Can i afford to move to oz

[surfersj]

Hi to everyone, I am new PIO member, and a special hello to all those parents who have been fortunate enough to make the move to Oz or are in the parent visa queue.

My wife and I are both age 61 and in full-time employment - counting down the years quickly and looking forward to our retirement!

However, all of this changed in this past 2 years as my daughter met an Aussie, got married, moved from the UK to Queensland, and then gave birth to our one and only grandson.

Now we are both desperate to emigrate to Oz. However, the 10 to 15 year wait for the standard parental visa isn't really practical and if we save hard over the next 4 years we may have the funds to make the move on a CPV. The worry that we have is the cost of living in Oz versus our likely income.

We don't want to become a short-term burden on our daughter or a long term burden on Australia - after the 10 year ASOB expires.

Our UK state pension will be frozen and my private pension is only partly inflation proofed so in the longer term the gap between our income and expenditure in Oz will only increase.

We are trying to study in fine detail future projections on our net income and expenditure if we were to make the move.

In connection with this, I have many questions and would appreciate help from any parents who have or are going through the same experience.

[Quoll]

My parents did the 6 month here, 6 month there thing for 15 yrs when they retired. That's another option you might want to consider. You might fork out all that money only to find your daughter and her family fancy living in UK, you never can tell. You'll want to be very well heeled to live in Aus in retirement! Good luck!

[paddymacs]

Gosh i wish you best of luck I am of no help but that has really pulled at my heart strings hope someone can shed some light. I like Quolls idea too :-) I'm hoping my parents who are in their 70's will do that. I didnt realise they could stay 6 months thought it was 3 at one time so thanxs Quoll for that info!

Best of luck surfersj hope you out in oz soon with daughter and grandson!

[Nikey]

My parents did the 6 month here, 6 month there thing for 15 yrs when they retired. That's another option you might want to consider. You might fork out all that money only to find your daughter and her family fancy living in UK, you never can tell. You'll want to be very well heeled to live in Aus in retirement! Good luck!

 

Good idea not to put all your eggs in one basket.

[MattD]

Just a quick message to welcome you to PIO and to wish you good luck!

[Rupert]

In all honesty I think the CPV is designed for the wealthy who can shell out this kind of money without batting an eyelid. If you have to save up for years then it suggests to me you could be on a path to financial ruin. I have seen people pay $40k and then not even like living in Australia. I am not being facetious, but genuinely would recommend long holidays.

[surfersj]

Thanks to everyone who posted comments, I appreciate the feedback.

For those grandparents with young grandchildren I am sure you will appreciate the anguish of being apart. We are kind of torn between a comfortable retirement in the UK with Oz trips versus a less well-off but happier retirement in Oz.

A number of good points have been made in the posts and I guess we have to assess our own situation in this regard. My Aussie son-in-law spent several years in the UK before meeting and marrying my daughter. It is almost 3 years since they moved and my daughter absolutely loves it over there. You never know what the future holds but I would say that they are very settled in Queensland and no thoughts of returning (my S-I-L would miss the Brisbane Lions!)

Although the daughter/grandson link is the main driver here, after spending all of my life in Scotland with long, cold, wet endless winters, the thought of emigrating and retiring in Oz is very appealing. The way I look at it, is that my daughter moving has provided us with the opportunity. Clearly I don't want to make the move and not cope financially. I have a few years anyways before making a final decision. Maybe things could change by then - if the exchange rate keeps going the way it has in the past couple of months - that would help! Maybe the UK government will provide commonwealth pensioners with annual pension increases! (and pigs could fly you may say!) To conclude, if anyone out there could help on a few queries that I have as part of my quest to understand future financial projections may be:

1. IF we move it will be in about 4 years time when age 65. Is there any advantage or disadvantage on us completing the move BEFORE reaching age 65 or AFTER. I know for example that the Oz age pension involves a 10 year residency qualification regardless of age but I am curious if it is in my best interests or not in completing the move before age 65 - I am assuming that it makes no difference.

2. The CPV entitles us to permanent residency and medicare enrolement etc but aside from the extra costs of dentists and opticians and perhaps some doctor appointment fees, is there really any need to take out private medical cover? Do seniors/pensioners get assistance/concessions on dental/optician costs?

3. Does the 10 year assurance of support bond affect my entitlement to the commonwealth seniors health card or it is still granted after the 2 year wait period?

4. Do OZ pensioners benefit from high

[Mike@Bonbeach]

Hi surfersj

I'll try and answer a couple of your questions.

We came out on a CPV in 2007,luckily the GBP/$au was in our favour then,so we didn't have to be "rich" to make the move although it was expensive.

The Commonwealth Seniors card can be obtained after 2 years in Au as an entitlement. The AOS pays a 6 monthly return to the AOS holder, I think it is about 5.5% and is returned in full after 10 years providing you have not made any claims for social benefits.

The CSHC also gives you quarterly payments to help with things like telephone,internet etc(currently around $400 a quarter per couple).

Unfortunatel being a UK pensioner gets you very little in the way of concessions. dental and optical expenses have to be paid in full unless you have Extras linked to your Hospital insurance, and then it depends on the level of cover you have.

We currently pay around $260 per month for Hospital and Extras insurance, this gets us about 30% reduction on dental and optical. The Hospital cover has been very good for us, we have both had cataracts done, I have had a stent fitted and a number of other things which would have cost the earth had we not been covered. I would certainly recommend the Hospital cover, not so sure of the benefit of extras as it covers a lot of things that we have had no need of.

Your UK pensions are deemed as income so you will be taxed on the full amount less any allowances.

It is nice to see the GBP/$Au exchange rate improving in the GBP's favour after having 6 years of dwindling income. As far as the UK paying Commonwealth pensioners any increase in their pensions forget it.

Good luck on your future.

Mike

[Quoll]

Re private health cover - personally I'd take it out (around $250+) per month as, in older age especially, you don't want to be hanging around months or years for something that might be considered elective surgery (18 months for gallbladder removal was quoted when I had mine out!). You get a year to take out private health cover without penalty but after that there is a loading for every year you are older than 30 - so at 65 it would be prohibitive. Dental and optical be prepared to pay through the nose with piddling rebates if you have extras cover (eye tests are bulk billed). Ant therapies eg physio will be user pays and medications will cost you $32+/- per fill per month at least in the beginning.

[surfersj]

Hi paddymacs - just to say that a new longer term tourist visa was introduced November 2012 and mainly geared towards parents. It's a 5 year tourist visa if parents are in the parent visa queue and 3 years if not. Both versions permit a maximum 12 month stay in any 18 month period. Its either the subclass 676 or was perhaps changed to the subclass 600 I just came across it last night.

[surfersj]

Hi surfersj

I'll try and answer a couple of your questions.

We came out on a CPV in 2007,luckily the GBP/$au was in our favour then,so we didn't have to be "rich" to make the move although it was expensive.

The Commonwealth Seniors card can be obtained after 2 years in Au as an entitlement. The AOS pays a 6 monthly return to the AOS holder, I think it is about 5.5% and is returned in full after 10 years providing you have not made any claims for social benefits.

The CSHC also gives you quarterly payments to help with things like telephone,internet etc(currently around $400 a quarter per couple).

Unfortunatel being a UK pensioner gets you very little in the way of concessions. dental and optical expenses have to be paid in full unless you have Extras linked to your Hospital insurance, and then it depends on the level of cover you have.

We currently pay around $260 per month for Hospital and Extras insurance, this gets us about 30% reduction on dental and optical. The Hospital cover has been very good for us, we have both had cataracts done, I have had a stent fitted and a number of other things which would have cost the earth had we not been covered. I would certainly recommend the Hospital cover, not so sure of the benefit of extras as it covers a lot of things that we have had no need of.

Your UK pensions are deemed as income so you will be taxed on the full amount less any allowances.

It is nice to see the GBP/$Au exchange rate improving in the GBP's favour after having 6 years of dwindling income. As far as the UK paying Commonwealth pensioners any increase in their pensions forget it.

Good luck on your future.

Mike

 

Re private health cover - personally I'd take it out (around $250+) per month as, in older age especially, you don't want to be hanging around months or years for something that might be considered elective surgery (18 months for gallbladder removal was quoted when I had mine out!). You get a year to take out private health cover without penalty but after that there is a loading for every year you are older than 30 - so at 65 it would be prohibitive. Dental and optical be prepared to pay through the nose with piddling rebates if you have extras cover (eye tests are bulk billed). Ant therapies eg physio will be user pays and medications will cost you $32+/- per fill per month at least in the beginning.

I read with particular interest the comments on OZ healthcare. Knowing that the CPV entitles the holder to medicare enrollment, I understood that this was on a par with our own national health service. (I also thought I read somewhere for example, that 40% of Australians do not have private health cover) This being the case, my thinking was that I would be fine with medicare and could do without the private Hospital cover or even any kind of private cover and either just take out the "extra" cover or just live with the cost for any opticians or dentists. If for example I were to retire in the UK I wouldn't think of then taking out private health cover. However, maybe the point is that the medicare system is not on a par with our NHS? Perhaps also that being age 65+ is exactly when your health can go wrong and private cover in OZ becomes more essential? Would the choice of state/location affect this decision in any way? (If I make the move it would likely be a Brisbane suburb but maybe the health cover issues apply regardless of which state and region)

Also interesting the comments on prescription medication. Am, I correct in saying that if I were on three different prescription medications, that I would pay $32 per month for EACH item = $96 per month for medication?

[Quoll]

I read with particular interest the comments on OZ healthcare. Knowing that the CPV entitles the holder to medicare enrollment, I understood that this was on a par with our own national health service. (I also thought I read somewhere for example, that 40% of Australians do not have private health cover) This being the case, my thinking was that I would be fine with medicare and could do without the private Hospital cover or even any kind of private cover and either just take out the "extra" cover or just live with the cost for any opticians or dentists. If for example I were to retire in the UK I wouldn't think of then taking out private health cover. However, maybe the point is that the medicare system is not on a par with our NHS? Perhaps also that being age 65+ is exactly when your health can go wrong and private cover in OZ becomes more essential? Would the choice of state/location affect this decision in any way? (If I make the move it would likely be a Brisbane suburb but maybe the health cover issues apply regardless of which state and region)

Also interesting the comments on prescription medication. Am, I correct in saying that if I were on three different prescription medications, that I would pay $32 per month for EACH item = $96 per month for medication?

 

Well, it is and it isn't on a par with the NHS. Whereas the NHS has time targets for particular procedures (with fines for non compliance) the Australian public system does not - waiting lists for "elective" procedures will very from state to state and specialist to specialist so in some states you could be waiting an inordinate length of time for a procedure which might get treated quicker in another state or city but, equally another elective procedure might be treated quicker in the same place. Qld is struggling financially with severe cuts in public services so heavens knows what impact that will have on public health interventions. An increasing number of Australians are finding they can't afford private health cover and that, of course puts more pressure on the public system and to keep the private system viable, premiums keep on rising! The Medicare system was designed as a co-pay system and the expectation at inception was that those who could afford insurance would take it - and there is a penalty for "high earners" whereby an additional levy is imposed if they don't. Many specialists are basically private - they also charge considerably more than your bog standard GP and it is hard to find one that will bulk bill in most places. Things like knee and hip replacements are generally considered to be elective (as was gallbladder removal!!!) and wait times can be crippling in more ways than one! Insurance is a risk issue - just like insuring your house or car. If I had my time over I would probably have self insured but after a couple of private ops would probably only just still be on the plus side.

 

you are correct with your maths on prescriptions but there is a ceiling called the PBS threshold beyond which you are only charged about $5 per fill per item in any financial year - think it is around $1500 pa. any possible health benefits are means tested once you've served your time requirements.

[Rupert]

To conclude, if anyone out there could help on a few queries that I have as part of my quest to understand future financial projections may be:

1. IF we move it will be in about 4 years time when age 65. Is there any advantage or disadvantage on us completing the move BEFORE reaching age 65 or AFTER. I know for example that the Oz age pension involves a 10 year residency qualification regardless of age but I am curious if it is in my best interests or not in completing the move before age 65 - I am assuming that it makes no difference.

2. The CPV entitles us to permanent residency and medicare enrolement etc but aside from the extra costs of dentists and opticians and perhaps some doctor appointment fees, is there really any need to take out private medical cover? Do seniors/pensioners get assistance/concessions on dental/optician costs?

3. Does the 10 year assurance of support bond affect my entitlement to the commonwealth seniors health card or it is still granted after the 2 year wait period?

4. Do OZ pensioners benefit from high

 

I don't think there is any particular advantage of moving before versus after 65, other than if you have decided you are going to do it on a CPV, well might as well get on with it. Note that the Australian pension is means tested and whilst I have not looked into it, I thought the income level to qualify was very low indeed, most people would hope they won't qualify for it to be honest.

 

I have not found my private medical cover helpful to date and mainly have it for tax reasons at the moment (in my 40s). But that is the thing with insurance, it doesn't do much until you need it, if I were in my 60s, then I think I definitely would want to have it in Australia. I wouldn't and don't bother with dental and extras cover, I see my private health cover as being there for the big stuff. No idea on 3 and I think you ran out of steam with question 4..? :wink:

[surfersj]

I don't think there is any particular advantage of moving before versus after 65, other than if you have decided you are going to do it on a CPV, well might as well get on with it. Note that the Australian pension is means tested and whilst I have not looked into it, I thought the income level to qualify was very low indeed, most people would hope they won't qualify for it to be honest.

 

I have not found my private medical cover helpful to date and mainly have it for tax reasons at the moment (in my 40s). But that is the thing with insurance, it doesn't do much until you need it, if I were in my 60s, then I think I definitely would want to have it in Australia. I wouldn't and don't bother with dental and extras cover, I see my private health cover as being there for the big stuff. No idea on 3 and I think you ran out of steam with question 4..? :wink:

OPS - question #4 ran out of words!! What I was attempting to ask was related to whether or not the tax free allowance on income for over 65's was more generous? The 2012-2013 standard allowance is $18,200 but I believe there is something called SAPTO rules and if there is a higher allowance, I was curious what the income allowance would be, before tax was paid, and also whether or not this can be combined as a couple. My wife would inevitably pay no tax as her only income would be the UK state pension but in addition to this I would have a private pension plus an annuity.