SOS not recognising full work experience SOS

[monk]

Just had an email from Brisbane asking if they can drop our points from 70 points to 60 as they are only recognising work experience as 17 months rather than the 7 years the ACS gave us ,they said they realised that our over claiming was done in error and we would have still been invited to apply for our 189 visa in the invitation rounds , should we allow them to drop our points to 60 ? will our visa be granted with the 60 points ? AARRGGGHHH why is it never simple

 

As ever thanks for your help Monk

[Ozmaniac]

Yes, you'll get an invitation with 60 points. It's unlikely to take any longer than 2 or 3 additional weeks. You are VERY fortunate that you got that email. If your EOI had resulted in an invitation with a points overclaim, it would have meant an automatic refusal and loss of your Visa Application Charge.

[monk]

thanks ozmaniac , we are still unclear as to why they have not recognised the years experience the ACS gave us though , should we ask them to clarify or should we just accept the 60 points they say we can claim , will we still be granted our visa on the 60 points ? Any help or insight would be gratefully recieved

[Ozmaniac]

If the email came from DIBP, my view is that you should just accept it and go with the 60 points. I know it would be interesting to know why they won't accept the additional experience but it really won't make much difference to the time it takes to get an invitation unless your occupation is one that is being pro-rated (ICT Business and Systems Analysts and Software and Applications Programmers in your field). Even if it does come under one of those, it still won't make more of a difference than a couple of extra weeks if the latest invitation rounds are anything to go by.

 

I wouldn't be willing to take a chance that if you ask for clarification, something might go wrong and the EOI is allowed to stand with points that won't be accepted. Wait until you lodge your application and have a CO and then ask if you really want to know.

[monk]

Just to clarify the email came from the DIBP , Brisbane , we applied for a 189 visa on the 28th of April with what we thought was 70 points , paid the money , did medicals and police checks etc , our occupation is ict business analyst , they then sent email today informing us we have inadvertently made an error but realise this was a mistake and are asking if they can reduce our points from 70 to 60 points so they can continue to process our application , as they said in the email we would have still been invited to apply in subsequent invitation rounds . Our worry is we will not be granted a visa with the offered 60 points therefore should we withdraw our application and try and get our money back ?

Any thoughts gratefully received

 

Monk

[Alnaibii]

It's not the first case of this sort I've heard of. If they said you would have been invited anyway, there's no need to worry. Dropping the points to 60 will not be cause for refusal. If they considered you should be denied, they wouldn't have bothered to send the email.

Anyway, the other two cases I've heard of were granted eventually.

[monk]

Thank you Alnaibii , that's how we read the email ,if it was a straight refusal why would they ask us to drop to 60 points ? the exact words are " I have reviewed your claims on which your invitation score was based.I am satisfied that you made an inadvertent error when entering your details in skillselect .

I find that your invitation score is actually 60 points .

I note that this invitation score of 60 would still have led to an invitation being issued in subsequent invitation rounds since you apllied .

I am therefore seeking your permission to correct the score to reflect the actual score of 60."

Any idea if we go down to the 60 points how long or even if a visa will be granted ?

 

As ever M.

 

We are staying up late tonight and phoning the gsm case officer on the number included in the email

[lebourvellec]

I would say from what I have seen from others who have over claimed points When DIBP are going to refuse they given you notice to refuse or giving you the chance to withdraw for over claiming, not asked to lower the score to then continue processing your application.

 

Personally I think you are ok but speaking to a registered migration agent will be better than DIBP.

[Pumpkin]

Just to clarify the email came from the DIBP , Brisbane , we applied for a 189 visa on the 28th of April with what we thought was 70 points , paid the money , did medicals and police checks etc , our occupation is ict business analyst , they then sent email today informing us we have inadvertently made an error but realise this was a mistake and are asking if they can reduce our points from 70 to 60 points so they can continue to process our application , as they said in the email we would have still been invited to apply in subsequent invitation rounds . Our worry is we will not be granted a visa with the offered 60 points therefore should we withdraw our application and try and get our money back ?

Any thoughts gratefully received

 

Monk

 

Wow. That is actually very unusual, DIBP must have grown a heart, I have never heard of that before. You are very fortunate not to have received a refusal in my opinion. But sounds like you are going to be ok. Please let is know.

[monk]

thanks guys for your advice and support , the last part of the email reads " I have provisionally assessed your points score as 60 . Subject to your agreement to correct the score to reflect your actual invitation score,I will then consider your assessed points test score against the actual invitation score ."

Is this still a positive or are we just clutching at straws ?

[Pumpkin]

thanks guys for your advice and support , the last part of the email reads " I have provisionally assessed your points score as 60 . Subject to your agreement to correct the score to reflect your actual invitation score,I will then consider your assessed points test score against the actual invitation score ."

Is this still a positive or are we just clutching at straws ?

 

Maybe post up the whole message together. Because that last bit doesn't read quite so positively does it, it sounds like they want to assess your points as 60, compare it to you invitation score of 70 and then look a difference means a visa refusal. But then the first bit didn't sound too bad. Me, I would be worried and thinking about getting an agent to help you through this, that is because it was always my understanding that over claiming points is a refusal.

[Raul Senise]

[189.214] (1) The applicant’s score, when assessed in relation to the visa under Subdivision B of Division 3 of Part 2 of the Act, is not less than the score stated in the invitation to apply for the visa.

[MaggieMay24]

You only need 60 points to qualify for the visa, so dropping the points will have no affect on that. The points would typically only affect when you would be invited. From everything I've read on the forums, you should be incredibly thankful they have said they will simply drop your claimed points as the normal approach is they simply refuse the visa due to over-claiming. I'd very quickly send a "thank you for catching our claiming error, and yes please drop the claimed points to 60" message back to DIBP.

[monk]

VISA JUST BEEN GRANTED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We phoned Oz and spoke to a wonderful lady who told us they realised that we had made a genuine mistake and if we dropped to 60 points she could complete our visa application .

 

Poms in Oz thank you all

[Ozmaniac]

I didn't realise that you had already lodged and paid for the visa application - I assumed you were still at the EOI stage so the email is even more surprising. According to a post on PIO from Alan Collett (Go Matilda) who is a highly respected RMA, overclaiming points should have resulted in an automatic refusal of the application. He wrote:

 

"I don't recall seeing this discussed on the forum to date, but those who have or who are lodging an EoI should be aware of the following provision in the recently published migration regulations:

 

The applicant’s score, when assessed in relation to the visa under Subdivision B of Division 3 of Part 2 of the Act, is not less than the score stated in the invitation to apply for the visa.

The score stated in the invitation to apply for the visa will be based on the EoI - so if it subsequently transpires upon the submission of documentation and assessment by the DIAC case officer that the points claimed in the EoI were too high the visa application must be refused, whether or not the actual points are 60 or more."

http://www.pomsinoz.com/forum/migration-issues/156621-overclaiming-eoi-instant-application-refusal.html

 

I see what they're written as very positive and in any case, one thing's for sure; if you decide to go ahead with the 70 point claim, your application is almost certainly doomed.

 

It seems to me that you've been given a free "get out of gaol card" and IMO, you should grab it with both hands before your CO changes their mind (or someone else takes over your case).

 

EDIT:

I didn't see your post saying that you had the visa wasn't there when I originally wrote this. CONGRATULATIONS - as someone else said, looks like DIBP have actually grown a heart.

[Pumpkin]

VISA JUST BEEN GRANTED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We phoned Oz and spoke to a wonderful lady who told us they realised that we had made a genuine mistake and if we dropped to 60 points she could complete our visa application .

 

Poms in Oz thank you all

 

Great news. You have been incredibly fortunate, people have been declined for same thing. It is actually really interesting that this has happened as maybe indicates a change in policy / practice.

[Adam Grey]

Great news. You have been incredibly fortunate, people have been declined for same thing. It is actually really interesting that this has happened as maybe indicates a change in policy / practice.

 

No, there has been no change. *Edit - incorrect, see below*

 

I wonder if a lot is being misinterpreted here. Monk, what score was your original EOI invited under? If it was 60 and then you inadvertently over claimed 70 points on the visa application, this can be amended.

 

If you were originally invited at 70 points, then claimed 70 points on the visa application and now they're assessing you at 60 points, this cannot be amended and would be refused. *Edit - incorrect, see below*

[Raul Senise]

I agree with Pumpkin, that you have been fortunate as Policy states, and I quote: “Assessed score must be at least equal to score at invitation”.

 

However, there has been a recent addition to Policy which does allow some discretion to case officers in cases where persons have made inadvertent errors when entering data in SkillSelect.

 

It looks like this very recent change to Policy has saved your application.

[Adam Grey]

I agree with Pumpkin, that you have been fortunate as Policy states, and I quote: “Assessed score must be at least equal to score at invitation”.

 

However, there has been a recent addition to Policy which does allow some discretion to case officers in cases where persons have made inadvertent errors when entering data in SkillSelect.

 

It looks like this very recent change to Policy has saved your application.

 

Do you have the PAM3 number for this policy change Raul? I haven't seen or had notice of any such change, and that's a huge change for them to sneak in without notice.

[Raul Senise]

Do you have the PAM3 number for this policy change Raul? I haven't seen or had notice of any such change, and that's a huge change for them to sneak in without notice.

 

It has been added at PAMS 7.2 Assessed score must be at least equal to score at invitation Criterion:

 

They have inserted another section titled: Errors in entering EoI information

 

Although this Policy is in direct contradiction of the Regulations 189.214 (1) and (2), it appears from this post at least, that it is being followed.

 

Very risky though and I would not rely upon it.

[Adam Grey]

It has been added at PAMS 7.2 Assessed score must be at least equal to score at invitation Criterion:

 

They have inserted another section titled: Errors in entering EoI information

 

Although this Policy is in direct contradiction of the Regulations 189.214 (1) and (2), it appears from this post at least, that it is being followed.

 

Very risky though and I would not rely upon it.

 

Cheers Raul, I'll check it out later. I'm surprised this hasn't been picked up and challenged yet.

 

I agree it sounds extremely risky, it's also a ridiculous change. The regulation is rightfully there to stop deliberate over-claiming on the EOI and receiving the invite ahead of someone with a genuinely higher score. What's stopping someone deliberately over-claiming and then simply saying they made an error after they've been invited? Giving case officers the discretion to decide whether or not to enforce this regulation if they believe an error is genuine opens up a can of worms. If we see a situation like last year where certain occupations had pro-rata invitations at EOI scores of 70-75 it's going to be interesting to see if they still think this is a good idea.

 

*Edit - Having now read the policy change I can now see that it can only be amended to a score that would have originally resulted in an invitation, so it wouldn't allow anyone to jump ahead of another applicant in the example above. Still think it's a bad idea/change, they've taken something that was very clear and completely muddied the water with this change*

[Usman]

Dear Adam Grey,

 

I do not think anyone can jump ahead in this process. Since DIAC will allow to change your points ONLY IF your new score (lesser score) is equal or greater to the EOI scores in subsequent rounds.

[Teezee]

Its a positive, I suppose the letter is not coming directly from DIBP but from the State/Territory wishing to nominate you state sponsorship. Their letters are usually issued on behalf of the DIBP as they handle the state nominations

[Wooba]

It would seem to me that the govt. approved agency doing the assessment made the error. The application was done in good faith based on that information. I don't see that as a mistake on the EOI, that's the agencies fault and it's only right that the "error" be waived as it's in no way your fault.