flag of convenience Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 (edited) Also, whilst your written English is good (and i know its only an informal forum here, theres no need to take as much care as you would in a work situation its easy to be casual and sloppy here, so it might not reflect your 'actual' written english) I do think that it's not quite up to the standard I'd expect from a professional HR role. That's just my honest feedback, coming from someone who's had to use a second language before and knows how hard it is to do! You seem to have a few issues with tenses and use of singular/plurals which you might want to look at. Have you had your cv/application forms/ cover letter proofread by a native speaker ? If not it might be worth doing just to make sure that that's not part of the reason you're not getting anywhere . I'm far from convinced their English is not always up to scratch, knowing folk in the area. Not difficult to copy and paste, laziness I suspect for the large part. Edited June 19, 2013 by flag of convenience Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 Its just the Oz economy going southward, lot less jobs. If you arent a citizen then they will always pick you last Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skani Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 I'd just like to add that I think your written English is absolutely fine. I wouldn't worry what a few people on here have said if they gave the impression its not up to scratch. Jeez, you should see some of the stuff written on here by native English speakers! I agree completely with your last sentence. However the OP was asking for advice with respect to employment. HR work often involves much written work of a formal nature and the standard required is high. I spent many years in recruitment and career counselling and that was my initial reaction, based on the limited information we were given. Significantly, Freckleface also had the same response. Without knowing the exact jobs for which the OP has applied, it is impossible to say whether it is a significant issue. However, it may be worth considering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harpodom Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 I agree completely with your last sentence. However the OP was asking for advice with respect to employment. HR work often involves much written work of a formal nature and the standard required is high. I spent many years in recruitment and career counselling and that was my initial reaction, based on the limited information we were given. Significantly, Freckleface also had the same response. Without knowing the exact jobs for which the OP has applied, it is impossible to say whether it is a significant issue. However, it may be worth considering. Whatever Skani. This isn't a job interview is it? The OP wrote a post emotionally driven by sheer frustration at not being able to find a job and support her child. I'm sure she didn't expect to invite an open season on her grammar and spelling, which by PIO standards, is in the top 5-10%. Not bad considering the vast majority are native English speakers, apparently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parley Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 Whatever Skani. This isn't a job interview is it? The OP wrote a post emotionally driven by sheer frustration at not being able to find a job and support her child. I'm sure she didn't expect to invite an open season on her grammar and spelling, which by PIO standards, is in the top 5-10%. Not bad considering the vast majority are native English speakers, apparently. Based on her response, she was happy to get the feedback and I think it is good to receive this sort of feedback. It is a lot better than not being told and being ignorant. Knowledge is power as they say and you can do something about it, or ignore it as you choose. The feedback was fine and I think valid. The current job market does mean that if you are competing against others who may be better with their written or verbal communication, it will be difficult. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harpodom Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 :laugh: Based on her response, she was happy to get the feedback and I think it is good to receive this sort of feedback.It is a lot better than not being told and being ignorant. Knowledge is power as they say and you can do something about it, or ignore it as you choose. The feedback was fine and I think valid. The current job market does mean that if you are competing against others who may be better with their written or verbal communication, it will be difficult. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parley Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 I'm glad I amuse you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizzyTinKnicks Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 Look, OP asked for honest feedback which I think has been constructively provided. I for one said her written English was good but in my opinion wasn't quite up to the standards I'd expect in a professional environment, based on my experience in a professional environment. Sorry if that's annoyed you, but no need to get all pissy on posters who are trying to reassure and provide helpful yet honest advice and suggestions to her to hopefully achieve that elusive job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harpodom Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 Look, OP asked for honest feedback which I think has been constructively provided. I for one said her written English was good but in my opinion wasn't quite up to the standards I'd expect in a professional environment, based on my experience in a professional environment. Sorry if that's annoyed you, but no need to get all pissy on posters who are trying to reassure and provide helpful yet honest advice and suggestions to her to hopefully achieve that elusive job. I've explained myself perfectly clearly. Clearly we don't agree, but that's no reason to get you tin knicks in a twist dear. Sorry OP, I genuinely think your written communication skills on this informal forum are fine. I'm sure they'd be up to scratch in a more formal setting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizzyTinKnicks Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 I don't disagree that her English is fine. But she was asking for ideas about why she wasn't getting anywhere job wise ( apart from the very difficult job market which is completely outside her control) and her 'professional written' English might -not IS, but might - be one of the reasons. Its also a 'reason' she can do something about. I think we are all just trying to help and pretending that something is all perfect when it isn't, doesn't help! OP - again, want to wish you best of luck in your jon search and don't take any of it personally. We're all on your side despite what certain posters might think! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizzyTinKnicks Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 Oh and well done on the pun by the way, must have taken you ages to come up with something so witty yet so patronising Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flybyknight Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 FM, i feel your pain, ive just got back from centerlink as im trying to change trade. they tell me, as ive been here only 8 months im entitled to nothing whilst training. they even suggested i 'go home' so $20,000 on a 176 visa to fix planes sponsored by the state of victoria because they feel they need plane engineers... then just leave us with your money and go home. my words to her.... "how about no!" for me, the temp works drying up, and the permanent positions are requiring further training, lifes a bit sticky atm! in all honesty, i didn't see this coming! i guess i became what i hoped i never would.... sheltered by the forces! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 FM, i feel your pain, ive just got back from centerlink as im trying to change trade. they tell me, as ive been here only 8 months im entitled to nothing whilst training. they even suggested i 'go home' so $20,000 on a 176 visa to fix planes sponsored by the state of victoria because they feel they need plane engineers... then just leave us with your money and go home. my words to her.... "how about no!" for me, the temp works drying up, and the permanent positions are requiring further training, lifes a bit sticky atm! in all honesty, i didn't see this coming! i guess i became what i hoped i never would.... sheltered by the forces! That is attrocious, I would be very tempted to report her - not that it would help your situation! I know many on here disagree and think that migrants are not owed anything but where state sponsorship is concerned in particular I think you are - it is not unreasonable to assume that work will be available. We came over during the time of the Critical Skills List and it destroyed my OH's career. I hope something comes up for you soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Pom Queen Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 I'm not so sure the OP is from the UK? I am wondering if the OP's English is part of the problem. Certainly the written English is not to the standard which would be expected in an HR role. That's why I am curious whether she has had any sort of feedback. I beg to differ, when I write on a forum my English, grammar, punctuation etc is rubbish, I know this as a fact. However, when dealing with business clients etc I take more time. Please don't judge the member by how she posts on the forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simmo Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 I'm not so sure the OP is from the UK? I am wondering if the OP's English is part of the problem. Certainly the written English is not to the standard which would be expected in an HR role. That's why I am curious whether she has had any sort of feedback. Who's "she"? the cats mother? please, a modicum of compassion wouldn't go amiss here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Pom Queen Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 FM, i feel your pain, ive just got back from centerlink as im trying to change trade. they tell me, as ive been here only 8 months im entitled to nothing whilst training. they even suggested i 'go home' so $20,000 on a 176 visa to fix planes sponsored by the state of victoria because they feel they need plane engineers... then just leave us with your money and go home. my words to her.... "how about no!" for me, the temp works drying up, and the permanent positions are requiring further training, lifes a bit sticky atm! in all honesty, i didn't see this coming! i guess i became what i hoped i never would.... sheltered by the forces! I heard on the grapevine (not sure if it's 100% as I know nothing about your occupation) that they are in desperate need of aero engineers up here also pilots, it may be worth checking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flag of convenience Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 Based on her response, she was happy to get the feedback and I think it is good to receive this sort of feedback.It is a lot better than not being told and being ignorant. Knowledge is power as they say and you can do something about it, or ignore it as you choose. The feedback was fine and I think valid. The current job market does mean that if you are competing against others who may be better with their written or verbal communication, it will be difficult. Assuming the best being selected which is far from always the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flag of convenience Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 Look, OP asked for honest feedback which I think has been constructively provided. I for one said her written English was good but in my opinion wasn't quite up to the standards I'd expect in a professional environment, based on my experience in a professional environment. Sorry if that's annoyed you, but no need to get all pissy on posters who are trying to reassure and provide helpful yet honest advice and suggestions to her to hopefully achieve that elusive job. I wonder just what does a professional work environment really mean? The best employed due to experience and skills? Hardly can't say what the UK work place is like in more recent times, but the Australian work place can hardly be accused of employing the best based on normal procedure in many cases. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flag of convenience Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 I've explained myself perfectly clearly. Clearly we don't agree, but that's no reason to get you tin knicks in a twist dear. Sorry OP, I genuinely think your written communication skills on this informal forum are fine. I'm sure they'd be up to scratch in a more formal setting. Highly ample and better than many. Could be a host of other factors at play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizzyTinKnicks Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 I wonder just what does a professional work environment really mean? The best employed due to experience and skills? Hardly can't say what the UK work place is like in more recent times, but the Australian work place can hardly be accused of employing the best based on normal procedure in many cases. I wasnt talking about the definition of 'best' for the job. I totally agree that often (and annoyingly) a job will go to someone that's not the best for the job, and who knows why. I've said that there are loads of subjective reasons outside the OPs control, but this one possible reason she can do something about, to eliminate any doubt that it might be playing a part in why she hasn't been getting anywhere. 'Professional work environment' in the OPs case, for me, would mean a director of a department coming to you becasue they want to know how to deal with an under performing employee, or someone who's put in a complaint about your recruitment procedure, or someone who's brought a grievance against their manager, or wants to know what their obligations to pay maternity are if the government reforms go through.... You need formal HR advice which might even need to stand up on court later on if it comes to it. For that you need a high standard of written English. Sorry if you disagree but this is how it works in my world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Pom Queen Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 For that you need a high standard of written English. Sorry if you disagree but this is how it works in my world. But that's not on a forum is it? This member probably does when she is working in a professional environment Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parley Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 It is not difficult to deduce from the writing that the OP was not from a UK background. She confirmed this also. It was not a case of someone deliberately being slack with grammar because its PIO, that is usually obvious too. So rather than provide well meaning tangible advice, which the OP can use, some suggest that it is just bad luck and provide no help. If the OP welcomes the feedback, who are you to repudiate it ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Pom Queen Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 It was not a case of someone deliberately being slack with grammar because its PIO, that is usually obvious too. Sorry I didn't realise you knew this poster in the real world, my bad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parley Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 Apology accepted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Pom Queen Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 Apology accepted. :tongue: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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