So the mass immigration never really happened.

[Paul1Perth]

They have no way of tracking it, many have been already there for ages anyway. there are now massive numbers of eastern European people in the UK, some towns have many polish and eastern shops lining the streets. lots of social problems occurring surrounding domestic violence and similar issues. never believe the news.

 

In 5 years when the numbers have broken the NHS it will definitely be back in the news again

 

Been away too long to have any knowledge of how the Eastern Europen influx has affected the UK dusty.

[Guest Andy]

They have no way of tracking it, many have been already there for ages anyway. there are now massive numbers of eastern European people in the UK, some towns have many polish and eastern shops lining the streets. lots of social problems occurring surrounding domestic violence and similar issues. never believe the news.

 

In 5 years when the numbers have broken the NHS it will definitely be back in the news again

 

The NHS is already broken.

[Guest]

"UKIP politicians suggested 29million Romanians (and Bulgarians) will invade the British shores"

 

Some people need some listening comprehension. UKIP say that they have the right to come to Britain, I have never seen anywhere where they have said that every single Romanian and Bulgarian will move to the UK.

 

That's a big difference

[bunbury61]

"UKIP politicians suggested 29million Romanians (and Bulgarians) will invade the British shores"

 

Some people need some listening comprehension. UKIP say that they have the right to come to Britain, I have never seen anywhere where they have said that every single Romanian and Bulgarian will move to the UK.

 

That's a big difference[/quote

 

 

SPOT ON ......we have had a few months of all the media attempting to de rail UKIP ......right or wrong , this is a quarter of the population speaking up

 

in relation to Bulgarians and Rumanians ....23,000 in 12 months is hardly a trickle is it .

 

Sorry to labour a point ....but the school places ...housing .....and NHS costs are coming from where exactly ?

[mickyb]

One of the people who compiled the report/study said it might not be entirely accurate though Mick,because of the fact that older immigrants might be more likely to be on benefits/pension etc,so this might include West Indians,Indians or Pakistanis etc,who came here in the 50's and 60's,much earlier than recent "younger" EU migrants,who are less likely to need the health service or be on UK a pension,so i think it's difficult to compare recent EU arrivals financial input to older immigrants from outside The EEA tbh

exactly mate , so to claim that we should welcome EU arrivals because they're good for the economy isn't entirely true as no one seems to know who's costing what . To make claims that non whites cost us more or Brits cost more doesn't take every thing , pensions , NHS ect into consideration .

as for new arrivals propping up pensions that's the worse kind of pyramid trading possible . All the new arrivals now will be taking out

In the future . The only way to stop it is a retirement age of 90 or compulsory private pensions that feed the traders and big banking bonuses .

[pablo]

True pabs but they are slowly getting bigger. Especially where the Indian, Pakistani and Bangladeshi communities are. When we moved from near Hyde in Cheshire the town had quite a few living in the loads of terraced houses there. We went back last year and what was once a nice market with family run businesses, owned for generations, has now been taken over. The Market Hall is still there and the FIL says a multi million pound grant was provided by the EU to tidy the outside market stalls up. They've taken down all the wooden ones that could be removed and put up steel fixed ones.

 

The major difference is though what used to be fruit and veg, deli stalls with local produce are now run by non-locals selling the same old crap, cheap clothes. My wife went thinking it would be like it was when we used to live there and came back really disappointed. Glad we moved when we did.

 

Markets and village shopping centre's should try and ensure its a decent mix of traditional stalls and newer traders,i like those French/German type markets tbh mate,the new and older type traders and shops should be able to exist alongside each other,without one or the other being excluded.

I know my local market checks that there is x amount of food,vegetable and clothes stores etc,if there is already x amount of food stalls(for instance),they wont let you open one,i've spoken to some of the traders about it,because i was thinking of having a go

[pablo]

exactly mate , so to claim that we should welcome EU arrivals because they're good for the economy isn't entirely true as no one seems to know who's costing what . To make claims that non whites cost us more or Brits cost more doesn't take every thing , pensions , NHS ect into consideration .

as for new arrivals propping up pensions that's the worse kind of pyramid trading possible . All the new arrivals now will be taking out

In the future . The only way to stop it is a retirement age of 90 or compulsory private pensions that feed the traders and big banking bonuses .

 

I couldn't honestly say for "fact" that EU migrants benefit the economy mate,a fair bit i've read said they do though,then other things i read say they aren't,it's hard to quantify exactly i suppose

I just think migration growth is inevitable the world over,that more borders will cease to exist eventually,or just be cursory checks,i don't think the UK will be any different,so i don't get too worked up about it tbh.

I get what you're saying about pension age having to rise,"but",if there was a "concerted" and "genuine" attempt by the gvnmt to at least attempt to clamp down on tax avoidance schemes/loop holes in the tax system,and claw back even just 20/30% of lost revenue,then i'm not so sure pension age would have to rise,but i wont hold my breath on that Mick

[paulv]

"UKIP politicians suggested 29million Romanians (and Bulgarians) will invade the British shores"

 

Some people need some listening comprehension. UKIP say that they have the right to come to Britain, I have never seen anywhere where they have said that every single Romanian and Bulgarian will move to the UK.

 

That's a big difference

 

 

They know exactly what they were doing. Given that the UK working population is only 30 million, this is scaremongering of the very worst kind.

[paulv]

"UKIP politicians suggested 29million Romanians (and Bulgarians) will invade the British shores"

 

Some people need some listening comprehension. UKIP say that they have the right to come to Britain, I have never seen anywhere where they have said that every single Romanian and Bulgarian will move to the UK.

 

That's a big difference[/quote

 

 

SPOT ON ......we have had a few months of all the media attempting to de rail UKIP ......right or wrong , this is a quarter of the population speaking up

 

in relation to Bulgarians and Rumanians ....23,000 in 12 months is hardly a trickle is it .

 

Sorry to labour a point ....but the school places ...housing .....and NHS costs are coming from where exactly ?

 

from the increase in tax revenue of course

[mickyb]

So the more people come , the better our health and school , roads , infrastructure ect will become ?

[Guest]

They know exactly what they were doing. Given that the UK working population is only 30 million, this is scaremongering of the very worst kind.

 

Yeah but it's factually correct. Or do you think that British people are stupid and think that means every single one will move to the UK and leave nobody left in these 2 countries?

 

Nick Clegg thinks leaving the EU would lose 3 million jobs. What's this based off? Surely that is more scaremongering than saying a fact about population sizes?

[paulv]

So the more people come , the better our health and school , roads , infrastructure ect will become ?

 

With proper planning and investment, yes.

But the government is attempting to run down and outsource the NHS, privatise schooling and turn it into a profit making arm of business, and in the most recent development privatise child protection services so that large multi nationals can make a profit from taking kids into care, or leaving them at home and at risk.

It suits the purposes of the government to run services down so they can then 'prove' that wholesale reform is needed.

No Tories will rely on the NHS or state schools so they don't give a monkeys.

[wakeboard1980]

With proper planning and investment, yes.

But the government is attempting to run down and outsource the NHS, privatise schooling and turn it into a profit making arm of business, and in the most recent development privatise child protection services so that large multi nationals can make a profit from taking kids into care, or leaving them at home and at risk.

It suits the purposes of the government to run services down so they can then 'prove' that wholesale reform is needed.

No Tories will rely on the NHS or state schools so they don't give a monkeys.

 

So before this government got in none of the sectors you mentioned needed a big overhaul?

[paulv]

Yeah but it's factually correct. Or do you think that British people are stupid and think that means every single one will move to the UK and leave nobody left in these 2 countries?

 

Nick Clegg thinks leaving the EU would lose 3 million jobs. What's this based off? Surely that is more scaremongering than saying a fact about population sizes?

 

 

It's factually correct in the same way that it was factually correct that we would be overrun with migrants from these countries come January 1st - ie not correct at all.

[paulv]

So before this government got in none of the sectors you mentioned needed a big overhaul?

 

 

Is is that a question or a supposition?

Any evidence that you have to support this statement is greatly appreciated...

[paulv]

So before this government got in none of the sectors you mentioned needed a big overhaul?

 

 

Since when is something like learning improved by allowing non qualified people to teach?

Would you go to an unqualified dentist for treatment?

Would you send your kids there?

[wakeboard1980]

Is is that a question or a supposition?

Any evidence that you have to support this statement is greatly appreciated...

It's a question.

[Gbye grey sky]

Since when is something like learning improved by allowing non qualified people to teach?

Would you go to an unqualified dentist for treatment?

Would you send your kids there?

 

Not comparable IMO. Parents don't have qualifications to be parents but doesn't mean we cannot help and guide. Private schools use non-qualified as well as qualified teachers so on that basis must provide a worse education than state schools. People can be highly qualified but lack people skills or empathy. Qualifications should be looked at in the round and not regarded as the be all and end all for all professions.

[wakeboard1980]

Since when is something like learning improved by allowing non qualified people to teach?

Would you go to an unqualified dentist for treatment?

Would you send your kids there?

 

No, what's your thoughts on the NHS and child protection services, not saying privatising is he right way, doubt the NHS ever will be totally, but there has been some shocking stories wher people haven't really been held to account.

[Gbye grey sky]

No, what's your thoughts on the NHS and child protection services, not saying privatising is he right way, doubt the NHS ever will be totally, but there has been some shocking stories wher people haven't really been held to account.

 

Many of the problems have arisen because the NHS is more business-orientated now and market forces influence getting stronger. Individual trusts are managed like businesses these days even though they are state-funded. Those in charge of corporations are rarely held to account for failings.

[paulv]

So before this government got in none of the sectors you mentioned needed a big overhaul?

 

 

Every institution can be improved in some way.

[wakeboard1980]

Many of the problems have arisen because the NHS is more business-orientated now and market forces influence getting stronger. Individual trusts are managed like businesses these days even though they are state-funded. Those in charge of corporations are rarely held to account for failings.

 

Too many managers?

i also think the ones that fail get off lightly as well.

[paulv]

No, what's your thoughts on the NHS and child protection services, not saying privatising is he right way, doubt the NHS ever will be totally, but there has been some shocking stories wher people haven't really been held to account.

 

There are some shocking incidents and these should be dealt with accordingly , but bath water and baby spring to mind

[paulv]

Too many managers?

i also think the ones that fail get off lightly as well.

 

A certain govt minister has overseen a couple of hundred million of wasted on the Universal Credit. Is he being held to account?

The rules should be the same for all - hold everyone to account equally by all means.

[Guest]

It's factually correct in the same way that it was factually correct that we would be overrun with migrants from these countries come January 1st - ie not correct at all.

 

Ok so in your world, how many Bulgarians and Romanians have the right to move to the UK?

 

That is not how many will move, but how many have the right?