all, I'm Cat 4 with off list WA SS. I applied for my visa as a Sales & Marketing Manager in Nov 2009. I have now got a CO to which, I'm chuffed. Good luck all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Team Rennolds Posted February 15, 2011 Author Share Posted February 15, 2011 Hi all,I'm Cat 4 with off list WA SS. I applied for my visa as a Sales & Marketing Manager in Nov 2009. I have now got a CO to which, I'm chuffed. Good luck all Great news Mike Hope for us all yet!! Feel silly asking, but what does off list mean? Is it anything I can influence with SA, who we applied for around same time as you? Thanks Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest SusieOR Posted February 15, 2011 Share Posted February 15, 2011 Hi all,I'm Cat 4 with off list WA SS. I applied for my visa as a Sales & Marketing Manager in Nov 2009. I have now got a CO to which, I'm chuffed. Good luck all Wow, I think you have shocked us all into silence!!! Congratulations... very good news!!! Well done... Susie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluecatcollectables Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Well done! But I believe you are actuallty Category 2 now, as Marketing Manager is on the State Sponsored List for Western Australia. You have been moved from Category 4 to Category 2 as Marketing Manager now appears on their Skilled Sponsored list. Pl. correct me if I am wrong, but I strongly feel that this is what has happened. Good Luck and Well Done again anyway - And most of all GOOD LUCK TO ALL CATEGORY 4 Applicants. I truely believe that we will be looked at soon. DIAC are sailing through applications now - well done DIAC also for sorting the back-log. Remember we are all qualified applicants who can benefit Australia with our presence there. Blue Cats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHANO7 Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 Well done! But I believe you are actuallty Category 2 now, as Marketing Manager is on the State Sponsored List for Western Australia. You have been moved from Category 4 to Category 2 as Marketing Manager now appears on their Skilled Sponsored list. Pl. correct me if I am wrong, but I strongly feel that this is what has happened. Good Luck and Well Done again anyway - And most of all GOOD LUCK TO ALL CATEGORY 4 Applicants. I truely believe that we will be looked at soon. DIAC are sailing through applications now - well done DIAC also for sorting the back-log. Remember we are all qualified applicants who can benefit Australia with our presence there. Blue Cats. I agree with you Blue Cats. Also as it is a regional sponsor which is Cat 1 I understand. DIAC are getting through them now and it was good to read that CAT 4 MIGHT be lookde at in 2011-2012. Its a shoe in a door that was closed. CAT 4 will be processed in Date order. I think there should be a priority in Cat 4 though so those that had been sponsored by a state to then not appear on their chosen states SMP was scandalous . Good luck all 4ers !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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