so1011 Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 Hi, We have a lease on our rental until the end of July. The landlord has informed us that he wants to sell the house at the end of April and is expecting us to view the house twice a week in the 4 weeks leading up to an auction. We are meeting the estate agent tomorrow to "discuss" our options. We are only 6 weeks into a new 6 month contract at the moment so we are understandably really annoyed about this. We have 2 young children and a relative visiting from the UK during this period so it is very inconvenient. Does anyone have experience of this situation? The agent mentioned financial compensation, does anyone know what is generally offered in this situation? Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Pom Queen Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 Sorry to hear this, unfortunately it is very common and they only have to provide you with 60 days notice, i know it is unfair and inconvenient, but if they are offering financial compensation jump at it as they don't have to, maybe ask that your removals are paid for and that they provide a written reference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
so1011 Posted March 18, 2012 Author Share Posted March 18, 2012 Sorry to hear this, unfortunately it is very common and they only have to provide you with 60 days notice, i know it is unfair and inconvenient, but if they are offering financial compensation jump at it as they don't have to, maybe ask that your removals are paid for and that they provide a written reference. Thanks for your reply. The 60 days doesn't apply in this case because our lease runs until the end of July and they can't break that. Will keep the removal costs in mind though! Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sally04 Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 Hi,We have a lease on our rental until the end of July. The landlord has informed us that he wants to sell the house at the end of April and is expecting us to view the house twice a week in the 4 weeks leading up to an auction. We are meeting the estate agent tomorrow to "discuss" our options. We are only 6 weeks into a new 6 month contract at the moment so we are understandably really annoyed about this. We have 2 young children and a relative visiting from the UK during this period so it is very inconvenient. Does anyone have experience of this situation? The agent mentioned financial compensation, does anyone know what is generally offered in this situation? Thanks According to the tenancy act, a landlord must give you a notice to vacate form (posted to you) but cannot end the tennancy agreement early if he plans to sell the house. He has to give at least 60 days notice before the end date of your agreement ( pg 26 renting a house a guide for tenants). Consumer affairs Vic would be a useful contact with confirmation emails as a paper trail Financial compensation would have to be substantial enough to cover the cost of a move and also the stress of resettlement with children! Have the agents got an alternative property avaiLable at a discounted rate? If your lease ends anyway in July then you may be able to get a deal on a new contract, bearing in mind that you are going to have to move soon anyway, (and I don't mean that in a flippant way). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gpo1971 Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 Happened to us, nowt you can do about I would imagine. It is fair though that any home opens are convenient for you as well, make that point. The rental we were in at the time didn't sell but we still had people walking through once a week for an hour or so until he took it off the market. I wouldn't mind, we'd made the place look immaculate, that's what I think he was waiting for. Pitfall of renting unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freckleface Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 We sold one of our properties while it was rented but the new owners knew they couldn't move in until the lease ran out. We reduced the rent while it was on the market (although we didn't have to). This might be worth asking about. In return the tennants agreed to have the house looking spick and span for viewings. Worked out well for everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Pom Queen Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 Thanks for your reply. The 60 days doesn't apply in this case because our lease runs until the end of July and they can't break that. Will keep the removal costs in mind though! Thanks. Take a look here http://www.lawhandbook.org.au/handbook/ch10s01s06.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Pom Queen Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 As stated it doesn't matter if you have a fixed tenancy or not they can issue you with a notice to vacate, if he wasn't selling then he may struggle, take a peak here as well. http://raywhitenorthcote.com.au/files/2012/02/ENDING-A-TENANCY.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brightonbee Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 Hi,We have a lease on our rental until the end of July. The landlord has informed us that he wants to sell the house at the end of April and is expecting us to view the house twice a week in the 4 weeks leading up to an auction. We are meeting the estate agent tomorrow to "discuss" our options. We are only 6 weeks into a new 6 month contract at the moment so we are understandably really annoyed about this. We have 2 young children and a relative visiting from the UK during this period so it is very inconvenient. Does anyone have experience of this situation? The agent mentioned financial compensation, does anyone know what is generally offered in this situation? Thanks I was rentiing an apartment which sold a few months Into a 12 month tenancy. I checked with a renters rights organisation and the landlord is bound by the lease then they have to give you notice before the lease is up. I asked for compensation for inconvenience whilst the flat was being sold - and it was inconvenient, what with viewings then an auction. I received one week's rent free during the sales process. You could ask for more then settle. lt is in their interest to have you on side . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozzbound Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 We had a 6 month lease then month by month until we were ready to move as we were building. Anyway, we said that house would be ready in August then I arrived home one day to the rental and there was a sale sign outside so i phoned the agent who said i should have already received the 60 days notice (obviously hadn't!) so she said she would do open house when it suited us so i opted for 12.30pm on saturdays so i could work all week then just pop out for 15 mins on a saturday - this included dragging 2 teenagers out of bed and into the car in the garage in their pj's drive around then return! To be honest the agent was good at fitting around us, we also had a dog and when the people who did buy wanted to view on a Tuesday she did come around after I'd finished work so i could take the dog out. We didn't ask for a rent reduction but should have in hindsight. If they are shirty about open for inspections offer them a time that suits you even by email so you have evidence that you aren't being funny. I wanted them onside so i could use them as referees should we rent again (which we are!) Try and keep it friendly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quinkla Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 As stated it doesn't matter if you have a fixed tenancy or not they can issue you with a notice to vacate, if he wasn't selling then he may struggle, take a peak here as well. http://raywhitenorthcote.com.au/files/2012/02/ENDING-A-TENANCY.pdf I'm afraid this is not right. Section 259 of the Residential Tenancies Act 1997 speaks of the 60 days' notice if the property is to be sold. But Section 266 (1) (b) says that this notice will not have any effect if the day of vacation is sooner than the end of a fixed term tenancy. A fixed term tenancy cannot be ended early unless both parties agree; or unless one or other party is in persistent breach; or unless there is a VCAT order. There are exceptions - e.g. if a premises is deemed uninhabitable or if a tenant or guest of a tenant is violent, etc, but sale of property is not a reason. When we were househunting, we came across various tenated properties. In most cases, the tenant had not gone to any great trouble to clean up (why should they) and in some cases, the tenant remained on the premises going about his or her daily business - clearly resenting the intrusion. The price the landlord pays for disturbing the tenants is that the tenants are likely to take a fair amount off the potential sale price. The landlord is not obliged to compensate you and provided enough notice is given to the tenant, the landlord can have as many open houses as he or she wants. On the other hand, tenants are under no obligation to behave themselves during the open house. Boiling vinegar smells nasty and a death metal CD played at loud volume would make a point. You can also insist that all visitors remove shoes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gpo1971 Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 Yeah, that's all well and good but, if you're going to rent again once that property sells, you'll need a reference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pintpot Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 Any system that allows landlords to quite fixed term tenancies early for their convenience, but doesn't allow tenants the same flexibility is clearly iniquitous. So I hope ProudPom is correct in his interpretation I wouldn't make life difficult if a property was being sold or re-let, but if my landlord was trying to sell it from under me when I had a legitimate contract and he had no right to end the tenancy early, then I would Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quinkla Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 Any system that allows landlords to quite fixed term tenancies early for their convenience, but doesn't allow tenants the same flexibility is clearly iniquitous. So I hope ProudPom is correct in his interpretation I am - but if you want an independent view please contact the Tenants Union of Victoria: http://www.tuv.org.au/publications/fact+sheets The factsheet called "The Landlord Is Selling" is the one you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Pom Queen Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 Agreed but the landlord still needs to provide them with 60 days notice which can be issued at any time, not in July!! My suggestion is still to take their offer of compensation, as whether you leave now or in July you are going to need to get out. Once July is reached he won't be bothered about offering any incentives to move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Pom Queen Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 I'm afraid this is not right. Section 259 of the Residential Tenancies Act 1997 speaks of the 60 days' notice if the property is to be sold. But Section 266 (1) (b) says that this notice will not have any effect if the day of vacation is sooner than the end of a fixed term tenancy. A fixed term tenancy cannot be ended early unless both parties agree; or unless one or other party is in persistent breach; or unless there is a VCAT order. There are exceptions - e.g. if a premises is deemed uninhabitable or if a tenant or guest of a tenant is violent, etc, but sale of property is not a reason. When we were househunting, we came across various tenated properties. In most cases, the tenant had not gone to any great trouble to clean up (why should they) and in some cases, the tenant remained on the premises going about his or her daily business - clearly resenting the intrusion. The price the landlord pays for disturbing the tenants is that the tenants are likely to take a fair amount off the potential sale price. The landlord is not obliged to compensate you and provided enough notice is given to the tenant, the landlord can have as many open houses as he or she wants. On the other hand, tenants are under no obligation to behave themselves during the open house. Boiling vinegar smells nasty and a death metal CD played at loud volume would make a point. You can also insist that all visitors remove shoes. It is not incorrect, an issue of a notice to vacate is going to be served within 60 days of the tenancy ending. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quinkla Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 It is not incorrect, an issue of a notice to vacate is going to be served within 60 days of the tenancy ending. In that case we are in furious agreement. I was concerned that your post suggested that the 60 days notice could supersede the end date of a fixed term tenancy (i.e. bring a fixed term tenancy to an end early). I think others interpreted it this way and I just wanted to clarify that it can't. In Victoria, if a landlord wants to bring a tenancy to an end without one of the statutory reasons, he or she can do so by giving 120 days notice. This also does not allow a fixed term tenancy to be brought unilaterally to an early end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Pom Queen Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 In that case we are in furious agreement. I was concerned that your post suggested that the 60 days notice could supersede the end date of a fixed term tenancy (i.e. bring a fixed term tenancy to an end early). I think others interpreted it this way and I just wanted to clarify that it can't. In Victoria, if a landlord wants to bring a tenancy to an end without one of the statutory reasons, he or she can do so by giving 120 days notice. This also does not allow a fixed term tenancy to be brought unilaterally to an early end. Correct. Also a tenancy can be ended if both parties agree, so as he is going to prefer selling the house with vacant possession it's a great time to bargain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pintpot Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 In that case we are in furious agreement. I was concerned that your post suggested that the 60 days notice could supersede the end date of a fixed term tenancy (i.e. bring a fixed term tenancy to an end early). I think others interpreted it this way and I just wanted to clarify that it can't. In Victoria, if a landlord wants to bring a tenancy to an end without one of the statutory reasons, he or she can do so by giving 120 days notice. This also does not allow a fixed term tenancy to be brought unilaterally to an early end. I think some of the early posts did say he could end it with 60 days notice before the end date of the term Also the OP thinks thinks this is what he is trying to do, I believe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockDr Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 I'm quite possibly completely wrong, but if it's a fixed term lease, I don't think the landlord can evict early just to sell the house. I thought in this situation the house would be sold with tenants, with the new owners taking over as landlords. If the new owners are wanting to continue letting the property, they might even renew the lease. If not, then the lease would be terminated in July as per the contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Pom Queen Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 Ok to make it clear, unless both parties agree the tenancy cannot end until July, however, the landlord MUST still provide 60 days notice to vacate (minimum). So he could send the notice to vacate now or in May/June depending on when the contract ends. He HAS to provide a notice to vacate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
so1011 Posted March 20, 2012 Author Share Posted March 20, 2012 Thanks for everybody's advice and opinions. The letting agent came round on Monday and appears to be a pretty fair guy. He has contacted the landlord to request compensation for our inconvenience (he confirmed this is normally 1 weeks rent). If he is fair and compensates us appropriately I will do my upmost to make the place look as presentable as possible, if not I will not be making much effort at all. I wouldn't sabotage his sale though, tempting as it might be ! We are fair people, just hoping the landlord turns out to be the same. I asked the agent if he would ask the landlord if he would let us vacate the property by the auction on 28 April but why on earth would he agree to that and lose 3 months rent and have to sell the property empty. Much better for him to get his rent, use our furniture and plants in the garden to get some great photos for the sales schedule. Think it's time to move on from this house anyway, between the noise from the building site over the road, the neighbour who let's his yappy dog out ever morning at 7am (including Sunday's) and being burgled 6 weeks ago, someone somewhere is telling us it's time to go ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest GeorgeD Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 Much better for him to get his rent, use our furniture and plants in the garden to get some great photos for the sales schedule I think you have the right to refuse any photographs be taken of your belongings. you will see many rentals with tenants advertised with just the external photos. We were in this situation, you can't be forced out, but the landlord does have a right to allow viewings at convenient times and at a resonable frequency...most of which is up for debate and not strictly defined. Our landlord offered us a month free to vacate early otherswise there would've been viewings while we were there...and two of the three people in our house worked shifts including night shifts over weekends, so there would've been two bedrooms occupied by sleepers on a Saturday morning! We were under absolutely no obligation to leave until the end of our lease, but we didn't want the intrusion so moved out. If you want to stay then you are going to put up with the viewings I'm afraid...but if there is any compensation you can get then great, as they don't need you to do that. It's probably a payment for you to keep the place clean and tidy and not have kippers for breakfast the morning of the viewing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brightonbee Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 I'm quite possibly completely wrong, but if it's a fixed term lease, I don't think the landlord can evict early just to sell the house. I thought in this situation the house would be sold with tenants, with the new owners taking over as landlords. If the new owners are wanting to continue letting the property, they might even renew the lease. If not, then the lease would be terminated in July as per the contract. My flat sold and new owners were prepared to let me stay until end of tenancy. Within 60 days of tenancy end, I received a notice to quit from the agents. I vacated at the end of 12 months and the new owner moved in. I was hoping that the new owner would buy me out and offer compensation for inconvenience - no such luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Pom Queen Posted March 21, 2012 Share Posted March 21, 2012 I think you have the right to refuse any photographs be taken of your belongings. you will see many rentals with tenants advertised with just the external photos. We were in this situation, you can't be forced out, but the landlord does have a right to allow viewings at convenient times and at a resonable frequency...most of which is up for debate and not strictly defined. Our landlord offered us a month free to vacate early otherswise there would've been viewings while we were there...and two of the three people in our house worked shifts including night shifts over weekends, so there would've been two bedrooms occupied by sleepers on a Saturday morning! We were under absolutely no obligation to leave until the end of our lease, but we didn't want the intrusion so moved out. If you want to stay then you are going to put up with the viewings I'm afraid...but if there is any compensation you can get then great, as they don't need you to do that. It's probably a payment for you to keep the place clean and tidy and not have kippers for breakfast the morning of the viewing! George is correct re photos. To be honest I think he may prefer you left early as he will struggle to sell with a tenant in, unless it's an investor who purchases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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