Bulk billing is dead. Not a good time to be in Australia if you are sick

[Tina2]

I pay my taxes thanks, i think i would be safe to say that we contribute more than we take. And yes you are right we did just have a baby, thanks for remembering. Thinking about your other points, it would be easier if everyone paid their own way, but that wouldn't work would it now, or should it jus be the ones that earn over a certain amount? A couple having a baby and supporting that baby together is what should happen, a couple that split up and then complain about not enough help is a different matter. Especially when one parent is not paying their way and leaving it up to the tax payer.

Do you have a view on that?

Single parents have been begging something to be done about child support payments for years but nothing is done. Why not stop access to the kids if you are behind in payments or late with payments ? In the US your drivers licence is suspended if you dont pay your child support. Self employed are the worse as many get cash in hand. Child support is decided on the ex "declared" taxable income, it should be based on the average wage for there job. Currently there are huge fights in the family court over child support. People with large homes, several cars, overseas holidays, but no money for child support. It is a way of making your ex suffer for not making the marrage work, sadly it is the kids who suffer. So yes on that point i agree with you something drastic needs to be done about child support and yes that would reduce the about center link have to pay out each week.

[wakeboard1980]

Without a shadow of doubt we definitely pay more into the system than we get out. We rarely visit the dr, our children go to an independent school and we obviously take nothing in benefits. Do I begrudge paying? No, of course not, because I happen to believe in society being more important than the individual.

Having a healthy and educated workforce benefits all of us - we have a stronger economy, pay less in benefits and have more tax money coming in.

I also want to do my bit by supporting those, who, through no fault of their own can't work. People who have disabilities, life limiting /changing illnesses and those who care for them.

Yes, absent parents should be hounded and be made to pay for their children, but why should everyone else be penalised for their choices (including the children who have no choice).

Preventative healthcare and early intervention has been shown to benefit not only individuals, but wider society and the economy.

 

I don't begrudge paying either, what I don't like is when families split up and the parents not pay their way. It then falls back on the tax payer. That's the post that I was responding to and then another member questioned paying for the hospital and schooling for our child. Children shouldn't be punished, and I didn't say they should.

Edited May 18, 2014 by wakeboard1980

[wakeboard1980]

Single parents have been begging something to be done about child support payments for years but nothing is done. Why not stop access to the kids if you are behind in payments or late with payments ? In the US your drivers licence is suspended if you dont pay your child support. Self employed are the worse as many get cash in hand. Child support is decided on the ex "declared" taxable income, it should be based on the average wage for there job. Currently there are huge fights in the family court over child support. People with large homes, several cars, overseas holidays, but no money for child support. It is a way of making your ex suffer for not making the marrage work, sadly it is the kids who suffer. So yes on that point i agree with you something drastic needs to be done about child support and yes that would reduce the about center link have to pay out each week.

 

Said it better than me.

[weaver]

I wholeheartedly agree with you on most points Tina, but I have reservations about cutting access to the children as I'm not sure that it would be in the children's interest to do so. I would also be wary about removing the driving license if a car is required for employment. After all if the absent parent loses their income then they will not be able to pay anyway. However I do believe that self-employed should be chased more as it is all to easy to hide income and I agree that no absent parent should be able to live the good life while their children are on the breadline

Edited May 18, 2014 by weaver
typo correction

[Tina2]

Said it better than me.

The other thing that is happening is that the child becomes a way of reducing child support payments. The more you have the child the less you pay. SO, courts are over loaded with fights of who gets what access to the child. Pushed by the mens rights movements judges are leaning more and more to giving dads more access. Now let me make this very clear I have no issue with dads having access to there kids IF they want access because they love the kids and want to spend time with them. Sadly that is not what happens in many cases. Kids are returned, dirty, hungry and stressed begging not to be sent back again, sadly the child has no rights and if mums dont send the child on access they will quickly find themselves in court on contravention of orders. Quite simply child support needs a major overhaul.

[Tina2]

I wholeheartedly agree with you on most points Tina, but I have reservations about cutting access to the children as I'm not sure that it would be in the children's interest to do so. I would also be wary about removing the driving license if a car is required for employment. After all if the absent parent loses their income then they will not be able to pay anyway. However I do believe that self-employed should be chased more as it is all to easy to hide income and I agree that no absent parent should be able to live the good life while their children are on the breadline

I guess i look at how the cops are now targeting drivers who owe huge amounts in unpaid finds, they clamp the car and it stays clamped until the finds are paid, does not seem to take to long for the drivers to pay the outstanding amounts. I see no difference with over due child support. There is public transport, friends and relatives who could drive them to work. Make life difficult and see how quick they can then find the money and maybe this would be enough of a threat to stop them getting behind in there payments.

[weaver]

I take your point

[jasepom]

The Australian people.

 

Why ?

 

Because a) They trusted Abbott's lies and b) They weren't thinking of the future.

 

The stupid reporting during the election was giving Abbott way too much TV time it's like the media wanted him to win, portraying him as a family man, into keeping fit, attractive family, doting daughters pushed in front of camera. Whilst three was poor Kevin Rudd, has been, no friends left in the party. Just totally biased towards liberals helped the win.

[sueandave]

I think maybe he's right , the higher income earners would leave the country and go elsewhere that's what me oh said anyway , he said why should the higher income earners do the heavy lifting when they already pay more than anyone else as it is , I can see it from both sides though don't shout at me haha .

 

Hi Shelleybingobingo

 

You are right they should not do all the heavy lifting, but they should do equal lifting, and this is not happening in this budget. it has been a budget that has hit the lower to middle income earners very hard.:smile:

[Shellybingobingo]

Hi Shelleybingobingo

 

You are right they should not do all the heavy lifting, but they should do equal lifting, and this is not happening in this budget. it has been a budget that has hit the lower to middle income earners very hard.:smile:

 

 

I do sympathise honestly , me and oh have been there when my kids were little except there was no help then I did night shift he did day shift , I stayed up all day with a power nap ready for night shift agen so I do understand , and do feel sorry for some peeps . And also both of us come from low income families when we were kids ourselves so I do get it .

 

Its a bit day ja voo ( carnt spell that lol ) to me what's happening in oz now it's like history reapeating itself to me , but I do get what you saying honestly I do .

 

I suppose we we could all sit here and think it's not fair , I'm guilty too of that but only because ya looking out for ya own family anyone would in the right mind .

 

But this I've seen or very similar over again back home and whoever gets in has a job to do and nobody ever seems happy with the outcome . My oh sympathises too aswel lol , it does make you want take the needy in and feed em yaself but you carnt do everyone . I do think high income people though do pay a massive amount in tax , .

 

my sister in uk her oh and her earns a decent salary each but didn't hit the high tax bracket , when one person hits the high tax bracket because they are the sole earner it didn't seem fair to me that we hit it but there's equated to the same but split between em so didn't hit it if that makes sense lol . Anyway I do sympathise and nothing's fair in life I don't suppose .:biggrin:

[sueandave]

Hi Shelleybingo

 

Like you we have done the hard yaks paid the high tax, never a day unemployed, or family allowance here but I would find it hard to except this as the genuine needy are not asking for a hand out, just fairness remembering England in by gone days, the 3 class system, I would hate to see it here by not giving a fair go to lower paid workers, I do not want that history to repeat itself here. I am not a low paid worker but I can totally sympathise with the outcry this has caused. Equal treatment as I said previously and you would not have had the backlash that this budget has created. Thousands of people protesting, look at their placards about education & health think of your grandchildren needing a decent education and good hospitals, the treasurer needs to spread the load, I don't think we would have seen this revolt then. People are not silly they know when they are being treated unfairly, If you take away the initiative what else is there, we all came to Oz for a reason, Please Sir Can I have More LOL

[Shellybingobingo]

Hi sueandave , ok I suppose you explain yaself better than me lol , well I go with ya I'm all for fair , I probably sound selfish haha I'm totally not though . I do understand though I would hate to see it here too , I hate to see anyone suffer in any country for that matter . :biggrin:

[Skani]

Yes I understand that, this is after the co - payment the user will pay an extra $7.00

 

The $7 is the co-payment.

[Diane]

I wonder how many turned up as 'rent a crowd'?

 

looks like there were a few discrepancies in crowd numbers, but anyway if there were say 15000 max in each state, take out 'rent a crowd', say half then that doesn't leave many does it? I thought most of the country were up in arms about the budget? Even if only 1/2 the country is, it's a pretty poor turnout for something that apparently is so wrong.

Just my thoughts reading the article you posted and this thread.

 

Then of course if you are subtracting 'rent a crowd' you have to add in those many thousands who would have gone if they could, but couldn't: those in country areas, those with other family commitments etc etc. Look at the polls today. Look at the way the State Premiers have united....

 

Tony Abbott truly is the worst Prime Minister this counbtry has ever had: he, Hockey, Bishop, Payne and Bishop should go. Now.

[Skani]

Yes it is , but I still don't believe there will be nothing at all available wether that be by food vouchers or some other form.

 

So how do you pay for accommodation with a food voucher?

[Harpodom]

Then of course if you are subtracting 'rent a crowd' you have to add in those many thousands who would have gone if they could, but couldn't: those in country areas, those with other family commitments etc etc. Look at the polls today. Look at the way the State Premiers have united....

 

Tony Abbott truly is the worst Prime Minister this counbtry has ever had: he, Hockey, Bishop, Payne and Bishop should go. Now.

Wakeboard has the makings of an LNP spin doctor, to scoff at many thousands up and down the country marching in protest, calling them a 'rent a crowd'.

 

This was 5 DAYS after the budget. These are remarkable times. One good thing about Abbott is that he has stopped the cancer of apathy in Australian politics.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/19/abbott-government-suffers-significant-slump-in-polls

[Shellybingobingo]

So how do you pay for accommodation with a food voucher?

 

 

Hiya skani , I know where you coming from but surely they not going give nothing and see kids homeless , isn't there council houses here , like I say I don't understand the system in oz but , I do know someone in another state here , unfortunately lost there job which is very sad , but they are still on a good thing here , have food vouchers , if they fall behind with rent they get a bit of help with that , they have centre link payments .

 

And nd to top it of are still going through with there house build , probably moved in it now . How does that work .

 

People who do cash in hand jobs are on a good thing I tell you , I don't mean this in a offensive way to anyone but , I have seen a lot in the other state people coming out of work ok theve done there two yrs or whatever and are entitled to whatever but now they claiming they had a bad back and got there notes from uk , claiming some sort of disability here , I am horrified on how they passed the medical and how come no questions have been asked .

 

 

I know also people living a dam good lifestyle here but not paying tax , lots of cash in hand , do I blame em not really lol , what I do get annoyed about is the higher tax earners get slated in a fashion to pay more. they already do pay more than a fair share people in higher professional jobs they carnt get away from it by taking cashies or whatever I'm not bothered what we have to pay , that's the way it is but I do think systems all over the show are unfair . Anyway I have my point and I do see your point too something needs doing to make it fair then , but I did think the vouchers and stuff was a good idea for some who abuse the system . :biggrin:

[sueandave]

Wakeboard has the makings of an LNP spin doctor, to scoff at many thousands up and down the country marching in protest, calling them a 'rent a crowd'.

 

This was 5 DAYS after the budget. These are remarkable times. One good thing about Abbott is that he has stopped the cancer of apathy in Australian politics.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/19/abbott-government-suffers-significant-slump-in-polls

 

 

Todays Polls tell a story, I couldn't help but think that when this budget was announced it seemed to be a divide and conquer, In the media letters to the editor was full of baby boomers against Uni students,

visa versa, Welfare recipients against the workers etc. It was great to see our states come together on education & health.

[Rupert]

Todays Polls tell a story, I couldn't help but think that when this budget was announced it seemed to be a divide and conquer, In the media letters to the editor was full of baby boomers against Uni students,

visa versa, Welfare recipients against the workers etc. It was great to see our states come together on education & health.

 

Divide and conquer? I think the budget has done more to unite. Unite as in nobody is a winner with this budget and everybody has a reason to feel aggrieved. Except for ballerinas maybe. I wonder if he will ever recover from what was a very unintelligent first budget. Pointless and unnecessary alienation of the electorate.

[sueandave]

Divide and conquer? I think the budget has done more to unite. Unite as in nobody is a winner with this budget and everybody has a reason to feel aggrieved. Except for ballerinas maybe. I wonder if he will ever recover from what was a very unintelligent first budget. Pointless and unnecessary alienation of the electorate.

 

Yes no one is a winner but the budget has hit to different degrees sectors of our population, and the people are shouting about this unfairness where most of the lifting is going to be done and comparing.

 

quote Concerns over broken promises and a lack of fairness have been vindicated by an independent analysis of the impact of budget decisions by the Australian National University. It found high income earners can largely escape the so-called "heavy lifting" of fiscal repair, with some well-paid couples worse off by just 0.9 per cent compared to a single parent on payments with a child aged six, who could lose more than 10 per cent of their income.

Voters agree, with nearly two thirds calling it unfair - 63 per cent, compared to 33 per cent who marked it ''fair''.

Edited May 18, 2014 by sueandave
addition

[Parley]

It is interesting though that Labor did not put up any alternative policies in their budget reply with a few to fixing the economy.

 

While they can play populist politics for a while, at some point they need to say how they will fix the mess.

[Xenon4017]

Unite as in nobody is a winner with this budget and everybody has a reason to feel aggrieved.

 

For a budget designed to save more than it spends, doesn't that represent a degree of success? Namely, no one financially benefits rights now because everyone has to contribute something.

 

Obviously we can argue over the relative contributions from each sector (Oh look, we're on page 15; we probably already have).

[Skani]

I pay my taxes thanks, i think i would be safe to say that we contribute more than we take.

Do you have a view on that?

 

So do many other people who later find themselves in unfortunate circumstances.

Life is extraordinarily fickle. It takes only a second and a stroke of bad luck for anyone to be in a position of needing help. None of us is exempt from that possibility. To think otherwise is to live in a fool's paradise.

 

A couple having a baby and supporting that baby together is what should happen,

 

But that's not what happens. That child is being supported care of the taxpayer . If there is an accident or chronic illness that child will receive care from the taxpayer which you couldn't possibly afford if you had to pay for the complete cost.

If the "I should only pay for what I use" principle is applied, then taxpayers without children should have their tax drastically slashed because they shouldn't be paying for any nursery/education/training or maternity/child health costs.

 

Especially when one parent is not paying their way and leaving it up to the tax payer.

 

I agree that a parent should not be allowed to escape their responsibilities. But that is the function of laws/systems which need to be applied effectively.

 

a couple that split up and then complain about not enough help is a different matter

 

So what would happen if your partner developed a drug, alcohol, gambling habit which you found intoleratle to live with, or died, and you were left to bring up 2 young children on your own? You have to leave your job and exist on a single supporting parent benefit or the children go into full time day care - both supported by other taxpayers.

 

Social welfare taxes are just like a giant insurance policy. You pay your premiums and hope you will never have to claim - but it's there in case of an emergency to save you from disaster.

[Xenon4017]

...with some well-paid couples worse off by just 0.9 per cent compared to a single parent on payments with a child aged six, who could lose more than 10 per cent of their income.

 

Talk about picking your stats.

 

The 0.9% increased contribution from "some well-paid couples" (let's not call them "hard working") contributes a greater dollar amount than 10% from the single parent.

 

Now, money is money, so the hospital or school which receives this amount is better off from the high-earners than the low earners. They _are_ doing the heavy lifting. Their increased contribution, in dollar terms, still outweighs that of their low-paid neighbours. Which is fine and fair, so let's give them just a moment of acknowledgement.

[Skani]

they will continue the moaning amongst themselves not even realising that no one is listening.

 

I don't know whether you are planning on returning to Oz but, if you are, you should be moaning too because the cuts to health and education, the increased fees for universities and the slashing of unemployment benefits without any increase in job creation, will make a much more miserable country for your children than the one in which you grew up.