Guest The Ropey HOFF Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Thats what I love about ya Hoff..always glass half full! I do have my moans like anyone else it's human nature, but an odd gripe once in awhile is par for the course for most, but moaning and griping every second post is bad for your health and ....... Really annoying, lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harpodom Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 I do have my moans like anyone else it's human nature, but an odd gripe once in awhile is par for the course for most, but moaning and griping every second post is bad for your health and ....... Really annoying, lol. You may be a glass half full type of guy, but you don't have the right to tell others how they should behave, or indeed to pose as some sort of quasi expert on Australia, based on a few holiday experiences. It really is quite offensive and....Really annoying, lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Ropey HOFF Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 You may be a glass half full type of guy, but you don't have the right to tell others how they should behave, or indeed to pose as some sort of quasi expert on Australia, based on a few holiday experiences. It really is quite offensive and....Really annoying, lol. Are you a mod again this week, No, Yes, whatever. Put yer handbag away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harpodom Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Are you a mod again this week, No, Yes, whatever. Put yer handbag away. Talk to the hand sweetie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
northshorepom Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 No skin hoff your nose great, stop bleating about it, buy a heater, or a leccy blanket, this threads about how big the houses are, Actually you made it into a thread on quality as well as size with your post number 4, right on the first page. especially compared to the tiny average of the UK, if you are lucky to live in Perth, Brisbane, North Australia, even Adelaide, you have months on end of great weather, so having to keep it warm for two or three months instead of 7 or 8 months like we have to in the UK, will be a bonus as far as I'm concerned. You'll probably find it's more like 4 or 5 months depending on where you live Look, I'm not denying that houses here are bigger, nor that the weather is better, nor that the heating season is shorter. What I am saying is that many more people here put up with being chilly indoors than would ever do at home, and principally they have to do so because the houses in general are pretty poor at dealing with cooler temperatures. That's not moaning - it's just being realistic. But if you want to put your hands over your ears and pretend it isn't so, or think you know better from 10,000 miles away, go ahead. We've had stuff posted on here recently suggesting posts should be constructive and realistic for prospective new migrants. Well, that's what I'm doing. I reckon most new migrants to Australia can expect to live somewhere more spacious than they did in the UK, depending on their individual circumstances of course. They can also expect to have better weather. But they should also expect in the temperate zones of Australia - which applies to the vast majority of them - to be colder than they think in their house in winter. Sure, you can do something about that when you buy or build your own place, but it is a fact that the majority of new migrants live in rentals for quite some time, it is a fact that you can expect rentals to be worse in this respect than most owner occupied houses, and it's a fact that the insulation standards in general are lower, regardless of occupancy. No matter how much you'd like to pretend otherwise Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perthbum Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Thats what I love about ya Hoff..always glass half full! :laugh: You are kidding , he s the most miserable and depressing bloke I ave ever seen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impatient Aussie Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 My experience is that in the two houses I've lived in Australia, one my parents and one my own (my own currently being rented out making me one of those evil Australian landlords :embarrassed:), both had central heating and good insulation and were adequately warm in winter. I've lived in three properties in the UK, one apartment and two houses. Only the Apartment had double glazing which was nice, but the heating was in the form of a night storage heater which was appallingly bad. Both houses were poorly insulated and cost a fortune to heat. I'm not claiming my experiences are the norm for either country, but I think it does put into perspective just how random personal experience can be. In my mind the real lesson is being a tenant means you need to compromise your expectations to fit choices made by the landlord regardless of which country you are in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perthbum Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 My experience is that in the two houses I've lived in Australia, one my parents and one my own (my own currently being rented out making me one of those evil Australian landlords :embarrassed:), both had central heating and good insulation and were adequately warm in winter. I've lived in three properties in the UK, one apartment and two houses. Only the Apartment had double glazing which was nice, but the heating was in the form of a night storage heater which was appallingly bad. Both houses were poorly insulated and cost a fortune to heat. I'm not claiming my experiences are the norm for either country, but I think it does put into perspective just how random personal experience can be. In my mind the real lesson is being a tenant means you need to compromise your expectations to fit choices made by the landlord regardless of which country you are in. Wait till you help build houses in oz...they are shocking quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Shell15 Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 are you hoping the build is of better quality in Brisbane than PB? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
northshorepom Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 My experience is that in the two houses I've lived in Australia, one my parents and one my own (my own currently being rented out making me one of those evil Australian landlords :embarrassed:), both had central heating and good insulation and were adequately warm in winter. I've lived in three properties in the UK, one apartment and two houses. Only the Apartment had double glazing which was nice, but the heating was in the form of a night storage heater which was appallingly bad. Both houses were poorly insulated and cost a fortune to heat. I'm not claiming my experiences are the norm for either country, but I think it does put into perspective just how random personal experience can be. In my mind the real lesson is being a tenant means you need to compromise your expectations to fit choices made by the landlord regardless of which country you are in. Bang on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johndoe Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 are you hoping the build is of better quality in Brisbane than PB? No "hope" about it. His mate there will have clued him up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harpodom Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Wait till you help build houses in oz...they are shocking quality. thing is PB, you don't lend yourself any credence by making such sweeping statements. There is a grain of truth in what you say, but obviously not ALL Oz houses are shocking quality, thats a ridiculous thing to say. I'd say its only in the region 95% are shocking quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perthbum Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 thing is PB, you don't lend yourself any credence by making such sweeping statements. There is a grain of truth in what you say, but obviously not ALL Oz houses are shocking quality, thats a ridiculous thing to say. I'd say its only in the region 95% are shocking quality. Where the hell are the other 5% then buddy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harpodom Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Where the hell are the other 5% then buddy? Hobart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rikyuu Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 I'm sure if you paid 250K-300K GBP (the avergage Aussie house price) you would get something a reasonable size in the UK too. There's just a broarder range of housing available in the UK, some of it's even affordable. 76m2 does seem small for the UK. Our old terrace there was 5m wide by 10m long (2 floors) so was 100m2. 76m2 would be something like a terrace which is just 1 room wide and the front door opens directly into the lounge. I don't think this is an average house. I think the avergage semi or terrace would be about 130m2. Our Oz rental is on 600m2 of land and the house (and double garage) takes up a bit more than half of this, so about 350m2. Again, the Aussie estimate seems a bit low, as there are many houses bigger than ours. I suppose the super expensive houses near the CBD are much smaller and closer together, which offsets it a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anya Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 (edited) We have been here, we have tried it, its impossible. I understand why those in the UK find it easier to label people like me negative whingers because nobody wants their dream p!ssed all over, but believe me, we had a dream too. We didnt come all this way to fukkk it up. But the truth is, you had to be here 10 years ago to get the dream house on the beach, mortgage free. Although I love my life in Melbourne, I agree with whatever you've said so far about houses and renting. And no, you're not a whinger because the way I see it, all you are doing is stating your personal experiences and some of the downsides of living in VIC/Melbourne. We had a bad experience in our previous rental - but being the fighter I am, I gave the landlord and RE agent more that they bargained for. They imagined we were some meek, helpless fresh-off-the-plane immigrants and could rip us off....little did they know. Unless you're truly living the dream (e.g. dream job, dream house and dream what not) it is simply a case of same $hit different bucket. I do hope it works out for you Blobby and that you find happiness wherever you choose to live Edited August 1, 2012 by Anya Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockDr Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Look, I'm not denying that houses here are bigger, nor that the weather is better, nor that the heating season is shorter. What I am saying is that many more people here put up with being chilly indoors than would ever do at home, and principally they have to do so because the houses in general are pretty poor at dealing with cooler temperatures. That's not moaning - it's just being realistic. But if you want to put your hands over your ears and pretend it isn't so, or think you know better from 10,000 miles away, go ahead. We've had stuff posted on here recently suggesting posts should be constructive and realistic for prospective new migrants. Well, that's what I'm doing. I reckon most new migrants to Australia can expect to live somewhere more spacious than they did in the UK, depending on their individual circumstances of course. They can also expect to have better weather. But they should also expect in the temperate zones of Australia - which applies to the vast majority of them - to be colder than they think in their house in winter. Sure, you can do something about that when you buy or build your own place, but it is a fact that the majority of new migrants live in rentals for quite some time, it is a fact that you can expect rentals to be worse in this respect than most owner occupied houses, and it's a fact that the insulation standards in general are lower, regardless of occupancy. No matter how much you'd like to pretend otherwise Completely agree. Many migrants don't realise how cold it gets in winter, or how difficult it can be to heat a huge open plan space with high ceilings no matter how much insulation there is. If reading a post on here can make it occur to them to think about it and take these things into account when looking for a rental, it might make for some warmer, happier migrants who can actually feel their toes in winter. How is that a bad thing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul1Perth Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Another typical blinkered response from someone that does not live here yet. Why do you lot in the UK refuse to listen to those of us that actually LIVE here.... I'm sure they do. It's just they are selective in what they want to believe. If they read my posts they will think everything is great, which it will be for some who come. If they read your posts they will think everything will be crap and a complete waste of time, which will be the case for others. It's a massive move and you have to come with a positive frame of mind or you are half way to getting back on the plane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slean Wolfhead Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 No skin hoff your nose great, stop bleating about it, buy a heater, or a leccy blanket, this threads about how big the houses are, especially compared to the tiny average of the UK, if you are lucky to live in Perth, Brisbane, North Australia, even Adelaide, you have months on end of great weather, so having to keep it warm for two or three months instead of 7 or 8 months like we have to in the UK, will be a bonus as far as I'm concerned. Insulation will also keep it substantially cooler for the remaining 7 or 8 hot months, thus saving on electricity for aircon/fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blobby1000 Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Although I love my life in Melbourne, I agree with whatever you've said so far about houses and renting. And no, you're not a whinger because the way I see it, all you are doing is stating your personal experiences and some of the downsides of living in VIC/Melbourne. We had a bad experience in our previous rental - but being the fighter I am, I gave the landlord and RE agent more that they bargained for. They imagined we were some meek, helpless fresh-off-the-plane immigrants and could rip us off....little did they know. Unless you're truly living the dream (e.g. dream job, dream house and dream what not) it is simply a case of same $hit different bucket. I do hope it works out for you Blobby and that you find happiness wherever you choose to live Thanks Im sure we will be happy back in the UK, heading back in December..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blobby1000 Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 I have to say properties have shot up in price from when we first arrived. Blocks of land were selling between $25 - $80k, the same blocks now are looking at $180 - $200.The new houses built in Melbourne are cr@p if you just buy the basic, otherwise it's a case of adding everything on. The houses up in Cairns are totally different, more expensive, smaller houses but they are built of concrete and solid, they have to be for the cyclones. If we were still in the UK I don't think we could afford the move now, but if you have money behind you or a job then I think it's the best place in the world, yes you may find suburbs that are not for you but there are plenty of other beautiful places/states You've got it spot on Moving to Melbourne. This is the problem, as you say, you doubt you could afford to come out here now. Its also very difficult at the current time to come out with any money behind you.....house prices are still low in the UK, its hard to sell a housse to release the equity and even if the house does sell it wont get you much equity. The you only get 1.5 dollars to the pound so the money you will have to buy a house here will be very little. Add to that the expense of houses in Australia (and the fact stamp duty is about $20k and compulsary insurance if you have less than a 20% deposit (of another $20k, in Victoria anyway) and you can see that you need $40k before you have nothing.......the average house must be around $400k and its nearer $600k for a decent place.....but lets work off $400k So you would need $100,000 in order to put down a deposit plus stamp duty and avoid the cumpulsary insurance. Thats 66,000 pounds. The you will have a mortgage of $320,000 at 7% which is about $23,000 a year in interest alone......($2000 a month), and thats for a house for $400,000 which will be horrible anyway. Its just not viable in terms of a dream life at the moment............................................................................................. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blobby1000 Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 Blobby ...... For crikey Moses sake, book your flights home and stop your moaning, it's incessant, it can't be good for you being so down all the time, lighten up fella, you only get one life, try to live it positively. So if its all about positivity......why dont you "live positively" in the UK? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johndoe Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 So if its all about positivity......why dont you "live positively" in the UK? He does. He's always saying how good he has it there, apart for the weather, which is one of the reasons his wife and kids are undecided. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnjinky Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 @blobby 1000 your spot on...tax tax tax on everything...the ropey fella hasn't got a clue I've never really read him being positive about uk...if the sole reason he was to move 12,000 miles is to get the weather he's in for a shock....the houses are made like lego and look nice from the outside but wasn't built to last..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slean Wolfhead Posted August 1, 2012 Share Posted August 1, 2012 (edited) I live in Sydney and have done for a while. It is irritatingly cold in my house, as it is in I think (racking my brains as to exceptions) every house I've been in in winter that friends live in. And moans about it are very frequent - had 8 people over on Friday, 4 pom and 4 Aussie, and it was about the second subject brought up in conversation - by an Aussie. Went out for drinks Friday before that with a group of 8, 2 Pom, 6 Aussie, again it was being moaned about and again started by an Aussie. Friends who live in other cities (Melbourne, Canberra, Adelaide) also complain. In my job I look at scores of buildings, resi and commercial, new and old, as part of my work for an investment company and with 20 years in the construction industry and a background in building surveying and structural engineering I know what I am looking at. Recently I've been househunting and have made a point of checking out the mode of construction and insulation standards and on the whole the standards are really poor. There are exceptions, but the norm isn't great, I don't want people thinking there's the odd "bad apple" house but most are fine - it's the other way around; there are a few good houses but many more poorly insulated ones. I'm sure there are areas in Australia where this doesn't matter - basically the Tropics. But in most of the country there is a winter, and whilst it doesn't get very cold, single digit temperatures at night outside for a few weeks and poor insulation means low teens temperatures inside - which is not comfortable - or big heating bills. The Hoff doesn't annoy me, but it (insulation standards) annoys me, because it's so easy and cheap to avoid when building - and not that expensive to rectify later, not really, although it does cost more then - so wasteful of energy resources, and so pointless. There's just no reason for it These are good points you're making and it's not a UK/Aussie thing so not fair for people to swerve the argument in that direction. The British are building crap houses now as well, you don't find many UK builders prepared to live in a house they've been employed on by one of the mass builders..they know the sort of quality and size restriction that's inside, all about profit. My brother-in-law went to America 10 years ago as a penniless illegal and now builds/renovates these LEED-certified houses in Atlanta through his company. Georgia has a very similar climate to NSW/ACT... warm spring and autumn, 40+ in summer with storms but no hurricanes, short frosty winters but dry...the native house design is also similar to Canberra with it's 1960-70's bungalows, or timber single storey on large plots....all of which have rocketed in capital value far in advance of the quality of the house components themselves. They can use timber for the structure as opposed to pre-cast concrete, because it's dry, sustainable and they don't get European dampness, plus like Australia they have an abundance of wood which doesn't take a ton of energy to process, like bricks or concrete. The standard of building is rocketing as people quickly realise that fuel and electricity costs are going to cost them a packet and even the USA can't guarantee future supply quality the way the population is growing and China takes hold of foreign markets. Builders/owners get tax breaks for incorporating LEED principles in renovations or newbuilds, which could address the problem of Aussie landlords not having a business reason for doing any improvements to old houses in Oz. One of the major principles is insulation...they skin the buildings inside and then inject cavities with liquid foam, spray it all over the underside of the roof tiles..fill any little cracks or gaps. Ventilation comes from aircon or low solar power fans to prevent condensation. The test is to open all the internal doors and leave them standing ajar, then place a massive "hoover" outside the house by the front door, then tape it over the door to seal the gap. The "hoover" attempts to suck the air out of the house. If any of the internal doors move because of airflow, you have a gap somewhere and you fail the test. If the doors don't move, you have a vacuum and your house is airtight, so will retain it's ambient temperature better. The owner gets a tax break, lower bills, and the value of the property is enhanced as they become more desirable....and he's made literally millions of $ in the last 10 years, just cannot keep up with the demand which is booming....especially as the buying market is dead so people are renovating existing plots, putting on 2nd storeys etc... If that cultural change is possible in Georgia with the local rednecks, it's possible in Australia who have similar roots and attitudes to life. In his own house, he reckons his aircon switches on twice a day in summer for a cool blast, then 3 times a day in winter where they can wear T-shirts in the house when it's -5 outside.....you just can't do that in Oz, but they're very similar places. If you can get that effect and save money...why wouldn't everybody want that? Edited August 1, 2012 by Slean Wolfhead Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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